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Author Topic: [XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency  (Read 4266191 times)
birr
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February 16, 2018, 06:47:41 PM
 #37881

So I've been thinking about this MoneroV fork problem. I saw the suggestion in a reddit thread about a tool that would allow monero users to specify ring signature inputs thus allowing us to sign with the same ring signature inputs that we used on the MoneroV blockchain.

I was wondering if anyone has given thought to a two pronged approach? We could additionally utilize a blacklist of ring sig inputs used on the forked chain. Some trusted team member could produce and update this blacklist. It could be a basic text file that we drag and drop into our monero directory. I know it would harm privacy to shrink the pool of available ring sig participants but we would only be blacklisting the ones used to produce the initial transaction on the MoneroV chain. So it would be a tiny tiny fraction of the ring signatures out there. Additionally new ring signature candidates are being produced constantly every 2 minutes every day.

It's a partial solution and an imperfect solution to a difficult problem but maybe worth considering.

Do you have a link to that thread? I don't know enough about this to have an opinion.

Here you go. https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/7x297t/careful_with_monero_forks_with_airdrops/du537ij/ It's a pretty simple to understand issue.
I'm trying to parse the seriousness of this... attack, for lack of a better word.
If revealing the real input was the only problem, it wouldn't bother me so much, because it's only one transaction.  Monero would live on without permanent ill effects.
But some of the reddit comments give the impression that there are knock-on effects that compromise other transactions.
My main concern is how it will affect the pool of decoy inputs.  Does the fact each transaction that's executed on both chains reveals four decoys mean that those decoys are rendered useless thereafter?  Or can the same decoys be used in future transactions safely?
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February 16, 2018, 07:15:37 PM
Merited by Hueristic (1)
 #37882

Does the fact each transaction that's executed on both chains reveals four decoys mean that those decoys are rendered useless thereafter?  Or can the same decoys be used in future transactions safely?

No you are misunderstanding. Each decoy input is SOMEONES real input. So it would only reveal that the other inputs were decoys for you not necessarily decoys for anyone else who uses them. It would reveal your real input and your decoys. So then if someone else used your real input as a decoy in the future they would have their mixin set reduced by one. So if they did a mixin 6 and it selected one of the 6 as your real input that was revealed by you spending on both chains, they would get the effect of having used mixin 5 instead.

I hope that makes sense.

As for the seriousness. It is serious. Serious in the sense that something will have to be done about it. But not serious in the sense that nothing can be done about it.

Rep Thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=381041
If one can not confer upon another a right which he does not himself first possess, by what means does the state derive the right to engage in behaviors from which the public is prohibited?
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February 16, 2018, 08:02:57 PM
 #37883

everything gold :')))
that's been a while since last time I notice XMR, price rise so quickly.
remember that time, when I chose XDN over XMR. and time pass out, XND still rise, but nowhere near XMR. . . make me fell sad so much
but now, ONION rise as very potential anonymous coin. . .
a little bit pointless comment but...any one see through ONION? please tell me your opinion.

EVERYONE can see through ONION.  It's blockchain is transparent.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=583449.msg28075509#msg28075509
sorry that's my bad English Grin
I mean if anyone take a look at ONION

by the way. if it's blockchain is transparent so why they call it anonymity.
and thanks for information ^^


Because they are unconscionable liars.  Scammers, if you will.
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February 17, 2018, 01:02:56 AM
 #37884

Some interesting discussion on the fork attack:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/7xz0mz/monero_deanonymization_or_how_i_learned_to_stop/

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February 17, 2018, 04:16:11 AM
 #37885

Ah somebody throw me some merits pls? Ive been inches away from hero when the 'merit system' came in and now like fkn miles away. lol Not that it really matters but it does

cheers

Monero - Wir sind die Leute vor denen uns unsere Eltern gewarnt haben!
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February 17, 2018, 04:25:20 AM
Merited by Nathan047 (1)
 #37886

Ah somebody throw me some merits pls? Ive been inches away from hero when the 'merit system' came in and now like fkn miles away. lol Not that it really matters but it does

cheers
Say something meritorious.

Rep Thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=381041
If one can not confer upon another a right which he does not himself first possess, by what means does the state derive the right to engage in behaviors from which the public is prohibited?
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February 17, 2018, 04:34:43 AM
Merited by explorer (3), Hueristic (1), Anon136 (1)
 #37887

Ah somebody throw me some merits pls? Ive been inches away from hero when the 'merit system' came in and now like fkn miles away. lol Not that it really matters but it does

cheers
Say something meritorious.
Ah now you want me to work for it? What is this generation coming to? Lol : fair enough.

edit: maybe this qualifies not because Im still fishing but because I still believe this maybe worth pondering on case of this and future forks which insist on not starting their own blockchain:

repost from reddit:

I proposed considering the implications of moving all our monero at a certain block after the fork and then donating the now monero empty but monerov 'airdropped' private keys to the development & research fund for purpose of obfuscation and dump of monerov. Not many takers to discuss at btctalk but reading a bit here and there makes me think that we could cause a lot of noise pointing to nowhere on their chain whilst having a nice dump of monerov at hand


//=========

and yes i  did post this in here somewhere but the silence was deafening. Maybe it is a silly idea but my game is not game theory and cryptography and so on so I am thinking about the problem from another angle

Monero - Wir sind die Leute vor denen uns unsere Eltern gewarnt haben!
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February 17, 2018, 04:54:30 AM
 #37888

I never shorted XMR but I did sell back in 2016 a huge chunk and bought Ethereum. Made a little less than $50MM, thank you ETH!

You guys really need to stop a handful of retarded devs (fat spaghetti) to force major changes without community consensus.
Monero has little time left anyway, Ethereum is about to launch ringCT and zK-Snarks, use the time you have left wisely.

Along with being a wrinkly toolbag, you are also a really amazing contrarian indicator.  I mean it's really something.
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February 17, 2018, 05:17:47 AM
 #37889

I never shorted XMR but I did sell back in 2016 a huge chunk and bought Ethereum. Made a little less than $50MM, thank you ETH!

You guys really need to stop a handful of retarded devs (fat spaghetti) to force major changes without community consensus.
Monero has little time left anyway, Ethereum is about to launch ringCT and zK-Snarks, use the time you have left wisely.

Along with being a wrinkly toolbag, you are also a really amazing contrarian indicator.  I mean it's really something.

Crazy but true.  Years on end!
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February 17, 2018, 05:19:48 AM
 #37890

Ah somebody throw me some merits pls? Ive been inches away from hero when the 'merit system' came in and now like fkn miles away. lol Not that it really matters but it does

cheers
Say something meritorious.
Ah now you want me to work for it? What is this generation coming to? Lol : fair enough.

edit: maybe this qualifies not because Im still fishing but because I still believe this maybe worth pondering on case of this and future forks which insist on not starting their own blockchain:

repost from reddit:

I proposed considering the implications of moving all our monero at a certain block after the fork and then donating the now monero empty but monerov 'airdropped' private keys to the development & research fund for purpose of obfuscation and dump of monerov. Not many takers to discuss at btctalk but reading a bit here and there makes me think that we could cause a lot of noise pointing to nowhere on their chain whilst having a nice dump of monerov at hand


//=========

and yes i  did post this in here somewhere but the silence was deafening. Maybe it is a silly idea but my game is not game theory and cryptography and so on so I am thinking about the problem from another angle


Figure a way to do it anonymously, and it sounds like a plan.  I had the idea to donate the proceeds in any case...
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February 17, 2018, 08:53:46 AM
 #37891

Long time since I've posted here.  Have been busy running my mining rigs and other crypto projects.  Can someone give me a State of the Union run down on Monero and what has been going on and what is coming up for the year?

Links or replies will work for me.  Hope everyone is well here.  This has always been my go to place for Monero news and problem solving.  

Multisig, sub-addresses, default fee reduction (what else?) in next month's fork.  Bulletproofs next fork after (massive reduction in tx size and fees)

monero hardware wallet soon, ledger nano s soon.

Our very own premine scam fork, moneroV soon.

network hash rate + GH/s

tons of media on web browser miners and 'crypto jacking' bot nets

That's a quick rundown off the top of my head.

Thank you.  

globee payment processor / merchands some time ago
xmr.to
android wallet

probably more

ah yeah: FluffyGate ....

Of course! The integration of XMR.to into the Monerujo Android wallet was epic!  Monero usability grows and grows!

Yeeaaahhhh that's right, except that the paymnet ID generator in the monerujo wallet has 16 digits and we need 32 digits. So dear MONERUJO DEV, please change that to 32 digits!!!

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February 17, 2018, 08:34:52 PM
 #37892

But even in peeling a bit of the history doesn't help you know anything about now.

*edit*

I mean knowing an address in bitcoin = all transactions revealed

Knowing an address in monero and maybe 1 or 2 old transactions = nothing

Day after fork we can all move everything, what do they know ?





Higher for the hardcore
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February 17, 2018, 08:50:03 PM
 #37893

This thread is insanely long. Is monero superior compared to dash and zcash?

Woah, welcome to 2016 or was it 2015? Anyway there is a thread with that exact title so try the search function.

Does the fact each transaction that's executed on both chains reveals four decoys mean that those decoys are rendered useless thereafter?  Or can the same decoys be used in future transactions safely?

No you are misunderstanding. Each decoy input is SOMEONES real input. So it would only reveal that the other inputs were decoys for you not necessarily decoys for anyone else who uses them. It would reveal your real input and your decoys. So then if someone else used your real input as a decoy in the future they would have their mixin set reduced by one. So if they did a mixin 6 and it selected one of the 6 as your real input that was revealed by you spending on both chains, they would get the effect of having used mixin 5 instead.

I hope that makes sense.

As for the seriousness. It is serious. Serious in the sense that something will have to be done about it. But not serious in the sense that nothing can be done about it.

Very nice explanation +m Smiley

Hey Crypto People,

I've seen discussion about how using a unique ringsize (EG 41) is a problem for privacy.

Would it be possible to use CT/Pederson commits/range proof magical crypto stuff to hide the ringsize from everyone that doesn't need to know it?

I'm sure Confidential Ringsize is a silly idea, but would like to know exactly why. Tongue

LOL

sorry that's my bad English Grin
I mean if anyone take a look at ONION

by the way. if it's blockchain is transparent so why they call it anonymity.
and thanks for information ^^


Because they are unconscionable liars.  Scammers, if you will.

This, but the idea of the "airdrop" (sig campain for premined coins) was really a great plan for getting all the scammers to come out and shill for them. Great Marketing even if completely deceptive.


I blame fluoride.



Ah somebody throw me some merits pls? Ive been inches away from hero when the 'merit system' came in and now like fkn miles away. lol Not that it really matters but it does

cheers
Say something meritorious.
Ah now you want me to work for it? What is this generation coming to? Lol : fair enough.

edit: maybe this qualifies not because Im still fishing but because I still believe this maybe worth pondering on case of this and future forks which insist on not starting their own blockchain:

repost from reddit:

I proposed considering the implications of moving all our monero at a certain block after the fork and then donating the now monero empty but monerov 'airdropped' private keys to the development & research fund for purpose of obfuscation and dump of monerov. Not many takers to discuss at btctalk but reading a bit here and there makes me think that we could cause a lot of noise pointing to nowhere on their chain whilst having a nice dump of monerov at hand


//=========

and yes i  did post this in here somewhere but the silence was deafening. Maybe it is a silly idea but my game is not game theory and cryptography and so on so I am thinking about the problem from another angle


sorry I missed the earlier post or I would have merited it then! Smiley

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February 17, 2018, 08:51:07 PM
 #37894

txs fees are a joke! what are you doing it about it? how will ever small time miners be able to afford just the exit fee from their pools?

they will not... thats the issue here

MiGold // The gold mining ICO  (https://www.migold.io/)
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February 17, 2018, 09:12:30 PM
Merited by Anon136 (1)
 #37895

txs fees are a joke! what are you doing it about it? how will ever small time miners be able to afford just the exit fee from their pools?

they will not... thats the issue here

If you can't handle a 75 cent tx fee, you should mine a bit more before withdrawing.  If your pool is charging you more than that(that right there is the issue), then you should do your due diligence, and find a pool that isn't going to rip you off Huh
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February 17, 2018, 10:01:26 PM
 #37896

txs fees are a joke! what are you doing it about it? how will ever small time miners be able to afford just the exit fee from their pools?

If you can't handle a 75 cent tx fee, you should mine a bit more before withdrawing.  If your pool is charging you more than that(that right there is the issue), then you should do your due diligence, and find a pool that isn't going to rip you off Huh
Don't forget the Elephant in the room. Bitcoin's fees are much higher, and any other coin that starts getting a bunch of traffic (e.g. Ethereum) will have their fees climb too.

Cryptos are still in development.

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February 17, 2018, 10:10:11 PM
 #37897

txs fees are a joke! what are you doing it about it? how will ever small time miners be able to afford just the exit fee from their pools?

If you can't handle a 75 cent tx fee, you should mine a bit more before withdrawing.  If your pool is charging you more than that(that right there is the issue), then you should do your due diligence, and find a pool that isn't going to rip you off Huh
Don't forget the Elephant in the room. Bitcoin's fees are much higher, and any other coin that starts getting a bunch of traffic (e.g. Ethereum) will have their fees climb too.

Cryptos are still in development.

Except that Monero fees reduce with increased traffic.  And Bullet Proofs are coming...  

via Imgflip Meme Generator
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February 17, 2018, 10:44:36 PM
 #37898

From what I can gather here this Monerov fork is considered a bad thing? But why is that actually case? Are they going to harm the XMR by forking it?

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February 17, 2018, 11:31:06 PM
 #37899

https://shouldhaveusedmonero.xyz/

Is the site not being actively run anymore? I really liked the concept.

In summary, the Intel Management Engine and its applications are a backdoor with total access to and control over the rest of the PC. The ME is a threat to freedom, security, and privacy, and the libreboot project strongly recommends avoiding it entirely. Since recent versions of it can’t be removed, this means avoiding all recent generations of Intel hardware. details https://libreboot.org/faq.html#intelme --- https://tehnoetic.com/laptops --- https://store.vikings.net/x200-ryf-certfied
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February 17, 2018, 11:47:41 PM
 #37900

From what I can gather here this Monerov fork is considered a bad thing? But why is that actually case? Are they going to harm the XMR by forking it?

If you can't scroll up several posts, I'm not sure this will help you, but:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=583449.msg30446883#msg30446883
Pages: « 1 ... 1845 1846 1847 1848 1849 1850 1851 1852 1853 1854 1855 1856 1857 1858 1859 1860 1861 1862 1863 1864 1865 1866 1867 1868 1869 1870 1871 1872 1873 1874 1875 1876 1877 1878 1879 1880 1881 1882 1883 1884 1885 1886 1887 1888 1889 1890 1891 1892 1893 1894 [1895] 1896 1897 1898 1899 1900 1901 1902 1903 1904 1905 1906 1907 1908 1909 1910 1911 1912 1913 1914 1915 1916 1917 1918 1919 1920 1921 1922 1923 1924 1925 1926 1927 1928 1929 1930 1931 1932 1933 1934 1935 1936 1937 1938 1939 1940 1941 1942 1943 1944 1945 ... 2008 »
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