Flat Earth

[nomad13666]

By your wish added to ignore. I suggest you do the same and we would be both happy.

... but then that would deprive us of double the lulz; mocking both Flat Earthers and Hollow Earthers !

We all chipped in and bought you something, BobLawblaw.

It's packed real tight, just the way you like it.

Bon appetit, princess.

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[teeneffigy]

Rockets are not used in space they are used on earth to get hardware into orbit. After that they fall back to earth.. plop into the ocean.. So what's all this about rockets not working in space? Who cares we don't use them in space. 

[notbatman]

Rockets are not used in space they are used on earth to get hardware into orbit. After that they fall back to earth.. plop into the ocean.. So what's all this about rockets not working in space? Who cares we don't use them in space. 

NASA claims they landed a man on the Moon and returned him to Earth. Assuming you believe this to be true how do you figure they managed to do this without rockets?

[nomad13666]

Rockets are not used in space they are used on earth to get hardware into orbit. After that they fall back to earth.. plop into the ocean.. So what's all this about rockets not working in space? Who cares we don't use them in space. 

See also:
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=space+is+fake+nasa+lies

[nomad13666]

Bon appetit, princess.

How many times do I need to remind you that I'm not into scat-play ? Regular enema's are cleanliness next to Godliness.

Sorry kitten, I forgot that it's all cotton candy and rainbows that you girls pinch out of your shit sockets.

 

[TooQik]

Instead of throwing shit and insults at eachother. Why not make some science?

[...snip...]

Przemax, if you really want to get into the science of how rockets work here's a good link:

http://www.real-world-physics-problems.com/rocket-physics.html

For the portion specific to how thrust is created you'll need to scroll down about half way and you'll see a section titled A Closer Look At Thrust.

Ill take a look. Thanks. But what this have to do with what I had written? Where have I made a wrong assumptions? Im not saying that there cant be made any pressure inside a propulsion engine by burning up the fuel. Im just proposing the idea that its a very small amount of pressure from the engine in supposed vacuum, making it only faasible to make a spacecraft change its directions not a speed especially when the fuel is mixed with some heavy particles like some metals.

The assumption that you keep making which is wrong is that pressure in the engine pushes against the outside pressure (atmosphere) to produce thrust, it doesn't. The outside pressure actually works against the thrust of the engine by slowing down the escaping gases. A good way to get your head around this is to think about what would happen if you stopped the gases from escaping the engine by blocking off the exhaust exit. If you did this the pressure would be equalized in all directions and no propulsion could occur.

And I go as far as here to make your version of story the most feasible. I dont know why I do that. You give me some engineering principles when I tell you physical properties. Explain me how does engineeres go about the physics stuff. Its wrong to assume that everyone is a constructor of rockets. Im not. I had just better education (post soviet) than the westerners in a general science.

The engineers study physics as part of their education process. Engineers generally specialise in particular fields, so you would have many engineers working together each contributing in their own areas.

Edit after reading the summary:

The analysis in this section is basically a force and momentum analysis. But to do a complete thrust analysis we would have to look at the thermal and fluid dynamics of the expansion process, as the exhaust gas travels through the rocket nozzle.

Are you a cheater or you just try to confuse me? They say they dont analyse the most important thing that im talking about..... They dont talk about how a gas moves. Shit man...... Thats the most important here.

Not trying to cheat or confuse you at all. The reason they don't analyse the mentioned fields is that while they would both affect the amount of thrust being produced, they don't change the principals behind how the engine produces thrust. Think of it this way, regardless of how the fuel flows into the engine and how much expansion occurs when the fuel is burned, pressure is still created that pushes against the inside walls of the engine and this fact is the key to understanding how they work.

[notbatman]

...[clip]...

The assumption that you keep making which is wrong is that pressure in the engine pushes against the outside pressure (atmosphere) to produce thrust, it doesn't. The outside pressure actually works against the thrust of the engine by slowing down the escaping gases. A good way to get your head around this is to think about what would happen if you stopped the gases from escaping the engine by blocking off the exhaust^† exit. If you did this the pressure would be equalized in all directions and no propulsion could occur.

...[clip]...

The outside pressure you say "works against the thrust of the engine by slowing down the escaping gases" creates what's called "compression". Do you know anything at all about engines? How about the wrench and the screwdriver?





Bonus meme:

†

[nomad13666]

Sorry kitten, I forgot that it's all cotton candy and rainbows that you girls pinch out of your shit sockets.

Sorry. It's more white creampies, and not so much cotton candy and rainbows.

Ah yes, that would explain the odorous slug trail you leave behind you.

[C0RE]

I don't read everything but how can you explain that we can trip around the world if the earth is flat?

[TooQik]

...[clip]...

The assumption that you keep making which is wrong is that pressure in the engine pushes against the outside pressure (atmosphere) to produce thrust, it doesn't. The outside pressure actually works against the thrust of the engine by slowing down the escaping gases. A good way to get your head around this is to think about what would happen if you stopped the gases from escaping the engine by blocking off the exhaust^† exit. If you did this the pressure would be equalized in all directions and no propulsion could occur.

...[clip]...

The outside pressure you say "works against the thrust of the engine by slowing down the escaping gases" creates what's called "compression". Do you know anything at all about engines? How about the wrench and the screwdriver?

It's funny that you mention compression, as it's the compression of the gases released from the burning mixture that push in all directions causing the pressure within the engine and thus the thrust. While a small amount of compression would occur between the escaping gases and the atmosphere there is nothing restricting the flow of gases outside the rocket so it's negligible.

I've fixed a number of four stroke engines over the years, so I'm quite familiar with the internal combustion engine, wrenches and screwdrivers. How about you?

[BADecker]

...[clip]...

The assumption that you keep making which is wrong is that pressure in the engine pushes against the outside pressure (atmosphere) to produce thrust, it doesn't. The outside pressure actually works against the thrust of the engine by slowing down the escaping gases. A good way to get your head around this is to think about what would happen if you stopped the gases from escaping the engine by blocking off the exhaust^† exit. If you did this the pressure would be equalized in all directions and no propulsion could occur.

...[clip]...

The outside pressure you say "works against the thrust of the engine by slowing down the escaping gases" creates what's called "compression". Do you know anything at all about engines? How about the wrench and the screwdriver?

It's funny that you mention compression, as it's the compression of the gases released from the burning mixture that push in all directions causing the pressure within the engine and thus the thrust. While a small amount of compression would occur between the escaping gases and the atmosphere there is nothing restricting the flow of gases outside the rocket so it's negligible.

I've fixed a number of four stroke engines over the years, so I'm quite familiar with the internal combustion engine, wrenches and screwdrivers. How about you?

Internal combustion engines have burns as slow as 3 one-thousandths of a second. Controlled detonations in rocket engines can reach an excess of 1 fifty thousandth of a second.

So, what do freshly exploding gasses in a rocket engine push against since there are no pistons? Two things. The rocket engine, and the previously exploded gasses that haven't made it out of the engine yet.

[Przemax]

The assumption that you keep making which is wrong is that pressure in the engine pushes against the outside pressure (atmosphere) to produce thrust, it doesn't.

No its you who make the wrong assumptions. You keep on talking about external gas to the engines like if its a one body within the rocket. Those are not. Even when gases are interior to the engine structure they are still external bodies per se. Gases around you may move very fast they dont affect you unless you compress them against you. Then and only then you might talk about gases affecting another bodies by a compression.

And yes it might seem they are part of rocket becuase they are inside the engine, but they are not a part of the rocket neither any objects with different density is not a part of another body unless you compress them against that body.

The engineers study physics as part of their education process. Engineers generally specialise in particular fields, so you would have many engineers working together each contributing in their own areas.

Engineers are not scientists. To be an engineer all you have to have is a master degree. To be a scientist you need phd. Someone else gives them assumptions and they build stuff based on that assumptions. Difference between a rockets works in vaccum and there is no vacuum in space is completly and utterly irrelevant for them.

I dont want to assume that they dont understand that you cant lift yourself by the belt. Maybe 4 years in college to be an engineer is to little time to understand that you cant but.... What can I say. Im not physicist maybe they figured out the way how to lift yourself up.

If something works inside a physical body it does not mean that it can move the body in any direction without the external force. If you create forces (newtons) inside the physical body the forces even themselfs (as in the law of thermodynamics) out in every direction if not acted upon by external forces. That is like elementary school physics.

Internal combustion engines have burns as slow as 3 one-thousandths of a second. Controlled detonations in rocket engines can reach an excess of 1 fifty thousandth of a second.

So? Does that makes theory of relativity valid at that kind of speeds? No. Its still a normal physics. Its just makes pressure higher IF A PRESSURE IS BUILT. IF is very important here.

Higher molecules speed makes it possible to use slower moving molecules as if they are different density objects to create a pressure but you need both of them.

So, what do freshly exploding gasses in a rocket engine push against since there are no pistons? Two things. The rocket engine, and the previously exploded gasses that haven't made it out of the engine yet.

Thats a BS. Gas is a gas. Freshly exploded gas with unfreshly exploded gas what does that even mean? Either something has same or different density or speed of particles or is soon to be the same fluid. How do you want to divide the gas? By what measures?

[Spoetnik]

I don't read everything but how can you explain that we can trip around the world if the earth is flat?

Good question.. i would like to see the Flat Earth'ers explain that one LOL 

[notbatman]

...[clip]...

The assumption that you keep making which is wrong is that pressure in the engine pushes against the outside pressure (atmosphere) to produce thrust, it doesn't. The outside pressure actually works against the thrust of the engine by slowing down the escaping gases. A good way to get your head around this is to think about what would happen if you stopped the gases from escaping the engine by blocking off the exhaust^† exit. If you did this the pressure would be equalized in all directions and no propulsion could occur.

...[clip]...

The outside pressure you say "works against the thrust of the engine by slowing down the escaping gases" creates what's called "compression". Do you know anything at all about engines? How about the wrench and the screwdriver?

It's funny that you mention compression, as it's the compression of the gases released from the burning mixture that push in all directions causing the pressure within the engine and thus the thrust. While a small amount of compression would occur between the escaping gases and the atmosphere there is nothing restricting the flow of gases outside the rocket so it's negligible.

I've fixed a number of four stroke engines over the years, so I'm quite familiar with the internal combustion engine, wrenches and screwdrivers. How about you?

The atmosphere is under tremendous pressure and greatly restricts the flow of expanding gasses from the rocket nozzle. The pressure caused by the flow of expanding gasses compresses the atmosphere and it's this force between the rocket engine and atmosphere that causes thrust.

[notbatman]

I don't read everything but how can you explain that we can trip around the world if the earth is flat?

The world is a motionless flat plane with magnetic north at the center, if you fly east or west via the compass you will eventually travel in a circle.

[Przemax]

I don't read everything but how can you explain that we can trip around the world if the earth is flat?

The world is a motionless flat plane with magnetic north at the center, if you fly east or west via the compass you will eventually travel in a circle.

But if you keep going south, you hit a huge impassable ice-wall, right ?

And you lick it, making your tongue stuck there, so you could never tell humanity about it.

[TooQik]

The assumption that you keep making which is wrong is that pressure in the engine pushes against the outside pressure (atmosphere) to produce thrust, it doesn't.

No its you who make the wrong assumptions. You keep on talking about external gas to the engines like if its a one body within the rocket. Those are not. Even when gases are interior to the engine structure they are still external bodies per se. Gases around you may move very fast they dont affect you unless you compress them against you. Then and only then you might talk about gases affecting another bodies by a compression.

And yes it might seem they are part of rocket becuase they are inside the engine, but they are not a part of the rocket neither any objects with different density is not a part of another body unless you compress them against that body.

I'm not making any assumptions, I'm using physics that has been tried, tested, proven, peer reviewed and is repeatable if you chose to perform the experiments yourself.

You are correct that the gases produced through the burning of the fuel are not part of the rocket itself, no-where have I said that they are.

The engineers study physics as part of their education process. Engineers generally specialise in particular fields, so you would have many engineers working together each contributing in their own areas.

Engineers are not scientists. To be an engineer all you have to have is a master degree. To be a scientist you need phd. Someone else gives them assumptions and they build stuff based on that assumptions. Difference between a rockets works in vaccum and there is no vacuum in space is completly and utterly irrelevant for them.

I dont want to assume that they dont understand that you cant lift yourself by the belt. Maybe 4 years in college to be an engineer is to little time to understand that you cant but.... What can I say. Im not physicist maybe they figured out the way how to lift yourself up.

If something works inside a physical body it does not mean that it can move the body in any direction without the external force. If you create forces (newtons) inside the physical body the forces even themselfs (as in the law of thermodynamics) out in every direction if not acted upon by external forces. That is like elementary school physics.

Don't get caught up on someones credentials. Just because someone doesn't have a recognised certificate in something doesn't mean that they don't understand how it works. There are plenty of people who have knowledge without certificates, as there are plenty who have certificates without knowledge.

You've mentioned lifting yourself up by the belt, as you're aware, you can't do this and no-one here is even suggesting that you can.

I really don't know how else to explain the physics to you, other than to say keep researching. From your comments it shows that you have some understanding of the physics involved but you are unable to grasp some of the other basic concepts.

[Przemax]

You are correct that the gases produced through the burning of the fuel are not part of the rocket itself, no-where have I said that they are.

So a force affecting a gas does not affect other bodies so why bother with explaining gas? There need to be some connection and the only connection there could be is pressure.

I'm not making any assumptions, I'm using physics that has been tried, tested, proven, peer reviewed and is repeatable if you chose to perform the experiments yourself.

Everybody is making assumptions or using someone elses assumptions. No sorry brainless people dont make assumptions, but yeah I discluded those.

BRAIN works on assumptions.

Experiments are repeated. On Earth. Well. Yeah they are and you just "assume" its the same in supposed vacuum.  Hence the space is vacuum because noone does experiments if a space is vacuum. Got it?

We are not talking about if a rocket works. THEY DO. We are talking about space being a vacuum or not. Got it? And that thing is just assumed not testen, proven peer reviewed or anything. This issue is just ignored.

I really don't know how else to explain the physics to you, other than to say keep researching. From your comments it shows that you have some understanding of the physics involved but you are unable to grasp some of the other basic concepts.

You have not explained ANYTHING. You have just gave me some stupid article ignoring a thermodynamics - the only thing worth mentioning in the rockets, and you have told me im wrong in assuming something and didnt explain why.

[TooQik]

...[clip]...

The assumption that you keep making which is wrong is that pressure in the engine pushes against the outside pressure (atmosphere) to produce thrust, it doesn't. The outside pressure actually works against the thrust of the engine by slowing down the escaping gases. A good way to get your head around this is to think about what would happen if you stopped the gases from escaping the engine by blocking off the exhaust^† exit. If you did this the pressure would be equalized in all directions and no propulsion could occur.

...[clip]...

The outside pressure you say "works against the thrust of the engine by slowing down the escaping gases" creates what's called "compression". Do you know anything at all about engines? How about the wrench and the screwdriver?

It's funny that you mention compression, as it's the compression of the gases released from the burning mixture that push in all directions causing the pressure within the engine and thus the thrust. While a small amount of compression would occur between the escaping gases and the atmosphere there is nothing restricting the flow of gases outside the rocket so it's negligible.

I've fixed a number of four stroke engines over the years, so I'm quite familiar with the internal combustion engine, wrenches and screwdrivers. How about you?

The atmosphere is under tremendous pressure and greatly restricts the flow of expanding gasses from the rocket nozzle. The pressure caused by the flow of expanding gasses compresses the atmosphere and it's this force between the rocket engine and atmosphere that causes thrust.

At sea-level atmospheric pressure is a mere 14.7 psi - not really the definition of "tremendous pressure" is it. Nor does the atmosphere greatly restrict the flow of expanding gases, just take a look at exhaust systems in cars and see how well a naturally aspirated engine runs without an exhaust.

[Spoetnik]

I don't read everything but how can you explain that we can trip around the world if the earth is flat?

The world is a motionless flat plane with magnetic north at the center, if you fly east or west via the compass you will eventually travel in a circle.

But if you keep going south, you hit a huge impassable ice-wall, right ?

Should be able to go around in a full circle in any direction.. north, south, east, or west.
How do flat earth'ers explain their way out of that one ?

The explanation earlier seems to potentially work in only west/east.