[NEM] NEM -New Economy Movement - No Envy Movement - Updates+Discussion thread

[TwinWinNerD]

The problem with africa and mobile apps is, that most cellphones there are not capable of running apps. While it would be nice to "capture" the cellphone payment marketshare, it won't work, until africa upgrades its hardware!

I think we should invent cheap smartphones and then spread them there

Haha that would be awesome. NXT/NEM sending africa to the 21th century!

"A sub-$50 no-contract smartphones are already a reality today. The MTN Steppa. It’s a pretty bad phone: Android 2.3.5 Gingerbread, 2MP camera, single-core processor, 480×320 HVGA screen. But it’s a genuine smartphone nonetheless, with a 3G antenna, Google Maps, Gmail, Facebook, Opera, and YouTube. And it retails for less than fifty dollars (no contract.) "
www.techcrunch.com/2014/02/08/in-3-5-years-most-africans-will-have-smartphones

In Kenya, cell phone usage increased by 4,000,000 users last year. Kenyans use cell phones for everything from buying groceries to paying rent. Kenyans pay $20 for cell phones with banking, streaming, and communication capabilities. kenyasocialventures.com

A simple app that can just send and receive NEM would be a great starting point. We can team up with a few entrepreneurs or business students at a local university and donate a few $50 smartphones. I am sure they will find NEM useful for one of there projects.

I didn't know that. Do you think that those 20$ cellphones are able to work with a very simple text based NEM app?

[Ged]

Built-in auction and crowdfunding - is it planned ?
Crowdfunding can work for NEM Evolution, developers will get money for their work, so they will be interested in it seriously. +Always looking forward, and will not die like other alt-coins.

[patmast3r]

Built-in auction and crowdfunding - is it planned ?
Crowdfunding can work for NEM Evolution, developers will get money for their work, so they will be interested in it seriously. +Always looking forward, and will not die like other alt-coins.

a NEM crowdfunding platform is planned and actually already set-up (in an initial version)

[Vicodin]

Seriously, why are we not going to launch with an app? If the reason is that it can't be done then I can understand. But I would love to hear why it would be a good idea to launch without one? I don't think the argument that we won't fail if we launch without one is good enough. Seriously, when NEM launches it should be READY for non-crypto users. READY for non-technical users. No one has said to rush this. Is it NOT possible to have one ready when we lauch? Is taking into account security of the app too much to have it ready? If that is the reason fine. I can understand. But I can't see the reasoning beyond that. Let's have this discussion. Maybe I am off base here, but I worry that some of us are so tech savvy that we have a hard time knowing the importance of making things simple for non-technical users. Like we just can't realize how others don't get things that are so easy for us tech guys to understand. So we don't place enough importance on it. IMO, an app would set us apart, and at the same time, allow new people to easily adopt NEM. If you agree, say something. I am new to cryptos, and this is one thing from a long list I plan to bring up to help NEM break the crypto mold.

I have to agree, even though I dont know how will we reach those non tech people immediatly after launch, I think it will be boiling here in crypto community for some time, until we are ready to push it more to mainstream. Talking mainstream are there any plans on how to push NEM further, behind the walls of current crypto scene here on BTT?

Seriously, you hit the nail right on the head. What are we going to do to spread NEM beyond the crypto community? This is a VERY big question. I am new to cryptos. I think I am seeing things differently than others here. What I am picking up in general is the "can't see the forest through the trees" situation. Let me be clear. NEM is much farther than other coins in the sense that it is breaking the mold in many ways already. Utopian has a lot on his plate. He has been very successful in creating a coin that has the POTENTIAL to break out of the crypto circle. I have breifly gone over the trello board as well. There are many interesting ideas there. Good ones. There is just so much to do.

What I see as a challenge is a few things. Theres is so much work to do when it comes to development in the first place. This is understandably taking up much of the focus. Also, I think the larger issue is, probably not Utopian, but many can't see it in their mind. They have seen EVERY coin they have been involved with talk about this I would imagine, and fail. They are just focused on making this a success here. In the back of their mind, I just think pushing for a coin to be adopted by the public is something so big that it is a waste of time. At the very least, something we should worry about LATER. This is the first thing. The time to start to take this to the general public is now. It will take us weeks to indentify things such as: What does our Marketing Sales Funnel look like. What does the "buying cycle" look like? Who are our different target audiences? Who is in charge of our newsletter?  The list goes on.

We should have already hired a search engine optimization firm to optimize our website and begin the campaign. We should have our army of stakeholders writing articles on different subjects related to cryptos and NEM.

Seriously, what we have to figure out is this: What is our message? How are we going to spread this message? How do we track the success of the that message being spread effectively? Who are we targeting with our message?

These are just the basics, and I'm leaving things out. The major point is we have to believe that it is possible. ANY coin that hired a professional marketing company, I mean a good one, could overtake Bitcoin easily.

The main challenge I believe is the decentralized nature of cryptos. This is why this hasn't happened yet. But it will. Utopian looks like a capable leader. NEM is lucky. This is VERY hard to find.

We need to find a good marketing company to take this mainstream. If not, I can help but as with everyone my time is limited. We CAN do this together. However, I would suggest that we leave it to pros if we really want NEM to reach its goals. But either way, we need to start now.

And of course, once we have a "buyer", it should be a simple as downloading an app.

The first step is to beleive!!! Really believe!!!

I'm goignt to try to address all of this but since your text is quite long I might miss a few things. Also note that this is my personal opinion and it doesn't necessarily reflect what UP or anyone else thinks.

First off it bothers me that you think launching with an app means launching ready for non-crypto users. That's complete nonsense in my opinoin (sry for being so blunt here). What a new currency needs for mass adoption besides value is utility. If people can't use NEM they aren't going to give a rats as about an app and that goes for goes for crypto and non-crypto people. Btw. what exactly do you think this app should do ?

So our number one goal imho has to be getting merchants and exchanges to accept NEM. Of course we'll also try to step up in that regard ourselfs as a community. Launching services and stuff.

Now you have also outlined in your write up - and I agree - marketing is important and something that every stakeholder should engage in. BUT not right now. The specs of NEM aren't final, our website is not ready in fact nothing is 100% finished. The whole project is still at a very early stage. If you start a huge marketing campaing now all the people will see is unfinished stuff and nothing to do with it as off now. More than one person has heard of NEM, came to this thread and whas dissapointed to see nothing but debates about sockpuppets and what not. Personally I'd like to attract people when we're ready for them. A good example are a couple of the signatures that you find among NEMsters. Many still have POS there which isn't true anymore. We'll privde a factsheet about NEM that everyone can use to market NEM. There'll also be a NEM vs NXT chart that will outline the differences. We can't have people writing inaccurate articles on something that isn't even finished.

To sum things up... I really appreciate how motivated you seem to be and I don't even disagree 100% I just think we shouldn't get ahead of ourselfs.

And to answer you question: If we don't launch with an app it will be because there's plenty of other stuff that needs to be done before we even need an app (like I said what should this app even to right now?).

Thanks for the quick response. To be clear, I am not attacking NEM or trying to stir things up. I am brand new here and I have already been promoting NEM in other places in this forum. I also have put myself on the waiting list. I have read alot of this thread and I am not here to troll or point out things to hurt this movement.I think that there are many other things that need to be done other than marketing. The idea is to focus on marketing as well. As I understand NEM will be launched in June/July, I just think a marketing strategy being started now would not be premature. This will take much longer than the actual launch of NEM. If you are worried that putting some focus on our marketing strategy for mass adoption will take away resources and cause exchanges not to happen, by all means, lets focus on the exchanges. I couldn't agree more that there needs to be an exchanges set up.

We are definitely on the same page when it comes to the currency needing utility. As for merchants accepting NEM, I can see the urgency of this subject, especially considering the whole chicken and the egg analogy. Users need merchants, and merchants need users to want to use NEM in the first place.

I think the greatest thing about NEM is that it is not just a currency. It is a movement. Let's start promoting that. Let's start defining and refining what that message is. Let's start spreading that message. Let's start getting the website optimized for beginners in cryptos now. This way there will be time for it to be indexed by search engines. That way when people who have an interest in cryptos are doing research, they find NEM.

I was not saying that having an app would be the end all to get new users. It would only be toward the end of the "the buying cycle" as a "call to action" tool. ie "download the app now"

Also, this is the easy way for us to position a new user to interact with "NEM". They download the app, then there is an introduction to cryptos and using NEM, places they can buy it,  the list of places they can spend it, etc.

I know, why are we worrying about this app when the currency isn't even made yet?

I believe, and this is my opinion and I could be off base, that the app will be instrumental in making it easy for people who are new to cryptos and/or non-technical users to join our movement. They are used to downloading apps. It projects credibility.

What could it do?

It can send messages, send/receive NEM. It can have an introduction to cryptos and NEM. The main point here is an app is something that gets people from the general public one step closer to becoming ACTIVE in our movement. Having a simple app is something that would make it VERY easy for non-crypto users to join. They enter in their email address when downloading the app, and we send them the newsletter.

People hear of NEM, they read about NEM, writers write about NEM, having a free app for people to download will be mentioned. This is normal nowadays. Then they have our app, we have their email address.

Now it is up to us to follow through on our message, and inform them how to use that app and contribute to community goals in the present and future.

I tell a friend about NEM, they are interested in it, I say download the app. Then they are getting the newsletter. Hopefully their intial interest makes them an active member now.

It can also measured. We can find out more and more ways to increase downloads. We also find ways to increase the percentage of downloads to ACTIVE members.

Its JUST an app. Only ONE tool. Not the movement itself.

Most importantly, what is our message? What are other ways we can spread it as well?

[apullman]

The problem with africa and mobile apps is, that most cellphones there are not capable of running apps. While it would be nice to "capture" the cellphone payment marketshare, it won't work, until africa upgrades its hardware!

I think we should invent cheap smartphones and then spread them there

Haha that would be awesome. NXT/NEM sending africa to the 21th century!

"A sub-$50 no-contract smartphones are already a reality today. The MTN Steppa. It’s a pretty bad phone: Android 2.3.5 Gingerbread, 2MP camera, single-core processor, 480×320 HVGA screen. But it’s a genuine smartphone nonetheless, with a 3G antenna, Google Maps, Gmail, Facebook, Opera, and YouTube. And it retails for less than fifty dollars (no contract.) "
www.techcrunch.com/2014/02/08/in-3-5-years-most-africans-will-have-smartphones

In Kenya, cell phone usage increased by 4,000,000 users last year. Kenyans use cell phones for everything from buying groceries to paying rent. Kenyans pay $20 for cell phones with banking, streaming, and communication capabilities. kenyasocialventures.com

A simple app that can just send and receive NEM would be a great starting point. We can team up with a few entrepreneurs or business students at a local university and donate a few $50 smartphones. I am sure they will find NEM useful for one of there projects.

I didn't know that. Do you think that those 20$ cellphones are able to work with a very simple text based NEM app?

I believe so. In South Korea, Singapore and Philippines you can add airtime (load), transfer airtime and make money payments all with the old text based mobile phones.

[nervozaur]

The problem with africa and mobile apps is, that most cellphones there are not capable of running apps. While it would be nice to "capture" the cellphone payment marketshare, it won't work, until africa upgrades its hardware!

I think we should invent cheap smartphones and then spread them there

Haha that would be awesome. NXT/NEM sending africa to the 21th century!

"A sub-$50 no-contract smartphones are already a reality today. The MTN Steppa. It’s a pretty bad phone: Android 2.3.5 Gingerbread, 2MP camera, single-core processor, 480×320 HVGA screen. But it’s a genuine smartphone nonetheless, with a 3G antenna, Google Maps, Gmail, Facebook, Opera, and YouTube. And it retails for less than fifty dollars (no contract.) "
www.techcrunch.com/2014/02/08/in-3-5-years-most-africans-will-have-smartphones

In Kenya, cell phone usage increased by 4,000,000 users last year. Kenyans use cell phones for everything from buying groceries to paying rent. Kenyans pay $20 for cell phones with banking, streaming, and communication capabilities. kenyasocialventures.com

A simple app that can just send and receive NEM would be a great starting point. We can team up with a few entrepreneurs or business students at a local university and donate a few $50 smartphones. I am sure they will find NEM useful for one of there projects.

+1. Totally agree. The faster we establish NEM as a currency and not a commodity, the better. Need to differentiate ourselves from all the other faceless coins.

I'm in on this idea too. +1

[thomastaylor]

Dogecoin community raised $55,000 for Josh Wise and he will be driving a dogecoin wrapped car at NASCAR at the end of April or early May. So tons of doge were cashed out recently to pay for the car painting and sponsor the driver why explains the recent dro in price which creates a good opportunity of buy a ton with a few BTC. But once he gets on National TV, then doge will get tons of attention. 3,000% jump may be an under estimation. DOGE at 3000 Satoshi doesn't feel over valued. Disclaimer: I own 10,000 doge at the time of this writing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josh_Wise
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogecoin

Nice idea. Can we make something like this, too? it could have a huge public relation effect for NEM to attract more people.
What do you thinking about ideas like this?

[hunanay]

Other cryptos thread, what they were discussing？maybe mining、Network Hashrate、Difficulty、Algorithm、Block, how to marketing. I think the NEM community subject to focus on some of the themes：developers, innovations, and community。At the same time also need someone to guide you to focus, let thousands of shareholders can talk about his own views. Most shareholders choose to hide behind, they do not know how to express their ideas,I estimate this also looks shareholders have thousands, but the actual in the forum of post less and less

[makoto1337]

Is Etherium really as revolutionary as this guy makes it out to be ? Can some of the more knowledgeable posters please enlighten me on how they are so much better than both NXT & NEM potentially ( since Etherium is yet to be released)

I think if Ethereum is really what it promises, it is that big of a deal.  

The way I see it is like this.  In the short term, it doesn't matter.  In the short term from a functionality perspective, they will all have the same functions.  The lead developer of Ethereum mentioned this in an interview recently.  Both will have multi-sig functions and asset exchanges and other key aspects.  Things that bitcoin simply can't do because its code is not designed for it.  So in this aspect, NXT has somewhat of a 1st mover bump.  

But.... Ethereum is designed basically to do anything and everything in the future, most of which hasn't been designed yet, or for that matter even thought of yet.  So, it is very possible that in 5 years, NXT will find itself in the "Bitcoin" situation of not being able to meet the needs of a new market.  A platform that was revolutionary and great at the time, but eventually limited for what it needs to do.  And then again.... maybe it won't.  Maybe it will prove very versatile and adaptable.  But I see a very long "blue-ray vs HD DVD" battle coming up between "Ethereum vs Ripple vs NXT" with honorable mention of NEM.  (and then trailing after that counterparty and bitshares)

Ethereum and NEM are late to the game, but both have advantages that if leveraged can really be a big factor.  Ripple and NXT are here now, both with advantages and disadvantages that makes them very polarized and hated/loved in the community.  It all depends on how bad their decisions are and how much NEM can monopolize their failings.  On top of that, NXT has already quasi-set a framework for NEM to follow.   This is not a bitcoin vs litecoin type of battle.  It is going to be much closer than that.  

One things for sure, NEM has the chance to be the people's 2.0 platform, but it will not be easy and we will really need to work as a community to make it happen.  

PS.  You asked for "knowledgeable" and well...... that probably isn't me, I am a newbie, but I thought I would give it a go. hahaha

Ethereum : impractical idea - no practical use cases
Ripple: outdated model - limited appeal
Mastercoin+ Counterparty: unsuitable foundation - limited functionality
Invictus Bitshare : fragmented products, lack a correct vision
Exo: dubious fundamental
Bitcoin: still great but the old King with new problems popping up everyday
NXT: XXXXXX
NEM: the 2015 King - best developers- best innovation - best vision - best community

Disclaimer: comments are with guaranteed objectivity as long as you understand there is no objectivity in forum writing.

I think this is a great summary of the state of crypto for 2015!

[makoto1337]

As far as wallet security goes, I have always thought that the wallet.dat file poses a huge unnecessary security risk (since malware or a hacker can easily scan the computer for wallet.dat). I think we should copy the approach that exocoin is taking when it comes to wallet security:

secure wallets: Using a random file (created by the gui/cmd tool) or a file of your choice (image, sound file, system file etc). Only you should know what file is needed for your authentication. Then you could store your 10,000 photos from your last holiday on an usb stick. Only you will know what special picture will unlock your account!

A secret file to unlock your account. Or at the very least, allow the user to create a custom name and filesystem location for the wallet.dat file.

This is a pretty cool idea.

[makoto1337]

As it was said before, whatever we do with the wallet and app, our most important filters should be simplicity and ease of use. I am convinced this will be one of the important things that make or break Nem in the long run.

In other words a one click install client would be just great to begin with.
I also think maybe it would be interesting for the Nem client to have 2 skins. Meaning one simple and very user friendly interface with just a few basic options and another interface for the more advanced Nem guys where all the interesting options and features are included. This is just a thought.

As i said before, i think this is vitally important.

I think it's very, very important we give people CHOICE - if they wish to have more advanced features, this option should be within the same client; not involve them having to download another client in order to get additional functionality because they're an advanced user. It's this exact thing that makes Crypto's more complicated thna they need to be. Sure, on the surface this is no big deal, but couple this with other hoops people need to jump through, the entire process gets complicated very, very quickly.

A simple option in a menu to enable or disable "Advanced user options" is all that's necessary.


This sort of reminds me of my stance between Firefox and Chrome - i find Chrome a more dumbed down experience and therefore prefer the additional options Firefox offers me (I especially dislike the fact Chrome doesn't even give you the option of choosing an install path - very patronizing, very frustrating)

In order to not piss off either party (Advanced users, casual users) we need to give them CHOICE.

Choice is good, but we should also try as hard as possible to design a good interface so that users don't have to choose.

[makoto1337]

We should have a feature where people are sending NEM (money) to each other can have a live conversation to make sure that it is the person you are sending it too. would that  be possible.?
But make it only connect to both parties who are making the transactions?

Messages?

[hunanay]

We should have a feature where people are sending NEM (money) to each other can have a live conversation to make sure that it is the person you are sending it too. would that  be possible.?
But make it only connect to both parties who are making the transactions?

Messages?

live conversation：I think that is  voice or Video...

[frajervitalny]

We should have a feature where people are sending NEM (money) to each other can have a live conversation to make sure that it is the person you are sending it too. would that  be possible.?
But make it only connect to both parties who are making the transactions?

Messages?

live conversation：I think that is  voice or Video...

whoa..that would be crazy, lt could help to make trading in general much more trustworthy, I also think that it has potential to open a new market of online tutorials, ranging from learnig to play an instrument, through language and self development courses to web cam ladies.
This could positively distinguish NEM from similar projects.

[Djentriser]

We should have a feature where people are sending NEM (money) to each other can have a live conversation to make sure that it is the person you are sending it too. would that  be possible.?
But make it only connect to both parties who are making the transactions?

Messages?

live conversation：I think that is  voice or Video...

whoa..that would be crazy, lt could help to make trading in general much more trustworthy, I also think that it has potential to open a new market of online tutorials, ranging from learnig to play an instrument, through language and self development courses to web cam ladies.
This could positively distinguish NEM from similar projects.

My vision of crypto platform, that will steal future, is much more than currency. Im looking forward to a new internet, based not on information and entertainment but on personal bussines affairs. Evolutionary, I think we are as species heading towards a technology based system with no need for manual work in current understanding. In future every person will be trying to be a bussinesman of some sort. Crypto would be used as "MySpace" for every producer, artist, craftsman, trader and any enthusiast that have something to offer. Internet with all its current features based on immediate  transfer of economic values, is exactly what free market needs to fulfill its meaning.

It certainly would be a New economic model, a true free market driven just by demand and supply. No psychology exploiting marketers. No mega corporations. No banksters. No monopols. An upgrade to corrupted and obsolete system manipulated for small groups benefit. Every skilled, talented and willing person connected to system could earn economic values in a fast, efficient and secure way.

Imagine cypto platform that would contain its own version of browser, youtube, instagram, ebay, personal video channels, different markets, filesharing services, etc...

I think this model would certainly be attractive, to every musician, pohotographer, designer, tutor, trader and bussinesman anyone who creates something or can teach any skill, I mean these markets are already booming, but I feel like current phaze of heftiness works against it. There are plenty of young talented people who feel limited by current economic mechanisms.

I heard some experts, who critically analyse market, that reason why is everything corrupted and manipulated, is beacuse capital moves too fast compared to system mechanisms that are installed now. So basically, capital overruns them. Crypto is natural step towards system that can meet economic demands.

So how much unrealistic is to want to have this type of platform that could cover all I was writing about, from technical aspect? And is there a possibility, that NEM could ever develope in to this platform?

[tlincoln]

Their is an article on CoinDesk right now about the carbon footprint of bitcoin. Some of you guys and gals can post additional comments in the discussion about the benefits of NEM.
http://www.coindesk.com/carbon-footprint-bitcoin/

[zsutbd]

As far as wallet security goes, I have always thought that the wallet.dat file poses a huge unnecessary security risk (since malware or a hacker can easily scan the computer for wallet.dat). I think we should copy the approach that exocoin is taking when it comes to wallet security:

secure wallets: Using a random file (created by the gui/cmd tool) or a file of your choice (image, sound file, system file etc). Only you should know what file is needed for your authentication. Then you could store your 10,000 photos from your last holiday on an usb stick. Only you will know what special picture will unlock your account!

A secret file to unlock your account. Or at the very least, allow the user to create a custom name and filesystem location for the wallet.dat file.

This is a pretty cool idea.

+1

[j23a]

Their is an article on CoinDesk right now about the carbon footprint of bitcoin. Some of you guys and gals can post additional comments in the discussion about the benefits of NEM.
http://www.coindesk.com/carbon-footprint-bitcoin/

I left a comment and I did mention Nem, but I'm afraid of others going there and spamming the comment section. So I would suggest for people to not comment unless it's not forced and it really relates to the article. Simply for name awareness. As long as there are a couple of comments, people will get it.

[noone000]

The gui is a lot of eye candy. I hope to get my hands on some before it hits the exchanges. I think we'll see the true definition of "to da moooooooon".

[www123]

NEM is a scam! nothing new except for the stupid discussion of stakeholder!
most members of the team of NEM(jaguar0625, bloodyrookie, thies1965, borzalom, gimre makoto and minusbalancer), except UP, are inactive! it seems that UP hopes to fund more money taking advantage of the   exiting strong community(ie, there is a waiting list).
anyway, UP doesnot deserve our trust!