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Author Topic: [ANN] KRAKEN.COM - Exchange with USD EUR GBP JPY CAD BTC LTC XRP NMC XDG STR ETH  (Read 612034 times)
ledmaniak
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February 12, 2014, 12:35:05 PM
 #1181

Currency pairs have the form XBT/EUR (500 EUR/XBT), LTC/EUR (14 EUR/LTC) and XBT/LTC (40 LTC/XBT).

Is there any option to flip the order on XBT/LTC?

Such that it's possible to show a) LTC/XBT (in sub-menu LTC?) and b) XBT/LTC (in sub-menu XBT?).

Cheers. Smiley
I would also like to see this option. The reason is almost every other site I have seen and traded on shows XBT/LTC the other way ie. - LTC/XBT
I'm much more accustomed to seeing it this way.  I would like to see this option too thanks.
Peace.
I think most engineers and scientists would disagree.

XBT/USD notation in the scientific world would mean: XBT per USD. So a notation of USD/XBT would say x USD per Bitcoin.

That the forex world uses XBT/USD as "x Bitcoin in USD" confused me a lot in the beginning.

Bitcoin: 1Cxi8BLvScSm1mW6kjb5MNeJZPrvAiYL6B
Litecoin: LLmjtrrq1ZeD51NSUJ8VanuQduW8Ma3jrs
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February 12, 2014, 12:51:25 PM
 #1182

Currency pairs have the form XBT/EUR (500 EUR/XBT), LTC/EUR (14 EUR/LTC) and XBT/LTC (40 LTC/XBT).

Is there any option to flip the order on XBT/LTC?

Such that it's possible to show a) LTC/XBT (in sub-menu LTC?) and b) XBT/LTC (in sub-menu XBT?).

Cheers. Smiley
I would also like to see this option. The reason is almost every other site I have seen and traded on shows XBT/LTC the other way ie. - LTC/XBT
I'm much more accustomed to seeing it this way.  I would like to see this option too thanks.
Peace.
I think most engineers and scientists would disagree.

XBT/USD notation in the scientific world would mean: XBT per USD. So a notation of USD/XBT would say x USD per Bitcoin.

That the forex world uses XBT/USD as "x Bitcoin in USD" confused me a lot in the beginning.
Yes, I think your statements are correct, what your saying the current listing of XBT/LTC is actually backwards and should read LTC/XBT.  I don't know which way they want to write it and I don't care, I just want to see the conversion shown the opposite way because that's what I'm used to and what most other sites use.
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February 12, 2014, 03:17:19 PM
 #1183

Currency pairs have the form XBT/EUR (500 EUR/XBT), LTC/EUR (14 EUR/LTC) and XBT/LTC (40 LTC/XBT).

Is there any option to flip the order on XBT/LTC?

Such that it's possible to show a) LTC/XBT (in sub-menu LTC?) and b) XBT/LTC (in sub-menu XBT?).

Cheers. Smiley
I would also like to see this option. The reason is almost every other site I have seen and traded on shows XBT/LTC the other way ie. - LTC/XBT
I'm much more accustomed to seeing it this way.  I would like to see this option too thanks.
Peace.
I think most engineers and scientists would disagree.

XBT/USD notation in the scientific world would mean: XBT per USD. So a notation of USD/XBT would say x USD per Bitcoin.

That the forex world uses XBT/USD as "x Bitcoin in USD" confused me a lot in the beginning.
Yes, I think your statements are correct, what your saying the current listing of XBT/LTC is actually backwards and should read LTC/XBT.  I don't know which way they want to write it and I don't care, I just want to see the conversion shown the opposite way because that's what I'm used to and what most other sites use.

if most other sites do mistakes it is better not to go mainstream and clone their mistakes but to make it correct. For the same reason gox and bitstamp have currently suspended bitcoin withdrawals and kraken is working well.
LTC/BTC flip was already asked here and discussed around 20-30 pages ago, as per information from there, such flip will not happened. The best solution is to handle flip on your side where you need it, it is not so difficult.


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February 12, 2014, 05:21:31 PM
 #1184

My 2 withdrawals arrived in my bankaccount just yet. So it's within the 4 working days period stated by Kraken. Some other Dutch folks on another forum are also reporting that their withdrawals are in. I guess we were just spoiled with withdrawals always coming through the next working day (or even the same day sometimes) in the past Smiley
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February 12, 2014, 05:27:00 PM
 #1185

Confirmed, I have my money now Smiley

BTC: 1BvzHyU2WnxtVYbUZYdQ6RExwLUZTfBN1K
LTC: LfoPTEEyhdRHn8Sob8tu1iLz8AjVpvAXa4
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February 12, 2014, 06:46:13 PM
 #1186

I created an excel sheet that allows me to track my profits/losses for Kraken and show a monthly overview of my profits/losses in a chart: http://sdrv.ms/1erQHfD

Feel free to use and edit it.

BTC: 1BvzHyU2WnxtVYbUZYdQ6RExwLUZTfBN1K
LTC: LfoPTEEyhdRHn8Sob8tu1iLz8AjVpvAXa4
medicine
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February 13, 2014, 01:51:43 AM
 #1187

Currency pairs have the form XBT/EUR (500 EUR/XBT), LTC/EUR (14 EUR/LTC) and XBT/LTC (40 LTC/XBT).

Is there any option to flip the order on XBT/LTC?

Such that it's possible to show a) LTC/XBT (in sub-menu LTC?) and b) XBT/LTC (in sub-menu XBT?).

Cheers. Smiley
I would also like to see this option. The reason is almost every other site I have seen and traded on shows XBT/LTC the other way ie. - LTC/XBT
I'm much more accustomed to seeing it this way.  I would like to see this option too thanks.
Peace.
I think most engineers and scientists would disagree.

XBT/USD notation in the scientific world would mean: XBT per USD. So a notation of USD/XBT would say x USD per Bitcoin.

That the forex world uses XBT/USD as "x Bitcoin in USD" confused me a lot in the beginning.
Yes, I think your statements are correct, what your saying the current listing of XBT/LTC is actually backwards and should read LTC/XBT.  I don't know which way they want to write it and I don't care, I just want to see the conversion shown the opposite way because that's what I'm used to and what most other sites use.

if most other sites do mistakes it is better not to go mainstream and clone their mistakes but to make it correct. For the same reason gox and bitstamp have currently suspended bitcoin withdrawals and kraken is working well.
LTC/BTC flip was already asked here and discussed around 20-30 pages ago, as per information from there, such flip will not happened. The best solution is to handle flip on your side where you need it, it is not so difficult.


Alright, is that popular opinion?  IS that the companies position?  I don't think it's a mistake by other sites, I just thinks its the way they have chosen to run things.  I am trying to get used to it.
Thanks
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February 13, 2014, 02:17:44 AM
 #1188

Currency pairs have the form XBT/EUR (500 EUR/XBT), LTC/EUR (14 EUR/LTC) and XBT/LTC (40 LTC/XBT).

Is there any option to flip the order on XBT/LTC?

Such that it's possible to show a) LTC/XBT (in sub-menu LTC?) and b) XBT/LTC (in sub-menu XBT?).

Cheers. Smiley
I would also like to see this option. The reason is almost every other site I have seen and traded on shows XBT/LTC the other way ie. - LTC/XBT
I'm much more accustomed to seeing it this way.  I would like to see this option too thanks.
Peace.
I think most engineers and scientists would disagree.

XBT/USD notation in the scientific world would mean: XBT per USD. So a notation of USD/XBT would say x USD per Bitcoin.

That the forex world uses XBT/USD as "x Bitcoin in USD" confused me a lot in the beginning.
Yes, I think your statements are correct, what your saying the current listing of XBT/LTC is actually backwards and should read LTC/XBT.  I don't know which way they want to write it and I don't care, I just want to see the conversion shown the opposite way because that's what I'm used to and what most other sites use.

if most other sites do mistakes it is better not to go mainstream and clone their mistakes but to make it correct. For the same reason gox and bitstamp have currently suspended bitcoin withdrawals and kraken is working well.
LTC/BTC flip was already asked here and discussed around 20-30 pages ago, as per information from there, such flip will not happened. The best solution is to handle flip on your side where you need it, it is not so difficult.


Alright, is that popular opinion?  IS that the companies position?  I don't think it's a mistake by other sites, I just thinks its the way they have chosen to run things.  I am trying to get used to it.
Thanks

The reason we have the pair flipped relative to other exchanges is that we want to avoid the situation where LTC/XBT price is a very small fraction. We think this is how it ought to be done, but we understand that it's awkward when other exchanges do it differently. I'm not sure what can be done to address the awkwardness, but we'll think about it.
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February 13, 2014, 02:27:55 AM
 #1189

I see, your right that seeing a string of zeros denoting a bunch of alt currency/BTC pairs isn't pretty.

On the other hand though, if you do add almost any other alt coin, the exchange rates will be a very large numbers.
Thibaut
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February 13, 2014, 03:38:19 AM
 #1190

Why don't you write 26.32m for 0.02632 ?
Dargo
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February 13, 2014, 05:40:24 AM
Last edit: March 04, 2014, 07:45:22 PM by Dargo
 #1191

I see, your right that seeing a string of zeros denoting a bunch of alt currency/BTC pairs isn't pretty.

On the other hand though, if you do add almost any other alt coin, the exchange rates will be a very large numbers.

It's not an issue with how pretty the numbers look.

We should walk through this with an example to make it really clear what the issue is. Suppose we have an exchange that, due to resource limitations, is limited to 5 decimal places for orders. This exchange wants to add a currency pair so that users can trade between currencies x and y. Should the exchange use pair x/y or y/x?

Let's say that given current market prices on other exchanges, the price of x/y is currently around 0.01. But the exchange wants to allow for the possibility that this price could crash by at least a factor of 100. After all, currency x isn't nearly as well established as currency y and it seems much more likely that currency x might crash relative to currency y than the other way round. So, the exchange wants to allow for the possibility that x/y price might drop to a price of 0.0001.

But if that happens, the exchange will only have one decimal place left to work with. Since the exchange is limited to 5 decimal places, it can only allow traders to place orders in increments of 0.00001. But there's only 10 such increments between 0 and 0.0001. This means that if price of x/y dropped to 0.0001, trading would be *severely* limited. To get a sense for how limited it would be, suppose that we limited the order book for XBT/EUR to increments of 50 EUR. So you could place a limit buy or sell for 500 or 550, but nothing in between. It would be mighty inconvenient already to have orders limited to increments of 5 or 1, but 50 would be a disaster - liquidity would be absolutely horrible.

This problem disappears if the exchange goes with pair y/x instead. The price of pair y/x is currently around 100. If currency x crashes relative to y by a factor of 100, then the price of y/x will go up to 10,000 (congrats y/x longs!  Cheesy). But this doesn't present any problem for trading on the exchange - orders can still be placed with very fine-grained precision.

Hence, given the scenario the exchange wants to be prepared for (currency x crashing relative to y), pair y/x is the better choice. Now if all the other exchanges are using pair x/y, this makes the choice less clear-cut, but still it's not unreasonable to think that y/x is the better choice.

The above is essentially the reasoning that led us to select XBT/LTC rather than LTC/XBT. We're not LTC bears, but we do figure that LTC is more likely to crash relative to XBT than the other way round.

Why don't you write 26.32m for 0.02632 ?

That's just a display trick. We'd still have to keep track of things computationally, which is the real issue. One thing that might work though is to offer the pair LTC/mXBT, where mXBT = 0.001 XBT. I think that'd be the way to implement your basic idea. But I'm not suggesting we'd do this.    


Edit: adding text below for easier search.

Reason for inverted pairs on Kraken
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February 13, 2014, 09:25:47 AM
 #1192

Currency pairs have the form XBT/EUR (500 EUR/XBT), LTC/EUR (14 EUR/LTC) and XBT/LTC (40 LTC/XBT).

Is there any option to flip the order on XBT/LTC?

Such that it's possible to show a) LTC/XBT (in sub-menu LTC?) and b) XBT/LTC (in sub-menu XBT?).

Cheers. Smiley
I would also like to see this option. The reason is almost every other site I have seen and traded on shows XBT/LTC the other way ie. - LTC/XBT
I'm much more accustomed to seeing it this way.  I would like to see this option too thanks.
Peace.
I think most engineers and scientists would disagree.

XBT/USD notation in the scientific world would mean: XBT per USD. So a notation of USD/XBT would say x USD per Bitcoin.

That the forex world uses XBT/USD as "x Bitcoin in USD" confused me a lot in the beginning.
Yes, I think your statements are correct, what your saying the current listing of XBT/LTC is actually backwards and should read LTC/XBT.  I don't know which way they want to write it and I don't care, I just want to see the conversion shown the opposite way because that's what I'm used to and what most other sites use.

if most other sites do mistakes it is better not to go mainstream and clone their mistakes but to make it correct. For the same reason gox and bitstamp have currently suspended bitcoin withdrawals and kraken is working well.
LTC/BTC flip was already asked here and discussed around 20-30 pages ago, as per information from there, such flip will not happened. The best solution is to handle flip on your side where you need it, it is not so difficult.


Alright, is that popular opinion?  IS that the companies position?  I don't think it's a mistake by other sites, I just thinks its the way they have chosen to run things.  I am trying to get used to it.
Thanks
This is also the de facto standard in foreign currency exchange, to have the currency with the highest value first.  Although most online crypto exchanges do it the other way around, this is actually non-standard in the bigger picture.
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February 13, 2014, 10:03:50 AM
 #1193

Currency pairs have the form XBT/EUR (500 EUR/XBT), LTC/EUR (14 EUR/LTC) and XBT/LTC (40 LTC/XBT).

Is there any option to flip the order on XBT/LTC?

Such that it's possible to show a) LTC/XBT (in sub-menu LTC?) and b) XBT/LTC (in sub-menu XBT?).

Cheers. Smiley
I would also like to see this option. The reason is almost every other site I have seen and traded on shows XBT/LTC the other way ie. - LTC/XBT
I'm much more accustomed to seeing it this way.  I would like to see this option too thanks.
Peace.
I think most engineers and scientists would disagree.

XBT/USD notation in the scientific world would mean: XBT per USD. So a notation of USD/XBT would say x USD per Bitcoin.

That the forex world uses XBT/USD as "x Bitcoin in USD" confused me a lot in the beginning.

XBT/USD to me looks like the value of 1 XBT divided by the value of 1 USD (alternatively: XBT/USD = 650 implies XBT = 650*USD).

12HYShbhrFH1eyrmXc3zMRSFFnkgaVstcg
ledmaniak
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February 13, 2014, 11:04:44 AM
Last edit: February 13, 2014, 12:00:22 PM by ledmaniak
 #1194

Currency pairs have the form XBT/EUR (500 EUR/XBT), LTC/EUR (14 EUR/LTC) and XBT/LTC (40 LTC/XBT).

Is there any option to flip the order on XBT/LTC?

Such that it's possible to show a) LTC/XBT (in sub-menu LTC?) and b) XBT/LTC (in sub-menu XBT?).

Cheers. Smiley
I would also like to see this option. The reason is almost every other site I have seen and traded on shows XBT/LTC the other way ie. - LTC/XBT
I'm much more accustomed to seeing it this way.  I would like to see this option too thanks.
Peace.
I think most engineers and scientists would disagree.

XBT/USD notation in the scientific world would mean: XBT per USD. So a notation of USD/XBT would say x USD per Bitcoin.

That the forex world uses XBT/USD as "x Bitcoin in USD" confused me a lot in the beginning.

XBT/USD to me looks like the value of 1 XBT divided by the value of 1 USD (alternatively: XBT/USD = 650 implies XBT = 650*USD).


I think I read the post that I responded to wrong. Response from Dargo is correct. I also find it much more logic how to kraken does it and don't like those 0.xxxx numbers that other exchanges use.

But indeed, XBT/USD would read to me like "amount of bitcoin for one USD". Like P = F / A.

Bitcoin: 1Cxi8BLvScSm1mW6kjb5MNeJZPrvAiYL6B
Litecoin: LLmjtrrq1ZeD51NSUJ8VanuQduW8Ma3jrs
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February 13, 2014, 02:18:13 PM
 #1195


Same problem for me... nearly 3 weeks passed and no funds on my account...
I contacted the support 10 days ago, sent them the bank receipt and a screenshot of my bank account webpage, but to date it seems they have not started any investigation yet...
I know your support is overwhelmed by work but, I just can not understand how it can be so slow to verify the receipt of a wire ...  Huh

Keep in mind that the issue may be more difficult than just verifying the receipt of a wire. It may be that we simply haven't received the deposit and it's a matter of searching rather than verifying (and searching can take a while). Even if your bank tells you we have received the funds, they may have only traced the wire as far as some intermediary bank. Bank transfers often go through at least one intermediary bank and in a small fraction of cases they get stuck at the intermediary bank.

But regardless of what's happened, it sounds like you're not getting responsive support on this. If you PM me your ticket number I can take a look for you.

The support has just contacted me to explain the problem ... it seems that my wire is stuck somewhere in intermediary banks, and the investigations can take from 2 to 4 weeks... ouch!  Shocked ... I hope this won't  happen again for a long time!   
Should I wait the solution of this issue before trying to make another wire?  Undecided

Thank you Dargo.

Another 2 weeks are gone and the wire has not arrived yet. 53 days are gone since I sent it. I believe the time elapsed is quite sufficient to carry out the investigations...
I contacted again my bank; they told me that if the wire were stuck somewhere, at this time it would have already come back to my bank account, but it did not happen.
What's going on?
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February 13, 2014, 03:38:21 PM
 #1196


Same problem for me... nearly 3 weeks passed and no funds on my account...
I contacted the support 10 days ago, sent them the bank receipt and a screenshot of my bank account webpage, but to date it seems they have not started any investigation yet...
I know your support is overwhelmed by work but, I just can not understand how it can be so slow to verify the receipt of a wire ...  Huh

Keep in mind that the issue may be more difficult than just verifying the receipt of a wire. It may be that we simply haven't received the deposit and it's a matter of searching rather than verifying (and searching can take a while). Even if your bank tells you we have received the funds, they may have only traced the wire as far as some intermediary bank. Bank transfers often go through at least one intermediary bank and in a small fraction of cases they get stuck at the intermediary bank.

But regardless of what's happened, it sounds like you're not getting responsive support on this. If you PM me your ticket number I can take a look for you.

The support has just contacted me to explain the problem ... it seems that my wire is stuck somewhere in intermediary banks, and the investigations can take from 2 to 4 weeks... ouch!  Shocked ... I hope this won't  happen again for a long time!   
Should I wait the solution of this issue before trying to make another wire?  Undecided

Thank you Dargo.

Another 2 weeks are gone and the wire has not arrived yet. 53 days are gone since I sent it. I believe the time elapsed is quite sufficient to carry out the investigations...
I contacted again my bank; they told me that if the wire were stuck somewhere, at this time it would have already come back to my bank account, but it did not happen.
What's going on?


Hi,
   I have the same problem with you (like many others). My bank is sure that the money transferred to Fidor Bank in 5/2/2014 (I checked it). I made an application from my bank and we will ask  to Fidor Bank officially for the fate of my remittance. So, I will have an officially answer from Fidor Bank (until next week) when the money came to them and if it was deposited to Kraken’s account.
For my officially request to Fidor Bank I paid 40€ (fees for my application from my bank and for Fidor's bank reply). If there is proof that the money was in Kraken’s account from last week and they lied to me then I will publish all the necessary evidence.
Something is wrong with Fidor Bank or Kraken....  I have never had any problem with funding my account with other exchanges.       
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February 13, 2014, 06:14:48 PM
 #1197

Greetings. My public ID with Kraken is AA08 N84G FWUC 22FA. I have made two SEPA deposits and they have yet to show up on the website.

Last time I had a problem, I waited two weeks before I acted, then had to wait a few days more. So, I'm posting here, even if it is a bit premature. I will wait until next week to make a support ticket.

My apologies for my selfishness.
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February 13, 2014, 08:40:18 PM
 #1198

Another 2 weeks are gone and the wire has not arrived yet. 53 days are gone since I sent it. I believe the time elapsed is quite sufficient to carry out the investigations...
I contacted again my bank; they told me that if the wire were stuck somewhere, at this time it would have already come back to my bank account, but it did not happen.
What's going on?

We haven't been able to find your deposit so far. The sending bank is really in a much better position to find missing transfers, so please have them run a trace on it. I'm sure wires do sometimes get returned if they are stuck, but you can't rely on that, so your bank really shouldn't have told you that IMO. So, as I said, have your bank run a trace on the payment. You may also be able to have them contact our bank by sending our bank a SWIFT message. But if any intermediary banks were involved, the communication between banks will probably have to proceed step-by-step, retracing the path of banks that the payment took. You can ask your bank to give you a copy of the "MT 103" message that was used for the transfer. This should show the path that the payment was supposed to take.   
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February 13, 2014, 09:50:13 PM
 #1199

Thanks Dargo for addressing the question about the XBT/LTC order in such detail. That certainly makes sense.

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February 14, 2014, 11:32:43 AM
 #1200

I sold a few BTC on Kraken in January and placed a "USD withdraw" order on their site on January 24th.  I kept checking and it never changed from "pending", which made me suspect they had never processed the order.  After 10 business days, I posted support ticket #19434.

The Kraken support wrote back to me (only after I started posting on their Facebook page) to say that they had a batch of "malformed" USD withdrawals and it will take an investigation and 2-4 weeks to perform an investigation to find out what happened. 

I asked for a copy of the outbound wire receipt, but they never replied to that request.

How do you have a "malformed" USD withdrawal?  It sounds like he was just using words from the Bitcoin malleability bug and making up an excuse.  I am suspecting that Kraken has a serious problem in the wires department.  They may be illiquid, understaffed, incompetent, or else their bank just sucks.

I don't know if I will ever see my money again.  There is no way that any other exchange business could possibly rely upon Kraken for restocking their inventory.  They are too slow.

I would never recommend Kraken to anyone.
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