bram_vnl
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November 16, 2015, 08:03:19 PM |
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Thanks for this update, how is it possible that there is almost a fix for 51% attacks?
Not 51% attacks entirely, just double spending. There are other attacks that can be executed via 51% e.g. denial of service and this won't address those (they aren't the immediate concern as they are less likely - no financial gain) This is just an interim solution so that we can move on in the meantime, in the medium term we will be putting out better solutions. Sorry, yes just the double spending attack |
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WaterLooDown
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Activity: 924
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November 16, 2015, 09:19:44 PM |
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I have just posted a statement on our development blog regarding the events that took place this weekend, please give it a read through to know what took place and what is being done moving forward. New wallets to be released tomorrow. https://developer.gulden.com/blog/ |
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GeorgeAurea
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November 17, 2015, 12:32:46 AM |
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I have just posted a statement on our development blog regarding the events that took place this weekend, please give it a read through to know what took place and what is being done moving forward. New wallets to be released tomorrow. https://developer.gulden.com/blog/ Sweat  |
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Bluestreet
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Activity: 988
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November 17, 2015, 04:31:11 AM |
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I have just posted a statement on our development blog regarding the events that took place this weekend, please give it a read through to know what took place and what is being done moving forward. New wallets to be released tomorrow. https://developer.gulden.com/blog/ You guys are simply amazing , what a rapid response! Absolute 100% Respect to all those involved in the development team! |
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pijpenstelen
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November 17, 2015, 07:42:34 AM |
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I have just posted a statement on our development blog regarding the events that took place this weekend, please give it a read through to know what took place and what is being done moving forward. New wallets to be released tomorrow. https://developer.gulden.com/blog/ You guys are simply amazing , what a rapid response! Absolute 100% Respect to all those involved in the development team! Oh crap! What did I miss, does this affect the gulden in our wallets? |
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WaterLooDown
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Activity: 924
Merit: 1000
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November 17, 2015, 08:15:37 AM |
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I have just posted a statement on our development blog regarding the events that took place this weekend, please give it a read through to know what took place and what is being done moving forward. New wallets to be released tomorrow. https://developer.gulden.com/blog/ You guys are simply amazing , what a rapid response! Absolute 100% Respect to all those involved in the development team! Oh crap! What did I miss, does this affect the gulden in our wallets? Hey pijpenstelen, These types of attacks wouldn't cause issues with your personal funds in your wallet. It mainly affects exchanges and vendors/merchants if targeted. We will be releasing our interim solution sometime today after further testing. The testing also included doing multiple 51% attacks on our test network and the results have been excellent. |
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MaNI
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November 17, 2015, 09:21:34 AM |
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Hey pijpenstelen,
These types of attacks wouldn't cause issues with your personal funds in your wallet. It mainly affects exchanges and vendors/merchants if targeted. We will be releasing our interim solution sometime today after further testing.
The testing also included doing multiple 51% attacks on our test network and the results have been excellent.
To be more specific you are only at risk when receiving NLG in exchange for something. e.g. If someone sends you 1000000 NLG and you send them 10 BTC, that 1000000 NLG transaction might later 'disappear' leaving you with no NLG or BTC. So in short exercise extreme caution in such situations for now, although that is anyway a good idea always. |
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jwinterm
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November 17, 2015, 05:06:49 PM |
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What's the frequency of the auto-checkpointing? Wouldn't there be time for an attack between checkpoints? Are you planning to just rollback transactions to the previous checkpoint if there's another attack?
It seems very unlikely that the attacker(s) would bother with NLG again, since afaik the only exchange is Bittrex, and you can bet they're going to keep a close eye on it, but it seems a bit disingenuous to say that you have solved double spending. The only way to prevent 51% attacks and double spending is to make the coin more centralized, which seems to be what is being done, that you kind of acknowledge with statements like "We will be releasing our interim solution...", where 'interim' implies it is a quick fix that will be removed later. I mean, if you truly solved double spending without centralizing the coin, you'd get the Nobel prize for crypto or something, right?
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Dutchyyy
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November 17, 2015, 05:35:48 PM |
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What's the frequency of the auto-checkpointing? Wouldn't there be time for an attack between checkpoints? Are you planning to just rollback transactions to the previous checkpoint if there's another attack?
It seems very unlikely that the attacker(s) would bother with NLG again, since afaik the only exchange is Bittrex, and you can bet they're going to keep a close eye on it, but it seems a bit disingenuous to say that you have solved double spending. The only way to prevent 51% attacks and double spending is to make the coin more centralized, which seems to be what is being done, that you kind of acknowledge with statements like "We will be releasing our interim solution...", where 'interim' implies it is a quick fix that will be removed later. I mean, if you truly solved double spending without centralizing the coin, you'd get the Nobel prize for crypto or something, right?
"Unlikely" unless you behind the attacks? No one knows what the intentions of these attackers are and they will strike again if there is no solution. Why haven't they attacked other coins?!?! |
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TamiLee
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November 17, 2015, 05:39:59 PM |
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I have just posted a statement on our development blog regarding the events that took place this weekend, please give it a read through to know what took place and what is being done moving forward. New wallets to be released tomorrow. https://developer.gulden.com/blog/ You guys are simply amazing , what a rapid response! Absolute 100% Respect to all those involved in the development team! Oh crap! What did I miss, does this affect the gulden in our wallets? Hey pijpenstelen, These types of attacks wouldn't cause issues with your personal funds in your wallet. It mainly affects exchanges and vendors/merchants if targeted. We will be releasing our interim solution sometime today after further testing. The testing also included doing multiple 51% attacks on our test network and the results have been excellent. Since the dev team knows how to do 51% attacks will you retaliate against other coins if we get attacked again ? |
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Dutchyyy
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Activity: 1197
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November 17, 2015, 05:46:53 PM |
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I have just posted a statement on our development blog regarding the events that took place this weekend, please give it a read through to know what took place and what is being done moving forward. New wallets to be released tomorrow. https://developer.gulden.com/blog/ You guys are simply amazing , what a rapid response! Absolute 100% Respect to all those involved in the development team! Oh crap! What did I miss, does this affect the gulden in our wallets? Hey pijpenstelen, These types of attacks wouldn't cause issues with your personal funds in your wallet. It mainly affects exchanges and vendors/merchants if targeted. We will be releasing our interim solution sometime today after further testing. The testing also included doing multiple 51% attacks on our test network and the results have been excellent. Since the dev team knows how to do 51% attacks will you retaliate against other coins if we get attacked again ? This will be a good way to get the attacker to own up? |
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WaterLooDown
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Activity: 924
Merit: 1000
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November 17, 2015, 05:56:04 PM |
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I have just posted a statement on our development blog regarding the events that took place this weekend, please give it a read through to know what took place and what is being done moving forward. New wallets to be released tomorrow. https://developer.gulden.com/blog/ You guys are simply amazing , what a rapid response! Absolute 100% Respect to all those involved in the development team! Oh crap! What did I miss, does this affect the gulden in our wallets? Hey pijpenstelen, These types of attacks wouldn't cause issues with your personal funds in your wallet. It mainly affects exchanges and vendors/merchants if targeted. We will be releasing our interim solution sometime today after further testing. The testing also included doing multiple 51% attacks on our test network and the results have been excellent. Since the dev team knows how to do 51% attacks will you retaliate against other coins if we get attacked again ? This will be a good way to get the attacker to own up? The development team would never consider this even if it happened to be a specific coin behind the attacks because there will be innocent investors buying into that coin that wouldn't deserve it and we want to keep a clean slate with Gulden where no one can point fingers at us for doing something wrong to ruin the repuation of Gulden. We have to take the higher ground here and make our blockchain bulletproof while building up Gulden with the help of our great community! |
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MaNI
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November 17, 2015, 06:13:47 PM
Last edit: November 17, 2015, 06:57:16 PM by MaNI |
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Wouldn't there be time for an attack between checkpoints?
No. Are you planning to just rollback transactions to the previous checkpoint if there's another attack?
No, checkpoints are to protect vendors and users from attacks not rollback the chain. It seems very unlikely that the attacker(s) would bother with NLG again, since afaik the only exchange is Bittrex,
It seems incredibly likely that unless we put a fix in place they will do it again and again. and you can bet they're going to keep a close eye on it,
You cannot stop a double spend just by keeping a close eye on it. but it seems a bit disingenuous to say that you have solved double spending.
We have been more than clear that this is just an interim solution. In the medium and long term we plan to put better systems in place. The only way to prevent 51% attacks and double spending is to make the coin more centralized, which seems to be what is being done, that you kind of acknowledge with statements like "We will be releasing our interim solution...", where 'interim' implies it is a quick fix that will be removed later. I mean, if you truly solved double spending without centralizing the coin, you'd get the Nobel prize for crypto or something, right?
Oh right you are just here to troll without anything positive to contribute to the world, I won't waste any more valuable time explaining things to you then. |
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MaNI
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November 17, 2015, 06:15:26 PM |
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Since the dev team knows how to do 51% attacks will you retaliate against other coins if we get attacked again ?
I don't do that sort of thing, if I did I would already be retired on an island somewhere plenty of coins out there with easy to target giant vulnerabilities in them. We are here to build things not tear them down. |
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DGBforver
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November 17, 2015, 06:15:33 PM |
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Sorry to hear about the 51% attack on Gulden. The GRS devs would be our first suspects if digibyte got attacked. HR and others would testify to this.
Have you considered Multi-Algo for Gulden?
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MaNI
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November 17, 2015, 07:00:32 PM |
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Sorry to hear about the 51% attack on Gulden. The GRS devs would be our first suspects if digibyte got attacked. HR and others would testify to this.
While that may very well be true, without evidence I don't think anyone should be pointing fingers anywhere, if anyone has any evidence please feel free to come forward. Have you considered Multi-Algo for Gulden?
Yes, we don't consider it a good long term solution for Gulden, I'm not going to go into any more specifics than that, you can probably find some details earlier in this thread or on our official forums if you are interested. |
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Poleski
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Activity: 5
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November 17, 2015, 07:24:41 PM |
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Are we getting new wallets ?
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MaNI
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November 17, 2015, 09:08:22 PM |
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Are we getting new wallets ?
New wallets are in the process of being built, it takes a few hours so likely tomorrow morning. |
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jwinterm
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Activity: 3010
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November 17, 2015, 10:24:50 PM |
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How am I trolling by asking how you intend to prevent double spends? I was just curious about your plan to do it, since, as I understand it, the entire point of proof of work is to prevent double spends, and proof of work breaks down if one entity controls more than half the hash rate. It seems like an intractable problem. Sorry for asking, jeez...
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MaNI
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November 18, 2015, 05:26:41 AM |
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How am I trolling by asking how you intend to prevent double spends? I was just curious about your plan to do it, since, as I understand it, the entire point of proof of work is to prevent double spends, and proof of work breaks down if one entity controls more than half the hash rate. It seems like an intractable problem. Sorry for asking, jeez...
It is the way you word things that makes all the difference, if you actually want people to take the time to give a serious response to you then I strongly suggest you go back and look at how you have worded your last message and do the complete opposite in future. As for our medium and long term solutions, we will release more on that when we are ready, there is no point discussing it before then. |
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