Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com

[Phinnaeus Gage]

Email them...?

Nah, I'll wait for them to answer in this thread.

I can't be the only person wondering about this.

Well I know they've stated they won't be making a profit on Mars it's to gain faith that they are capable of producing a product en mass. That much they have stated in this thread before. I forget when and where, but it was obviously after Mars and Jupiter were announced. They weren't considering an FPGA before.

That said I'm also under the impression Mars is to raise funds for the ASIC development and that the first round of ASICs has no real profit as a lot is non-recurring engineering costs being covered. After that point they can lower pricing. The reward for those purchasing first is hopefully getting in whilst hashrate provides a strong return. Not too sure what happens with the sale price/ROI after that point, but then neither does anyone right now.

Also with respect to Litecoin mining, I was told the scrypt algorithms is larger and more complex than what is required for Bitcoin and requires very fast access to memory. It's not just the amount of memory, and they will be working on that.

In any case they also stated to bring the FPGA price down they need to sell 400 units, so economies of scale are a factor as well.

Anything more specific you will have to email them, but for sure it's economies of scale and the fact they want to build trust as opposed to profit on this first Mars device.

Color me confused, for the way I read it is that Mars is going to be sold at a lose to build faith in their company, using the profits of that lose venture to develop the ASIC-based rigs, then afterward lower the price point because the non-recurring engineering costs would already be covered.

I want to hire their accountant or put their CFO on my payroll. Taking a page from their business model, starting with nothing, I could sell lower grade barn wood at a lose, then use the profit from those sales to sell a higher quality barn wood, and since all my equipment is now paid for, I would be in position to undercut my competition by lower my prices. And all that is predicated on the barns being given to me free and the paying of labor is deferred during the nascent stage of the operation.

Here's the kicker. I'm not doing this to make millions in profit. I'm doing it to save the planet by having fewer trees cut down, and to further the barn wood furniture movement. To prove that Lumbermar & Poles AB (American Barns) is a viable entity to trust your pre-order money with, we have teamed up with Acme Barns in Coyote, ID, supplying all their barn wood needs. Placement of our entity onto their website is forthcoming.

[1713928192]

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[MooC Tals]

Email them...?

Nah, I'll wait for them to answer in this thread.

I can't be the only person wondering about this.

Well I know they've stated they won't be making a profit on Mars it's to gain faith that they are capable of producing a product en mass. That much they have stated in this thread before. I forget when and where, but it was obviously after Mars and Jupiter were announced. They weren't considering an FPGA before.

That said I'm also under the impression Mars is to raise funds for the ASIC development and that the first round of ASICs has no real profit as a lot is non-recurring engineering costs being covered. After that point they can lower pricing. The reward for those purchasing first is hopefully getting in whilst hashrate provides a strong return. Not too sure what happens with the sale price/ROI after that point, but then neither does anyone right now.

Also with respect to Litecoin mining, I was told the scrypt algorithms is larger and more complex than what is required for Bitcoin and requires very fast access to memory. It's not just the amount of memory, and they will be working on that.

In any case they also stated to bring the FPGA price down they need to sell 400 units, so economies of scale are a factor as well.

Anything more specific you will have to email them, but for sure it's economies of scale and the fact they want to build trust as opposed to profit on this first Mars device.

Color me confused, for the way I read it is that Mars is going to be sold at a lose to build faith in their company, using the profits of that lose venture to develop the ASIC-based rigs, then afterward lower the price point because the non-recurring engineering costs would already be covered.

I want to hire their accountant or put their CFO on my payroll. Taking a page from their business model, starting with nothing, I could sell lower grade barn wood at a lose, then use the profit from those sales to sell a higher quality barn wood, and since all my equipment is now paid for, I would be in position to undercut my competition by lower my prices. And all that is predicated on the barns being given to me free and the paying of labor is deferred during the nascent stage of the operation.

Here's the kicker. I'm not doing this to make millions in profit. I'm doing it to save the planet by having fewer trees cut down, and to further the barn wood furniture movement. To prove that Lumbermar & Poles AB (American Barns) is a viable entity to trust your pre-order money with, we have teamed up with Acme Barns in Coyote, ID, supplying all their barn wood needs. Placement of our entity onto their website is forthcoming.

It's not that far fetched at all, think of it as a brand new shop opening up and they need to create new clients so the mechanic has a grand opening sale and offers cheap at cost oil changes. I have seen many new mechanic shops do this and it works well. Consider it as advertising. It's a good idea as the need for new products comes along the reputation of the company is well enforced through the products durability and the fact their in the hands of those customers already.

I like it.makes sense. As everything else the more they build the cheaper the RnD

[Bitcoinorama]

is monday showing still on?

Don't think so, would be good of the guys going could confirm.

I like it.makes sense. As everything else the more they build the cheaper the RnD

From what I understand this is the case. They have longer term goals and an interest in a wider product line. The first couple of waves are for proving legitimacy and covering NRE costs.

Again this is something that requires confirmation whenever the meet occurs. So reword it in a palatable format and pm it to those attending to ask (Phin).

[KS]

It's not that far fetched at all, think of it as a brand new shop opening up and they need to create new clients so the mechanic has a grand opening sale and offers cheap at cost oil changes. I have seen many new mechanic shops do this and it works well. Consider it as advertising. It's a good idea as the need for new products comes along the reputation of the company is well enforced through the products durability and the fact their in the hands of those customers already.

I like it.makes sense. As everything else the more they build the cheaper the RnD

It's not far fetched but it's not in the right market for barn sales.

Consider this:

-WHEN do you do barn sales? When you have inventory.
-WHY do you do barn sales? To get rid of inventory.
-HOW do you make money on barn sales? By buying liquidated inventory (i.e. ex-bankrupcy, overstocks, etc) or selling high margin products cheaper (like tire sales).

-Do they have inventory? No.
-Do they want to get rid of said inventory? No, it's a lossleader, not overstock.
-Will they make money on the inventory? No, it's a lossleader.

As Bitcoinorama rightly pointed out, the Mars sale is a way to lock you into buying a Jupiter. It's not to make a profit to fund development, they're pretty much selling at cost already. They'll make their money when you send yours for the preorder.

Bitcoin mining is a niche industry. In niche industries, you don't do barn sales, you sell know-how at a high price. The performance leader sets the price. If you have a low price, you're automatically "less good" and/or suspicious.

You shouldn't mix commodity market techniques and niche markets. They won't work together because of the low volumes. If you did do barn sales, you wouldn't make any money and YOU'd be the one whose inventory gets bought by bankrupcy sharks. It niche markets, you need to be a performance leader.

edit: when I mean they sell at cost, I don't mean it will just cover the BOM. I consider the R&D and other normal company expenses as well.

[MooC Tals]

It's not that far fetched at all, think of it as a brand new shop opening up and they need to create new clients so the mechanic has a grand opening sale and offers cheap at cost oil changes. I have seen many new mechanic shops do this and it works well. Consider it as advertising. It's a good idea as the need for new products comes along the reputation of the company is well enforced through the products durability and the fact their in the hands of those customers already.

I like it.makes sense. As everything else the more they build the cheaper the RnD

It's not far fetched but it's not in the right market for barn sales.

Consider this:

-WHEN do you do barn sales? When you have inventory.
-WHY do you do barn sales? To get rid of inventory.
-HOW do you make money on barn sales? By buying liquidated inventory (i.e. ex-bankrupcy, overstocks, etc) or selling high margin products cheaper (like tire sales).

-Do they have inventory? No.
-Do they want to get rid of said inventory? No, it's a lossleader, not overstock.
-Will they make money on the inventory? No, it's a lossleader.

As Bitcoinorama rightly pointed out, the Mars sale is a way to lock you into buying a Jupiter. It's not to make a profit to fund development, they're pretty much selling at cost already. They'll make their money when you send yours for the preorder.

Bitcoin mining is a niche industry. In niche industries, you don't do barn sales, you sell know-how at a high price. The performance leader sets the price. If you have a low price, you're automatically "less good" and/or suspicious.

You shouldn't mix commodity market techniques and niche markets. They won't work together because of the low volumes. If you did do barn sales, you wouldn't make any money and YOU'd be the one whose inventory gets bought by bankrupcy sharks. It niche markets, you need to be a performance leader.

edit: when I mean they sell at cost, I don't mean it will just cover the BOM. I consider the R&D and other normal company expenses as well.

Your making it sound like it's going out of business. They have questions like what will make money? What do the customers want? Will I make a profit from this? How long can I sell this product or its shelf life?

They understand that this market the products sold affect the product that have already been sold and in turn also affects the products value before they are sold.

So the problem here is this. How do I make my company relevant to the market in such a hostile environment? People don't know me, and as a result don't trust me. How do I make and keep making money? If I build 1 prototype it costs the same to me if I sell 100 or 100,000.

Will I be able to sell 100,000? If I'm going to make them and their is a demand how do I push these out in batches or a super release of all at the same time?

I would need to make the first batch small but not to small where its not profitable. I have to do this quickly provided I have the demand to do this. My competition will work against me.

These products make money literally, I mean if banks where in the business of selling you branches of the bank would it work? thats basically what their doing here. This is another reason these companies like BFL still don't understand that the act of making these products kill currencies like steroids kill weightlifters. However the need is there to be fulfilled, the need is greed.

So I would first register names by making a poll to see if there is demand. Then use FPGA technology for litecoin as a stepping stone to gain relevancy in the market. They need a gimmick a flagship product that will generate revenue for other products.

 When my name is more out there I can quickly push products out in batches and adjust prices according to profitability and need of the consumer.

Barn sales are products that are discounted and discontinued where the value of the product is reducing and has already been advertised and well known. Even the brand name is not even required at times. As seen on TV shit and stuff like that.

They will have a tough time entering but I feel they can learn from others on how not to do it.

Oil changes is a bad analogy due to the oil change value would not affect future oil changes but the goal would be customer awareness that they exist. That is their needed goal here for now.

[KS]

It's not that far fetched at all, think of it as a brand new shop opening up and they need to create new clients so the mechanic has a grand opening sale and offers cheap at cost oil changes. I have seen many new mechanic shops do this and it works well. Consider it as advertising. It's a good idea as the need for new products comes along the reputation of the company is well enforced through the products durability and the fact their in the hands of those customers already.

I like it.makes sense. As everything else the more they build the cheaper the RnD

It's not far fetched but it's not in the right market for barn sales.

Consider this:

-WHEN do you do barn sales? When you have inventory.
-WHY do you do barn sales? To get rid of inventory.
-HOW do you make money on barn sales? By buying liquidated inventory (i.e. ex-bankrupcy, overstocks, etc) or selling high margin products cheaper (like tire sales).

-Do they have inventory? No.
-Do they want to get rid of said inventory? No, it's a lossleader, not overstock.
-Will they make money on the inventory? No, it's a lossleader.

As Bitcoinorama rightly pointed out, the Mars sale is a way to lock you into buying a Jupiter. It's not to make a profit to fund development, they're pretty much selling at cost already. They'll make their money when you send yours for the preorder.

Bitcoin mining is a niche industry. In niche industries, you don't do barn sales, you sell know-how at a high price. The performance leader sets the price. If you have a low price, you're automatically "less good" and/or suspicious.

You shouldn't mix commodity market techniques and niche markets. They won't work together because of the low volumes. If you did do barn sales, you wouldn't make any money and YOU'd be the one whose inventory gets bought by bankrupcy sharks. It niche markets, you need to be a performance leader.

edit: when I mean they sell at cost, I don't mean it will just cover the BOM. I consider the R&D and other normal company expenses as well.

Your making it sound like it's going out of business. They have questions like what will make money? What do the customers want? Will I make a profit from this? How long can I sell this product or its shelf life?

They're not IN business yet, let's give them that...
The product shelf life is very short.

They understand that this market the products sold affect the product that have already been sold and in turn also affects the products value before they are sold.

Yes, like the drug market. Your customers will always need more but their old "stuff" is now worthless.

So the problem here is this. How do I make my company relevant to the market in such a hostile environment? People don't know me, and as a result don't trust me. How do I make and keep making money? If I build 1 prototype it costs the same to me if I sell 100 or 100,000.

You will make 100.000 units a lot cheaper per unit than for 100 units. trust me on that

Will I be able to sell 100,000? If I'm going to make them and their is a demand how do I push these out in batches or a super release of all at the same time?

You won't sell 100.000 units. This is not a mass market. Avalon has batches of 300, 3 so far, one barely shipped completely. The chips they sell on the side won't make tens of thousands of mining units of the same 60GH/s hashrate.

I would need to make the first batch small but not to small where its not profitable. I have to do this quickly provided I have the demand to do this. My competition will work against me.

Up to you to find out what the proper price is. Price it too high and it won't sell. You should not be afraid to loose money on the first batch. You make an investment then you get in back over a certain period of time, not all at once. There are always outliers, but best to think in a way that ensures you will succeed. Don't be greedy.

These products make money literally, I mean if banks where in the business of selling you branches of the bank would it work? thats basically what their doing here. This is another reason these companies like BFL still don't understand that the act of making these products kill currencies like steroids kill weightlifters. However the need is there to be fulfilled, the need is greed.

If it's not BFL, it's Avalon, ASICMINER, AMD, whoever. As long as the BFL's share their products, it's not a problem. Everyone will always try to outdo their neighbor anyway.

So I would first register names by making a poll to see if there is demand.

Sure, why not?

Then use FPGA technology for litecoin as a stepping stone to gain relevancy in the market. They need a gimmick a flagship product that will generate revenue for other products.

LTC is another market, you won't get relevance in BTC for making LTC FPGA's. You also don't need to make products that loose money but would be supported by your money making flagship product. Sorry to say, but this is a bit silly. Not a mass market.

When my name is more out there I can quickly push products out in batches and adjust prices according to profitability and need of the consumer.

If you don't pay for batch one out of your pocket, you will always have a delay between batches (months, in BTC products). Or you make small batches and kill your margin (or make your products too expensive).

Barn sales are products that are discounted and discontinued where the value of the product is reducing and has already been advertised and well known. Even the brand name is not even required at times. As seen on TV shit and stuff like that.

Current BTC miners will quickly be on barn sales when the ASICs will finally be deployed en masse, so your window of opportunity to sell anything is very short right now.

They will have a tough time entering but I feel they can learn from others on how not to do it.

Let's hope so... but they still don't seem to have their business-side setup right (ATM).

Oil changes is a bad analogy due to the oil change value would not affect future oil changes but the goal would be customer awareness that they exist. That is their needed goal here for now.

Your phrasing is slippery, but maybe you could use the example of a kind of ICT product instead. Computers, smartphones, whatnot. each new generation chips away at the value of the previous one.

Anyway, you seem to want their products and want to find a way to reassure/convince yourself they will succeed. That means you are already actively ignoring the little voice of caution in your head. That's what desire/greed will do to you, so be careful

Cheers .

[Bitcoinorama]

From what I've been told; initial run is priced to cover NRE (non-recurring engineering), initial investors are rewarded with the advantage of a lower hash rate, from then on in products become less expensive to buy, and less expensive to produce, whilst the range of products becomes more varied. This allows KNC and their products to remain profitable and competitive, whilst distributing the network fairly, and opening it up for a variety of consumers to enter the bitcoin mining market at various entry points. 28nm will become the standard for some time.

The risk is can they develop and produce a stable power-efficient 28nm chip en mass, and distribute the initial run by September? For now, that's all anyone cares about.

Are these guys capable and trustworthy? This is what we need evidence of.

Can we secure our payments via buyer protection through reputable payment channels and receive our goods within then time period covered by buyer protection? (45 days for Paypal). That's what I'm most concerned about with respect to me actually putting my hand in my pocket.

The risk should be having your funds tied up for a period of time, an inconvenience, but not a loss.

That is the reason for accepting Paypal, and credit card, otherwise you may as well pay in Bitcoin or cash (anonymous currencies) if the time from payment to delivery exceeds that stipulated by the buyer protection.

If you're protected there is no risk to you, and KNC have crowdsourced an interest free loan to develop and produce - both parties are hugely rewarded at the end.

Investors get to mine virtual currency, KNC gain a massively in demand company which has forged a solid reputation (if they succeed) rapidly, and a product line with NRE paid for. Products can then be produced at far less expense at no financial risk to KNC, with no need to advertise for new custom.

[KS]

I think there is really nothing to add to the case.

It's wait and see time.

[MooC Tals]

Anyway, you seem to want their products and want to find a way to reassure/convince yourself they will succeed. That means you are already actively ignoring the little voice of caution in your head. That's what desire/greed will do to you, so be careful

Cheers .

Great post and most of it I was in agreement, however the part I left here was where you went wrong.

I learned a big lesson with BFL as I have placed a pre-ordered on Oct 9 2012 and cancelled it on Jan 2013. I later waited for a working prototype to pre-order again however they then later raised prices. So I do believe that statement is a bit presumptuous.

However I can see why you would say that. Now that you know more about me I guess you would see that statement would be incorrect.

[bitpop]

Can we order yet?

[kevcoins]

Can we order yet?

Anyone know if the live prototype FPGA show going to be available this coming monday?

[bitpop]

Can't wait for the unveiling

[Bitcoinorama]

Can we order yet?

Anyone know if the live prototype FPGA show going to be available this coming monday?

No, still awaiting parts that were due for delivery last week (Thurs), so perhaps sometime this week.

[KS]

Anyway, you seem to want their products and want to find a way to reassure/convince yourself they will succeed. That means you are already actively ignoring the little voice of caution in your head. That's what desire/greed will do to you, so be careful

Cheers .

Great post and most of it I was in agreement, however the part I left here was where you went wrong.

I learned a big lesson with BFL as I have placed a pre-ordered on Oct 9 2012 and cancelled it on Jan 2013. I later waited for a working prototype to pre-order again however they then later raised prices. So I do believe that statement is a bit presumptuous.

However I can see why you would say that. Now that you know more about me I guess you would see that statement would be incorrect.

Sorry, I'm blunt by nature, but I didn't mean it to sound presumptuous.

The way you put your arguments makes me think you are indeed wishing this a little bit too much and are trying to find excuses for KnC. That's what I see.

I'm not you, and I trust you know you better than I do, so I'll take your word for it

[ninjaboon]

someone started a thread here.
http://bitcoinmalaysia.com/forum/index.php?topic=33.msg54#msg54

hope I don't get kicked for posting another forum site here.

[glowkeeper]

someone started a thread here.
http://bitcoinmalaysia.com/forum/index.php?topic=33.msg54#msg54

So?

In other news, David Beckham retired. Though please don't post a link to every news organisation discussing the matter.....

[dan99]

Anyway, you seem to want their products and want to find a way to reassure/convince yourself they will succeed. That means you are already actively ignoring the little voice of caution in your head. That's what desire/greed will do to you, so be careful

Cheers .

Great post and most of it I was in agreement, however the part I left here was where you went wrong.

I learned a big lesson with BFL as I have placed a pre-ordered on Oct 9 2012 and cancelled it on Jan 2013. I later waited for a working prototype to pre-order again however they then later raised prices. So I do believe that statement is a bit presumptuous.

However I can see why you would say that. Now that you know more about me I guess you would see that statement would be incorrect.

Sorry, I'm blunt by nature, but I didn't mean it to sound presumptuous.

The way you put your arguments makes me think you are indeed wishing this a little bit too much and are trying to find excuses for KnC. That's what I see.

I'm not you, and I trust you know you better than I do, so I'll take your word for it

Some of us maybe be kind of protective or come to the defense of KNC and that including me sometimes.. have to admit that because at the present moment  in terms of an existing Asic Chip Miner they are only 2 that is  avalon and asic miner .. We need more players to create a more conducive and a fairer market with good products at good prices that will benefit the communities and the users. Really hope they make it though  

[daggeteo]

Updating with a list of compiled questions.

@pichadpi
I shall bring a powermeter with me, just in case. Good idea with the audio recording. Here in Sweden you don't need to ask for permission as long as you partake in the conversation but it is polite to ask.


Photos/Videos (I'll try to include objects for distance-reference)
* Mars unit hashing
* Mars without a cover/case …shots of the internals if possible
* Hashing results in the software client
* The power supply attached
* A meter read of the power draw at the outlet – hopefully they’ll provide a monitor, or do you have one you could bring?


Questions
1) Is this demo unit built on the final design revision that we’ll see used at the time of full-scale production?
2) When will Mars begin production, if it hasn’t already?
3) Has any development work yet begun on the ASIC modules?
4) (If you’re not able to get a wattage reading from a meter)What is the power consumption on the Mars device?
5) What is the projected power consumption of the Saturn/Jupiter?
6) Do you plan on discontinuing the Mars BTC miners by a certain date or a quantity sold? (See https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=170332.msg2200152#msg2200152)
7) With this modular design, how will the ASIC units be interfaced with each other, considering that additional devices may be added at a later time?
8 ) Will these connected ASIC devices use a single shared network connection? What about the power?
9) Why only 50.000SEK in capital? (about 5500 EUR, not even funny considering there are so many founders. no penalty for failure, so not much of an incentive for success either)
10) Who pays for this really, how?
11) Debt incurred? how much, how long?
12) Why no ORSoC ppl on the board or directors? (not even deputy directors, only K/C wives or family?) (See https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=170332.msg2200152#msg2200152)
13) Is there an employee payroll or just founders?
14) Why start K&C AB as a consulting/hosting firm with the ORSoC ppl aboard?
15) K&C AB focus on miners or hosting/consulting?
16) Where is the real office? K's house, C's house, K & C AB office, another one??
17) What about security (data/facilities)? (why self host? no datacenters?) Disaster recovery plans? [careful, no specifics]
18)What about patents? Potential lawsuits? (are they insured against this?)
19)Are the founders insured? Does the insurance money cover losses/refunds? Is the company the beneficiary or not?
20)Expecting more sale outside of Sweden than in, can they finance the VAT in-between tax return periods? (See https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=170332.msg2200152#msg2200152)
21) Project % completion?
22) How much of the production will be financed by preorders? (possible corollary: why not more seed capital?)
23) Obviously with the Swedes' worshiping the semi-permanent sunlight they get for the summer months causing an acknowledged lackluster in productivity (according to JJ), will this in anyway affect the design and manufacture of their Saturn and Jupiter miners? And, what realistically, are the chances of having those devices delivered in September?
24) How can you be confident this will happen when both BFL and apparently Avalon have had issues delaying their production beyond reasonable expectations?
25) Most important can they meet the September 2013 dateline. When is the 350gh/s Asic prototype Miner going to be out? July 2013??
26) Will KNCMiner support P2Pool mining?

Other
1) Where are you? Office / Workroom / Lab …?[/li][/list]
2) What else is around? Desks (with phones? ..how many?) / Workstations / Machinery …?
3) Who, specifically, is in attendance at this meeting? Do you see other people around as well?
4) How much noise does the Mars device produce? ..perhaps think of something comparative
5) Do you feel much heat radiation from the Mars unit?

[KS]

Updating with a list of compiled questions.

@pichadpi
I shall bring a powermeter with me, just in case. Good idea with the audio recording. Here in Sweden you don't need to ask for permission as long as you partake in the conversation but it is polite to ask.


Photos/Videos (I'll try to include objects for distance-reference)
* Mars unit hashing
* Mars without a cover/case …shots of the internals if possible
* Hashing results in the software client
* The power supply attached
* A meter read of the power draw at the outlet – hopefully they’ll provide a monitor, or do you have one you could bring?


Questions
1) Is this demo unit built on the final design revision that we’ll see used at the time of full-scale production?
2) When will Mars begin production, if it hasn’t already?
3) Has any development work yet begun on the ASIC modules?
4) (If you’re not able to get a wattage reading from a meter)What is the power consumption on the Mars device?
5) What is the projected power consumption of the Saturn/Jupiter?
6) Do you plan on discontinuing the Mars BTC miners by a certain date or a quantity sold?
7) With this modular design, how will the ASIC units be interfaced with each other, considering that additional devices may be added at a later time?
8 ) Will these connected ASIC devices use a single shared network connection? What about the power?
9) Why only 50.000SEK in capital? (about 5500 EUR, not even funny considering there are so many founders. no penalty for failure, so not much of an incentive for success either)
10) Who pays for this really, how?
11) Debt incurred? how much, how long?
12) Why no ORSoC ppl on the board or directors? (not even deputy directors, only K/C wives or family?)
13) Is there an employee payroll or just founders?
14) Why start K&C AB as a consulting/hosting firm with the ORSoC ppl aboard?
15) K&C AB focus on miners or hosting/consulting?
16) Where is the real office? K's house, C's house, K & C AB office, another one??
17) What about security (data/facilities)? (why self host? no datacenters?) Disaster recovery plans? [careful, no specifics]
18)What about patents? Potential lawsuits? (are they insured against this?)
19)Are the founders insured? Does the insurance money cover losses/refunds? Is the company the beneficiary or not?
20)Expecting more sale outside of Sweden than in, can they finance the VAT in-between tax return periods?
21) Project % completion?
22) How much of the production will be financed by preorders? (possible corollary: why not more seed capital?)
23) Obviously with the Swedes' worshiping the semi-permanent sunlight they get for the summer months causing an acknowledged lackluster in productivity (according to JJ), will this in anyway affect the design and manufacture of their Saturn and Jupiter miners? And, what realistically, are the chances of having those devices delivered in September?
24) How can you be confident this will happen when both BFL and apparently Avalon have had issues delaying their production beyond reasonable expectations?
25) Most important can they meet the September 2013 dateline. When is the 350gh/s Asic prototype Miner going to be out? July 2013??

Other
1) Where are you? Office / Workroom / Lab …?[/li][/list]
2) What else is around? Desks (with phones? ..how many?) / Workstations / Machinery …?
3) Who, specifically, is in attendance at this meeting? Do you see other people around as well?
4) How much noise does the Mars device produce? ..perhaps think of something comparative
5) Do you feel much heat radiation from the Mars unit?

Pack a sandwich...

[Bitcoinorama]

Okay they were KS' q's but there were others in the thread I PM'd the other day.

Also, Q.6 I posted an answer to from Sam. Mars v2 will be for Litecoins, so not retired, improved. though they will apparently not part-exchange or give the option of buying a the new board to upgrade your chips upon which is a shame.

Q.12 I was told all 5 guys mentioned on the KNC website, Sam, Andreas, Johan, Marcus and Michael were all directors. Do check with them.

Q.20 I posted a long answer about VAT inside and outside Europe, Did that not cover the answer? I noticed on the site the other day, aside a new logo, they actually have an area for your to register your VAT number.