Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[nutildah]

For the record, the following is my restatement as best I concisely can of Rizun’s ‘Five Fundamental Flaws of LN’:

1) Lightning scales txs not users
2) Friction in layer 1 leaks into layer 2
3) Routing failures are inevitable
4) Much trapped liquidity in the system
5) Running a non-custodial wallet is more cumbersome than onchain

More anti bitcoin propaganda from the threads #1 bitcoin hater.

1. Bullshit. Users are transactions.
2.-5. Well I guess we should just abandon a blossoming technological breakthrough since its current incarnation has potential flaws/limitations.

[jbreher]

Bcash is just pathetic with their concern trolling of LN, when we openly discuss its limitations, or the constant rehashing old talking points from rogers past propaganda.

That's your rebuttal? Weak. You don't seem to be openly discussing shit, but rather shouting down reasoned critique with nothing but bluster. I note you've not responded to my observation that you have characterized something you later agreed with as "false rumors and misinformation". Interesting debating strategy. Tell someone they're wrong, the agree with them on the very same point. Of course, you were cornered.

Bcash is so insecure and so centralized that they further shifted away from the whitepaper into an area where they no longer even use PoW to achieve consensus anymore but have reorg timestamps approved by a central dev team where PoW is merely to be used at the chain tip to order txs.

Perhaps you are unaware that Core also relies upon checkpoints? That said, yes. I agree that following core in this bad practice of relying on checkpoints rather than pure PoW was a mistake.

Unlike BTC and the way Bitcoin was described in the whitepaper the BCH alt now uses weak subjectivity as the basis of determining consensus.

In a limited manner, yes. For everything else, there is SV.

[El duderino_]

BTC ...... "they said" .... so many bad and negative things, but yet its here for more than 10years and growing, "they said" so much, but we BTC'ers just know what we have in our possession nothing is more important, let "them" say

[nutildah]

Unlike BTC and the way Bitcoin was described in the whitepaper the BCH alt now uses weak subjectivity as the basis of determining consensus.

In a limited manner, yes. For everything else, there is SV.

Nobody is going to use SV for anything. Its just another altcoin, the 28th with the word bitcoin in its name. When are you going to give up the farce?

[HairyMaclairy]

Perhaps you are unaware that Core also relies upon checkpoints? That said, yes. I agree that following core in this bad practice of relying on checkpoints rather than pure PoW was a mistake.

Just run Core with -nocheckpoints    This was discussed in this thread less than a week ago.  Please try to keep up !

[rebal15]

I scammed a lot of people. First, I sold them a software that is good for nothing. Then I sold them the dream of became rich by telling them BTC is gooing to "100k if not I will eat ...." but I have not told them BTC will go to 6k sell some to buy more.
Who am I?

[jbreher]

Bullshit. You can't just point at the entire corpus of material written about LN, and tell me that these concise targeted assertions are disproven therein. Grab one and point me to what you believe is written that disproves it.

If you can, pretender.

Sigh ... , lets start with the first link ....

https://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/85650/htlcs-dont-work-for-micropayments/85694#85694

https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1G4xchDGcO37DJ2lPC_XYyZIUkJc2khnLrCaZXgvDN0U/edit?pref=2&pli=1#slide=id.g85f425098_0_195

which directly addresses one of Rizun's concerns with the dust limit expressed in the article "Visualizing HTLCs and the Lightning Network’s Dirty Little Secret"

Well, it provides a workaround, but does not solve it.
Sometimes names are misleading. In this case however, 'Probabilistic Payments' is a very apt description of this mechanism. The payment may or may not happen. Is there something about this that you do not understand?

I also note that the "concern of Rizun's" that you have chosen to 'rebut' is merely one micro-sub-case of one of the listed FFFoLN. Not only is it not a solution (being a mere compromise) to the issue you chose to 'rebut', but the actual one of the FFFoLN of which it is a special case -- namely, that fraction at layer 1 leaks to layer 2 -- has much more damaging consequences. Such as 'persistently full blocks prevent opening of channels, closing of channels, and repudiation of counterparty posting of stale channel state data'.

Bzzt. Try again.

[El duderino_]

I scammed a lot of people. First, I sold them a software that is good for nothing. Then I sold them the dream of became rich by telling them BTC is gooing to "100k if not I will eat ...." but I have not told them BTC will go to 6k sell some to buy more.
Who am I?

Same d*ckhead as always?? 

[HairyMaclairy]

It doesn’t sound like a much needed apology to me



https://twitter.com/cobrabitcoin/status/1120742431144779783?s=21

[VB1001]

BTC Dominance: 54.7%

CMC

 
 
 

[gentlemand]

It doesn’t sound like a much needed apology to me

Am pretty confident this person is our modern equivalent of this forum's Shroomskit who admitted that 3-5 different people were using that same account. I think Cobra must be at least 5-10 different people who rent it on an hourly basis.

[bitcoinPsycho]

Unlike BTC and the way Bitcoin was described in the whitepaper the BCH alt now uses weak subjectivity as the basis of determining consensus.

In a limited manner, yes. For everything else, there is SV.

Nobody is going to use SV for anything. Its just another altcoin, the 28th with the word bitcoin in its name. When are you going to give up the farce?

He won't, SV more encapsulates what he wants Bitcoin to be or stand for. The majority of us just don't share that opinion, which needs to be noted as having a great cost of Craig bring the lead on it. (Whether people want to accept that is the case or not)

There is a place in the ALTcoin section  for discussing imposter coins

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4985868.msg50755442;topicseen#msg50755442


Be carefull there's a lot of RED tags in that place

[BTCMILLIONAIRE]

I'll try to summarize the last 4 months. The first important point was of course the recovery jump from $3100K (15 Dec 2018) to $4000 (Bitstamp prices everywhere). This suggested that the new bottom $3100 is either the final or it would be tested again. The fear of the second posssibility led to the gradual decline until 7 Feb 2019, which was the next even more important turning point. Then we had the higher low of $3350 and a jump to $3700. At this point the first possibility that we found the final bottom seemed more probable for the traders, and soon followed another breakout to $4100. After that another drop to $3700 area. But then followed what was the most important period IMO. From 7 Feb until 1 April the price was gradually increasing showing no sings of testing the bottom. Each time the price dropped in a matter of minutes it recovered again and again. This indicator clearly showed that way more people were waiting with fiat to buy at any small dip. Finally the $3800 and $4200 resistances fell and with several big and smaller jumps we got to $5600 (1-2 April 20% short squeeze was epic!).

Now, what can we expect? It seems quite probable that in the coming days or 2-3 weeks we are going to reclaim the old support at $6-6.4K.  The other less probable case for the next month  is to have a gradual declining price to $5K or in the worst scenario to $3.8K. It all depends on the buying strenght. I think that the sings of the recent quick recoveries show that the buying potential is much bigger than in 2018. This potential is enough to bring us back to $20K and beyond. The only problem is the psychological fear that the price above $10K is too high. You know, the average Joe is thinking: $10K is too late for me. See ripple it is only $0.30 now. All of my ignorant friends are thinking in this way.   They don't know about market cap or the real value of the Bitcoin   Fortunately, FOMO will overcome fear and after some battle we will see soon 5 digit prices! And when the halving comes, nobody will know what the real price should be. It will be worldwide news to have 20-30% jumps like 80-100K$ in 1 day. I can't wait to see that

Holy fuck, we dropped 99,99871% on December 15? Maybe I should go see a doctor.

[mindrust]

BTC Dominance: 54.7%

CMC

 
 
 

I dumped my RVN and LTC bags for BTC at the fucking top. (ltc from 0.0181BTC, rvn from 1640sats.) I feel like a genius. Only Monero left in my portfolio. I am now %98.5 Pure in BTC. (this is purer than the Heisenberg standard) Feelsgoodman.

I am probably not returning to RVN but can get back in to LTC from <0.01BTC.

[Paashaas]

sorry mate ^

https://twitter.com/justinsuntron/status/1120927231587393536
-snip-

Tron is coming home.

Ahhhh man  

That fraudulent coin has struck a partership with that club? Eww. I don't expect LC fans to be any smarter than average monkeys about this. When you think about a real cryptocurrency, how could Bitcoin partner up with a club? Who would we send, fake Jesus or fake Satoshi?

Liverpool denies partnership with Tron. lol.

A spokesperson at the football club told Decrypt : “Liverpool Football Club has confirmed that it does not  have a partnership with Tron.”

https://decryptmedia.com/6684/tron-liverpool-football-club-fc

[Arriemoller]

Hey Arriemoller,

Got Fire, Water, Heaven and Earth and Archaeology in the East and the West coming from Amazon.  Please do mention it if you notice that The spring at the bottom of the well of time has been released in translation.

I only ever learned nynorsk, and that is really rusty, thanks.

Will do.
I was about to jump a number of pages, good thing I didn't or i would have missed your post.
He is  an academic so his books can be a bit cautious in its conclusions, but they are interesting never the less.

[jbreher]

Dispelling LN FUD from Rizun For others that care to research -

Rizun is not a chief scientist lol..

Well, that's his title. For all it is worth. Of course, the title is not as important as the content. Do you want to talk about that, or just sling shit?

this guy is on Rogers payroll

Quite literally the first time I have come across this assertion. May be true, but I'm not going to just take your word for it. Want to back up your assertion?

shilling bigger blocks,

It ain't 'shilling', if it is something in which you believe. By definition. Or do you mean to denigrate any advocacy of any position that you personally do not agree with?

he's trying hard

Well, he may be trying hard. Though we've known about and discussed these issues with Lightning for years - though perhaps not condensed into five pithy points as he has.

to discredit LN

Well, to point out flaws within the Lightning design which seem to be shouted down rather than discussed. If you want to refer to this process as 'discredit', then knock yourself out.

which is all FUD.

If it is just FUD, it should be easy to provide a convincing rebuttal. None yet in evidence.

Funny thing is that Jbreher rather listen to him than the actual engineers who's working on LN itself..lol.

Are you lying or just intentionally ignorant? I provided a summary of one of Lightning Labs' important engineer's weaksauce 'rebuttal' just a handful of posts upthread. In case you don't understand the significance, Joost is one of "the actual engineers who's working on LN itself". As just one example which proves how wrong you are. lol, indeed

When Bitcoin SV has been experiencing new problems due to 6 consecutive orphan blocks

I don't see how this is relevant to LN, but I'll bite. What 'problems'?

not even a singel word from Jbreher.

Again, I have responded to this issue upthread. Intentionally ignorant again? Lying again?

Like i said before; just tunnel vision big blocks without understanding the consequences.

Oh, I understand the consequences. By your refusal to engage on the actual issues raised, however, it would seem tacit admission that you have no understanding of the consequences of design decisions behind Lightning.

[jbreher]

For the record, the following is my restatement as best I concisely can of Rizun’s ‘Five Fundamental Flaws of LN’:

1) Lightning scales txs not users
2) Friction in layer 1 leaks into layer 2
3) Routing failures are inevitable
4) Much trapped liquidity in the system
5) Running a non-custodial wallet is more cumbersome than onchain

More anti bitcoin propaganda from the threads #1 bitcoin hater.

More anti-jbreher propaganda from the net's #1 jbreher hater. Your personal vendetta is just ... so ... adorable.

We've covered this. You're a slow learner. In no way am I a bitcoin hater.

1. Bullshit. Users are transactions.

People are inanimate transitory relationships between people? You don't logic much, do you?

2.-5. Well I guess we should just abandon a blossoming technological breakthrough since its current incarnation has potential flaws/limitations.

Scathing rebuttal. Not. EyerollCribbedFromJjgPost.png

You just. Don't. Get. It. It is silly to bet your future on a technology which is utterly dependent upon an implementation that has flaws and limitations which you do not only not understand, but you also refuse to learn about. More than silly. DarwinAwardIstic.

[VB1001]

https://twitter.com/100trillionUSD/status/1121086435682082816

Since miners capitulated in Dec 2018, #bitcoin difficulty is back to Aug 2018 levels (when price was $7000)...

Everything returns to its course.

[LFC_Bitcoin]

It doesn’t sound like a much needed apology to me



https://twitter.com/cobrabitcoin/status/1120742431144779783?s=21

Happy to see Cobra has seen the light.

Only a couple of million dollars lost. Fuck it, pocket change !!!!!!