Evolution occurs naturally. Mutations are random, and caused by errors in cell replication. Some mutations are beneficial to survival, some are detrimental, some are neither. People who have a mutation that is beneficial is more likely to survive and have children than someone who has a mutation that is detrimental. In this way, from generation to generation, beneficial mutations tend to spread through the gene pool of the species. Evolution is the term for how these two elements work together, a) mutations and b) natural selection (or 'survival of the fittest', meaning best fit to the conditions of the environment).

Viruses reproduce much much more rapidly than humans. The same processes of mutation and natural selection are true for viruses, but because they reproduce so much more quickly, dangerous mutations (such as the delta variant of Covid-19) also arise comparatively quickly.

As for scientists manipulating the human genome and this becoming the primary method of human evolution, I'd say yes, this is very likely to happen.... mostly because science advances so much more rapidly than natural human evolution. It's not even 20 years ago that the human genome was first fully sequenced.


All crops are genetically modified. "Natural" wheat for example has been selectively bred by humans for thousands of years. Modern dog breeds have been created through directed selection by humans, and through self-domestication by interaction with humans; "natural" dogs are wolves. When we talk nowadays about GM foods, what we mean is that we now understand genetics a lot better, and our attempts at modification are a lot more precise than they have been over previous human history. But we have always tampered with the genetics of other organisms, going back to the neolithic and the agricultural revolution, possibly further.

I agree with all of your points about human development... this is certainly a contributing factor. But it's not an 'either/or' situation. Human development certainly contributes to events like flooding, but this doesn't mean that human-caused climate change is not real. The data on climate change are utterly conclusive.

Global Temperature Rise. Warming Ocean. Shrinking Ice Sheets. Glacial Retreat. Decreased Snow Cover. Sea Level Rise. Declining Arctic Sea Ice. Extreme Events. Ocean Acidification.


https://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/

You can't possibly believe this. It's a joke, surely? You're suggesting that when viruses spread amongst a population of people, they are not spreading from person to person at all, but rather everyone's dying cells are simultaneously turning into the exact same virus, and it's all happening internally in each case? I must have misunderstood what you mean, because this is absurd.

Well, thanks at least for mentioning that your post has been edited - others may not have done that.


It's unfortunate that you cut your quote there, rather than including the very next sentence:
But this isn't really the point, anyway, is it? I mean, smallpox is a terrible disease, which has killed hundreds of millions of people. If your recommended solution to stop people dying of smallpox is to infect them with smallpox, then I'd suggest this may not be a particularly sound strategy.


Indeed.


---


Poker Player, do you want to take over for a bit? I'm done for the moment.

You're not obliged to do anything. It's just that if you make the effort to construct a coherent argument, you might be more persuasive. Go on; give it a go.

Thanks! I noticed your chicken fixation in another thread. Are you the same guy who writes the word 'tranny' in every post, or was that someone else?


---


Look at excess deaths. I don't know the provenance of your "data", but here are the results from numerous independent bodies around the world, here's the link. You can even get at the source data. Go on, knock yourself out (just don't claim it's a side-effect of the vaccine).



https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-pcr-idUSKBN24420X



Well, I did advise you to "look at the data, not at random YouTube nut-jobs and snake-oil salesmen".
You've linked to a YouTube nut-job who doesn't understand basic arithmetic, and can't even grasp that Biden won the election.

TBH I'm getting sick of dealing with these anti-vaxxer fools. One way that internet discussion differs from real world discussion is that people can pick and choose what they respond to. Anti-vaxxers obviously are unable to counter such troublesome concepts as facts and evidence, so they simply ignore it and just press on with their nonsense. This thread is a good example - you will note that no attempt is made to address my data-driven arguments. Try mentioning smallpox on any anti-vaxxer thread and it's like their eyes simply glide over the word without even seeing it. Maybe I should make my charts bigger, or all-bold everything as BADecker does.



The connection between Bill Gates and CV19 is that he tried to warn people that we weren't ready for the next pandemic. He's also - regardless of what you think of his business practices - a multi-billionaire who is giving away most of his money and making huge inroads into solving the problem of malaria. Now apparently you think he's involved with designing and creating CV19. Although as with other anti-vaxxers, your opinion appears to have been plucked from the air fully-formed, rather than arrived at through something as outrageous as reasoning.



Yeah. And BADecker says that everyone who has had the vaccine will be dead within two years. So which is it?



Look at data on excess deaths. As I've been saying for a year now. How many more people than usual have been dying, regardless of reason? Something has been killing millions of people, and just happens to coincide with the pandemic. Look at the data, not at random YouTube nut-jobs and snake-oil salesmen. But of course you won't; you'll pretend that these troublesome facts don't exist, and that I haven't mentioned them.



When I look at these posts, I am unable to distinguish between what you genuinely believe and what is trolling. From the perspective of someone who strives to base their conclusions on data, there is absolutely no difference.

If there's one extraordinary post in this thread, it's not Natsuu's, it's the one at the top of the page.



That's disingenuous at best. SARS and MERS are coronaviruses. They were kind of a big deal, a few years ago. 'Coronaviruses have been around since year x' means nothing - did you see my 'humans aren't gorillas' post?

Also, do you have an opinion on the smallpox vaccine? Was that a good idea? The polio vaccine?
Obviously early days for the Covid vaccines, but a pattern is emerging in highly vaccinated nations such as the UK and Israel. And I would go as far as to say it's an entirely predictable pattern. Vaccination works.
You're in the UK, like me, aren't you? Massive spike in cases from the delta variant... and yet so few deaths now that most of us are vaccinated.


https://ourworldindata.org/smallpox


https://ourworldindata.org/polio


https://ourworldindata.org/covid-deaths

Not quite sure why that merits a sunglasses emoji, but anyway...

Africa has administered 59% of its vaccine supply (as of June 2nd 2021). And whilst there is certainly a degree of vaccine hesitancy, there are, as you might expect (or, rather, as anyone else might expect), other factors involved...

https://reliefweb.int/report/world/africas-lack-vaccine-not-only-reason-slow-vaccine-rollout

Although I almost always disagree with you, I'd certainly agree that there is a huge problem of people being put on medication they don't need, just in order for companies to boost their profits. And certainly this is even more true in countries that follow the US model of healthcare.

But this doesn't make it true for the Covid-19 vaccine. The pandemic has wrought huge economic damage across the globe. No nation would accept such a devastating economic hit just in order to boost drug sales... the financial losses vastly outweigh any potential financial gains.

The problem with natural immunity is that you get it by contracting the disease. The Covid-19 vaccine has saved countless lives, as the data indicate quite clearly (as I've presented many times).
And I don't think any anti-vaxxer has yet explained why the Smallpox vaccine, as one example, was a bad idea.


Population growth - and decline - follows the five stage demographic model, again, quite clearly. An increasing population is a temporary phenomenon that disappears once a country reaches a sufficient level of development.
There is no need to artificially reduce population, when it happens by itself. Consider Japan as an example. Look at the data.


You can stop the destruction of humans by accepting the vaccine.

I wouldn't assume that they'll definitely get Grealish. Villa have hugely ambitious owners and have Grealish under a long contract; they'll do everything they can to keep him.
As for whether Grealish wants to go... Man City is definitely a step up, but perhaps his experiences at the Euros may impact his decision. For England he is merely an impact sub, which is likely the role he'd have for Man C. Would he prefer to stay at Villa, who are improving each year, and be a guaranteed first teamer?

Thanks, that's really interesting. Whenever I see handball (only in the Olympics really), it looks like a great sport. It's not very well known here (UK) but it should be. I'd love to give it a go one day.

Actually, I think you probably have defined it:


If you invade Iraq, you can "liberate" lots of oil. If you invade Cuba, all you can liberate is poor people.
Obviously this is a bit of simplification, and ignores the history of Cuban links to the USSR... but oil reserves are a powerful motivator.

I'd say (and have said) both. We can't really separate them.



---

Yeah, I remember when Michael Moore took 9/11 first responders to Cuba for free healthcare.

Yes, that's right. The list of phone numbers is important because this details exactly who has been flagged by NSO's customers as a 'person of interest' for surveillance. NSO are claiming that being on the list does not mean that any surveillance was actually carried out, but I'd be surprised if anyone actually believed them on that. Forensic investigation by Amnesty has found evidence of Pegasus spyware on the majority of phones they tested. And we don't just have evidence of who is being surveilled, we also have evidence in each case of who wanted them surveilled. Current high profile targets include:

Imran Khan, the prime minister of Pakistan, targeted by India in 2019.
French president, Emmanuel Macron, targeted by Morocco in 2019.
South African president, Cyril Ramaphosa, targeted by Rwanda in 2019.
Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus, director general of the WHO, targeted by Morocco in 2019.
Saad Hariri, until recently the Lebanese prime minister, targeted by the UAE in 2018 and 2019.
Felipe Calderón, former president of Mexico, targeted by a Mexican client in 2016 and 2017 when his wife was running for office.
_source

Khan (particularly because it's India who targeted him) and Macron are the big names so far... but more keep coming. NSO are claiming that Macron was never targeted... however Pegasus spyware has been identified on the phone of one of his ministers.

Well, I'm in Europe (UK). We have high levels of vaccination here, and also high case numbers due to the delta variant. But thanks to the vaccine, despite the high case numbers, hospitalisations are low and deaths are very low... far far lower, as a percentage of cases, than in the first and second waves that preceded the vaccination programme. I've presented the data many many times. "One million with serious vaccine injury" is nonsense.

I'm glad he's okay, too.

Hot-headed and petulant behaviour from Verstappen? Surely not!
He's a great driver, but too aggressive to be safe. Probably because he is young. I'm sure Hamilton was reckless too in his early years in F1.

I don't know, I think Verstappen will win it quite easily. But the second drivers of both teams could become important. If Bottas can get up near the front with Perez remaining further back, then that would give Mercedes a tactical advantage and the ability to run split strategies on pit stops, and effectively manage Verstappen's stops. We'll see, I suppose. And whilst Red Bull have the faster car at the moment, it isn't guaranteed to remain fastest for the rest of the season.

---

Yeah, that's the point I've been trying to make, too. Hamilton was almost completely alongside Verstappen, it's not like Verstappen didn't see him. So if someone is coming up the inside of you on a bend, what do you do? A) go wide and let them take the position, or B) think "hey! no you don't! that's MY racing line!" and then deliberately crash into them and put yourself in hospital? Max chose option B.

I'm still wondering what happened to the testicles. Some people say he was brave to go into space. I think he lacks balls.

1. Humans are great apes.
2. Gorillas are great apes.
3. Chimpanzees are great apes.
But... humans are not gorillas, and humans are not chimpanzees. Make a note of this; it will become important in a moment.


1. Sars-CoV-2 is a coronavirus.
2. MERS, with a death rate of 37.2%, is a coronavirus.
3. The common cold is a coronavirus.
But... SARS-CoV-2 is not the common cold or (thankfully) MERS. It is a novel coronavirus that has been responsible for millions of deaths (and if you dispute 'reason for death', then just look at data on excess deaths).

I never thought I'd see you as a champion of state intervention!
But yes, it does work very well from an economic perspective*. There is a strong government that allows and encourages capitalist practices, but reins in excesses and maintains a guiding hand - actually, controlling hand - over the overall economy. The five year plan is still a thing.


I'm not sure anyone would dispute this. The Chinese market reforms are what led to the period of crazy growth and export-led industrialisation.
I'd be surprised to see anyone saying that communism does work, when historical attempts at communism always give us the same terrible outcome.


Yes, this is the problem. China's huge size and power means that no other nation feels able to challenge them on things such as human rights abuses. If you anger China, you endanger your relationship with the world's most lucrative trading partner.


*_{but not necessarily or always from a human perspective.}