[HYP] HyperStake | Generous Reward Staking | Advanced Staking Controls & Wallet

[ruddsd01]

and you sir just made my day.

w00t!

Glad to help. This version is a big improvement. 

Now we just need the price to go back up.

Why is the order book on Poloniex stuffed with sell orders of 50-100 HYP?

I´m pretty sure the answer is ¨someone is manipulating the price,¨but I thought I´d ask anyway.

[1714638529]

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[mtwelve]

Literally begging the question, but yup bascially

[billotronic]

and you sir just made my day.

w00t!

Glad to help. This version is a big improvement.  

Oh man it sure is!

The themes were not in the build I upped for you but they are a bit buggy still on OSX (on my to do list)

I don't know what presstab will want to do but if nothing else I will send you a link for another build tomorrow with the themes and one more double check that I have fixed my build issues. Thanks again for bringing this to my attention bud.

[Biomech]

and you sir just made my day.

w00t!

Glad to help. This version is a big improvement. 

Now we just need the price to go back up.

Why is the order book on Poloniex stuffed with sell orders of 50-100 HYP?

I´m pretty sure the answer is ¨someone is manipulating the price,¨but I thought I´d ask anyway.

Selling "at market" is a stupid plan. I'd like everyone reading this to read that again. Hell, I'll repeat it. Selling "at market" is a stupid plan. If everyone who has a sell order up would take it down RIGHT NOW and relist at 2K satoshis or higher, do you really think no one would buy?

[ruddsd01]

and you sir just made my day.

w00t!

Glad to help. This version is a big improvement.  

Oh man it sure is!

The themes were not in the build I upped for you but they are a bit buggy still on OSX (on my to do list)

I don't know what presstab will want to do but if nothing else I will send you a link for another build tomorrow with the themes and one more double check that I have fixed my build issues. Thanks again for bringing this to my attention bud.

If that´s how I can help, I´m glad to.  I wish I had more time.

There´s work, a class I´ve been taking, and some major personal stuff going on.
These days, if I get my pants on the right way, it´s a good day!

[mtwelve]

hi all , just a small comment about the market .
things are moving on Polo and this is good.
All we need is more pressure on the sell orders, so please for the ones how have some HYP on polo, remove your orders and stake !!!!
There is no point to sell at this current price, panic sell has already passed.
Thanx to presstab,david and the others for being faithful to HYP.

What incited the panic sell anyways? All I assumed it was the price was super high so people started cashing out....

[Biomech]

hi all , just a small comment about the market .
things are moving on Polo and this is good.
All we need is more pressure on the sell orders, so please for the ones how have some HYP on polo, remove your orders and stake !!!!
There is no point to sell at this current price, panic sell has already passed.
Thanx to presstab,david and the others for being faithful to HYP.

What incited the panic sell anyways? All I assumed it was the price was super high so people started cashing out....

Never look for logic in a panic. The two are incompatible. There was NO fundamental change in HyperStake or it's development. Just the usual continual improvements and tweaks. Somebody, somewhere, got their panties in a wad, and ten other idiots followed suit, which attracted a bunch of other idiots which propelled me into the top 250 on the Richlist. Fun as that was, I'm out of BTC, and tired of the idiots controlling the market. I'm not ready to sell yet, and will not be until I have at least 100K HYP. When I am, I'll list 25% across two markets, possibly three. I will not list for less than 2K sats, and if it sits and rots, so be it. If a bunch of us do that, it won't.

[mtwelve]

I'll follow suit, listing no less thank 2k sats, when I get 100k at least

[David Latapie]

Selling "at market" is a stupid plan. I'd like everyone reading this to read that again. Hell, I'll repeat it. Selling "at market" is a stupid plan. If everyone who has a sell order up would take it down RIGHT NOW and relist at 2K satoshis or higher, do you really think no one would buy?

Easy tactic: Place a sell order at the second topmost price.
Why?
- Sell order for not dumping and what Biomech said
- Second topmost instead of topmost because topmost is used by bot. Second topmost may be used by bots too but less of a risk. You can sell at third topmost too (or even farther away from spread) but I doubt most people have the required patience (like for selling at 2K). Plus, selling consistently reduces volatility.

Update: if you sell order is not processed, don't close your sell order to place a sell order at a lower price. Just wait for you next stake.

[billotronic]

and you sir just made my day.

w00t!

Glad to help. This version is a big improvement.  

Oh man it sure is!

The themes were not in the build I upped for you but they are a bit buggy still on OSX (on my to do list)

I don't know what presstab will want to do but if nothing else I will send you a link for another build tomorrow with the themes and one more double check that I have fixed my build issues. Thanks again for bringing this to my attention bud.

If that´s how I can help, I´m glad to.  I wish I had more time.

There´s work, a class I´ve been taking, and some major personal stuff going on.
These days, if I get my pants on the right way, it´s a good day!

ha, you have no idea how handy it is to have one more person I can ask to test my builds... especially since you are running something older then 10.9 (which til now I was lacking) so again, thank you.

I will trade you your stress for my twins. . . and maybe some hyp to sweeten the deal

hi all , just a small comment about the market .
things are moving on Polo and this is good.
All we need is more pressure on the sell orders, so please for the ones how have some HYP on polo, remove your orders and stake !!!!
There is no point to sell at this current price, panic sell has already passed.
Thanx to presstab,david and the others for being faithful to HYP.

What incited the panic sell anyways? All I assumed it was the price was super high so people started cashing out....

Never look for logic in a panic. The two are incompatible. There was NO fundamental change in HyperStake or it's development. Just the usual continual improvements and tweaks. Somebody, somewhere, got their panties in a wad, and ten other idiots followed suit, which attracted a bunch of other idiots which propelled me into the top 250 on the Richlist. Fun as that was, I'm out of BTC, and tired of the idiots controlling the market. I'm not ready to sell yet, and will not be until I have at least 100K HYP. When I am, I'll list 25% across two markets, possibly three. I will not list for less than 2K sats, and if it sits and rots, so be it. If a bunch of us do that, it won't.

I'd say don't look for logic in general in the markets... there is no real rhyme or reason to prices or demand... just what the vultures think they can make a quick buck on.

[David Latapie]

We'll all probably get away with it (staking small'ish blocks) for another month or so, but I'm guesstimating that soon enough, we'll stop worrying about hitting the cap, and start worrying about having enough size/weight to stake before reaching 30 days maturity.
Personally, my block sizes are anything between 2K ~ 4K at the moment, but by the end of the month I'll be aiming at 3K+ blocks.

I just realised this could prove bad for network security, since bigger blocks => less block => less security.

I'd like your input on this. Extending max age or removing it altogether (like Blackcoin was the first to do, I think) would alleviate this issue and would lead to ever-diminishing blocks (and would require a hard fork). Difficulty would rise exponentially.
OTOH, after a transition phase from small blocks to large blocks during which network security would be reduced, we would again gain network security because inflation would lead to more block. Security/Difficulty would increase smaller, though (the larger the blocks, the smaller the difficulty rise).

Opinions?

[nioc]

David, since your concern is the security of the network I imagine you have a minimum diff as a target.  With that parameter you can then play with the others.

[David Latapie]

 Some new calculations. My point is that having 100% fail at 71200 means either very bad luck or that 71200 has a somehow low probability of staking (keep in mind that the population is onlt 2 blocks, so not statistically significant, though). Although, I have daily stakes of lower block (the power of randomness/nonce)
So, I'm heading to a higher block size and try with 4000, which should give 115491 weight, 60% more weight than a 2400 block. FYI, a block of 3000 would give 20% more weight. The table below shows which values are verified and which are extrapolated

 
 Size   Days   Weight
 2000      9    17341 (verified)
 2400     30    71200 (verified, 2 out of 2 did not stake after 3 days)
 3000      9    26011 (extrapolated)
 3000     30    86616 (extrapolated)
 4000      9    34682 (extrapolated)
 4000     30   115491 (extrapolated, if no 71200 block stake after 3 days, either particularly bad luck or low probability with 71200, thus trying 115491)

Update1:

David, since your concern is the security of the network I imagine you have a minimum diff as a target.  With that parameter you can then play with the others.

I don't have a diff target, I just speculate on the variation of diff.

Update2: due to present low diff, I have an unusually lot of blocks staking now. I don't expect this (relatively) low diff to last, though, so it should not impact my considerations.

[Biomech]

We'll all probably get away with it (staking small'ish blocks) for another month or so, but I'm guesstimating that soon enough, we'll stop worrying about hitting the cap, and start worrying about having enough size/weight to stake before reaching 30 days maturity.
Personally, my block sizes are anything between 2K ~ 4K at the moment, but by the end of the month I'll be aiming at 3K+ blocks.

I just realised this could prove bad for network security, since bigger blocks => less block => less security.

I'd like your input on this. Extending max age or removing it altogether (like Blackcoin was the first to do, I think) would alleviate this issue and would lead to ever-diminishing blocks (and would require a hard fork). Difficulty would rise exponentially.
OTOH, after a transition phase from small blocks to large blocks during which network security would be reduced, we would again gain network security because inflation would lead to more block. Security/Difficulty would increase smaller, though (the larger the blocks, the smaller the difficulty rise).

Opinions?

I have no math to back this, but my take is that it will make little difference to security. Large blocks will stake faster, small blocks will take longer, but the network will continue to adjust to meet the time per block specifications. I suspect we'll see wild swings in difficulty as people figure out the optimum (for them) method of staking, but that over time it will stabilize. I'm not fully versed in the difficulty adjustment specs for HyperStake, but I believe it readjusts with every block, so the security risk is minimal.

[presstab]

Some new calculations. My point is that having 100% fail at 71200 means either very bad luck or that 71200 has a somehow low probability of staking (keep in mind that the population is onlt 2 blocks, so not statistically significant, though). Although, I have daily stakes of lower block (the power of randomness/nonce)
So, I'm heading to a higher block size and try with 4000, which should give 115491 weight, 60% more weight than a 2400 block. FYI, a block of 3000 would give 20% more weight. The table below shows which values are verified and which are extrapolated

 
 Size   Days   Weight
 2000      9    17341 (verified)
 2400     30    71200 (verified, 2 out of 2 did not stake after 3 days)
 3000      9    26011 (extrapolated)
 3000     30    86616 (extrapolated)
 4000      9    34682 (extrapolated)
 4000     30   115491 (extrapolated, if no 71200 block stake after 3 days, either particularly bad luck or low probability with 71200, thus trying 115491)

Update1:

David, since your concern is the security of the network I imagine you have a minimum diff as a target.  With that parameter you can then play with the others.

I don't have a diff target, I just speculate on the variation of diff.

Update2: due to present low diff, I have an unusually lot of blocks staking now. I don't expect this (relatively) low diff to last, though, so it should not impact my considerations.

A sampling of 6 blocks does very little to prove anything, let me share my wonderful little world of block experimentation to help the cause.

8 blocks of 2021 - 21.5 days old - current weight 42,890 - 5/8 (62.8%) have staked.
http://hyp.cryptospread.com:2751/tx/17014e3158cee1a8b82a4f924cb3f365ea0647abc94037c50fe44c4997823799

13 blocks of 1489 - 16.43 days old - current weight 23,982 - 3/13 (23%) have staked
http://hyp.cryptospread.com:2751/tx/5ba42f3150d0ae2f7d1c8ec3842a6398105ef7d8c256ce39dce0583b81c67b08

13 blocks of 1609 - 22.46 days old - current weight 35,605 - 8/13 (61.5%) have staked
http://hyp.cryptospread.com:2751/tx/e43f33b761327086152d4a986c8e2e21b78ca761918df98538c3e09d72f42459

17 blocks of 778 - 24.88 days old - current weight 19,113 - 8/17 (47%) have staked
http://hyp.cryptospread.com:2751/tx/f3aab183bbdf72ffb3c2b945889587401c648597b9a38f657cc63e5f75ddb7b3

46 blocks of 900 - 25.96 days old - current weight 23,094 - 24/46 (52%) have staked
http://hyp.cryptospread.com:2751/tx/f00145e34c3168cc8df9699274dc358962965fe95ce0f8dc1d82e36225127949

51 blocks of 963 - 26.47 days old - current weight 25,190 - 27/51 (52%) have staked
http://hyp.cryptospread.com:2751/tx/dcbe755bd97d5587375c1120f8ca4887ff752e697f2fb247912271efb926b7ed

25 blocks of 1007 - 28.56 days old - current weight 28,455 - 17/25 (68%) have staked
http://hyp.cryptospread.com:2751/tx/6bb28b0704d23c4bc5572cacc539a21b69a6f0bb0676742791820dec144bd6df

76 blocks of 1397 - 28.9 days old - current weight 39,922 - 60/76 (78.9%) have staked
http://hyp.cryptospread.com:2751/tx/1e53dbdcc049f7761f436d3252969d70b72e6eef7079e71a391278768be68892

141 blocks of 1350 - 33.55 days old - current weight 40,065 (maxed out) - 133/141 (94.3%) have staked
http://hyp.cryptospread.com:2751/tx/ec6b2e4a07ca353fc7ad24c4d6499684ee56baf11091c5b94d9a250e77955b10


I think we could open up the max age to accumulate weight by 5-15 days or so without much compromise to security... but don't be fooled, this will not increase security, it will simply allow smaller blocks to have more time to gain weight in order to catch up to the bigger blocks staking. It is less secure, because you would be able to gain more weight with less coins, and as in PoS weight is hash power... well do the math.

The other proposal of eliminating weight altogether is a flawed approach. This means taking power away from the small user and consolidating it to the big user. Smaller blocks don't gain weight, so essentially would be nearly dead on arrival. You can see above that I have decent results with blocks as small as 778.

I believe that we should not be anxious to find ways to fork HYP into a newly styled coin, but instead to carefully consider, craft, and weigh the pros and cons of changing the underlying code further from its peercoin ancestor. Any fork that occurs should have precise reasoning, that either strengthens security, or adds equality in a manner that doesn't compromise much security.

[David Latapie]

Winners are:

• +6 semidead (56 posts)
• +5 johan11 (via PM)
• +6 Tpruvot (via Wikia, a first!)
• + diabanhxeo - pAXaGf6oNNJevd6pnQGoJP4UFU7mXbpNG6 (45 posts)

Happy loaning, happy stacking!

[David Latapie]

HyperLoan round 8
What is HyperLoan? • HyperLoan logs

Candidates:

• +5 eatthetree3 - p9qwRDJz8Rm7Xexfq4BiYJNqJJfKLwcPWA (42 posts)
• +1 m33 - pKNBvmDS3UMce4epLNB8vJnhUFkmugN5rD (94 posts)
• +2 shadowmoon (via PM)
• +1  PryptoMontreal (via PM) - pFE1BUZRTVferkv1EZfU2gBLcQEqNL5Bmg

[David Latapie]

A sampling of 6 blocks does very little to prove anything, let me share my wonderful little world of block experimentation to help the cause.

I think we could open up the max age to accumulate weight by 5-15 days or so without much compromise to security... but don't be fooled, this will not increase security, it will simply allow smaller blocks to have more time to gain weight in order to catch up to the bigger blocks staking. It is less secure, because you would be able to gain more weight with less coins, and as in PoS weight is hash power... well do the math.

The other proposal of eliminating weight altogether is a flawed approach. This means taking power away from the small user and consolidating it to the big user. Smaller blocks don't gain weight, so essentially would be nearly dead on arrival. You can see above that I have decent results with blocks as small as 778.

I believe that we should not be anxious to find ways to fork HYP into a newly styled coin, but instead to carefully consider, craft, and weigh the pros and cons of changing the underlying code further from its peercoin ancestor. Any fork that occurs should have precise reasoning, that either strengthens security, or adds equality in a manner that doesn't compromise much security.

I'm afraid I've been misunderstood here:

• My listing is not a sample, but a reminder of the size-data-weight correspondances, so the number of value I am giving doesn't matter
• I do not promote hard fork, I merely mention when a change would imply a hard fork
• I do not propose to eliminate weight, but max age (and it is not a proposition yet, just an investigation because I want to be sure of what I am saying before I propose something)

That being said:

• Moving from 8.73-30 to 5-15, I don't see the point (it would encourage larger blocks, to stake faster, I fail to see the use of it). What did I miss?
• I believe that eliminating max age would actually help small miners since they would not have a 30-day countdown to stake (and it would also mean more blocks to stake). I understand this would increase difficulty, but I don't think that preventing such increase would do any difference for holders, since it is more difficult for everyone. If impatience is the issue, then HyperPool should lower the variance, like poolmining does for PoW. Plus, I never understood the rational behind max age

I hope it clarified things. Could you explain what is the reason for max age?

[Sir William]

Now we just need the price to go back up.

Why is the order book on Poloniex stuffed with sell orders of 50-100 HYP?

I´m pretty sure the answer is ¨someone is manipulating the price,¨but I thought I´d ask anyway.

Selling "at market" is a stupid plan. I'd like everyone reading this to read that again. Hell, I'll repeat it. Selling "at market" is a stupid plan. If everyone who has a sell order up would take it down RIGHT NOW and relist at 2K satoshis or higher, do you really think no one would buy?

I didn't sell any here (yet), but decided to start this moving if I can.  I set up a trade on polo for 2000, at 2k sats.  Anyone want to match???

[Biomech]

Now we just need the price to go back up.

Why is the order book on Poloniex stuffed with sell orders of 50-100 HYP?

I´m pretty sure the answer is ¨someone is manipulating the price,¨but I thought I´d ask anyway.

Selling "at market" is a stupid plan. I'd like everyone reading this to read that again. Hell, I'll repeat it. Selling "at market" is a stupid plan. If everyone who has a sell order up would take it down RIGHT NOW and relist at 2K satoshis or higher, do you really think no one would buy?

I didn't sell any here (yet), but decided to start this moving if I can.  I set up a trade on polo for 2000, at 2k sats.  Anyone want to match???

Since I was the one who opened my big mouth...

yes. I'll match, and increment a little above with another 800. Just sent the coins, it'll be posted up as soon as they confirm.

EDIT: Done and increments of 200 up to 4K. Let's do this shit