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Question: Did we reach the bottom already?
Yes - 60 (50%)
No, it's coming later this year - 44 (36.7%)
No, it's coming next year or after - 16 (13.3%)
Total Voters: 120

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Author Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion  (Read 25878718 times)
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Arriemoller
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April 21, 2019, 10:04:18 PM

Hope you guys had a nice easter!  Grin

Anyone find a bitcoin in an egg? Tongue

Same to you thanks, and no, didn't even find an egg
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April 21, 2019, 10:05:43 PM

China is “socialism with Chinese characteristics” which translates to hyper-capitalism.  

The USA is far more socialist than China.  

Funny how socialists always claim that the socialist countries aren't really socialist.

Maybe Venezuela is not socialist either. I donno, I am starting to get very lost on this subject.

To the moon?
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April 21, 2019, 10:06:58 PM

Well it doesn’t look like anyone wants to advocate for children starving in the streets.  If you follow that through to its logical conclusion you end up with a system not dissimilar to the current system.

On that basis I think that left and right are actually quite close in their approach although the rhetoric differs.  

I guess Jbear and Arie and I can agree on stuff.
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April 21, 2019, 10:08:26 PM

After the greatest naval defeat since the Battle of Midway, I see Elwar has given up on his dream of cosplaying a floating fishing lure.

He will continue elsewhere

And long time  no see, think its been from the night of that 1K pump Cheesy Cheesy
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April 21, 2019, 10:09:11 PM


Just so we are clear, the right wing utopia has people that starve in the streets?


hard to believe anyone would actually choose starvation over sweeping up the stockroom, I mean, come on.

I believe that the community has a number of people who are able bodied and mentally ill, or just plain stubborn.  

I want to work on the edge cases, because the edge cases are where the rubber hits the road.

You don't "work on the edge cases", you change the goalposts, first we agree that people who are not capable of working should be helped, then you include the very same category in your cohort of unwilling (people who are able bodied and mentally ill).
And btw children that are endangered would be cared for by social services. We are talking about adults here. Another example of you moving the goalposts.

Ok so the right wing utopia does have social services ?

I want to know what happens to the kids because that is where the right wing approach always breaks down, and we end up with something that looks like what we currently have.
If taxes were voluntary they would imply a government participating in the free market by offering services that the population decides how much it should be worth. Hence compatible with capitalism.

These services could also extend to contracts along the line of "if you receive social services for x amount of time you will pay p percent of your paycheck for y amount of time once you get a job". The money could then be used either for further funding, or if "too profitable" be paid back to people who "invested their taxes" in the service.

The rest would take care of itself by services being added, redacted and modified based on funding and changing landscape of social issues.

Could also use that to fund going to fucking Mars, longevity, curing random diseases or fixing any other type of problem that is unlikely to be profitable and that people would come up with.

Would also change the political debate from retarded pronouns to figuring out how to best allocate money and thus end partisan horseshit.
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April 21, 2019, 10:12:36 PM


Just so we are clear, the right wing utopia has people that starve in the streets?


hard to believe anyone would actually choose starvation over sweeping up the stockroom, I mean, come on.

I believe that the community has a number of people who are able bodied and mentally ill, or just plain stubborn.  

I want to work on the edge cases, because the edge cases are where the rubber hits the road.

You don't "work on the edge cases", you change the goalposts, first we agree that people who are not capable of working should be helped, then you include the very same category in your cohort of unwilling (people who are able bodied and mentally ill).
And btw children that are endangered would be cared for by social services. We are talking about adults here. Another example of you moving the goalposts.

Ok so the right wing utopia does have social services ?

I want to know what happens to the kids because that is where the right wing approach always breaks down, and we end up with something that looks like what we currently have.

No you don't, if that was the case you would have asked that to begin with. You are just out to provoke.

No we went through a necessary process in order to establish that refuseniks starve in the streets.  

This is important context because it establishes the risk that children of refuseniks could also starve in the streets.

Having lived in China, I have seen a 4 year old child sleeping in a garbage bag in the snow outside my office. I want to know if the right wingers aspire to the same result in Western countries.   Or alternatively whether that is unacceptable and the talk about refuseniks starving in the streets is just bluster.
Did you mention that the child was most likely stolen to be used for begging?

Weird how that's left out. It's a well known crisis in China.

I guarantee if having children gave a monthly check in China they would have even more child theft.
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April 21, 2019, 10:14:44 PM

Well it doesn’t look like anyone wants to advocate for children starving in the streets.  If you follow that through to its logical conclusion you end up with a system not dissimilar to the current system.

On that basis I think that left and right are actually quite close in their approach although the rhetoric differs.  

I guess Jbear and Arie and I can agree on stuff.
We are discussing what is being suggested in real legislation in the US. Not some fantasy land only this only that. The current US setup but now with added giving money to lazy people and taxing out the ass.
Arriemoller
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April 21, 2019, 10:22:10 PM

Well it doesn’t look like anyone wants to advocate for children starving in the streets.  If you follow that through to its logical conclusion you end up with a system not dissimilar to the current system.

On that basis I think that left and right are actually quite close in their approach although the rhetoric differs.  

I guess Jbear and Arie and I can agree on stuff.

If you think having a function of some kind for taking care of children makes a socialist and a free society the same you are delusional.

I really can't take care of you any more, I have to go to bed now. Try to find answers to your questions using DDG instead.
You can start here. https://www.cato.org/publications/commentary/key-concepts-libertarianism
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April 21, 2019, 10:22:29 PM
Last edit: April 21, 2019, 11:13:11 PM by realr0ach

It will not go under $1200. Whoever was dreaming months ago about that is just a dreamer. Right now is not a dreamer anymore but an idiot. Even sub $2000 should never happen.  $3200 as it was is just perfect. Yes it can go there in next 4 months, but most likely will dip to like $3600 minimum.  Come on. $1200. Really? Bitcoin was $1200, 5 and half years ago.

In a bog standard pump and dump (which is what bitcoin is - a pump and dump scam), the $3000's would be the bottom in a standard pump and dump whose future is not to completely implode and die off and live to see another day.  Since transaction validators are designed to centralize making it have zero fundamentals and no reason to exist, plus tokens being non-fungible and thus a permissioned ledger by default, it could also go the other way in a slow grind to complete failure, as anything with zero fundamentals would do on a long enough timeline.

Bitcoin's future relies entirely on how many clueless people you can fool because it's fundamentals are just not there - they don't exist.  It's a govt created bancor scam designed to try and trick people away from actual money (physical metals) and into a cashless society slavery system.  Everything about the "whitepaper" was a lie from day one.  Things like "peer to peer currency with no middlemen".  Every transaction has 3 or more parties involved.  It has built-in, rent seeking middlemen and it's not even possible to do a transaction with only 2 parties!  How the fuck is that "peer to peer"??

The big lie:  "the use of a lie so colossal that no one would believe that someone could have the impudence to distort the truth so infamously"

There's your whitefraudpaper.  Everything from $200 to $20,000 was entirely accounting fraud/tether fraud on Bitfinex, so who knows what the hell the real bottom is.  Start with $200 then attempt to do mental gymnastics to try and buffer it higher by whatever nonsensical measure you choose.
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April 21, 2019, 10:23:30 PM


Just so we are clear, the right wing utopia has people that starve in the streets?


hard to believe anyone would actually choose starvation over sweeping up the stockroom, I mean, come on.

I believe that the community has a number of people who are able bodied and mentally ill, or just plain stubborn.  

I want to work on the edge cases, because the edge cases are where the rubber hits the road.

You don't "work on the edge cases", you change the goalposts, first we agree that people who are not capable of working should be helped, then you include the very same category in your cohort of unwilling (people who are able bodied and mentally ill).
And btw children that are endangered would be cared for by social services. We are talking about adults here. Another example of you moving the goalposts.

Ok so the right wing utopia does have social services ?

I want to know what happens to the kids because that is where the right wing approach always breaks down, and we end up with something that looks like what we currently have.
If taxes were voluntary they would imply a government participating in the free market by offering services that the population decides how much it should be worth. Hence compatible with capitalism.

These services could also extend to contracts along the line of "if you receive social services for x amount of time you will pay p percent of your paycheck for y amount of time once you get a job". The money could then be used either for further funding, or if "too profitable" be paid back to people who "invested their taxes" in the service.

The rest would take care of itself by services being added, redacted and modified based on funding and changing landscape of social issues.

Could also use that to fund going to fucking Mars, longevity, curing random diseases or fixing any other type of problem that is unlikely to be profitable and that people would come up with.

Would also change the political debate from retarded pronouns to figuring out how to best allocate money and thus end partisan horseshit.
listen here xer, you don't understand, my pronouns and hashtag drama are more important to voters and the general hivemind than getting real advancement in the political process.
kingcolex
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April 21, 2019, 10:26:17 PM

It will not go under $1200. Whoever was dreaming months ago about that is just a dreamer. Right now is not a dreamer anymore but an idiot. Even sub $2000 should never happen.  $3200 as it was is just perfect. Yes it can go there in next 4 months, but most likely will dip to like $3600 minimum.  Come on. $1200. Really? Bitcoin was $1200, 5 and half years ago.

In a bog standard pump and dump (which is what bitcoin is - a pump and dump scam), the $3000's would be the bottom in a standard pump and dump whose future is not to completely implode and die off and live to see another day.  Since transaction validators are designed to centralize making it have zero fundamentals and no reason to exist, plus tokens being non-fungible and thus a permissioned ledger by default, it could also go the other way in a slow grind to complete failure, as anything with zero fundamentals would do on a long enough timeline.

Bitcoin's future relies entirely on how many clueless people you can fool because it's fundamentals are just not there - they don't exist.  It's a govt created bancor scam designed to try and trick people away from actual money (physical metals) and into a cashless society slavery system.  Everything about the "whitepaper" was a lie from day one.  Things like "peer to peer currency with no middlemen".  Every transaction has 3 or more parties involved.  It has built-in, rent seeking middlemen and it's not even possible to do a transaction with only 2 parties!  How the fuck is that "peer to peer"Huh??

The big lie:  "the use of a lie so colossal that no one would believe that someone could have the impudence to distort the truth so infamously"
Life must take a weird path to end up being an angry Nazi that is so jealous and enraged about making a wrong decision and following rawdawgs advice that your still in disbelief and spend your days refusing to believe the truth in front of your face.

Silvers not going up anytime soon, we're all going to be making a much better ROI than you.
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April 21, 2019, 10:32:39 PM

It will not go under $1200. Whoever was dreaming months ago about that is just a dreamer. Right now is not a dreamer anymore but an idiot. Even sub $2000 should never happen.  $3200 as it was is just perfect. Yes it can go there in next 4 months, but most likely will dip to like $3600 minimum.  Come on. $1200. Really? Bitcoin was $1200, 5 and half years ago.

In a bog standard pump and dump (which is what bitcoin is - a pump and dump scam), the $3000's would be the bottom in a standard pump and dump whose future is not to completely implode and die off and live to see another day.  Since transaction validators are designed to centralize making it have zero fundamentals and no reason to exist, plus tokens being non-fungible and thus a permissioned ledger by default, it could also go the other way in a slow grind to complete failure, as anything with zero fundamentals would do on a long enough timeline.

Bitcoin's future relies entirely on how many clueless people you can fool because it's fundamentals are just not there - they don't exist.  It's a govt created bancor scam designed to try and trick people away from actual money (physical metals) and into a cashless society slavery system.  Everything about the "whitepaper" was a lie from day one.  Things like "peer to peer currency with no middlemen".  Every transaction has 3 or more parties involved.  It has built-in, rent seeking middlemen and it's not even possible to do a transaction with only 2 parties!  How the fuck is that "peer to peer"Huh??

The big lie:  "the use of a lie so colossal that no one would believe that someone could have the impudence to distort the truth so infamously"
Silvers not going up anytime soon, we're all going to be making a much better ROI than you.

Correction, you *HOPE* you're able to scam some random millenials or boomers to buy into your Ponzi in order to profit off them and make an ROI.  I guess it's possible you might be able to scam Tim Draper into holding the bag or something?  But rich people tend to be harder to scam.  It's usually the rich scamming the common man instead.  This is why a pump "to the moon" is such a sketchy proposition in bitcoin.  

The average human is flat broke nowadays with all wealth concentrated at the top, so the rich taking the ball and manipulating it to a gazillion dollars would have nobody for them to sell to and they'd be the bagholders with a few small fish profiting off them.  The only real, valid proposition for bitcoin "to the moon" pumping is that it's a govt created bancor scam designed to try and trick people away from physical metals and into a (((digital currency))) slavery system.  But if you're going to be a Judas shilling for that you might as well just get a job at MSNBC.

I hope you caught the polls on Zerohedge the other day.  70% of people oppose a digital only currency.  Physical metals win, (((digital currency))) loses.
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April 21, 2019, 10:38:02 PM

Well it doesn’t look like anyone wants to advocate for children starving in the streets.  If you follow that through to its logical conclusion you end up with a system not dissimilar to the current system.

On that basis I think that left and right are actually quite close in their approach although the rhetoric differs.  

I guess Jbear and Arie and I can agree on stuff.
We are discussing what is being suggested in real legislation in the US. Not some fantasy land only this only that. The current US setup but now with added giving money to lazy people and taxing out the ass.

TBH I haven’t followed the new green deal and don’t know what is being proposed.
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April 21, 2019, 10:40:00 PM

China is “socialism with Chinese characteristics” which translates to hyper-capitalism.  

The USA is far more socialist than China.  

Funny how socialists always claim that the socialist countries aren't really socialist.


China left socialism 40 years ago.  Of course slow at start. Right now is in many aspects way more liberal capitalist country as is Trump USA. If China would stay socialist until today would not become strongest economy. Impossible.


Maybe Venezuela is not socialist either. I donno, I am starting to get very lost on this subject.

Venezuela is socialist.  Venezuela and China are opposite.     China is Communist society system and capitalist economic system. Venezuela have democratic society system and socialist economic system.
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April 21, 2019, 10:41:35 PM

Well it doesn’t look like anyone wants to advocate for children starving in the streets.  If you follow that through to its logical conclusion you end up with a system not dissimilar to the current system.

On that basis I think that left and right are actually quite close in their approach although the rhetoric differs.  

I guess Jbear and Arie and I can agree on stuff.
We are discussing what is being suggested in real legislation in the US. Not some fantasy land only this only that. The current US setup but now with added giving money to lazy people and taxing out the ass.

TBH I haven’t followed the new green deal and don’t know what is being proposed.
Just what we were discussing a living wage for those unable AND unwilling to work. It's that and unwilling for what we discussing.

Another part of it is a rehab of every single building in the US to make it green, every single home.

A ban on combustion engines fully implemented in under 10 years.

Ban on cow farms

Ban on airplanes (part of the combustion engine issues)

And much much more. It's a silly thing.
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April 21, 2019, 10:42:42 PM

TBH I haven’t followed the new green deal and don’t know what is being proposed.

UN sustainable development program - aka the deindustrialization of the entire 1st world.  Much of it is just Jewish attacks vs white western civilization disguised as environmentalism in order to try and destroy them and have moron leftists champion their own demise while pretending they're on the 'insider' team that will be spared - they won't.  There's only one actual valid path for sustainable development, and that's a global war on R-selection brown people. The complete opposite of the Jewish Kalergi plan which is essentially infinite brown people.
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April 21, 2019, 10:46:48 PM

Sounds like an attempt to move the Overton window

Jojo:  I want to think before responding

Arie:  I will read your link

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April 21, 2019, 10:47:00 PM
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I don't know about party affiliations but it seems to me that every citizen of a country should be given the exact same benefit of any social program. Managing any kind of rules requires an administrative burden. For each edge case or unique circumstance, there are 1000 administrative types in an office somewhere processing paperwork/requests/waivers. Make it universal or don't do it.

If we are giving welfare to one person, then we give it to every registered citizen. If that means everyone gets 500 a month, indexed for inflation, then that's what it means. Most of that monthly benefit would get pumped back into the economy and since fiat value is not based on anything really, the cost of the system could be calculated into the inflation of the USD and paid for by the FED rather than the US Government. The fed is going to stimulate the economy anyway, why not do it at the citizen level rather than the bank level? Call it the base cost of a having a population of citizens. Like oil revenues for Alaska residents. I mean, the country technically belongs to its citizens anyway, right?

A billionaire won't give a shit about that 500 a month and any soul who wants a better life for themselves is not going to settle for that either. The mentally ill will find someone to help them for that 500 and the people who refuse to work will have enough to deter them from committing petty crime for food (I mean they are too lazy to work and stealing takes work). People who are here illegally will not get it, so every citizen will have an immediate advantage over illegals.
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April 21, 2019, 10:50:28 PM
Last edit: April 21, 2019, 11:01:23 PM by realr0ach

If that means everyone gets 500 a month

The plan is to give the goyim slaves a small stipend and then begin to attach ENORMOUS strings and requistes to receiving that stipend that results in complete communist control - control of movement, spending, everything.  From there it's word for word the same plan that was used against the goyim during the Jewish Bolshevik revolution in Russia where 20+ million white Christians were murdered.  

As you can see, this is why there's starting to be large divides in the (((ruling class))).  Even if you're a billionaire right now, you will probably either lose it all, be killed, or jailed at some point during all this, so there's not a whole lot of reason to support it for much of anyone.  The real situation at hand that has to be addressed is either extreme monetary inflation to keep the debt based system afloat, or transition to an entirely new system. The only real valid way out of it that doesn't involve war where everyone on the planet dies is to simply revalue/remonetize gold and silver to what they should be and everyone dumb enough to be holding debt or imaginary digital instruments gets left holding the bag with nothing.
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April 21, 2019, 10:52:49 PM

Did you guys saw the Bitcoin Heist movie from 2016.?  Here is the poster image https://imgur.com/wh6LauW I've never watched it so far, now I was doing some random searches on google and found this movie (https://myopenloadmovies.com/watch/bitcoin-heist). If anyone here saw it, can you please share some experience, is it worth watching?  Grin
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