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941  Local / 中文 (Chinese) / Re: Bitcoin 高質技術討論專區 on: July 16, 2014, 03:55:52 AM
btc能硬分叉吗?能不能把被盗的币全部孤立
肯定是可以的,但是现在比特币系统这么庞大,硬分叉成本应该很高。

在定義上, 所有山寨幣都是bitcoin的硬分叉

"能不能把被盗的币全部孤立"? 當然可以, 只要沒有人接受這些"被盗"的幣就可以. 問題是誰來決定什麼是盗, 什麼不是盗?
942  Economy / Speculation / Re: BTC price will stagnate in November on: July 10, 2014, 09:42:09 AM

I'm not an American, but I suppose the SR case will be judged by a jury?

If he goes to trial, yes.

Only a fool goes to trial in the federal system.

Only a really big fool has a bench trial (i.e. judge decides, no jury) in the federal system.



How could he escape from a trial? The only way I know is pleading guilty.
943  Economy / Speculation / Re: BTC price will stagnate in November on: July 10, 2014, 09:17:01 AM
I gotta say, it's pretty obvious that none of you guys have ever had the misfortune of having to deal with a federal prosecution.

I'm not saying that in a condescending way. I'm saying it in an envious way.

The truth is a federal prosecutor can walk into a courtroom with his penis hanging out of his pants in a clown suit. Federal judges are rubber stamps for the US Attorney's Office, plain and simple. This isn't a state/local court where legal precedent and constitutional rights are valued. This is a dog-and-pony show designed to give the illusion of fairness.

The truth is, they might as well take him out back and put him down like Old Yeller if he goes to trial. He's not going to win. He's just not.

There is a reason that U.S. federal conviction rates are on par with Russia, China and other horrendously unfair justices systems throughout the world.

The sad thing is, 99% of Americans are completely oblivious to the miscarriage of justice carried out every day in any federal court in the country. Ask any attorney that deals specifically in federal cases. Ask any retired federal prosecutor. Ask any retired federal judge. It's downright wrong how unfair some of these prosecutions are.

When you are indicted, it's not a question of *if* you're going to jail...it's a question of for how long.

The only system that's worse is the UCMJ.

I honestly have no idea how federal prosecutors sleep at night. Sure, in some cases they are doing society a great service. Unfortunately, in a disproportionately high amount of cases, they are causing so much more societal harm than good.

I don't know about you, but I don't think 19 year old crack addicts that get tied up in drug conspiracies deserve 20 year mandatory minimum sentences, without parole. Particularly when no violence is even alleged.

It's quite despicable, actually.



I'm not an American, but I suppose the SR case will be judged by a jury?
944  Economy / Speculation / Re: BTC price will stagnate in November on: July 10, 2014, 05:44:31 AM
Proving he is guilty is one thing. Proving ALL of the coins were profit from SR is another thing. I am assuming when he got paid by SR, the BTC was sent through a tumbler, so for them to prove which coins are his and which coins are from SR will take forever if even possible.

Also, I'm not 100% convinced he will be proven guilty of ALL charges.

Bitcoin is fungible like cash. The prosecutor doesn't need to prove a particular banknote is profit from drug dealing. The same principle should apply to bitcoin

Yes BUT

They need to prove that he made an equivalent amnt of BTC equal to the amount they seized.  Not that they seized the RIGHT btc, but that they seized the RIGHT AMNT of BTC.

See?

I think prosecutors face the same problem in traditional drug cases. Since they have seized the SR server, it shouldn't be too difficult to guesstimate his profit
945  Economy / Speculation / Re: BTC price will stagnate in November on: July 10, 2014, 04:11:03 AM
Proving he is guilty is one thing. Proving ALL of the coins were profit from SR is another thing. I am assuming when he got paid by SR, the BTC was sent through a tumbler, so for them to prove which coins are his and which coins are from SR will take forever if even possible.

Also, I'm not 100% convinced he will be proven guilty of ALL charges.

Bitcoin is fungible like cash. The prosecutor doesn't need to prove a particular banknote is profit from drug dealing. The same principle should apply to bitcoin
946  Local / 中文 (Chinese) / Re: Bitcoin 高質技術討論專區 on: July 08, 2014, 08:39:39 AM
请问为何有的区块会早于前一个区块出现?比如309736和309735

請看以下例子:

  • 在一個荒島上, 如果只有一個人, 他有一只太陽能手錶, 那麼他就是荒島上唯一的時間標準, 他也沒必要和其它人對時
  • 在一次軍事行動之中, 長官要求隊員在2014年7月1日早上10時正發動攻擊, 時間以長官的手錶為準. 因此隊員需要先和長官對時
  • 在商業上, 張三和李四簽訂合約, 於2014年7月1日早上10時正前必須完成交易. 因於雙方關係平等, 他們協定以香港天文台的時間為準
  • 在這個論壇發言所顯示的時間, 都是是論壇主機時間為準, 不受發言者電腦時間的影響

在上述的例子, 都有一個中心化的時間標準. 中心化的好處是容易管理, 但缺點是如果這標準出錯, 甚至刻意發出錯誤時間, 所有依賴這標準的人都會出錯.

然而Bitcoin是去中心化的, 其中一個後果就是沒有人能成為時間標準. 當一個礦工挖出一個有效區塊, 這區塊需要數秒甚至數分鐘才能傳播到整個網絡, 所以要核實區塊的真實產生時間是不可能的, 我們只能相信礦工所聲稱的時間, 也就是區塊的timestamp; 但timestamp的時間有可能是超前於真實時間的, 因此Bitcoin協議容許後來的區塊timestamp先於之前的區塊. 但無論如何, 一個區塊的timestamp必須大於過去11個區塊timestamp的中位數. ( 詳見: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Block_timestamp )

這做法確保了只要大部份礦工是誠實的, 區塊的時間大致上會和真實時間相符; 即使個別礦工不當地用了過大的timestamp, 後來的礦工都有機會修正. 如果硬性要求後來區塊的時間必須大於上一區塊, 只要一個惡意礦工就能操控了整個區塊鏈的時間.

但請注意, 須然後來區塊的timestamp可以小於之前的區塊, 但區塊出現的先後次序卻是不會改變的: 這是因為每一區塊必包括上一區塊的hash, 而這個hash只有在上一區塊找出來後才會知道. 也因為如此, 不論timestamp是什麼, 交易的先後次序是由區塊的先後次序所決定.

(C) jl2012@bitcointalk 2014. CC BY-NC-SA 3.0  http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/3.0/

這裏又出現刷子了. 在這裏刷帖只會浪費你的時間, 刪帖後你不會得到任何Activity
947  Local / 中文 (Chinese) / Re: Bitcoin 高質技術討論專區 on: July 08, 2014, 08:00:53 AM
你好,我想请问,地址有没有可能重复? 按理如果地址越来越多,那最后肯定会出现重复的,或者到时候等所有地址都产生完毕,就不允许产生新的地址了?

这个问题我都可以回答,地址一共有2^160个,重复的几率相当于你每天买彩票中五百万,连中一辈子。

在統計學上是有可能重複的. 但不難證明, 就算到了太陽滅亡的一天, 隨機產生重複地址的概率仍然是極低
948  Economy / Speculation / Re: SecondMarket Bitcoin Investment Trust Observer on: July 03, 2014, 09:37:33 AM
I agree that Tera's claim that "the auction doesn't matter" was kind of naive. His point is, and it's a valid one, that the amount of coins auctioned is simply too small to be significant, when compared to what is mined,

Actually even this point is invalid. All bidders, no matter opportunistic or not, needed to have 100% of their bidding amount ready in cash, as they only had 1 day to pay if they won. Although "merely" 29600 coins were sold, 100s of million USD was effectively frozen for over 2 weeks.
949  Economy / Speculation / Re: SecondMarket Bitcoin Investment Trust Observer on: July 03, 2014, 04:28:52 AM
406XBT bought. This is the biggest buy in the past 2 months
Woot.

"So basically at least USD$20MM of bitcoin buying demand went unsatisfied in the auction and will look elsewhere to buy bitcoins i.e. market" Alan Silbert

Yes, those claiming the auction not significant were completely delusional ( https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=665961.0 )

lol   "30K coins are... a mere 0.22% of coins - it is nothing" - Tera

Yet (s)he tracks squiggly lines created by dozens of coins..to predict the future
such are the cultists...

Such are the trolls. The auction left 44 disappointed bidders with 10s, if not 100s, of million USD ready for buying bitcoin. Even only 10% of these USD will actually buy on the market, that should push us to $700; and we have already see this effect in BIT on the first 2 days of July
950  Economy / Speculation / Re: SecondMarket Bitcoin Investment Trust Observer on: July 03, 2014, 03:13:54 AM
406XBT bought. This is the biggest buy in the past 2 months
Woot.

"So basically at least USD$20MM of bitcoin buying demand went unsatisfied in the auction and will look elsewhere to buy bitcoins i.e. market" Alan Silbert

Yes, those claiming the auction not significant were completely delusional ( https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=665961.0 )
951  Economy / Speculation / Re: SecondMarket Bitcoin Investment Trust Observer on: July 03, 2014, 02:48:05 AM
406XBT bought. This is the biggest buy in the past 2 months
952  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: I assume this 497 BTC output is unspendable? on: July 02, 2014, 05:11:39 PM
I think attempting to return the coins to Mt Gox would probably be hard to get consensus behind, but as it's never been tried nobody really knows for sure.

Respawning those coins into the money supply is probably a lot less controversial and I did consider the idea a few times before, bit it's also not clear it's worth the effort and complexity. Actually I'd say it's not.

Both are very bad ideas. Any hardfork related to money supply will destroy the value of bitcoin.

Also, we never know if there was any secret deal between Mark and someone, and these coins were used as a proof-of-burn.

Finally, these unspendable UTXO could be safely pruned.
953  Economy / Speculation / Re: Winklevoss ETF will list on NASDAQ as "COIN" on: July 02, 2014, 08:57:13 AM
I am reading the Registration Statement now. I do not understand the maths behind it. Can anyone help me out?

My understanding (could be wrong) of the COIN ETF: WBT is issuing 1 million shares and each share represents 0.2btc. The price of bitcoin today is around $600 (for easy calculation). So, each share should have a trading value of around $120. But on page 1 of the Registration Statement, it says "proposed maximum offering price per Share" is $20.09??

The share price listed on nasdaq is also $20.09:
http://www.nasdaq.com/markets/ipos/company/winklevoss-bitcoin-trust-909930-72927

Is that $20.09 offering price going to change?
If not, who is going to make money from the $100 price difference?

Thanks!

That price was calculated 1 year ago, when bitcoin was about $100 each. I think they will update the price when it is really approved
954  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: July 02, 2014, 05:37:24 AM
What the heck are you talking about, ive been getting all these benefits "for free". I have never paid a dime to any credit card company. No annual fees, no charges, nothing... I have all the above "totally free". If you have never heard about these things you should do some research.

You absolutely have, you just aren't aware of it.  Merchants are charged fees by the CC processors and those are passed onto you, the customer.  Don't think you're not paying for that shit one way or another just because you don't see the charge first hand.
Maybe there is a markup to make up for transaction fees. The point that Im making is that the merchants charge the same price whether you pay by cc or cash or bitcoin. At least I get a few % cashback + other benefits and it basically negates any markup. You pay the same price with bitcoin and get no benefits.

Therefore unless bitcoin payments get some sort of discount youd have to be pretty stupid or paranoid about the nsa snooping on you to pay via bitcoins...

SOME merchants charge you the same, but not all. Here I always buy computer parts with cash because I have to pay at least 2% extra with CC, and that could not cover those CC "benefits". For those merchants who charge you the same, the price is usually less competitive.
955  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: July 02, 2014, 03:57:24 AM
So today we had two major retailers announce that they're taking bitcoin and we're now lower value than we were 24 hours ago. This market is brutal.
As many people have pointed out already, those major retailers announced that they are taking dollars -- that will come from the sale of bitcoins, mostly by bitcoin enthusiasts.  So those news may give bitcoin more visibility, but it is questionable whether they will expand the number of bitcoin owners, and they imply more coins moving from hoards into the market.

And, anyway, those news are irrelevant to the Chinese traders -- who seem to be leading the current drop.


Merchant adoption is the next step towards global acceptance after the initial investment / speculation phase. It's the next logical step and it's a good sign.

They are not taking dollars, they are taking Bitcoins. And not all of the merchants are selling 100% of the Bitcoins back to dollars by the way.

When people start to realize how easy crazy is to buy things in locally and the internet without the need of giving credit card or bank information to anyone acceptance is going to increase. It's the next natural / logical step, credit cards are a thing of the past and obsolete.



Interesting points. However I still cannot understand why someone would pay with bitcoins if rewards credit cards offer bonus cashback + services and features.
eg. many companies add an extra year warranty + some have purchase protection if item gets stolen/breaks within 90 days + protection from sellers who dont send quality goods and refuse to make good on the purchase and many more features.

Some of these benefits coupled with extra cash back (eg. I have a card that gives 2% cashback on all purchases) wont exactly make people flock to bitcoin unless they have something to hide or are paranoid and want to be "anonymous" (as if the nsa cant track you anyway...).

P.S. Of course there is a use for someone who cant get their hands on a credit card with features like those mentioned above (most people probably can though).



Do you truly believe all these bonus cashback, services, features, extra year warranty, purchase protection, and ability to charge-back are FREE? YOU are the one paying for all these crap, and even you don't want these you have no choice
956  Economy / Speculation / Re: SecondMarket Bitcoin Investment Trust Observer on: July 01, 2014, 04:09:23 PM
As many BIT customers failed to bid, we have see some action this week
957  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: I assume this 497 BTC output is unspendable? on: July 01, 2014, 04:02:39 PM
Quote
No, they won't. They'd have no economic incentive to.
Give me a seed of your hope in this.
I see a lot of absurd (for my opinion of course) things in real world created by crowd.
Why bitcoin is free of it?

Because that will make bitcoin worthless
958  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: July 01, 2014, 03:47:39 PM
I also have one btc stowed away. In the format of a ticket for the btc1k party. It's in a corner, almost forgotten, has been accumulating dust for a while. I wouldn't mind using it before Xmas this year.

There is a good chance that the price will be 5k on the day of the btc1k party.

So the ticket to the $1k party was $1k (as you will only get to use it if Bitcoin reaches $1k again). That's quite pricey for a party ...

You can pay $650 to buy 1 bitcoin and use the bitcoin to buy a ticket now

But it will only count if Bitcoin reaches $1k one day so effectively it will have cost you $1k. There's no way around this.

No. Just consider it as a lottery ticket. If bitcoin will never reach 1k, you lose the money you spent on that bitcoin (say $650). If bitcoin reaches 1k someday, you still lose $650, but you get a party ticket of >$1k

This is all bullshit if your alternative is to hold onto the BTC1. You are still stuck thinking in fiat. Think about it.



See the highlight. YOU are the one stuck thinking in fiat, not me.
959  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: July 01, 2014, 03:34:27 PM
I also have one btc stowed away. In the format of a ticket for the btc1k party. It's in a corner, almost forgotten, has been accumulating dust for a while. I wouldn't mind using it before Xmas this year.

There is a good chance that the price will be 5k on the day of the btc1k party.

So the ticket to the $1k party was $1k (as you will only get to use it if Bitcoin reaches $1k again). That's quite pricey for a party ...

You can pay $650 to buy 1 bitcoin and use the bitcoin to buy a ticket now

But it will only count if Bitcoin reaches $1k one day so effectively it will have cost you $1k. There's no way around this.

No. Just consider it as a lottery ticket. If bitcoin will never reach 1k, you lose the money you spent on that bitcoin (say $650). If bitcoin reaches 1k someday, you still lose $650, but you get a party ticket of >$1k
960  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: July 01, 2014, 03:21:41 PM
I also have one btc stowed away. In the format of a ticket for the btc1k party. It's in a corner, almost forgotten, has been accumulating dust for a while. I wouldn't mind using it before Xmas this year.

There is a good chance that the price will be 5k on the day of the btc1k party.

So the ticket to the $1k party was $1k (as you will only get to use it if Bitcoin reaches $1k again). That's quite pricey for a party ...

You can pay $650 to buy 1 bitcoin and use the bitcoin to buy a ticket now
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