Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com

[genykm]

Dear mota, my native language is Russian, and i'm tremendously grateful for your kind lesson in English usage.
As a Russian, allow me to return the favor & tutor you in the fine art of waging war -- more precisely, on how to not start world wars and lose them.

  LOL'd so hard!!! 

[donch]

The point has been reached:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

[Meizirkki]

Naa crumbs! that was way too easy, you can do better

[crumbs]

Naa crumbs! that was way too easy, you can do better

Why bother with heaven-storming when there are so many low-hanging fruit?

[johnyj]

What I'm worrying about is the following scenario:

Chips all packaged and arrived by a courier taking direct flight from TaiWan to Sweden, and sent to the factory, ready to be mounted on the board. At mean time, the first prototype is assembled in china

When they fired it up, they get something like.... no device found/communication failure/error reading bus xxx...

From this point forward, a lengthy process of debugging and integration started... 

At least this is what happened with BFL (two times)

[Xialla]

august 26th coindesk interview excerpt.
http://www.coindesk.com/kncminer-takes-delivery-of-asic-boards/
Sam saying"
"


also..
September 17th coindesk interview. Read the very last line.
http://www.coindesk.com/kncminer-offers-free-speed-increase-first-bitcoin-miner-shipments/

yes, this is what I'm trying to say current fanclub members for last 2 weeks. September delivery is now impossible..

[Xialla]

When they fired it up, they get something like.... no device found/communication failure/error reading bus xxx...

yes, but KNC promised everybody full refund until shipping date. of course, that this should happen, but vendor must be ready to compensate, because it is his fault (discount voucher, partly refund, etc).

[tolip_wen]

Just when hosting option starts looking like a better option..  here's a new fear to throw into the mix.

I for one think that the hosting option will be more of a delay then the delivery side of things.

I only think this because of the photos they published building their data center. (i'm a sparky and cable guy by trade)

in the photos they were constructing the cabinets that hold the miners, but I couldn't see any cabling yet.. it looks to neat for the cabling to have started.

how many units are they hosting..? 

1. they will need 240v cabling for all the miners, earthing on all cabinets, etc.. (this sort of thing cannot be rushed)
2. they will need network cable to all the miners, switches and routers configured, etc..
note: the above wiring needs to be tested and inspected for safety before it can actually be used.

the people who are using the hosting option how are you going to confirm you miner is hashing,  It could be a while before they actually have remote or online viewing for your miners.

One or more of the hosting center buildout pictures clearly show what appears to be A/C drops and power strips mounted on the enclosures. It looks to me like they had the electricians finish before they started building the enclosures. It is a raised floor data center and the A/C drops were left under the floor to facilitate ease of enclosure instalation.
Trivia: the suction cup floor tile pullers are often colorfully refered to as deck-sucker's.

Another of the pics clearly shows Cisco equipment (router and switches) already powered up and being configured and tested.

They could WORST CASE use pre terminated ethernet cables and get miners online as fast as people can carry them into the data center.

There ARE things worthy of concern without this particular non-issue in the mix.


YMMV

soon?
 

[Professor James Moriarty]

 Change begins at board!! or some sort of ikea joke about swedish kncminer company that would make you blow air out of your nose while typing lol

[Axios]

...
I hate to break it to you, but September delivery and Shipping in September mean basically the same thing. "Delivery" is per definition the act of transporting letters or goods to a predefined point/person - shipment is the act or an instance of shipping goods. It is NOT the same as you getting your order in September.  

I see.  So if i just had a letter delivered to me, that means someone just dropped it in the mail, and i should be expecting delivery soo.. wait.  Where do you get this ridiculous stuff?  Is this a German thing?  Sauce pl0x.

As a German, let me be a grammar nazi for once
Delivery: The act of transferring to another.  The act of conveying or delivering.
Deliver someone or something to someone or something: to transfer someone or something to someone or something
Shipping: transporting cargo by any means
Delivered is past tense of the verb to deliver - It means the process of delivering is over.

Don't argue when a non native speaker knows your language better than you.  

As a stupid american consumer - delivery means on the damn truck that is on my way to my house.

As per UPS: http://www.ups.com/content/us/en/tracking/tracking/description.html

"In transit":  Your shipment is moving within the UPS network and should be delivered on the scheduled delivery date.
"Out for delivery": The shipment has reached the local UPS facility responsible for delivery and has been dispatched to a UPS driver.


Also "package delivery date" means when a package delivered not shipped.

[rizzman]

Noticed how BFL have suddenly picked up shipments the last couple of weeks, they have been shipping about 2 weeks worth of 50-60GH/s Single SC orders each day. That's a lot of GH/s they had thousands of those on pre-order. That will be a big part of the net hash increase we had this month, add KNCminer to that and omg.

yeah, I have also been curious of this new revelation as well. I think it confirms what I originally thought, that BFL has been withholding machines purposely to influence difficulty increase. now that the new kid on the block is getting close two competing, now they open the floodgates and let everybody have their 1 year late order in attempts 2 spike the difficulty and scare investors away from the competition. Is actually a pretty smart move business wise

[Cablez]

As a stupid american consumer - delivery means on the damn truck that is on my way to my house.

As per UPS: http://www.ups.com/content/us/en/tracking/tracking/description.html

"In transit":  Your shipment is moving within the UPS network and should be delivered on the scheduled delivery date.
"Out for delivery": The shipment has reached the local UPS facility responsible for delivery and has been dispatched to a UPS driver.


Also "package delivery date" means when a package delivered not shipped.

Agreed. 'Delivery' does not mean 'I just generated a shipping label, yay!'

[btc_uzr]

c'mon...wasn't it somehow predictable that a Swedish manufacturer will be shipping late if selling full assembled devices ?




maybe there's just more work to be done than thought




and there's even the risk involved, that things do not work out as expected

[timmmers]

Noticed how BFL have suddenly picked up shipments the last couple of weeks, they have been shipping about 2 weeks worth of 50-60GH/s Single SC orders each day. That's a lot of GH/s they had thousands of those on pre-order. That will be a big part of the net hash increase we had this month, add KNCminer to that and omg.

yeah, I have also been curious of this new revelation as well. I think it confirms what I originally thought, that BFL has been withholding machines purposely to influence difficulty increase. now that the new kid on the block is getting close two competing, now they open the floodgates and let everybody have their 1 year late order in attempts 2 spike the difficulty and scare investors away from the competition. Is actually a pretty smart move business wise

Not very smart to have idle rigs sitting somewhere, wouldn't they "test" them for a month or so instead? Fucking amazing company they are, you order from them and they don't deliver until you can't make any return, then you move on to another supplier and they start to bang their kit out so you can't make as much there either. Then maybe they top that and get monarch out on time and in numbers ..although that does seem unlikely.

[dwdoc]

Noticed how BFL have suddenly picked up shipments the last couple of weeks, they have been shipping about 2 weeks worth of 50-60GH/s Single SC orders each day. That's a lot of GH/s they had thousands of those on pre-order. That will be a big part of the net hash increase we had this month, add KNCminer to that and omg.

yeah, I have also been curious of this new revelation as well. I think it confirms what I originally thought, that BFL has been withholding machines purposely to influence difficulty increase. now that the new kid on the block is getting close two competing, now they open the floodgates and let everybody have their 1 year late order in attempts 2 spike the difficulty and scare investors away from the competition. Is actually a pretty smart move business wise

Huh? So instead of releasing units early which would increase BFL sales, decrease refunds, decrease lawsuits, and decrease competitor sales earlier they were holding back why? If they had been sitting around why not release all their units when KNC opened their order book?

Let's face it, it's just taken this long for them to ramp up production to a reasonable level.

[Paladin69]

Noticed how BFL have suddenly picked up shipments the last couple of weeks, they have been shipping about 2 weeks worth of 50-60GH/s Single SC orders each day. That's a lot of GH/s they had thousands of those on pre-order. That will be a big part of the net hash increase we had this month, add KNCminer to that and omg.

yeah, I have also been curious of this new revelation as well. I think it confirms what I originally thought, that BFL has been withholding machines purposely to influence difficulty increase. now that the new kid on the block is getting close two competing, now they open the floodgates and let everybody have their 1 year late order in attempts 2 spike the difficulty and scare investors away from the competition. Is actually a pretty smart move business wise

Huh? So instead of releasing units early which would increase BFL sales, decrease refunds, decrease lawsuits, and decrease competitor sales earlier they were holding back why? If they had been sitting around why not release all their units when KNC opened their order book?

Let's face it, it's just taken this long for them to ramp up production to a reasonable level.

If they were willing to ship out of line when people attempted chargebacks, they were probably also willing to accept 6 figure bribes to move MiniRigs out the back door when the difficulty was below 10m.  I don't trust BFL one bit.  Network protection for themselves while a tiny 20TH operation on the side is running is also possible.  Or a combination of all of the above.  Maybe a class-action against BFL will come.  But they have hidden their tracks well because nobody proactively had a private investigator tailing them.  There might never be any proof for a successful class-action.

I personally think the ASIC generation has screwed over the small miner for good.  BFL was the last shot at making a decent return for yourself, but they kept it all.  Now the difficulty is going to run away from everyone.  If you can't build your own, you have no advantage.  Why would people be honest and ship money printing boxes when there are so many sneaky things you could do with that?  I'm not gonna jump the gun and say KnC is doing this, but people really need to be careful.  I would get refunds if you can.  There is just too much hashrate coming online now.  November is many difficulty changes away.  And you don't come online alone.  Everyone else does too.

There are going to be a lot of disappointed people come December.  I would say $5K was still too expensive, but if they were cheaper, people would just buy more anyway.  The greed of previous ASIC developers have pretty much set the tone going forward and turned this industry into a rich mans game.  If you aren't on the inside and willing to give head, I think you better find some other way to make money.  Holding coins is far more important if you still have any left.  If you blew it all on mining equipment, you are probably at a huge loss.

[Its About Sharing]

Noticed how BFL have suddenly picked up shipments the last couple of weeks, they have been shipping about 2 weeks worth of 50-60GH/s Single SC orders each day. That's a lot of GH/s they had thousands of those on pre-order. That will be a big part of the net hash increase we had this month, add KNCminer to that and omg.

yeah, I have also been curious of this new revelation as well. I think it confirms what I originally thought, that BFL has been withholding machines purposely to influence difficulty increase. now that the new kid on the block is getting close two competing, now they open the floodgates and let everybody have their 1 year late order in attempts 2 spike the difficulty and scare investors away from the competition. Is actually a pretty smart move business wise

Huh? So instead of releasing units early which would increase BFL sales, decrease refunds, decrease lawsuits, and decrease competitor sales earlier they were holding back why? If they had been sitting around why not release all their units when KNC opened their order book?

Let's face it, it's just taken this long for them to ramp up production to a reasonable level.

If they were willing to ship out of line when people attempted chargebacks, they were probably also willing to accept 6 figure bribes to move MiniRigs out the back door when the difficulty was below 10m.  I don't trust BFL one bit.

Network protection for themselves while a tiny 20TH operation on the side is running is also possible.  Or a combination of all of the above.

I personally think the ASIC generation has screwed over the small miner for good.  BFL was the last shot at making a decent return for yourself, but they kept it all.  Now the difficulty is going to run away from everyone.  If you can't build your own, you have no advantage.  Why would people be honest and ship money printing boxes when there are so many sneaky things you could do with that?  I'm not gonna jump the gun and say KnC is doing this, but people really need to be careful.  I would get refunds if you can.  There is just too much hashrate coming online now.  November is many difficulty changes away.

Well said. I really gave BFL the benefit of the doubt and for a long while. I read this thread and seeing the owner Josh try to defend himself (and attack others) as well as seeing people put him in his place with his own words, really helped me to see them for what they are. Title (LOL) - How about upping the Ghash/s on units to compensate for delays? https://forums.butterflylabs.com/post-sales-customer-service/4943-how-about-upping-ghash-s-units-compensate-delays.html

I understand people were/are trying to make money with the rigs (and also support the network, have a hobby, etc.) but seeing people having to wait over 1 year for their equipment is just sad. Basically, BFL shouldn't have taken so many pre-orders. I'm sure when this gets to court (and it will), we will see just how far over the line BFL went. I think we will see the same thing with Avalon and Yifu.

But, I think KNC Miner is going to be ok. Trying to limit the number of miners produced was a nice first step. Better communication is another. We can only hope now for the next few days. But KNC, BitFury, etc. are in another class compared to BFL and Avalon. ( aka - Cutting off your nose to Spite your Face.)

[AussieHash]

Kncminer.cn have changed their news post,
http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dkncminer.cn%26client%3Dsafari%26sa%3DX%26hl%3Den%26nfpr%3D1%26biw%3D768%26bih%3D928&rurl=translate.google.com.au&sl=zh-CN&u=http://kncminer.cn/news/demo-machine-shanghai/&usg=ALkJrhi7amzFm5rfNZ-vwJIOgCc8i4R91w

"In October, we will be in china to present you the genuine machine...."

But the original month is still there on their FAQ

http://translate.google.com.au/translate?hl=en&sl=zh-CN&u=http://kncminer.cn/&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dkncminer.cn%26client%3Dsafari%26sa%3DX%26hl%3Den%26nfpr%3D1%26biw%3D768%26bih%3D928

"In the end of September, we will present you in Shanghai...."

As long as it don't change it to "in 2 weeks"

[The Avenger]

But, I think KNC Miner is going to be ok. Trying to limit the number of miners produced was a nice first step.

When did they limit the number of miners produced? They have been trying to sell as many as possible. They are bidding thousands of dollars every week to advertise on this forum. They started a reseller program just a few weeks ago to get other people to sell their products for them.

And if you listen to the interview with Sam posted a few pages back, he said if other asics manufacturers keep pumping out units (which they of course will), KNC wil continue to keep pumping out units (i.e. not taking the 3 months break they spoke about).

They have done nothing to limit the number of miners produced - exactly the opposite. What IS limiting how many they can produce -
- people are priced out of the market. People can afford a few gpu's, but a lot less can afford to have thousands tied up in pre-order for months.
- people doing the maths on difficulty levels and realising they aren't going to make their money back.

[Kuroth]

So how many of you that ordered early have received your Sept Orders?   Oh wait....   NONE     LMFAO


So funny