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Author Topic: Obyte: Totally new consensus algorithm + private untraceable payments  (Read 1168400 times)
jhenfelipe
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May 23, 2018, 04:00:41 PM
 #19041

Whats up with that thing about free distribution of byteballs to the first 100k(?) wallets? Is that true? I heard that eventually first hundred thousand users will receive free bytes! Am I too late? What is the number of bytetball addresses/wallets?
Where did you get the info from? If it is true, I believe they will announce it first here and in their social media accounts, but I have not seen any. So, I doubt it. The only recent distribution method I know is by contributing to World Community Grid.
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May 23, 2018, 04:58:03 PM
 #19042

Send the receiver's address using "Insert address" from the receiver's chat interface. Click on that address in the sender's chat interface and normally you should be able to choose blackbytes and send them. As HCP pointed out, you need bytes to pay for the transaction fees.

How should someone guess that? I mean, there is no instructions whatsoever for doing something lile that. I understand the idea of Byteball is to be easy to use to pursue mass user adoption, but that's certainly not easy unless you know the trick.
And by the way, it didn't work. I am getting now a mistake in red color:
"Impossible to send the payment: precommit callback failed: [a string of text]: conflicting spend proof in inner unit [a string of text]"

When you are stuck you try other things, you click wherever you can until something works ... Having said that, nobody's asking you to guess anything, that's why you can ask here and/or on Slack and people will help you. You actually didn't tell me what you did. For instance, I don't even know if you clicked the send button, copied the address you want to send to, selected blackbytes and were unable to send. It's interesting how you seem to be pissed off after receiving help Smiley.

Anyway, back to the help Smiley. Do you have the latest release on both devices? Are both of them synced?

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May 23, 2018, 06:59:32 PM
 #19043

Send the receiver's address using "Insert address" from the receiver's chat interface. Click on that address in the sender's chat interface and normally you should be able to choose blackbytes and send them. As HCP pointed out, you need bytes to pay for the transaction fees.

How should someone guess that? I mean, there is no instructions whatsoever for doing something lile that. I understand the idea of Byteball is to be easy to use to pursue mass user adoption, but that's certainly not easy unless you know the trick.
And by the way, it didn't work. I am getting now a mistake in red color:
"Impossible to send the payment: precommit callback failed: [a string of text]: conflicting spend proof in inner unit [a string of text]"

When you are stuck you try other things, you click wherever you can until something works ... Having said that, nobody's asking you to guess anything, that's why you can ask here and/or on Slack and people will help you. You actually didn't tell me what you did. For instance, I don't even know if you clicked the send button, copied the address you want to send to, selected blackbytes and were unable to send. It's interesting how you seem to be pissed off after receiving help Smiley.

Anyway, back to the help Smiley. Do you have the latest release on both devices? Are both of them synced?

I was not pissed off with you, sorry if I've given this impression. In fact, thank you for your help.  And I am a big fan of Byteball, and I have been holding bytes already for a year, and I'm quite used to the interface, therefore I'm sorry when I find something not user-friendly which can be a serious obstable to a wider adoption.
So that's what I did:
1. I've paired the apps on two PC Windows devices, both apps are the latest light wallet 2.2.0
2. At this point as I went to send blackbytes I realized the dropdown menu of the available addresses of paired devices was not active.
3. I've asked on forum and you gave me a kind suggestion which I've followed.
4. Following your instructions I could actually get the destination address to appear in the field where you usually would get it by the way of the drop down menu, but as I've clicked send I've got the mistake: "Impossible to send the payment: precommit callback failed: [a string of text]: conflicting spend proof in inner unit [a string of text]"

It's not a big sum of blackbytes, it's worth 4$ in total now so it's not even worth the time of writing this post. But the point is that if there is a problem it must be solved, if we care about Byteball.

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May 23, 2018, 07:08:35 PM
 #19044



is it possible to give some random airdrop of blackbyte to holders of Monero, Zcash and Dash? On full moon...

I think it could be done  between Blackbytes and Monero ( Zcash , Dash) holders on a mutually beneficial basis. Dedicated service could be established for this.
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May 23, 2018, 07:22:01 PM
 #19045

Whats up with that thing about free distribution of byteballs to the first 100k(?) wallets? Is that true? I heard that eventually first hundred thousand users will receive free bytes! Am I too late? What is the number of bytetball addresses/wallets?
Where did you get the info from? If it is true, I believe they will announce it first here and in their social media accounts, but I have not seen any. So, I doubt it. The only recent distribution method I know is by contributing to World Community Grid.

this is just not true. i would have read about it. @jhenfelipe: or did you talk to tony in private and he told you this? i dont think so....

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May 23, 2018, 07:40:11 PM
 #19046

Whats up with that thing about free distribution of byteballs to the first 100k(?) wallets? Is that true? I heard that eventually first hundred thousand users will receive free bytes! Am I too late? What is the number of bytetball addresses/wallets?
Where did you get the info from? If it is true, I believe they will announce it first here and in their social media accounts, but I have not seen any. So, I doubt it. The only recent distribution method I know is by contributing to World Community Grid.

this is just not true. i would have read about it. @jhenfelipe: or did you talk to tony in private and he told you this? i dont think so....

For as long as I can remember this message has been part of the topic start:

"One last thing.  The remaining 1% will be given away to the first 100m users who install Byteball wallet, 100 Kbytes to each user.  This will start 6 months from now or later, after we get ready for that scale."

It's still there, right at the bottom. The whole distribution went way different than Tony expected at the time, we never came close to millions of users through airdrops. So this 100KB giveaway is most likely postponed (on hold?) untill one of the new distribution methods gains enough traction to attract thousands of new users per day. The e-mail attestation reward for Venezuelan USB students went viral though, so it can happen. We'll see how many of them will keep using the wallet. Anyway, from the wording it's not clear what kind of scale is needed to trigger the start of this giveaway, nor what "ready" means, so we'll just wait and see.

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May 23, 2018, 09:00:21 PM
 #19047

Whats up with that thing about free distribution of byteballs to the first 100k(?) wallets? Is that true? I heard that eventually first hundred thousand users will receive free bytes! Am I too late? What is the number of bytetball addresses/wallets?
Where did you get the info from? If it is true, I believe they will announce it first here and in their social media accounts, but I have not seen any. So, I doubt it. The only recent distribution method I know is by contributing to World Community Grid.

this is just not true. i would have read about it. @jhenfelipe: or did you talk to tony in private and he told you this? i dont think so....
Why did you mention me? I also said that I haven't seen any announcement about that. Moreover, I didn't and never talked to tony in private, just to be clear, if ever that question is for me.



For as long as I can remember this message has been part of the topic start:

"One last thing.  The remaining 1% will be given away to the first 100m users who install Byteball wallet, 100 Kbytes to each user.  This will start 6 months from now or later, after we get ready for that scale."
Oh thanks for sharing. I checked and saw it now in the main post. There's no news about it anymore, but yeah let's wait and see
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May 23, 2018, 10:44:10 PM
 #19048


For as long as I can remember this message has been part of the topic start:

"One last thing.  The remaining 1% will be given away to the first 100m users who install Byteball wallet, 100 Kbytes to each user.  This will start 6 months from now or later, after we get ready for that scale."
Oh thanks for sharing. I checked and saw it now in the main post. There's no news about it anymore, but yeah let's wait and see

The system of distribution has already been changed many times, to adapt it to the new emerging realities, so we cannot take anything for granted as for the upcoming methods of distribution. We just have to wait and see, and if we get some good new ideas to share it here so that it can be eventually adopted.

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May 24, 2018, 01:04:46 AM
 #19049

The prices are dropping like anything. Every time the payouts for signature campaigns are sent, I see more drops in the prices.

The campaign will end in another week, so we hope not to see a little selling shield on Wednesdays.

Do you guys expect any recovery or shall I sell?
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May 24, 2018, 01:49:29 AM
 #19050

4. Following your instructions I could actually get the destination address to appear in the field where you usually would get it by the way of the drop down menu, but as I've clicked send I've got the mistake: "Impossible to send the payment: precommit callback failed: [a string of text]: conflicting spend proof in inner unit [a string of text]"
Sounds like the "bytes" you have are possibly not valid... due to being used in another transaction. Not sure if it's referring to the "normal" bytes or the "blackbytes". Your best bet might be to hit up the slack channel and see if the guys there can help.

I have to agree that sometimes the errors thrown by the wallet are a bit obscure. Undecided

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May 24, 2018, 02:24:53 AM
 #19051

The whole crypto market have witnessed massive falls, not only Byteball.
The prices are dropping like anything. Every time the payouts for signature campaigns are sent, I see more drops in the prices.

I actually hope that tonych will keep the campaign operating for one more month to distribute coins to Byteball community and help spreading information about the project out.
Quote
The campaign will end in another week, so we hope not to see a little selling shield on Wednesdays.

Selling at current extremely low prices, I don't think you should sell, mate.
Quote
Do you guys expect any recovery or shall I sell?

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May 24, 2018, 02:33:35 AM
 #19052

The Venezuelan student scheme shows a good way forward for future airdrops, a small amount of USD value can mean a lot to students in countries with low exchange rates, maybe target a campaign to students in Africa, South America,  South East Asia  etc if that went viral could easily get loads of new users, sort of like what Facebook did, but target low exchange rate countries where 10 USD is worth jumping through some hoops.

Verifying students is probably quite possible too, avoid sock puppets.
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May 24, 2018, 03:03:36 AM
 #19053

The Venezuelan student scheme shows a good way forward for future airdrops, a small amount of USD value can mean a lot to students in countries with low exchange rates, maybe target a campaign to students in Africa, South America,  South East Asia  etc if that went viral could easily get loads of new users, sort of like what Facebook did, but target low exchange rate countries where 10 USD is worth jumping through some hoops.

Verifying students is probably quite possible too, avoid sock puppets.

In such countries, people are more interested in dollars than in bytes. think that the distribution should be accessible to all equally.

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May 24, 2018, 03:10:06 AM
 #19054

The Venezuelan student scheme shows a good way forward for future airdrops, a small amount of USD value can mean a lot to students in countries with low exchange rates, maybe target a campaign to students in Africa, South America,  South East Asia  etc if that went viral could easily get loads of new users, sort of like what Facebook did, but target low exchange rate countries where 10 USD is worth jumping through some hoops.

Verifying students is probably quite possible too, avoid sock puppets.
It's good approach to allocate Byteball airdrops to Venezuelan, particularly students and most vulnerable groups of locals there (pregnant women, elderly, etc.). It will be good for both those sort of target airdrop receivers, Byteball project, Byteball community.
Byteball popularity will be increased significantly with such massive airdrops (if available).
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May 24, 2018, 03:35:05 AM
 #19055

The Venezuelan student scheme shows a good way forward for future airdrops, a small amount of USD value can mean a lot to students in countries with low exchange rates, maybe target a campaign to students in Africa, South America,  South East Asia  etc if that went viral could easily get loads of new users, sort of like what Facebook did, but target low exchange rate countries where 10 USD is worth jumping through some hoops.

Verifying students is probably quite possible too, avoid sock puppets.

In such countries, people are more interested in dollars than in bytes. think that the distribution should be accessible to all equally.

Yes, so the student can sell their BB for whatever currency they want, but many would choose to keep it and hope for price appreciation. The point is students in Europe and USA wouldn't be bothered for 5-10 USD worth of value, but sure, all distro methods should be open to everyone, but marketing resources should focus where adoption is more likely i.e. where 10 USD might be worth many hours of equivalent in work. Where I live 10 USD buys a student 1 beer, that guy has very little incentive.
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May 24, 2018, 04:05:27 AM
 #19056

In such countries, people are more interested in dollars than in bytes. think that the distribution should be accessible to all equally.
That totally depends on their temporary needs. Sometimes they need fiats to pay for their daily life expenses. Sometimes, they will stick on holding their Bytes for future use.
For instance, with a  member rank, I can earn $30 which will be paid in Bytes each week. In my country, $30 is high enough to pay for my weekly expenses. By the way, thanks tonych for operating the current signature campaign and hope that it will last more months.

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May 24, 2018, 04:24:43 AM
 #19057

Are there any other developers officially on the Byteball team or is this still a one man show?

I appreciate Tony's principles of wanting to make this an organic community driven project without an ICO.  I also appreciate that this is Tony's baby and he is a bit of a control freak about it.  Unfortunately the reality of the cryptosphere today is that Byteball is going to continue to be further eclipsed by other massively well funded projects and left in the dustbin of history eventually if it doesn't start gaining traction fast.  Tony really needs to start throwing around that massive stash of undistributed GBYTE to give this thing momentum.

Hire 10 full-time developers.  Have them all sign year long contracts at a rate of 1000 GBYTE per year.  That's 185000$ at today's prices.  I am sure there are plenty of qualified programmers and software developers who would find that to offer an acceptable risk/reward ratio (risk of their salary depreciating in value vs appreciating).  That would only cost 10,000 GBYTE.  Imagine what 10 full time developers would be able to accomplish in a year.

Figure out a way to offer more incentive to witnesses at least for now.  Maybe some automated way of rewarding witnesses (start relatively high and have rewards slowly drop as time goes by so that in 5-10 years witnesses will be incentivized solely by transaction fees).  Right now there is very little incentive to become a witness, and even less incentive for users to manually select different witnesses other than the default.  The witnesses will forever remain centralized in Tony's hands unless this problem is solved.
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May 24, 2018, 04:34:05 AM
 #19058

Are there any other developers officially on the Byteball team or is this still a one man show?

I appreciate Tony's principles of wanting to make this an organic community driven project without an ICO.  I also appreciate that this is Tony's baby and he is a bit of a control freak about it.  Unfortunately the reality of the cryptosphere today is that Byteball is going to continue to be further eclipsed by other massively well funded projects and left in the dustbin of history eventually if it doesn't start gaining traction fast.  Tony really needs to start throwing around that massive stash of undistributed GBYTE to give this thing momentum.

Hire 10 full-time developers.  Have them all sign year long contracts at a rate of 1000 GBYTE per year.  That's 185000$ at today's prices.  I am sure there are plenty of qualified programmers and software developers who would find that to offer an acceptable risk/reward ratio (risk of their salary depreciating in value vs appreciating).  That would only cost 10,000 GBYTE.  Imagine what 10 full time developers would be able to accomplish in a year.

Figure out a way to offer more incentive to witnesses at least for now.  Maybe some automated way of rewarding witnesses (start relatively high and have rewards slowly drop as time goes by so that in 5-10 years witnesses will be incentivized solely by transaction fees).  Right now there is very little incentive to become a witness, and even less incentive for users to manually select different witnesses other than the default.  The witnesses will forever remain centralized in Tony's hands unless this problem is solved.

Using the undistributed BB to pay competitve rewards for independent witness operators is a good suggestion, tony is a very smart guy, so I expect he has a plan in place to decentralise the witnesses already, and maybe he is going to pay some rewards from the remaining bytes.

As for adding more devs, tony has achieved amazing results so far, might be better to let third party companies add services on top, having tony employ people just further entrenches him as a 'single point of failure', the sooner tony disappears and retires from active duty the better (no offence tony, just the truth, the day you go the way of satoshi is the day BB is fully decentralised).
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May 24, 2018, 08:34:45 AM
 #19059

Send the receiver's address using "Insert address" from the receiver's chat interface. Click on that address in the sender's chat interface and normally you should be able to choose blackbytes and send them. As HCP pointed out, you need bytes to pay for the transaction fees.

How should someone guess that? I mean, there is no instructions whatsoever for doing something lile that. I understand the idea of Byteball is to be easy to use to pursue mass user adoption, but that's certainly not easy unless you know the trick.
And by the way, it didn't work. I am getting now a mistake in red color:
"Impossible to send the payment: precommit callback failed: [a string of text]: conflicting spend proof in inner unit [a string of text]"

When you are stuck you try other things, you click wherever you can until something works ... Having said that, nobody's asking you to guess anything, that's why you can ask here and/or on Slack and people will help you. You actually didn't tell me what you did. For instance, I don't even know if you clicked the send button, copied the address you want to send to, selected blackbytes and were unable to send. It's interesting how you seem to be pissed off after receiving help Smiley.

Anyway, back to the help Smiley. Do you have the latest release on both devices? Are both of them synced?

I was not pissed off with you, sorry if I've given this impression. In fact, thank you for your help.

No problem and you are welcome Smiley.

4. Following your instructions I could actually get the destination address to appear in the field where you usually would get it by the way of the drop down menu, but as I've clicked send I've got the mistake: "Impossible to send the payment: precommit callback failed: [a string of text]: conflicting spend proof in inner unit [a string of text]"

Sounds like the "bytes" you have are possibly not valid... due to being used in another transaction. Not sure if it's referring to the "normal" bytes or the "blackbytes".

So, do you know if you are trying to send blackbytes that are no longer available? Did you at some point restore from an old backup or have the same wallet (same seed) running on more than one device or anything that you think could have somehow corrupted one or both the wallets?


It's not a big sum of blackbytes, it's worth 4$ in total now so it's not even worth the time of writing this post. But the point is that if there is a problem it must be solved, if we care about Byteball.

+1

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May 24, 2018, 09:21:15 AM
Merited by tonych (10), jbreher (5), Cacingkemi (2), Welsh (1), LoyceV (1), rty (1), Random-String-Symphony (1)
 #19060

The distribution to the Venezuelan university comes in two steps.

The initial idea was to host a Use-a-Thon, where students can enter a contest with prizes in bytes worth about $800 - which is comparatively much money to any student. Arranging such contest had the implication, that contestants would need bytes to experiment with transfers etc. so Tony suggested their domain was added to the white list of the email attestation bot, allowing all students to claim the $10 worth of bytes as reward.

The word spread like wild-fire and people were all over the place offering to pay other students to attest their email to get the referral reward (also worth $10) and that resulted in a complete craze. We had more than than 4000 attestations from students at the university.

What I believe is the best thing about this is, that while some will of course sell it as soon as they get it, others might hold on for a while. This allows the projects of the Use-a-Thon to materialize which suddenly makes their bytes spendable in actual use cases developed by the participants of the Use-a-Thon.

I've seen the suggestions about expanding the concept to other universities in developing countries where the $10 is comparatively worth more than ie. the US or EU. And this has been the plan right from the get go of this initiative.

At the moment, we're gathering information and experience from this first edition of the Byteball Use-a-Thon, which is definitely needed in order to expand to more universities. We encounter problems and questions on a daily basis, that we hadn't thought of, and some of the events at the university couldn't possibly have been foreseen. We also quickly came to the conclusion, that in order for the initiative to have more effect, it would be a smart move to also reward a team of documentarists. During the period of the Use-a-Thon, they will take pictures, do short interviews and/or video clips that will help us build the case when presenting it to other universities.

We also currently ran into the problem, that the university's mail server actually blacklisted the byteball.org domain (any decent spam filter would probably consider thousands of almost identical emails sent from the same address in a few days a text-book example of spam) so we had to get contacts from the Student Council and the on-site coordinating professor meet with the IT department of the university to explain the reason for this.

All in all, there's simply just SO many things, that we discover and learn from doing this, that it wouldn't be plausible to host multiple contests at this point in time. I wouldn't be exaggerating if I say that me and the two other organizers spend somewhere between 3 and 4 hours a day, sorting out issues, having correspondence with university representatives and making needed decisions on things we hadn't thought of before the contest was announced.

My long term dream is to run a series of contests at several universities in a broad range of developing countries. Then - have a huge inter-university contest, where all winning teams will compete against winning teams from other universities in one major Use-a-Thon. That one should of course have a massive prize pool, and preferably include some kind of event, where participants are invited to attend some kind of event where winners will be announced. All contestants would have their travel and living expenses covered. But this is a long term dream, and at this point in time, not feasible. But who knows what the future will bring Smiley

As soon as we start receiving material from the documentary team at the Universidad Simòn Bolìvar, we will start publishing articles and news on the progress, so stay tuned, and if possible, lend a helping hand with whatever the students might request help with. There's plenty to do, and I must say, that being able to directly affect the adoption of the Byteball project is really amazing! This is only possible with smaller projects like Byteball before they grow too big. Had this been an Ethereum-effort, it would simply be a drop in the ocean. I therefore highly encourage everyone to contribute and come up with cool ideas. The Byteball Grants program is open for everyone with great ideas. So get started! Smiley

Cheers!
Punqtured
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