MtGox withdrawal delays [Gathering]

[Squeaker]

I got verified at gox. i'm not in any kind of panic about it. shit happens. we move on.

Fortunate enough to never have to deal with the aftermath of identity theft I take it?

=squeak=

yes.
i am spartacus.

but.. in gox case it wouldn't be identity theft. it'll be identity fraud.

Well, you seem awfully spry for your age. Way to go.

=squeak=

edit: that all depends on who ends up buying the company, and all the verification info they have on file, and what they do with it.

[raskul]

I got verified at gox. i'm not in any kind of panic about it. shit happens. we move on.

Fortunate enough to never have to deal with the aftermath of identity theft I take it?

=squeak=

yes.
i am spartacus.

but.. in gox case it wouldn't be identity theft. it'll be identity fraud.

Well, you seem awfully spry for your age. Way to go.

=squeak=

edit: that all depends on who ends up buying the company, and all the verification info they have on file, and what they do with it.

for certain, I can see how some may be a tad paranoid about what happens with their personal details. And I dare-say they have every right to be concerned. But.. had this been a small scale business, who had no background in bitcoin, and no perseverance to working legitimately, do you think they would have gotten so many customers and a database as large? I doubt very much gox will be throwing the scan of my passport out of the windows for all and sundry passing by to take home and copy/defraud.

Now, i'm not saying that what has happened with gox has been in any way good business practice, but what I am confident is that without me physically  transferring my money to them - that is all they currently have, a few scanned documents with my business address. Anyone could get that just by searching the internet enough - a mugshot, bank details and address. We are all susceptible to fraud, it's not limited to the companies to whom we proffer our personal information.

add: just trying to think sensibly, i don't think panic is warranted.

[jwest411]

I am a verified customer and I have about 20 btc trapped in mtgox. I tried to withdraw as soon as I found out about btc delays. I wasn't really planning on pursuing any of legal action until I saw that shit has really hit the fan. Now that it has, does anyone have any advice of where to start in the long journey to possibly getting my coins back/punishing mtgox for this injustice?

From what I understand, if Mtgox closes for a month and covers its liabilities through all of the measures outlined in that document, there is a chance that some of us with get our money back? What are the chances of that actually happening?

[ImI]

I am a verified customer and I have about 20 btc trapped in mtgox. I tried to withdraw as soon as I found out about btc delays. I wasn't really planning on pursuing any of legal action until I saw that shit has really hit the fan. Now that it has, does anyone have any advice of where to start in the long journey to possibly getting my coins back/punishing mtgox for this injustice?

From what I understand, if Mtgox closes for a month and covers its liabilities through all of the measures outlined in that document, there is a chance that some of us with get our money back? What are the chances of that actually happening?

there is only ONE chance left:

that some financial bidder is interested in acquiring gox and helps to pay some of those debt.

there is NO chance imo from suing Gox. why? cause they simply have no funds anymore. even if you win (what you do most likely) there wont be any assets.

even worse i could see that suing gox could possibly be contraproductive in terms of some external bidder who is willing to help.

[raskul]

I am a verified customer and I have about 20 btc trapped in mtgox. I tried to withdraw as soon as I found out about btc delays. I wasn't really planning on pursuing any of legal action until I saw that shit has really hit the fan. Now that it has, does anyone have any advice of where to start in the long journey to possibly getting my coins back/punishing mtgox for this injustice?

From what I understand, if Mtgox closes for a month and covers its liabilities through all of the measures outlined in that document, there is a chance that some of us with get our money back? What are the chances of that actually happening?

there is only ONE chance left:

that some financial bidder is interested in acquiring gox and helps to pay some of those debt.

any acquirer of gox would be legally bound to take on ALL the debt. not just a portion of it. If the company is so much in the quagmire that those debts are unsaleable, either current gox, or future gox would be forced into administration, and could write-off/CVA a lot of the debt. this would be the worst case scenario.

there is NO chance imo from suing Gox. why? cause they simply have no funds anymore. even if you win (what you do most likely) there wont be any assets.

There is every chance. sorry. having the funds or not having the funds is irrelivent. If gox are sued and a court awards damages, those damages will have to be paid, even if it means Mark K's mummy selling her condo/yacht/theme park on the moon.

even worse i could see that suing gox could possibly be contraproductive in terms of some external bidder who is willing to help.

No. it needs pointing out that just taking peoples funds is not acceptable and a lawsuit should be filed (last week)

[jwest411]

ok, thanks. This may sound like a stupid question, but what about the possibility of finding the theives who stole from everyone (other than gox)? That possibility has already passed right?

[whave]

No. it needs pointing out that just taking peoples funds is not acceptable and a lawsuit should be filed (last week)

Yeeeeeeaaaaaaah, proving a point is so much more important than having an actual chance to get your money back

[smoothie]

Does anyone know if sturle is ok?

Pretty comical when bitstamp went down for a couple of days sturle was on here crowing that I told you so, its not just gox that was affected lolol.

Yup and MR. STURLE will not admit to that.

The guy is scummy and obviously was a paid shill for gox or at least had a huge interest in not having them fail.

Oops looks like Gox got GOXXED. 

Sturle I'm still trying to get a letter from my mum for you ....lulz

[raskul]

No. it needs pointing out that just taking peoples funds is not acceptable and a lawsuit should be filed (last week)

Yeeeeeeaaaaaaah, proving a point is so much more important than having an actual chance to get your money back

if that's your take on it. so do nothing and have absolutely no chance of seeing your funds, the choice is your own.

[smoothie]

Can we get sturle back in here to complain about "signal to noise" in this thread?

Haha, it's all noise now.  SCREAMING.

Where you at sturle?

Simply hiding as he could not take the truth.

The "noise" he speaks of is the TRUTH. He can't handle it.

[raskul]

But... why didn't they just hire sturle to do PR?

I thought they did.
 

[Squeaker]

any acquirer of gox would be legally bound to take on ALL the debt. not just a portion of it. If the company is so much in the quagmire that those debts are unsaleable, either current gox, or future gox would be forced into administration, and could write-off/CVA a lot of the debt. this would be the worst case scenario.

That would be true of a purchaser acquiring the company as a whole, outright... but if Gox was selling off assets in pieces, the debt would remain with Gox.

=squeak=

[donk4u]

I am a verified customer and I have about 20 btc trapped in mtgox. I tried to withdraw as soon as I found out about btc delays. I wasn't really planning on pursuing any of legal action until I saw that shit has really hit the fan. Now that it has, does anyone have any advice of where to start in the long journey to possibly getting my coins back/punishing mtgox for this injustice?

From what I understand, if Mtgox closes for a month and covers its liabilities through all of the measures outlined in that document, there is a chance that some of us with get our money back? What are the chances of that actually happening?

Bout the same chance as pigs flying and hell freezing over

[whave]

No. it needs pointing out that just taking peoples funds is not acceptable and a lawsuit should be filed (last week)

Yeeeeeeaaaaaaah, proving a point is so much more important than having an actual chance to get your money back

if that's your take on it. so do nothing and have absolutely no chance of seeing your funds, the choice is your own.

A lawsuit won't help, and I personally don't care about proving points. Remember the tilt poker controversy? Another poker company bought it so the customers could get their funds. That won't happen with gox if lawsuits are going to hit, but I understand sueing is like the only and ultimate solution for most americans...

[raskul]

any acquirer of gox would be legally bound to take on ALL the debt. not just a portion of it. If the company is so much in the quagmire that those debts are unsaleable, either current gox, or future gox would be forced into administration, and could write-off/CVA a lot of the debt. this would be the worst case scenario.

That would be true of a purchaser acquiring the company as a whole, outright... but if Gox was selling off assets in pieces, the debt would remain with Gox.

=squeak=

Yes. In most cases however, it has proved more beneficial to take on the debt and then CVA it to the lowest possible payment plan. It would truly be interesting if gox were able to sell of portions of the business and retain the debt. I would surmise that any deal would be negotiable only if the debt was saleable/sold on. i doubt, even gox would be so stupid to sell all but the debt. then again...

 

[Squeaker]

... i doubt, even gox would be so stupid to sell all but the debt. then again...

...two years... so... .. .

=squeak=

[Nagle]

any acquirer of gox would be legally bound to take on ALL the debt. not just a portion of it. If the company is so much in the quagmire that those debts are unsaleable, either current gox, or future gox would be forced into administration, and could write-off/CVA a lot of the debt. this would be the worst case scenario.

That would be true of a purchaser acquiring the company as a whole, outright... but if Gox was selling off assets in pieces, the debt would remain with Gox.

This is why it's important to put Gox into involuntary bankruptcy - to prevent "dissipation of assets" and take control away from Mt. Gox management.

[Squeaker]

any acquirer of gox would be legally bound to take on ALL the debt. not just a portion of it. If the company is so much in the quagmire that those debts are unsaleable, either current gox, or future gox would be forced into administration, and could write-off/CVA a lot of the debt. this would be the worst case scenario.

That would be true of a purchaser acquiring the company as a whole, outright... but if Gox was selling off assets in pieces, the debt would remain with Gox.

This is why it's important to put Gox into involuntary bankruptcy - to prevent "dissipation of assets" and take control away from Mt. Gox management.

After the apparent incompetence and apathy on behalf of those in charge, that led up to this situation over so long a period of time, I would have a hard time disagreeing with this sentiment.

=squeak=

[Lohoris]

having the funds or not having the funds is irrelivent. If gox are sued and a court awards damages, those damages will have to be paid, even if it means Mark K's mummy selling her condo/yacht/theme park on the moon.

This is a very strong and totally wrong assumption.

First, there are some kinds of company (such as LLC) that eat up all debt and the owners are safe whatever happens.

Second, even if it's not the case, if the owner just doesn't have that much money, he doesn't, and you'll still get nothing.

[ImI]

having the funds or not having the funds is irrelivent. If gox are sued and a court awards damages, those damages will have to be paid, even if it means Mark K's mummy selling her condo/yacht/theme park on the moon.

This is a very strong and totally wrong assumption.

First, there are some kinds of company (such as LLC) that eat up all debt and the owners are safe whatever happens.

Second, even if it's not the case, if the owner just doesn't have that much money, he doesn't, and you'll still get nothing.

Exactly, and that leads to the conclusion that to sue a totally blank company makes no sense, cause there isnt anything to get.

Ofcourse all under the precondition that we do KNOW what the financial condition is.