NEM (XEM) Official Thread - 100% New Code - Easy To Use APIs

[makoto1337]

8b? Really? Didn't see that one coming.. It must be for reasons other than just that 4 = death in China? Or atleast a good reason on top of that..

If it is for any reason, it is this reason: https://forum.nemcoin.com/index.php?topic=2531.msg6776#msg6776. No one ever shot it down yet with a more solid counter proposal. 8 is an incidental change to the argument that I have put forth.

If I have my way 10 Billion coins would be a good round number if we are going to increase it.

How about 13.37 billion coins?

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[fragout]

For the unclaimed stakes, the idea of putting them into a venture capital fund to feed the NEM ecosystem seems to have a lot of support. This fund would be a legal entity that is incorporated in some country and will be managed by professional fund managers who have their identities public. This would be completely outside of the control of the NEM dev team. All NEMsters would benefit by having the fund pay dividends to stake holders.



How would this fund work in practice? . I mean if you issue the fund with unclaimed stakes, the only way they can use them to invest in anything is to dump NEM on the market for BTC/cash or am I missing something?

[rockethead]

8b? Really? Didn't see that one coming.. It must be for reasons other than just that 4 = death in China? Or atleast a good reason on top of that..

If it is for any reason, it is this reason: https://forum.nemcoin.com/index.php?topic=2531.msg6776#msg6776. No one ever shot it down yet with a more solid counter proposal. 8 is an incidental change to the argument that I have put forth.

If I have my way 10 Billion coins would be a good round number if we are going to increase it.

How about 13.37 billion coins?

If you add the digits together it is 14. Chinese won't like it.

[bitdraw]

why not give the rest away to new users? wouldnt it be in the interest of NEM to reach as many people as possible?

No, as continuously giving away coins mean that existing owners (especially those who paid for it on Nxt AE)  continue to lose money. We had one IPO -- not a hundred where you continue to give away coins forever. The new users should buy it . There should be reasons that they should be tempted to buy it.  

Aruracoin gave the whole country of Iceland "free" coins. It didn't gain "users" -- instead it killed aruracoin as those who got it for free immediately dumped them for BTC. Aurora is dead now.

i think you are pointing out a very valid conflict with free ipos. some people got it for free(or a minimal pocket change) at the start cause they were lucky enough to be at the right place at the right time, and the rest gets kinda left behind. so basically some get gifted, some not. that makes it even harder to convince people to invest into something, others got for nearly free.

This makes it necessary that you offer really strong reasons for new people to join the movement! Its hard to convince people to join something that gives and in the process of it give someone else a 1000% profit on his investment. Not to say its not gonna work!

[rockethead]

For the unclaimed stakes, the idea of putting them into a venture capital fund to feed the NEM ecosystem seems to have a lot of support. This fund would be a legal entity that is incorporated in some country and will be managed by professional fund managers who have their identities public. This would be completely outside of the control of the NEM dev team. All NEMsters would benefit by having the fund pay dividends to stake holders.



How would this fund work in practice? . I mean if you issue the fund with unclaimed stakes, the only way they can use them to invest in anything is to dump NEM on the market for BTC/cash or am I missing something?

No one is going to dump just like that. It should be controlled release. e.g., staff are paid in NEMs, payments are made in NEM. Release should not be a huge dump, although there may be instances where a few investee companies will need money and may coincide. But if this is well planned, then they shouldn't happen.

Otherwise, like what Pat mentioned earlier, if we can put that in a bank and collateralise the value against fiat, then we would borrow in fiat. So, long that we take cognizance of the impact this can be controlled.

[rockethead]

why not give the rest away to new users? wouldnt it be in the interest of NEM to reach as many people as possible?

No, as continuously giving away coins mean that existing owners (especially those who paid for it on Nxt AE)  continue to lose money. We had one IPO -- not a hundred where you continue to give away coins forever. The new users should buy it . There should be reasons that they should be tempted to buy it.  

Aruracoin gave the whole country of Iceland "free" coins. It didn't gain "users" -- instead it killed aruracoin as those who got it for free immediately dumped them for BTC. Aurora is dead now.

i think you are pointing out a very valid conflict with free ipos. some people got it for free(or a minimal pocket change) at the start cause they were lucky enough to be at the right place at the right time, and the rest gets kinda left behind. so basically some get gifted, some not. that makes it even harder to convince people to invest into something, others got for nearly free.

This makes it necessary that you offer really strong reasons for new people to join the movement! Its hard to convince people to join something that gives and in the process of it give someone else a 1000% profit on his investment. Not to say its not gonna work!

All for the same reason why  unclaimed and sock coins should not be burnt. It will only consolidate the holdings of the balance of NS to a better position when most got them for literally next to nothing.

[yufu571]

PHASE 2 FOR BTT HAS STARTED
We'll update OPs here and on forum.nemcoin.com soon but i didn't want to let you guys wait.

register address and token here -> chain.nem.ninja/stakes
chain.nem.ninja/stakes/registered shows all registered with address AND token + all received NEMStake assets from the NXT AE. Everyone please check if your are there after you've registered or sent your asset

Remember to read up on how to create a REAL address https://forum.nemcoin.com/index.php?topic=2488.0 and in other threads on that forum.

thanks! i registered successfully!
as to those unclaimed and sock coins, i hope to burn them!

[bitdraw]

why not give the rest away to new users? wouldnt it be in the interest of NEM to reach as many people as possible?

No, as continuously giving away coins mean that existing owners (especially those who paid for it on Nxt AE)  continue to lose money. We had one IPO -- not a hundred where you continue to give away coins forever. The new users should buy it . There should be reasons that they should be tempted to buy it.  

Aruracoin gave the whole country of Iceland "free" coins. It didn't gain "users" -- instead it killed aruracoin as those who got it for free immediately dumped them for BTC. Aurora is dead now.

i think you are pointing out a very valid conflict with free ipos. some people got it for free(or a minimal pocket change) at the start cause they were lucky enough to be at the right place at the right time, and the rest gets kinda left behind. so basically some get gifted, some not. that makes it even harder to convince people to invest into something, others got for nearly free.

This makes it necessary that you offer really strong reasons for new people to join the movement! Its hard to convince people to join something that gives and in the process of it give someone else a 1000% profit on his investment. Not to say its not gonna work!

All for the same reason why  unclaimed and sock coins should not be burnt. It will only consolidate the holdings of the balance of NS to a better position when most got them for literally next to nothing.

Agree. It would be better to actually use the non-claimed stakes for something useful that boosts the project in one way or another.

I think you have a simple conflict here.. people who already got their cheap stakes and want to have even more profit vs. people who stumbled upon NEM at a later point in time and want to join the movement without spending lots more than the original stakeholders. Id say its a basic greed game...

im quite excited how this one plays out

[dodgecharger]

For the unclaimed stakes, the idea of putting them into a venture capital fund to feed the NEM ecosystem seems to have a lot of support. This fund would be a legal entity that is incorporated in some country and will be managed by professional fund managers who have their identities public. This would be completely outside of the control of the NEM dev team. All NEMsters would benefit by having the fund pay dividends to stake holders.



How would this fund work in practice? . I mean if you issue the fund with unclaimed stakes, the only way they can use them to invest in anything is to dump NEM on the market for BTC/cash or am I missing something?

very interesting,  I Have a feeling this is going to be massive 

[rockethead]

why not give the rest away to new users? wouldnt it be in the interest of NEM to reach as many people as possible?

No, as continuously giving away coins mean that existing owners (especially those who paid for it on Nxt AE)  continue to lose money. We had one IPO -- not a hundred where you continue to give away coins forever. The new users should buy it . There should be reasons that they should be tempted to buy it.  

Aruracoin gave the whole country of Iceland "free" coins. It didn't gain "users" -- instead it killed aruracoin as those who got it for free immediately dumped them for BTC. Aurora is dead now.

i think you are pointing out a very valid conflict with free ipos. some people got it for free(or a minimal pocket change) at the start cause they were lucky enough to be at the right place at the right time, and the rest gets kinda left behind. so basically some get gifted, some not. that makes it even harder to convince people to invest into something, others got for nearly free.

This makes it necessary that you offer really strong reasons for new people to join the movement! Its hard to convince people to join something that gives and in the process of it give someone else a 1000% profit on his investment. Not to say its not gonna work!

All for the same reason why  unclaimed and sock coins should not be burnt. It will only consolidate the holdings of the balance of NS to a better position when most got them for literally next to nothing.

Agree. It would be better to actually use the non-claimed stakes for something useful that boosts the project in one way or another.

I think you have a simple conflict here.. people who already got their cheap stakes and want to have even more profit vs. people who stumbled upon NEM at a later point in time and want to join the movement without spending lots more than the original stakeholders. Id say its a basic greed game...

im quite excited how this one plays out

You know what? I came in late to the game and I had no freebies. I paid high for my stakes in the AE. And I ain't complaining at all. I am dead against giving more freebies. Sometimes, it makes one get angry because in the first place all these fudsters and trollers are just kicking so much dust without ever helping the cause at all. They only arouse bad thoughts among the weak followers. They are good for nothing and they deserve nothing at all.

It is at these times, that I favor centralized decisions and cut the shit out of everyone, so long  that the conscience is clear and that something good is done and no fund is being squandered away. After all, most came with nothing and should deserve nothing if they don't contribute. At least the devs contributed to the very existence of NEM. Even if they say they want to control, we should be happy that many of us got them for almost next to nothing. In a level playing field, who should deserve more, the fudsters? The trollers? The fence sitters? The supporters? The AE owners like yours truly who paid probably 50 times more than some and infinitely more than the rest? The contributors? The devs and core team?

I leave that for you all to answer. And if no one has a better answer, it is better to STFU.

[makoto1337]

For the unclaimed stakes, the idea of putting them into a venture capital fund to feed the NEM ecosystem seems to have a lot of support. This fund would be a legal entity that is incorporated in some country and will be managed by professional fund managers who have their identities public. This would be completely outside of the control of the NEM dev team. All NEMsters would benefit by having the fund pay dividends to stake holders.



How would this fund work in practice? . I mean if you issue the fund with unclaimed stakes, the only way they can use them to invest in anything is to dump NEM on the market for BTC/cash or am I missing something?

very interesting,  I Have a feeling this is going to be massive 

I don't know of any other currency that has done something like this. It could be really huge and it would benefit all the stakeholders.

[illodin]

Sorry this is just too long of a thread to keep up with, but what was the reason you lose 25% if you missed the Phase 1 deadline?

[jabo38]

PHASE 2 FOR BTT HAS STARTED
We'll update OPs here and on forum.nemcoin.com soon but i didn't want to let you guys wait.

register address and token here -> chain.nem.ninja/stakes
chain.nem.ninja/stakes/registered shows all registered with address AND token + all received NEMStake assets from the NXT AE. Everyone please check if your are there after you've registered or sent your asset

Remember to read up on how to create a REAL address https://forum.nemcoin.com/index.php?topic=2488.0 and in other threads on that forum.

You know... a lot of people here take the time to rake all of you folks that burn your time over the coals, but not enough people stop to say "thanks". Thanks Pat, nice work. You did a good job dealing with a lot of coordination.

Well said, thanks Pat

KC

Much appreciated !

+1  I really appreciate all your hardwork.  I know there have been many long hours on many long days.

[jabo38]

Sorry this is just too long of a thread to keep up with, but what was the reason you lose 25% if you missed the Phase 1 deadline?

It was basically a compromise of lots of people wanting different things so that was the middle ground.

[jabo38]

Eadeqa your supposed to be a "respected" member of the nxt community.. stop talking shit about nem as if nem has done something to personally harm you. i know you want to "fit in with the gang" and all but this is just lowering you to a bottom feeding troll destroying what ever respect you had.

This isn't a new point.  Nxt didn't have development fund, so unclaimed coins went to development development.  Nem already allocated 25% for the development, and now they are planning to add unclaimed coins to that stash, growing the development fund to 50%.   I mentioned this months ago, and back then Jaguar acknowledge this could become a problem. Nothing has been done to fix it, except doing exactly what I warned will happen.  Nem has the biggest percentage of coins controlled by the developers, only behind Ripple.

50% of coins would be controlled by the developers.

If this is true than 50% is way too much! The develompent funds should not exceed 25%. If it does, this will haunt us like NXT initial distribution forever! These unclaimed stakes need to be burned or distributed to the current users! Heck, 2000 initial users is still amazing, even if we don't get to the number of 3000. NXT had only 71!!

Dev team will not control the unclaimed stakes or socks from socks. No one ever said we would. Don't listen to trolls for your information

What to do with the unclaimed stakes and stakes from socks has been discussed and is being discussed on our forums at forum.nemcoin.com

For the unclaimed stakes, the idea of putting them into a venture capital fund to feed the NEM ecosystem seems to have a lot of support. This fund would be a legal entity that is incorporated in some country and will be managed by professional fund managers who have their identities public. This would be completely outside of the control of the NEM dev team. All NEMsters would benefit by having the fund pay dividends to stake holders.

For the socks, nothing has really been discussed yet as we don't have all the final numbers public. There are some proposals to redistribute to those who run nodes, at least for part of the stakes. There will probably be 3-4 different uses for the stakes for the benefit of all NEM stakeholders. These stakes won't be controlled by the dev team.

As a side note, I think there is a good chance to go with 8 billion NEM

That was a lot of good information.  

[nembit86]

Sorry this is just too long of a thread to keep up with, but what was the reason you lose 25% if you missed the Phase 1 deadline?

A PENALTY for those who dont keep up with the thread/project and participate at least once in a while.

[JakeThePanda]

For the unclaimed stakes, the idea of putting them into a venture capital fund to feed the NEM ecosystem seems to have a lot of support. This fund would be a legal entity that is incorporated in some country and will be managed by professional fund managers who have their identities public. This would be completely outside of the control of the NEM dev team. All NEMsters would benefit by having the fund pay dividends to stake holders.



How would this fund work in practice? . I mean if you issue the fund with unclaimed stakes, the only way they can use them to invest in anything is to dump NEM on the market for BTC/cash or am I missing something?

I guess I'm the only one that thinks unclaimed stakes should remain in a holding fund waiting to be claimed.  They should remain forever waiting to be claimed.  Stealing someones money because they are inactive for not even a year yet?  That's something a bank would do.    Each stake is worth thousands of USD right out of the gate.  It just seems wrong to me.

[rockethead]

For the unclaimed stakes, the idea of putting them into a venture capital fund to feed the NEM ecosystem seems to have a lot of support. This fund would be a legal entity that is incorporated in some country and will be managed by professional fund managers who have their identities public. This would be completely outside of the control of the NEM dev team. All NEMsters would benefit by having the fund pay dividends to stake holders.



How would this fund work in practice? . I mean if you issue the fund with unclaimed stakes, the only way they can use them to invest in anything is to dump NEM on the market for BTC/cash or am I missing something?

I guess I'm the only one that thinks unclaimed stakes should remain in a holding fund waiting to be claimed.  They should remain forever waiting to be claimed.  Stealing someones money because they are inactive for not even a year yet?  That's something a bank would do. 

And how would you propose to do that?

[JakeThePanda]

For the unclaimed stakes, the idea of putting them into a venture capital fund to feed the NEM ecosystem seems to have a lot of support. This fund would be a legal entity that is incorporated in some country and will be managed by professional fund managers who have their identities public. This would be completely outside of the control of the NEM dev team. All NEMsters would benefit by having the fund pay dividends to stake holders.



How would this fund work in practice? . I mean if you issue the fund with unclaimed stakes, the only way they can use them to invest in anything is to dump NEM on the market for BTC/cash or am I missing something?

I guess I'm the only one that thinks unclaimed stakes should remain in a holding fund waiting to be claimed.  They should remain forever waiting to be claimed.  Stealing someones money because they are inactive for not even a year yet?  That's something a bank would do.  

And how would you propose to do that?

I'm not a tech guys. I'm sure the genius programmers can figure it out.

[rockethead]

For the unclaimed stakes, the idea of putting them into a venture capital fund to feed the NEM ecosystem seems to have a lot of support. This fund would be a legal entity that is incorporated in some country and will be managed by professional fund managers who have their identities public. This would be completely outside of the control of the NEM dev team. All NEMsters would benefit by having the fund pay dividends to stake holders.



How would this fund work in practice? . I mean if you issue the fund with unclaimed stakes, the only way they can use them to invest in anything is to dump NEM on the market for BTC/cash or am I missing something?

I guess I'm the only one that thinks unclaimed stakes should remain in a holding fund waiting to be claimed.  They should remain forever waiting to be claimed.  Stealing someones money because they are inactive for not even a year yet?  That's something a bank would do.  

And how would you propose to do that?

I'm not a tech guys. I'm sure the genius programmers can figure it out.

Precisely the point. If you cannot have an answer it is also likely no one has the answer because it is not possible. How can a BTT account be clean from hackers who will be hacking their lives away to claim the NEM Stakes? BTT accounts are beyond anyone's control in the NEM development.

Don't need a rocket scientist to think this through.