[ActiveMining] The Official Active Mining Discussion Thread [Self-Moderated]

[JoTheKhan]

Why use USD on a BTC payment with a BTC return?

If we could have paid for these shares in USD (Like miners purchase their gear) then I can see the USD usage but in a strictly BTC environment nope

For those interested in fiat value, of course.

Also, I need to apologize to your Bargraphics, I said that 5% of the TNH was "crazy" and/or "insane" and after crunching some numbers now realize that those are not the proper words for describing ACTM's odds of holding 5%.

Can we not include the 1,000,000ish we got sitting around from preorders  ( I know this money covers ordering customer equipment but would expect some money to be left over for our own equipment) which includes the 3xx,xxx that was paid for with BTC which should be worth more now. Wonder how much money Ken has kept as BTC.

Let me know if I'm completely off as I'm not the most business adept.

[sebastienurbain]

Team AMC just solved a block...

Had 30 blocks yesterday, at 31 today.

https://www.btcguild.com/index.php?page=rankings&section=teams

That's good news I guess 

[kleeck]

Why use USD on a BTC payment with a BTC return?

If we could have paid for these shares in USD (Like miners purchase their gear) then I can see the USD usage but in a strictly BTC environment nope

For those interested in fiat value, of course.

Also, I need to apologize to your Bargraphics, I said that 5% of the TNH was "crazy" and/or "insane" and after crunching some numbers now realize that those are not the proper words for describing ACTM's odds of holding 5%.

Can we not include the 1,000,000ish we got sitting around from preorders  ( I know this money covers ordering customer equipment but would expect some money to be left over for our own equipment) which includes the 3xx,xxx that was paid for with BTC which should be worth more now. Wonder how much money Ken has kept as BTC.

Let me know if I'm completely off as I'm not the most business adept.

We certainly could, but I didn't because I don't know what all that money goes to. I'm sure it isn't all profit. The sales side of has a lot more moving parts to it. Also, the 1400 BTC from the Avalon refund was for mining back then, why would it not be now? It just made sense to assume that these coins will go towards the ActM operation.

[JoTheKhan]

Yeah of course. So your calculations are based on one of the worst case possible with working equipment which is even better than I thought then. I would love  $.013 divs/share per week though.

[zumzero]

For those of you NOT on IRC. I will grace you with this glorious theorycraftage:

<kleeck> Here you go guys:

1400 BTC from Avalon Refund = $770,000. If we get machines at retail value, and not cost (unlikely, but we'll do worst case scenario) it'll cost $155,598,80 for 24.576TH/s and we can afford 4.94 fully loaded Platinum miners. (I'm guessing we can get that to 5 full machines with expansions). 5 X 24.576 = 122.88 TH/s. (The $770K is based off of a $550 BTC)

100TH/s is 2% of a 5PH network, (We are at 4.8PH currently). 2% of the TNH is 72 coins a day (2% of 3600 possible coins). 72 * 7 for the weekly net amount is 504. I'll cut it in half, for reinvestment, so we can keep up with the hashrate, so 252.

252 / 10,000,000 (not counting the other 15M yet) is .0000252/share. Which is $.01386/share @ $550 a BTC each week. Not bad for paying $.25 a share initially.

<kleeck> Read it and weep.

<kleeck> WEEP I SAY!

<FunkyMunky> Boner Alert!!

<kleeck> Warning! Reading the above may cause boners.

<kleeck> Yeah. I like those numbers. We need to get this plan in motion, though.

<FunkyMunky> That warning was too late!!

Thanks for crunching the numbers and posting this.  I think I may have breached again!

Just a thought though.  Can we be absolutely sure that the Avalon refund hasn't been converted to fiat and already spent on something?  I would exercise caution in trying to second guess Ken's business moves (if that's what we're doing) as we might be setting ourselves up for a possible disappointment.  Or perhaps the Avalon refund isn't a factor as we should have the money anyway, to achieve kleeck's figures?  

[kleeck]

For those of you NOT on IRC. I will grace you with this glorious theorycraftage:

<kleeck> Here you go guys:

1400 BTC from Avalon Refund = $770,000. If we get machines at retail value, and not cost (unlikely, but we'll do worst case scenario) it'll cost $155,598,80 for 24.576TH/s and we can afford 4.94 fully loaded Platinum miners. (I'm guessing we can get that to 5 full machines with expansions). 5 X 24.576 = 122.88 TH/s. (The $770K is based off of a $550 BTC)

100TH/s is 2% of a 5PH network, (We are at 4.8PH currently). 2% of the TNH is 72 coins a day (2% of 3600 possible coins). 72 * 7 for the weekly net amount is 504. I'll cut it in half, for reinvestment, so we can keep up with the hashrate, so 252.

252 / 10,000,000 (not counting the other 15M yet) is .0000252/share. Which is $.01386/share @ $550 a BTC each week. Not bad for paying $.25 a share initially.

<kleeck> Read it and weep.

<kleeck> WEEP I SAY!

<FunkyMunky> Boner Alert!!

<kleeck> Warning! Reading the above may cause boners.

<kleeck> Yeah. I like those numbers. We need to get this plan in motion, though.

<FunkyMunky> That warning was too late!!

Thanks for crunching the numbers and posting this.  I think I may have breached again!

Just a thought though.  Can we be absolutely sure that the Avalon refund hasn't been converted to fiat and already spent on something?  I would exercise caution in trying to second guess Ken's business moves (if that's what we're doing) as we might be setting ourselves up for a possible disappointment.  Or perhaps the Avalon refund isn't a factor as we should have the money anyway, to achieve kleeck's figures?  

As usual, I will share what I know:

Ken,

Watching the BTC value run up this evening had me thinking about the Avalon refund Bitcoins. Is that full amount still in BTC? If not how much is still in Bitcoin?

Thanks!

 

Note: Ken doesn't smile much.

[zumzero]

sweet 

[Ozymandias]

The holidays are looking to be quite merry this year (if the ability to trade shares is there)!

[kleeck]

Kleeck,

No amount of your good news will deny me the right to complain.

Lorenzo Money

For those of you NOT on IRC. I will grace you with this glorious theorycraftage:

<kleeck> Here you go guys:

1400 BTC from Avalon Refund = $770,000. If we get machines at retail value, and not cost (unlikely, but we'll do worst case scenario) it'll cost $155,598,80 for 24.576TH/s and we can afford 4.94 fully loaded Platinum miners. (I'm guessing we can get that to 5 full machines with expansions). 5 X 24.576 = 122.88 TH/s. (The $770K is based off of a $550 BTC)

100TH/s is 2% of a 5PH network, (We are at 4.8PH currently). 2% of the TNH is 72 coins a day (2% of 3600 possible coins). 72 * 7 for the weekly net amount is 504. I'll cut it in half, for reinvestment, so we can keep up with the hashrate, so 252.

252 / 10,000,000 (not counting the other 15M yet) is .0000252/share. Which is $.01386/share @ $550 a BTC each week. Not bad for paying $.25 a share initially.

<kleeck> Read it and weep.

<kleeck> WEEP I SAY!

<FunkyMunky> Boner Alert!!

<kleeck> Warning! Reading the above may cause boners.

<kleeck> Yeah. I like those numbers. We need to get this plan in motion, though.

<FunkyMunky> That warning was too late!!

Thanks for crunching the numbers and posting this.  I think I may have breached again!

Just a thought though.  Can we be absolutely sure that the Avalon refund hasn't been converted to fiat and already spent on something?  I would exercise caution in trying to second guess Ken's business moves (if that's what we're doing) as we might be setting ourselves up for a possible disappointment.  Or perhaps the Avalon refund isn't a factor as we should have the money anyway, to achieve kleeck's figures?  

As usual, I will share what I know:

Ken,

Watching the BTC value run up this evening had me thinking about the Avalon refund Bitcoins. Is that full amount still in BTC? If not how much is still in Bitcoin?

Thanks!

 

Note: Ken doesn't smile much.

Fair enough.

[Stuartuk]

So if the 1.4k BTC (or a portion) are still with us then when is the best time for Ken to convert to FIAT?

We could have got 800USD last night for them, 500 this afternoon or 700 now. Tomorrow or in a few days they could be back in the 3-400 range.

Any thoughts on this.

[kslaughter]

So if the 1.4k BTC (or a portion) are still with us then when is the best time for Ken to convert to FIAT?

We could have got 800USD last night for them, 500 this afternoon or 700 now. Tomorrow or in a few days they could be back in the 3-400 range.

Any thoughts on this.

Or next week they may be worth $2,000 each.

[Bargraphics]

So if the 1.4k BTC (or a portion) are still with us then when is the best time for Ken to convert to FIAT?

We could have got 800USD last night for them, 500 this afternoon or 700 now. Tomorrow or in a few days they could be back in the 3-400 range.

Any thoughts on this.

Or next week they may be worth $2,000 each.

You cash them in when they are needed regardless of price as at that point, the new mining equipment that comes from that will make more BTC than was cashed out by far.

Speaking of which, it is the third week of November. Some groundbreaking news should be due soon.

[Stuartuk]

So if the 1.4k BTC (or a portion) are still with us then when is the best time for Ken to convert to FIAT?

We could have got 800USD last night for them, 500 this afternoon or 700 now. Tomorrow or in a few days they could be back in the 3-400 range.

Any thoughts on this.

Or next week they may be worth $2,000 each.

Yes ofcourse - but that is a gamble. They could also be 200 USD next week and they could stay there for a month.

If we need any of the the funds that we have locked up in these BTC I would advise you to take them out today.

If we don't need the funds for development I'd be happy for you to hold them. But please do not under any circumstances rely on BTC being where it is now over the next few months. That is not written in stone.

[JoTheKhan]

So if the 1.4k BTC (or a portion) are still with us then when is the best time for Ken to convert to FIAT?

We could have got 800USD last night for them, 500 this afternoon or 700 now. Tomorrow or in a few days they could be back in the 3-400 range.

Any thoughts on this.

Or next week they may be worth $2,000 each.

You cash them in when they are needed regardless of price as at that point, the new mining equipment that comes from that will make more BTC than was cashed out by far.

Speaking of which, it is the third week of November. Some groundbreaking news should be due soon.

+1 and.. another +1

[minerpart]

Cashing them out when needed is an overly simplistic attitude in such a volatile market.

BTC is not unlike any other security on the planet. When it goes up a long way holders cash-out. That is the nature of every security and BTC is no different. That's why is was 900 one moment and 500 the next.

When price is relatively high compared to recent highs (as it is right now) you must profit-take.

[Effayy]

So if the 1.4k BTC (or a portion) are still with us then when is the best time for Ken to convert to FIAT?

We could have got 800USD last night for them, 500 this afternoon or 700 now. Tomorrow or in a few days they could be back in the 3-400 range.

Any thoughts on this.

Or next week they may be worth $2,000 each.

Exactly.  I'd say a rise has more merit than a fall next week, too.  After the US senate hearings (which are quite positive by the way), investors will be more at ease to step in, and those who may have heard of Bitcoin but haven't done any research may now start to invest as well.  Give it a week for that new money to pass through the system into a position where Bitcoin can be purchased, and boom!

[minerpart]

investors will be more at ease to step in, and those who may have heard of Bitcoin but haven't done any research may now start to invest as well. 

Do you know how many people got their fingers burned last night? You are looking at maybe 1000 Mill USD pumped into it last night from 600 up to 900USD.

On the way down to 500USD you are looking at hundreds of millions of USD lost - mostly by Chinese housewives I'd imagine. This bubble and bust may have scared an awful lot of people off.

[Bargraphics]

Thankfully shareholders have little to no say in the speculation of when to cash out BTC so I particularly won't be entertaining this discussion after this post. But just food for thought, BTC will always go up, it has been shown/proven, however you will never be able to guess what the price point will be in the immediate future so there's no reason to try and "Play the speculation game". As what has always been done in BTC Business, you cash out immediately when you receive the BTC OR you cash out when you need the USD after holding it. It is that simple.

Carry-on!

[SebastianJu]

It was a bad idea to price the miner in USD

If you price them in BTC only you won't get half as many orders. So it was not a bad idea.

Might be though he could write beneath a USD-Price. Now the problem is he is selling miners for a price that was created when a bitcoin was worth 1/5? So now buying those miners means 5 times faster ROI.
In fact i would think about buying miners too if ukyo would release my money from weexchange and if i knew when i would get that miner depending on the queue...

[minerpart]

Bargraphics you just repeated yourself.

As you did I'll repeat myself - if you don't cash out at opportune times in a very volatile market you run the risk of cashing out at a very bad price.

BTC will always go up? Like it did last night you mean? Have a look at the chart and tell us how long we had to wait to see 260 USD after the first time.