I just read this thread, and I want the last 7 minute of my life back.  |
|
|
|
- I am from Sweden and living in Thailand. I never been in Azerbaijan. And I will for sure get a VISA in the US, been there many many times. So lets go, lets meet. and we speak face to face and we see who is what?
I like Thailand. I'll be in Chiang Mai next year around this time, or if you're in NorCal before then send me a PM, I'll buy you a beer. BTW, why are you still up at 3am? May I ask why did you not just ask me if you wonder something? Why did you come into my thread and being rude?
Okay, I'll ask now: Are you the same guy who defaulted on $400 worth of loans that I gave you, and pretended to be moonbux on Telegram? For fuck's sake! |
|
|
|
" Unfortunately I do not have any concrete evidence but I have a strong suspicion that this user is an alt of elmanchez (u=2553198) and ps34 (u=2751022). If dealing with this user, I suggest you trust him no more than you would the other two. If in doubt, use escrow. DireWolfM14 "
It's true I do believe you are elmanchez, and I believe that ps34 is his and your alt account. I have my reasons, like the many coincidences with the timing of you starting your service and ps34 ranting about newbies being treated poorly in the lending subsection. When you first started your service you made no mention of not lending to newbies. You were asking for a high rate of return, and offering scraps as if to prove to those in doubt that newbies could be trusted. You've learned your lesson the hard way, and only when I made mention of it did you revise your thread to mention the restriction against lending to newbies. Not to mention, you pretending to be such a pleasant and polite person is an obvious farce. Your interactions with me, Timelord2067, HedgeFx, and the creation of this thread has exposed the petulance for which you (elmanchez) have become infamous. Maybe I'm wrong, I've been wrong before and in the past I've adjusted my stance when convinced. There's still hope for you, but I'll be honest, it's not much. I don't like speculative feedback, and for the most part I avoid leaving them, but since I'm convinced you are elmanchez, an especially conniving and manipulative individual, I felt it was worth warning the community who they are dealing with. But, my dislike of speculative feedback won out, and so it gave way to me revising the feedback to something more concrete and pertinent. Lol, you are a ridiculous fool if you think I'm afraid of you as "competition." I only recently resurrected my lending thread after a three year hiatus because I finally have time for it again. I'm not hurting to put food on the table, and obviously I'm not looking to generate an income through my service. But I don't expect you to see that through your delusion that I'm "stalking" you. But I can do you a favor, if you dislike me so much, let's meet and speak face to face, I show who I am and you can show the forum that you actually can back up your worlds. Deal?
~
Why can't just all you just leave me the fuck alone and I happy leave your meaningless life's alone to.
Make up your mind. Do you want me to leave you alone or do you want to go out on a date? What about all that talk of 17 years of martial arts training, was that supposed to be some kind of threat? Regardless of any of that, I have no interest in meeting you face to face. Azerbaijan is nowhere I want to visit, and somehow I doubt your ability to get a visitor's visa for the US. This topic is created because he called me an alt of PS34 and another account
Elmanchez.  Funny you don't want to type that name yourself. You even claimed you forgot it, though it was present in the same post in which you quoted my original review. I think you and I both know why you're avoiding mentioning that name. BTW, you forgot to lock this thread after your umpteenth edit of the first and last posts. |
|
|
|
Not meant as ridicule, if he doesn't know what he's doing he should accuse based in the information he thinks he has is all. Not to mention I know for a fact he is 100% wrong here.
I don't have the information that you have, but I agree there's nothing to suggest that the two accounts are connected. As for the information he had, we're all in the same boat, i.e. we don't know what we don't know. He posted his question, I responded, then he thanked me for the information. Seems to me that he recognized his error in this case. I don't know if that means he's done looking into HedgeFx, but if he needs more corrections in the future we'll be here to help. |
|
|
|
PS : before acting as forum police at least try to have a clue on how a usdt transaction on tron network works.
If you don't know what you're doing, better to not do it.
I don't like ridiculing people for their lack of shitcoin knowledge, this is The Bitcoin Forum after all. I've never used Tron, and had to dig around for a few minutes to find the information I posted above. It's understandable that a bitcoiner finds it difficult to wrap their head around smart-contract shitcoinery. |
|
|
|
HedgeFx has engaged in some sleight of hand with a ban evading thread asking for another loan - take a good look at the wallet address that the lender has quoted and claims to have paid the borrower $500 into https://tronscan.io/#/address/TFqN1GmbXtQNZu1BsuhrExzpKLszXBfQ4UTwo days ago there were two dust transactions TO that wallet address, then $500 went FROM that address to another wallet address. (see below) Eleven minutes later, HedgeFx claims to have received the payment - how? The funds went FROM the wallet address he was asking they be sent TO. The outbound occurred hours *after* HedgeFx claims to have received $500 (but didn't). ~ The link you provided only shows Tron transactions. There was no inbound Tron transaction for receiving the USDT. There was an outbound Tron transaction (gas) when he sent or exchanged the coins. This link shows the transfers tab, and it shows that the address received 500 Tether at 14:12:06 UTC on 21 July 2023 https://tronscan.org/#/address/TFqN1GmbXtQNZu1BsuhrExzpKLszXBfQ4U/transfers |
|
|
|
I mean I’m just trying to create some trust with those information and if the lender is from Germany he could in fact do something with this information, I think.
No one here has the ability to authenticate ID, and they're too easily faked. The offer alone makes you look untrustworthy. Im sorry but not everyone has a rich family or friends who can quickly lend some money.
One doesn't have to be rich to help a family member or friend with a €700 loan or gift if the person is altruistic. Statements like that poke holes in your story. |
|
|
|
@Timelord2067, @DaveF, @LoyceV, @JeromeTash, Thank you all for the great suggestions, I've implemented them all in one form or another. Shouldn't they create a childboard specially for the investments or ventures? Or this should be fine to go in the services section as I did before?
There's a "Long Term" sub-board in this section for such requests and the Services board, like you mentioned or the Gambling sub-board, Investor-based games. |
|
|
|
Local Rules: This thread is for the discussion of general lending and borrowing practices, the validity of specific types of collateral, and the overall safety of lending and borrowing activities. The following types of posts will be seen as off topic and removed: - Requests for loans or offers to lend
- Spamming links to requests or offers
- Discussions of one specific individual's reputation or habits
|
|
|
|
.Introduction:The Bitcoin Forum is committed to providing a free marketplace for all to trade and transact without any official limitations. This is a truly free, capitalistic economy, or, as the administrator has described it, "anarcho-capitalistic." As such, it's up those who engage in this economy to protect themselves. Caveat Emptor! However, that doesn't mean that you are completely on your own. There are many reputable members of the forum who are committed to keeping the forum safe, and thwarting scammers before they have a chance to cause damage. One of the tools available to members is the Trust System, which is intended to provide participants with feedback that others can use to judge a potential trade partner's trustworthiness. The trust system is decentralized in the way that it is left to the community to manage. It may not be perfect, but the philosophy aligns with the forum's commitment to a free marketplace. In the Lending sub-board this poses a few challenges for those who are new to the forum. If you are a newbie to the forum or the Lending board it would behoove you to take a few moments to learn a little bit about the culture and expectations when requesting a loan or offering to lend to others. These are not official forum rules, not even unofficial forum rules. These are simply my observations and suggestions based on years of experience (good and bad) participating in, and monitoring this segment of the forum's economy.
.Borrowers:If you are requesting a loan I suggest you follow these guidelines to keep yourself and your account safe. If you are newbie looking for a loan, offer collateral! There is almost no chance of a newbie receiving a loan without collateral. Regardless of your account status or rank, if you do offer collateral make sure you are dealing with a reputable lender, or use a trusted escrow agent to hold the collateral. Don't trust a new lender with your collateral, you'll likely be scammed. Many lenders offer unsecured (no collateral) loans, but you will notice experienced lenders will issue unsecured loans only to aged accounts that have proven themselves as trustworthy. Acceptance of unsecured loans is subject solely to the discretion of the lender. New accounts asking for unsecured loans will often be summarily tagged as scammers. If your first post on the forum is a request for an unsecured loan, don't be surprised to see your account painted red and your request ridiculed. If you are new to the forum, there's no need to prove you're the owner of the brand new account, but if you've been around for a while you should take steps to assure a lender that you are the original owner of the account. Sign your loan request with an address that's been staked or has been posted previously on the forum. Use of PGP signatures is also highly recommended. Even if the lender doesn't request it, he'll grow accustomed to you signing messages. If your account gets hijacked and a lender sees an unsigned request, he's likely to notice the oddity and investigate further, potentially saving your account from being given a fraudulent loan. Remember that all is not always as it seems. Not all lenders are altruistic and helpful. Generally speaking, most of the established lenders are trustworthy folks, but be wary of new lenders or those who are new to lending market. Make sure you have a thorough understanding the lender's terms the interest rates, and repayment deadlines before accepting the loan. Making changes to the terms and conditions is always easier before the parties commit to the loan. Identification documents, paycheck receipts, proof of income, and written or verbal contracts promising to pay are worthless to a lender. There are no documents you can provide that will secure your loan request. All forms of identification and documentation can easily be forged or faked, and no lender here has the ability to authenticate anyone's identity. The prevailing theory is that no one would willingly disclose their personal information to a stranger on the internet for a few hundred dollars, unless of course it's not their identity to begin with. Honest or not, such a request will appear to be a scam attempt. - You are not entitled to a loan:
Requesting a loan does not guarantee you'll receive one. Lenders are not obligated to fill each (or any) loan request, nor should you expect yours to be honored. When others respond to your request with questions or suggestions, it would be wise to answer honestly and heed the advice given. Do not push the issue by repeating the same talking points or without modifying your request. A sense of entitlement will almost always end with you being red-tagged and labeled a scammer. Requests for investment in a project are highly unlikely to be accepted. Unless the requester is an established member who would otherwise qualify for an unsecured loan, requests for a project based on a business plan or a high yield investment proposal are often seen as a scam attempt by the community. Even established members who offer proposals that sound too good to be true will be seen as attempting to scam so, imagine what it looks like when a newbie tries it.
.Lenders:If you plan to offer a lending service, you must assume many risks, not the least of which is giving the community the wrong impression about your motives. You will increase your chances of success if you follow these simple suggestions: The Trust System can be very helpful in evaluating the borrower's potential to pay back the loan, however you shouldn't rely on only the one source for information. Risks can be mitigated by issuing only secured loans, but you may find opportunities in that market segment are limited. If you issue unsecured loans you alone are responsible for evaluating your client, and assume the risks. Make sure to consider all the information publicly available to evaluate those risks, and beware of borrowers who've over-extended themselves with multiple loans. Also beware of aged accounts suddenly asking for a loan if it seems out of character. Another trend to look out for is borrowers who are asking for short-term loans just to develop their trust rating. Often they are budling up to take bigger and bigger loans, with the possible goal of defaulting on a large loan. If you are new member offering a lending service or an established member new to the market, it's recommended that you sign a message using an address containing some funds. This can demonstrate to the community that you are serious, and have the capitol to fill accepted requests. It's also advisable to ask borrowers to sign a message using an address that was staked or previously posted on the forum. This will help ensure that you are dealing with the same person responsible for the account's reputation. I'm of the opinion that requesting signed messages should be standard practice, especially for unsecured loans. - Be willing to use escrow:
If you are new member offering secured loans, you may not have the reputation to earn the borrower's confidence that you will return the collateral. Using a trusted, reliable third party as an escrow agent will help everyone feel safe. Bitcoin technology such as multi-sig wallets can also be helpful in this regard. Showing that you are willing to use escrow will demonstrate to the community that you are not attempting to scam someone out of their collateral. Transparency and communication will help the lender maintain a professional and respectable reputation. Once a loan has been issued, use the Trust System to communicate that the borrower has an active loan with you. It's just common curtesy. Publicly posting the addresses and transaction IDs involved is not mandatory, but can be helpful in resolving issues, or to prove that one party breached the initial agreement. Generally speaking, transparency provides safety for the lender, however it's important to respect your clients' privacy, even from yourself. Do not ask your clients to disclose personal information about themselves, such as identification documents, for example. Not only is this an unreliable way to ensure the borrower's identity, it's likely to be seen as attempted identity theft.
.Collateral:The question of what constitutes valid collateral often comes up, and is often met with some debate. Only the lender can decide what collateral suites his risk profile, however the following guidelines can help borrowers assess the likelihood of their secured loan request being accepted. The most likely asset to be accepted as collateral by the majority of lenders is a cryptocurrency other than the one you want to borrow. The currency, coin, or token must have sufficient trade volume, and be traded on reputable and accessibly exchanges. For example, a borrower who is bullish on BTC but needs some USDT to pay for a service may request a USDT loan with BTC posted as collateral. Often the lender holds the collateral in an address he controls, but the lender and borrower may agree to have the collateral held by an impartial third party or escrow agent. - Non-Fungible Digital Assets:
Non fungible assets are rarely accepted as collateral, and depending on the request can often be seen as an attempted scam or deceptive sale of the asset. Despite some debates regarding the validity of digital assets and collectables (such as NFTs, domain names, or websites) as collateral, it's worth noting that they are frequently offered but rarely accepted. Again, the lender needs to evaluate the legitimacy of the asset's proclaimed value, and the risk inherent in such offers. Some escrow agents can help with non-fungible assets, in the event an offer is accepted. Physical goods can be deemed valid collateral by some lenders, but often the logistics of transporting the items to and from the lender or escrow agent can be time-consuming and cost-prohibitive. Borrowers who are within a close geographic area to the lender or a trusted escrow agent may have an easier time having their offer accepted. Lenders will not accept photos or video evidence of the existence of the asset in leu of having the collateral physically in their possession. If it's not in the lender's or escrow agent's hands, it's not collateral. Borrowers who offer only proof of the existence of the asset, and are unwilling to relinquish possession are often seen as attempting to scam. - What is not collateral:
- Identification documents are not collateral. IDs can be faked or forged, and do not guarantee the identity of the borrower. Nor do they guarantee recourse in the event of a defaulted loan. Even if the documents are authentic, law enforcement agencies could take years to make any progress on a reported case.
- Fiat sent through PayPal or other reversable payment methods should never be offered or accepted as collateral. The borrower could charge-back the collateral as soon as the lender sends the loan, leaving the lender empty handed and at a loss.
- Social media accounts and service provider accounts (such as exchange or casino accounts) are not collateral. Any account that can be recovered by social engineering is a high risk for the lender to accept as collateral.
- Bitcoin Forum accounts should not be offered or accepted as collateral. If a lender attempts to sell a Bitcoin Forum account in the event of a loan default, he risks being red-tagged as an account seller. Selling and buying of Bitcoin Forum accounts is frowned upon by many members of the community.
- Items the borrower has listed for sale. If the borrower is looking to sell the item he's offering as collateral, odds are he's not going to return the loan and is trying to trick the lender into unwittingly buying the item.
- Virtual credit cards, gift cards, access codes, game codes, VPS codes, or any similar type of item that holds digital value should be avoided. These can easily be retrieved by the borrower through social engineering, or drained of their value immediately after the loan is issued.
Summary:
Historically the lending board has been an unkind place for members with fanciful borrowing requests. It has been less kind to lenders with unclear or clearly malicious motives. The nature of the lending board will always attract lazy scammers with feeble attempts that lack creativity. If you are a legitimate borrower or lender, you'll want to make every effort to avoid the appearance that you are one of these lazy scammers, or you risk being tagged and labeled as if you are one.
|
|
|
|
Now, now. I'm not familiar with CYBER_COWBOY, but DireWolfM14 is certainly not a bitch of any size.
Lol, I'm sure some would argue that I've had my moments.  But I think Stalker22 was talking about PytagoraZ, since he started a similar thread about the neutral that he received a few weeks ago. |
|
|
|
I really don't like users using the trust system for this type of stuff. Speculation tags are just not cool IMO.
I'm 100% in agreement with this comment, but when in Rome... The trust system seems to have become the new post-it-note for the forum, even Switzerland suggested I leave that tag.  |
|
|
|
I've received a message I don't know him I don't know why he chose to contact me.
I get unsolicited messages regularly, many asking for a loan or offering an "investment" in their project. If there are no links in the message, or there's no underhanded effort to advertise a website or anything like that I just ignore it. If there are links I won't click on them, but I might copy them and investigate using tor browser with a fresh circuit. If it looks even the slightest bit suspicious, I'll report the PM. Unsolicited PMs are annoying, but they're not automatically dangerous. You can also tag it with a negative tag and write in the reference link that it was an unsolicited PM.
And people wonder why the trust system is growing more useless by the day. |
|
|
|
@direwolf: please update trust after lender confirm repayement
Oops, guess I was a bit quick on the trigger. I already removed the feedback, but I'm sure it's all good. @hopenotlate, please confirm repayment at your earliest convenience. |
|
|
|
Conditionally accepted. I'll respond in a PM. I thought it was your policy to not negotiate with terrorists.  One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter! |
|
|
|
Loan Amount: 0.01 BTC
Loan Purpose: Trade
Loan Repay Amount: 0.02
Loan Repay Date: One week
Type of Collateral: Dogecoin
Escrow profile Link:
Bitcoin Address: I can send PM
Conditionally accepted. I'll respond in a PM.Never mind. I see Zazarb already accepted your loan. |
|
|
|
Let me know what I need to do to join this cause I definitely could use more distractions in my life.
I see an opportunity here. Does the league need a hazing ritual for new members? Let's put it up to a vote for all of last year's participants. You know, like the clusterfuck for all the league settings we had last year. I feel hazed.  My suggestion for the league hazing ritual; find the shittiest shitpost that you have made (and survived the mods) and post it in the hall of shame thread. Welcome aboard! |
|
|
|
I'd be curious to know what commonality @ Peanutswar, @ mdgabrielzim, and @ Woodie have had in their browsing history. If they all clicked on a phishing link, or if they all downloaded some software, or if they all participated in an off-site give-away that asked for forum details. It would seem they all fell into the same trap. |
|
|
|
As with their first loan to HedgeFx there are no TX details, so we only have both of their words that a loan occurred.
I wouldn't put a lot of thought into that part of it. I go through great lengths to disassociate my lending funds from my main stash to preserve my privacy. I wouldn't assume anything untoward just because a lender chooses to preserve his privacy. Nevertheless Timelord2067, good effort in finding a link between HedgeFX and the previously banned user. Honestly, I'm not sure HedgeFX is someone we need to be worried about as a scammer, but as DaveF pointed out, a ban is a ban, and ban evasion is not a good look for someone trying to do business on the board. @HedgeFX, it's worth pointing out that scams have nothing to do with bans. Scams aren't moderated, and scammers are not banned. The ban had to result from breaking one or more of the forum rules. If I were you I would create a ban appeal thread for the P2Pfinder account in Meta, and stop posting anywhere on the forum with the exception of that thread. At least for the time being, while the mods have an opportunity to look at your case. |
|
|
|
Why it is to hard to imagine some people know they'll never want to take a loan on Bitcointalk? The large majority of all internet users will never need it.
That's not hard to imagine at all. Have you known me to ask for a loan in the 5 plus years I've been here? It's also not hard to imagine all the pea-brained lemmings jumping on the most recent and virtuous "cool-kid-bandwagon." All this will do is give the account holder an excuse to shirk their responsibility of keeping their account secure (one already claimed that would be an "unnecessary fuss.") Is that something you want to put yourself in the middle of when the account gets "hacked" and some lender issues a loan? Mark my words, someone will abuse this and honestly I would expect a more critical stance on this silliness from you. Shouldn't a lender check a user's feedback history anyway before deciding on a loan?
Lenders should be considering a lot more than just the borrower's feedback, especially for an unsecured loan. As it is lenders face a lot of challenges, and the last thing they need is a highly reputable and trusted member of the community giving some shitty account "plausible deniability" to further erode the lenders ability to recover loans. I thought of that possibility too. One way or another, it's not a perfect solution.
"Not a perfect solution" would be acceptable, but this is far from that. My fear is that you're providing an opportunity for scammers. Also true. But it's clear many people fail to keep their account secure. That's probably why more and more websites are bugging users with 2FA.
Don't make that your problem. I was thinking the same too, and it's the reason I made the neutral tag suggestion to avoid this. OP's mistake was not keeping his account secure, but giving a loan is on shasan.
One solution could be to share the losses 50-50, but that would open the possibility for users to claim their account was compromised, and only pay back half their loan.
I don't think shasan should pay a penny, not the right president to set. But at the same time this could have gone a very different way for him if Peanutswar wasn't a standup guy. Maybe shasan needs to learn this lesson in the hardest way possible before he secures his service.
Why do you think, that many of them would ask for a loan in the future?
I don't think that many of them will ask for a loan in the future, but I think there's a very distinct possibility that one of them will, get it, then say it wasn't him and point to LoyceV's feedback as "proof" that it wasn't him. Sure, the lender should have been more scrutinous, but as has been demonstrated in this case not all lenders are as scrutinous as they should be. I already have a very strong suspicion that one of the accounts tagged by LoyceV is the sockpuppet of a loan defaulter and escrow impersonator. |
|
|
|
|
Show Posts
