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2021  Other / Politics & Society / Re: How science works on: March 29, 2021, 01:56:49 PM
The biggest way that we can tell that engineering is different than science theory is, once the working engineering absolutely matches the science theory completely, the science theory becomes science rather than science theory.

I'm interested in exploring this further. Are you saying that not all scientific research is proven fact? This is certainly true. Some is proven, to our current understanding. What I mean by this is that science sits outside the realm of a priori or inherent truths... these are the preserve of mathematics. Scientific theories remain just that - theories - until they are proven, to our current understanding. By which I mean that Newton's laws of motion were 'proven' until Einstein came along. This sort of science is our best approximation to truth. Because scientific truths are a posteriori truths, i.e., they need to be proven, they need empirical evidence, and experiments need reproducible results.

But this doesn't mean that scientific truths are vague approximations. Some are, certainly, at the frontiers of science. But many - and arguably all of those used in engineering - are based on proven (to our current understanding) facts.

If I say you're travelling at 30 miles per hour, that's true. Or is it? No, it's an approximation, you're actually travelling at 30.1 miles per hour. But actually 30.1 is just a better approximation, really you're travelling at 30.097 mph, etc.

Any subsequent proof doesn't remove the previous truth, it just refines it. If our scientific understanding improves, we get a better approximation. Newton's laws of motion, for example, are perfectly adequate for most everyday engineering. But if you accelerate to say half the speed of light, they won't be a good enough approximation, and you'll need to apply relativity.

Please could you give me an example of where engineering goes against scientific truths?
2022  Other / Politics & Society / Re: These Air Force 'rods from God' could hit with the force of a nuclear weapon on: March 29, 2021, 12:41:15 PM
The questions are, has any other country done so? Has the US done it secretly? Is this the way that God is going to start the destruction of the world? - not that He needs this.

I'm happy to answer these.

1) No. No country has put tungsten 'rods from God' into space.
2) No.
3) No.
2023  Other / Politics & Society / Re: How science works on: March 29, 2021, 12:31:07 PM
There is an overlap in real science, science theory and engineering. For example...

If you compare real science with science theory, and if you do it carefully and slowly, you will find that true science doesn't match science theory.

Regarding engineering, a developer may develop some practical device off some science theory, but when you critically examine the engineered development against the science theory, you will find that the development has all kinds of tiny departures from what the science theory says.

If an engineered development uses practical proven science, often it will use pieces of science that are not included in the abstract of why and how it works, scientifically.

The point is moving forward. The point should be defining the various levels of science properly, so that we can see the differences between what science really is... and often, what it is not.

Cool

You've tried to make this distinction before, and I've never understood what you meant. Engineering is just applied science, whether you're talking about chemical engineering, mechanical engineering, electrical engineering, whatever. If you're saying that 'real world' solutions don't match theory, well, this is true only insofar as a theory, for simplicity, describes ideal conditions, whereas in the real world an implementation of a scientific theory may have to deal with external factors. For example, an electrical engineer may have to take steps to ensure that rats can't chew through his cables... but it's absurd and a false syllogism to conclude from this that electrical science doesn't mention rats, but electrical engineers have to deal with rats, therefore engineering isn't science.
2024  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: Fate or lack of control - Gambling on: March 29, 2021, 10:38:12 AM
The issue is that things are never so simple, for people like us that have self-control stopping our gambling activities after we have gotten a few bad losses is easy, but for those that have addictive tendencies this is a problem as they cannot control their impulses, the best thing to do for people like that is to simply not gamble anymore as the more they gamble the bigger the chances they lose and this fires up an intense desire to get that money back and that is when their fate will be sealed and they will gamble until they lose every single cent they have.

This is a good point. Some people are more vulnerable than others, whether through circumstance or personality, and addiction is a real problem. It needs to be seen in the same way as other addictions, such as alcohol. Treatment and support groups are available, but I suspect that those most in need are reluctant to use them.
2025  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: Motosport General discussion tread --- Formula1, MotoGP, WTCC, ETCC, DTM..... on: March 29, 2021, 10:22:13 AM
he won with an inferior car.
Yes. This is more evidence against those who say that Hamilton only wins because he has the best car.

Sensational because once again the strategic guy from Mercedes figured out how can they win this race without having the necessary pace and in the end it payed out but to be honest RedBull engineer should have kept Max on the track and let him do his best and if the penalty will come that would be another story
Red Bull were told by the officials that he had to give the place back, and they passed the message on to Max. It wasn't Red Bull's decision.
Weirdly though, it might not have been an issue were it not for Red Bull earlier in the race complaining that the Mercedes cars were gaining an advantage by going beyond track limits at that exact same corner. Hamilton complained, but then changed his route to remain on the track... so when Max went off at the same point and gained a place, the officials didn't really have a difficult decision to make, they had to apply the same rule to Red Bull that they did to Mercedes.

I saw that Vettel without hair is not better than with hair.
This deserves a merit Cheesy
2026  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: Motosport General discussion tread --- Formula1, MotoGP, WTCC, ETCC, DTM..... on: March 28, 2021, 05:06:40 PM
^  The overcut turned out to have worked in Hamilton’s favor.  Brilliant performance from him and it really showed how Hamilton is really good at managing his tires towards the end.  Can’t wait for the next one.

This season’s gonna be close between RBR and Merc. 

Definitely, and it's great to see the top two teams so closely matched. Red Bull I think do have the better car, but Bottas was crucial to this race, giving Mercedes that 2:1 split strategy advantage early on. Superb work from Hamilton to just about keep Verstappen at bay at the end. Crazy last few laps.
2027  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: 2022 FIFA World Cup in Qatar - UEFA Qualifiers on: March 28, 2021, 09:59:12 AM
Turkey is on fire. First they beat Netherlands and now didn't had any probems against Norway, confident 3:0 win.
Another big upset is Luxembourg wing against Ireland. And what a great goal by Rodriguez.

The Ireland result was quite shocking, but I think the Turkey result is the biggest thing in this round of fixtures. A 3-0 away win vs Norway is quite an achievement, and it puts the Netherlands under huge pressure even this early on in the campaign. It already looks like their return fixture against Turkey could decide the group.
2028  Other / Politics & Society / Re: 25th Amendament for Joe Biden, when? on: March 28, 2021, 09:46:15 AM
Okay, I will give you that Trump is not very principled, but he is not willing to do anything for power.

True I suppose, he does have limits. His attempted coup was quite half-hearted, and he distanced himself from the mob at the first sniff of trouble. It was mostly bluster and an attempt to save face after the election loss... but in the end he went more quietly than might have been anticipated.
2029  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Books on Libertarianism Everyone Must Be Forced to Read on: March 27, 2021, 02:02:39 PM
interventionism is not perfect either and if we take things to the extreme in the most interventionist societies, injustices like that also occur. Let's look at how the children of politicians live in Venezuela for example and then look at how the rest of the population lives, who go hungry. I know Venezuela would not be a model of the society you are defending, but I was giving an extreme example.
Looks like we agree on most things after all Smiley
Venezuela is a good example, yes. Communist societies, or socialist fully-managed societies, are no good, and they fail because they are too easy to corrupt. Extreme left-wing is easily corruptible, and extreme right-wing (laissez-faire capitalist, a.k.a. libertarian) is easily exploitable. Neither works very well. The best approach*, I think, is a capitalist society governed by a left-leaning party... but not too left. The thing that works best will be the thing that is hardest to corrupt or exploit. Media misinformation needs dealing with, too, as this is the biggest corrupter of the democratic process.


On the other hand, how would you intervene to prevent people like Boris Johnson or George W. Bush from having advantages over those born in poorer families?
It's difficult. But as above, I suppose. You probably can't eliminate advantage, but a system that controls it and reduces it to a more acceptable level would be an improvement on what we have now.



* Best approach that is workable today. Whereas best approach in a perfect (and post-scarcity) world would be something that includes a fundamental redefinition of the barometers of value and success, and removes the links to power, and to money, which is largely the quantification of power.
2030  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Do you miss Trump? on: March 27, 2021, 01:36:52 PM
You chop the biggest, clearest chunk of evidence - evidence that Trump was watching, himself, while it was happening - right out of your quote of my response to you.

Good for you. You're a politician, par excellence.

I chopped that bit of your post because I wasn't addressing that, I was addressing the 'passion of followers' bit. Also because I get sick of writing citation needed.
But here you go, you can have your 'biggest, clearest chunk of evidence' back:



Trump won. Biden is living on a lie.

[CITATION NEEDED]


... Unless you're referring to the 'my pillow guy' bit? Is that the same as satan-soldiers-fun-hat-guy from a while back?
If Trump has evidence, strange that he wasn't willing to present it in court.
2031  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Do you miss Trump? on: March 27, 2021, 10:40:00 AM
You will find people all over the place, today, who are parading Trump, and riding around with Trump signs. Biden still doesn't have any serious followers.

I'll agree that some Trump supporters are extremely pro-Trump, and Biden doesn't elicit the same emotional response, either for or against. But this is immaterial in the context of an election. It's not about whose supporters are more passionately behind their guy. It's about who has enough voters to win seats.
2032  Other / Politics & Society / Re: 25th Amendament for Joe Biden, when? on: March 27, 2021, 09:53:13 AM
unprincipled?
will do anything for power?



---

Joe Biden had his first press conference today, you can make up your mind if you think he is slow or not or whether he has dementia - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L5CPTxij6YE

Answer probably is no, but he looks tired every time he speaks, slurs his speech, forgets his train of thought numerous times, and doesn't make much sense sometimes while rambling on.
Yes, he does appear to be struggling somewhat, and is likely too old for the office. His whole selling point really was "I'm not Trump"... which is great if you're a unifying compromise figure who can pull in sufficient numbers of voters... but then the strategy may unravel a bit once you win and move into office.
2033  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: Motosport General discussion tread --- Formula1, MotoGP, WTCC, ETCC, DTM..... on: March 27, 2021, 09:42:20 AM
I wouldn’t be surprised that despite these changes Mercedes yet manages to win all the races

I wouldn't be surprised, either.

Red Bull do look to have the best package i) at the moment, and ii) in the heat and dry of Bahrain.
But this doesn't mean they are guaranteed the win, and it doesn't mean that they'll dominate the season. Mercedes are formidable and not easily beaten.

But... it does look closer than it has recently. There is cause for optimism that there will be some real competition this season. And also that Mercedes may struggle if the low/high rake issue is the cause of their under-performance.
2034  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Do you miss Trump? on: March 27, 2021, 09:30:38 AM
Biden didn't win. Fraudulent election electronics won, and then transferred the win to Biden.

You can repeat it as often as you like, but you need to supply some evidence.

All anybody need do is these two searches:
1. https://duckduckgo.com/?q=Biden+campaign+rallies+2020&t=ffab&iar=images&iax=images&ia=images
2. https://duckduckgo.com/?q=Trump+campaign+rallies+2020&t=ffab&iar=images&iax=images&ia=images

If you use a different search engine, be sure to click on "images."

I'll state the obvious. There are way more people in the Trump rallies than the Biden rallies.

The problem with clicking, as you advise, on images, is that you then lose the context.
Perhaps you could supplement the images with some context from this page: https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-crowd-biden-trump-support-idUSKBN27F27Y

There were fewer people at Biden rallies because he didn't think that massive gatherings of close-packed people during a respiratory pandemic was a great idea. Whereas I'd imagine Trump just wanted pictures of a big crowd, regardless of whether it killed people.
2035  Other / Politics & Society / Re: How science works on: March 27, 2021, 08:12:27 AM
even to this day there are parts of science where questions about established preconceptions are not so welcome.

Yes, scientists are still human, and egos can be a problem.

I'd say that the biggest challenge to scientific integrity is probably money, by which I mean scientific experiments funded by industry, where there is a clearly desired outcome. I'm not suggesting that links between science and business should be severed, that's a bad idea and it would impede progress... but certainly there should be more rigorous oversight of these purportedly impartial business-funded studies.
2036  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: La Liga (Spanish League) Prediction Thread 2020/21 on: March 27, 2021, 08:02:20 AM
Barcelona, ​​Real Madrid and Atletico Madrid all have equal chances to win the title. It's seem Atletico Madrid are losing form, they have lost 4 points in the last 5 matches. I think the title will be won by Barcelona or Real Madrid.

Real have also lost four points in the last five matches. They're six points behind Atletico, and with a worse goal difference. Atletico may have a harder run-in, but still, it's difficult to see how Real aren't in a worse position.
Barca may be a different story, four points behind and with a superior goal difference, and they're winning every game.

I think it will be close, but Atletico should still be favourites, closely followed by Barca, with Real in a clear third place.
2037  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: Motosport General discussion tread --- Formula1, MotoGP, WTCC, ETCC, DTM..... on: March 27, 2021, 07:50:35 AM
Cars are very close and more ringing bells from Mercedes with bottas.

It's great that the cars are close. I hope this carries over throughout the season and we see some real competition across the grid.
Bottas was complaining a bit, and Red Bull do look to have the best car (at least in Bahrain)... but I think it's clear that Mercedes have improved their car since the testing, and will be right up there at the top of grid. Difficult to determine at the moment how representative current performance is compared to the cooler tracks of Europe, though.

I think Mercedes may be right that the subtle rule changes for this season have impacted their low-rake design more than Red Bull's high-rake... in which case Mercedes could well be on the back foot all season, still up near the front of the grid, yes, but perhaps behind Max.
2038  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Books on Libertarianism Everyone Must Be Forced to Read on: March 27, 2021, 07:39:34 AM
Well, I think we can come to an agreement here. I have already said that I believe that there should be some public intervention in the economy, although I suppose your position is that there should be more intervention than I like. The problem I see is that the more intervention and the more taxes, the more money collected ends up being used for political spending and not so much for the benefit of the population.

Yes, I think we agree that some degree of intervention is required, and that the aim of any intervention should be the benefit of the population.

I'm sure we also agree that communism is a bad idea. A system that ensures equality of outcome disincentivises innovation and entrepreneurship, stifles development, discourages energy and risk-taking and destroys free-thinking and creativity. On top of which, a system whose strength is premised on the power of collectivised labour is utterly outdated in our high-tech era of ever-increasing automation (even, now, automation of traditionally white-collar jobs). And from a crypto perspective, smart contract platforms will accelerate the trend and allow automation of whole industries.

The reason I am in favour of intervention is because I want there to be equality of opportunity. Unfettered capitalism means that those who already have power and wealth start from a huge advantage. If you're highly intelligent, highly creative, highly energetic, but you're born in a poor inner-city family, get sent to a failing school, don't pass your exams, have to take insecure low-paid jobs, then you never get a fair chance to fulfill your potential; you're condemned due to the innate inequality of the system. Conversely, if you're a lazy fool born to an ultra-rich family, you'll get sent to the best private school, be fast-tracked into a great job, then through the revolving door into politics and maybe even become prime minister or president, from where you'll do everything you can to maintain the unfairness that worked so well in your own favour.

Intervention is necessary in order to ensure that everyone gets a fair chance to achieve their potential. No intervention means that those who start with an advantage can maintain and increase that advantage for further generations. Slight intervention is like recycling your domestic plastics in order to fight climate change; it glosses over the problem, makes it look like it's being addressed, whilst at the same time having next to no effect.
2039  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: 2022 FIFA World Cup in Qatar - UEFA Qualifiers on: March 25, 2021, 01:53:10 PM
Netherlands is far ahead of all the other teams in Group G. Their performance was pathetic yesterday, but that doesn't mean that they don't have any chance to top the group. 9 matches remain for Netherlands and they will face Turkey again on 7th September. It is too early to say that Netherlands is currently at the bottom of the points table. The situation is going to change.

We do also have Norway in the group, and Montenegro might snatch a draw against Turkey or the Netherlands.
But some matches do seem pointless... what is the purpose of having Gibraltar in a group? It's likely they'll end the campaign with zero points. Far better to have weaker teams play off against one another to see who then goes into a smaller group with the big teams. This would also improve fixture congestion for the big teams.
2040  Other / Politics & Society / Re: How science works on: March 25, 2021, 01:36:28 PM
But regarding the scientists at CERN, their biggest science has to do with how to scientifically hide their real understanding from all of us.
I've actually had the privilege in the past of being given CERN particle traces to analyse. It's quite something to see, before your eyes, direct evidence of these tiny pieces of reality.
Science is the pursuit of knowledge. It's those who pursue money who have a motivation to guard secrets and hide understanding... business people and politicians.


the fabric of the whole thing that is called empty space, is solidly a mass of moving particles
Yes, of course. I never thought I'd ever be discussing elementary particle physics with you, and that we would agree! But even beneath that, a 'particle' is not really a particle. And wave-particle duality is a simplification, too. It does seem that, beneath everything, the universe consists of fields, and it is the perturbations and interplay of these fields that manifest as matter.
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