MtGox withdrawal delays [Gathering]

[ineededausername]

Ok, no one's talking about this so I'll say it. Absent evidence otherwise I think the 5% manual withdrawal option is dead. MTGOX repeatedly missed their promised timeline to process one for me and were very reluctant to allow me to cancel it and get the funds back in my account (though they finally did to their credit).

I have two reports of two successful withdrawals from IRC.  I asked them both to report here so the information would be first hand.  Both wanted to wait until Monday to have the full details of the transfer (e.g. originating bank).

People are quick to complain when their withdrawal is late, and not so quick to report the good news when their money arrive.

Did they have time frames, IE Days, Weeks, a month? Ill take 3rd party hearsay

Here's one case for you. I may be getting a 5% withdrawal on Monday. I will report back soon.

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[ardana123]

is the 5% withdrawal option also available for SEPA transfers?

[sturle]

is the 5% withdrawal option also available for SEPA transfers?

No.  Their Japanese bank offer this manual transfer at a high fee, and you can't send a SEPA transfer from Japan.  You can send EUR as an international wire, of course.

[ardana123]

is the 5% withdrawal option also available for SEPA transfers?

No.  Their Japanese bank offer this manual transfer at a high fee, and you can't send a SEPA transfer from Japan.  You can send EUR as an international wire, of course.

so euro swift would be faster than a euro sepa?

[bitcoinbboyce]

is the 5% withdrawal option also available for SEPA transfers?

No.  Their Japanese bank offer this manual transfer at a high fee, and you can't send a SEPA transfer from Japan.  You can send EUR as an international wire, of course.

so euro swift would be faster than a euro sepa?

Most probably as you cannot send a SEPA transfer from Japan.

[melon]

sepa is sort of a domestic batch process for the Eurozone...what I gather from Wikipedia anyway...only 4 years old ,not well implemented yet..similar to ach batches rather than instant wires...might be wrong though

 I see 4 types imagined

domestic batches       (sepa,ach) usually 3 day before batch is processed
international  batches (not sure but pay processors like dwolla seem to fit the descrip) 7 dayprocess?

domestic individual instant wires ( what sepa is trying to implement ,swift) instant meaning same day
international instant wires                         (swift w iban account number) same day by 2pm plus hops

id appreciate any corrections as i'm interested in understanding normal processing time versus the current gox times..thanks

[sturle]

is the 5% withdrawal option also available for SEPA transfers?

No.  Their Japanese bank offer this manual transfer at a high fee, and you can't send a SEPA transfer from Japan.  You can send EUR as an international wire, of course.

so euro swift would be faster than a euro sepa?

It used to be faster until the beginning of June this year, and could be now as well if MtGox manage to fix their international wire problems.  The limited manual transfer at 5% fee has always been faster.

[enquirer]

I don't know if this is good news or bad news, but it is certainly a big WTF regarding Japanese banks..:

Code:

11:05 < sturles> I noticed on the forum that Japanese domestic transfers come 
                 from a new bank.  I keep watching for reports of international 
                 wires from a new bank as well.  That would be a very good sign.
11:08 <@MagicalTux> sturles, the new bank we use for Japanese transfers is a 
                    domestic only bank
11:16 < sturles> Oh. :-(
11:18 <@MagicalTux> they're the first bank we've seen in JApan that can do 
                    domestic transfers without the need for faxes

Fax!  In 2013!  For a simple domestic transfer!  Can you even buy fax machines any more?  Must be years since I saw one of those.  No wonder even Japanese transfers were slow during high volume periods.  People still think SWIFT transfers from the same banks are fully automated?

I wouldn't trust a bank that allows to transfer my money based solely on a fax message. Nothing is easier to forge than fax.

[gizmoh]

"<@MagicalTux>  they're the first bank we've seen in JApan that can do domestic transfers without the need for faxes"

Karpeles is taking us for a ride on this one.

[justusranvier]

"<@MagicalTux>  they're the first bank we've seen in JApan that can do domestic transfers without the need for faxes"

Karpeles is taking us for a ride on this one.

According to more than one source Japanese banking really is like that.

[gizmoh]

"<@MagicalTux>  they're the first bank we've seen in JApan that can do domestic transfers without the need for faxes"

Karpeles is taking us for a ride on this one.

According to more than one source Japanese banking really is like that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_banks_in_Japan

Online banks:

Jibun Bank (subsidiary of Mitsubishi UFJ Financial Group and KDDI)
Japan Net Bank (subsidiary of Sumitomo Mitsui Financial Group)
Seven Bank (subsidiary of 7-Eleven and Seven & I Holdings Co.)
Sony Bank (subsidiary of Sony Financial Holdings and Sony)
Rakuten Bank (renamed from eBANK, subsidiary of Rakuten )
Incubator Bank of Japan, went bankrupt on 2010/09/10.
ÆON Bank (subsidiary of ÆON)

[sturle]

"<@MagicalTux>  they're the first bank we've seen in JApan that can do domestic transfers without the need for faxes"

Karpeles is taking us for a ride on this one.

According to more than one source Japanese banking really is like that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_banks_in_Japan
Online banks:
[...]

So what?  Online doesn't mean "no fax".  There may be, and probably are, different procedures and requirements for business and personal accounts.  Many online only banks around here only offer personal accounts.

[twobitcoins]

sturle, thank you for your efforts to provide factual and level-headed information.  Regarding this:

Regarding other fiat withdrawal option, I expect most of their problems will be resolved within a month, and the fastest fiat withdrawal option (except domestic JPY and manual express international wire) to take less than a week before Christmas.  I'm willing to bet 1 BTC on this.

I haven't seen any evidence that the international wire transfer situation is improving.  What do you base your optimism on?  Do you have information that isn't publicly known?

[NewLiberty]

I don't know if this is good news or bad news, but it is certainly a big WTF regarding Japanese banks..:

Code:

11:05 < sturles> I noticed on the forum that Japanese domestic transfers come 
                 from a new bank.  I keep watching for reports of international 
                 wires from a new bank as well.  That would be a very good sign.
11:08 <@MagicalTux> sturles, the new bank we use for Japanese transfers is a 
                    domestic only bank
11:16 < sturles> Oh. :-(
11:18 <@MagicalTux> they're the first bank we've seen in JApan that can do 
                    domestic transfers without the need for faxes

Fax!  In 2013!  For a simple domestic transfer!  Can you even buy fax machines any more?  Must be years since I saw one of those.  No wonder even Japanese transfers were slow during high volume periods.  People still think SWIFT transfers from the same banks are fully automated?

I wouldn't trust a bank that allows to transfer my money based solely on a fax message. Nothing is easier to forge than fax.

Its OK, this is not solely based on fax message.  It is backed up with x.400 out of band confirmation.

[tvbcof]

I don't know if this is good news or bad news, but it is certainly a big WTF regarding Japanese banks..:

Code:

11:05 < sturles> I noticed on the forum that Japanese domestic transfers come 
                 from a new bank.  I keep watching for reports of international 
                 wires from a new bank as well.  That would be a very good sign.
11:08 <@MagicalTux> sturles, the new bank we use for Japanese transfers is a 
                    domestic only bank
11:16 < sturles> Oh. :-(
11:18 <@MagicalTux> they're the first bank we've seen in JApan that can do 
                    domestic transfers without the need for faxes

Fax!  In 2013!  For a simple domestic transfer!  Can you even buy fax machines any more?  Must be years since I saw one of those.  No wonder even Japanese transfers were slow during high volume periods.  People still think SWIFT transfers from the same banks are fully automated?

I had to use fax for machine parts from New Zealand the other day.  If the Japs like Faxes, so be it.  It should not be rocket science to use a fax, and even to automate things significantly with something like HylaFAX.  The suggestion that Mt. Gox cannot figure out facsimile machines and that is somehow to blame for trouble getting funds to customers smacks of bullshit to be blunt about it.

[Keyser Soze]

Wires are high risk for banks, they will often set limits for online wires to help alleviate the risk. Banks are always being targeted for fraud, typically with identity theft and withdrawing through wires.

If you have it set up with your bank there are usually up to 3 ways to send wires.

1. In person - The authorized individual on an account is positively identified and signs the bank's form.
2. Fax - Banks normally have to have an agreement set up before accepting wires via fax. Often the wire request must be on the bank's form. It is also very common to call and verify the wire before it is sent out.
3. Online - Typically some kind of two-factor authorization is required and there will be a limit on number of wires and/or funds sent. If unusual activity occurs, the bank may hold back the wires and verify them with the account holder. Must be set up beforehand.

Any other method is probably not allowed by the bank.

Presumably, due to the nature of their account (money service business), MtGox has tight limits in place with their current bank(s) and others probably do not want to deal with them. Due to the current regulatory environment, most banks are looking to decrease risk from their depository accounts. Money service businesses are very high risk and thus banks are not very willing to work with them.

I don't know if this is good news or bad news, but it is certainly a big WTF regarding Japanese banks..:

Code:

11:05 < sturles> I noticed on the forum that Japanese domestic transfers come 
                 from a new bank.  I keep watching for reports of international 
                 wires from a new bank as well.  That would be a very good sign.
11:08 <@MagicalTux> sturles, the new bank we use for Japanese transfers is a 
                    domestic only bank
11:16 < sturles> Oh. :-(
11:18 <@MagicalTux> they're the first bank we've seen in JApan that can do 
                    domestic transfers without the need for faxes

Fax!  In 2013!  For a simple domestic transfer!  Can you even buy fax machines any more?  Must be years since I saw one of those.  No wonder even Japanese transfers were slow during high volume periods.  People still think SWIFT transfers from the same banks are fully automated?

Faxed wires are more common then you may think, as are all in one printer/scan/copy/fax machines. 

[Nagle]

Here's one case for you. I may be getting a 5% withdrawal on Monday. I will report back soon.

Monday is over. Did it show up?

[sturle]

The suggestion that Mt. Gox cannot figure out facsimile machines and that is somehow to blame for trouble getting funds to customers smacks of bullshit to be blunt about it.

I don't think anyone here suggested anything like that until you did.  However many people insist that international wires are fully automated in modern banks.  When even domestic transfers are based on signatures on paper, I find it hard to believe that international wires are fully automated in the same banks.  (And I don't know of any bank where international wires are fully automated.)

[glas7]

    
how long must i wait for MtGox withdrawal ?

[sturle]

how long must i wait for MtGox withdrawal ?

Depends on method and size.  See my previous posts for all details.