[POOL][Scrypt][Scrypt-N][X11] Profit switching pool - wafflepool.com

[FrankieSaysRelax]

I have no issue with being incorrect; however, there was an announcement on the main waffle site stating that it would be taking advantage of the 2x rewards. Every time the ghash.io jumps, waffle hash loses 20gh. Could be a single miner or could be proxying to ghash. I'm just going on observation and the announcement.

It's a Chinese group - they have posted on these forums as 'sfire' - that is moving the ~20GH/s back and forth.  PoolWaffle disabled proxying to GHash as soon as they implemented the tiered bonus scheme.

@PoolWaffle: WafflePool's profitability does seem to consistently climb a bit whenever sfire leaves.  Is this really just due to luck?  Seems weird to me.

No, it is basic economic. Less dumping of coins on market at once = higher price per coin for the rest of us.

[1714287121]

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[phzi]

@PoolWaffle: WafflePool's profitability does seem to consistently climb a bit whenever sfire leaves.  Is this really just due to luck?  Seems weird to me.

No, it is basic economic. Less dumping of coins on market at once = higher price per coin for the rest of us.

I highly doubt that.  If we don't mine them, someone else will.  Also, considering we mainly mine Doge and LTC right now, we definitely are not moving the markets very much.

Edit: allow me to answer myself - based on our current block discovery rate (low), it definitely is just dumb luck - sfire's ("the whale") mining presence just seems to smooth out our profitability's variance.

[cebb]

Is it still a good idea to mine Dogecoin?

after the static dogecoin block reward implemented today,  pool can no longer cherry pick big reward blocks.

Also with the new difficulty algorithm coinwarz and coinchoose are showing different difficulties. and both are incorrect IMHO. Actual difficulty is higher than what both website shows.

[zneww]

Is it still a good idea to mine Dogecoin?

after the static dogecoin block reward implemented today,  pool can no longer cherry pick big reward blocks.

Also with the new difficulty algorithm coinwarz and coinchoose are showing different difficulties. and both are incorrect IMHO. Actual difficulty is higher than what both website shows.

Difficulty changes every block now I think or something like that

[phzi]

Is it still a good idea to mine Dogecoin?

after the static dogecoin block reward implemented today,  pool can no longer cherry pick big reward blocks.

Also with the new difficulty algorithm coinwarz and coinchoose are showing different difficulties. and both are incorrect IMHO. Actual difficulty is higher than what both website shows.

Difficulty changes every block now I think or something like that

WafflePool's profit switching system considers each block and its difficulty, reward, exchange depth and price, etc (and throws in a few other offsets).  If we are mining Doge, it's because at the difficulty of that block, it was more valuable to mine then the alternatives.

Keep in mind, also, that PoolWaffle has indicated that the new switcher mines multiple coins simultaneously - ala, splitting WafflePool's total hashrate at multiple coins.  If you want many miners at once connected to WafflePool, you will notice workers diverge in mining duty on occasion.

[poolwaffle]

Is it still a good idea to mine Dogecoin?

after the static dogecoin block reward implemented today,  pool can no longer cherry pick big reward blocks.

Also with the new difficulty algorithm coinwarz and coinchoose are showing different difficulties. and both are incorrect IMHO. Actual difficulty is higher than what both website shows.

Difficulty changes every block now I think or something like that

WafflePool's profit switching system considers each block and its difficulty, reward, exchange depth and price, etc (and throws in a few other offsets).  If we are mining Doge, it's because at the difficulty of that block, it was more valuable to mine then the alternatives.

Keep in mind, also, that PoolWaffle has indicated that the new switcher mines multiple coins simultaneously - ala, splitting WafflePool's total hashrate at multiple coins.  If you want many miners at once connected to WafflePool, you will notice workers diverge in mining duty on occasion.

This is correct.  They also do caching (you'll only notice them changing data every 5min or so), we check literally nonstop.  We mine Doge when it is profitable, something else when that something else is profitable, has nothing to do with random block rewards, other than with random block rewards the profitability changed drastically from block to block, now it just shifts slower...

I have no issue with being incorrect; however, there was an announcement on the main waffle site stating that it would be taking advantage of the 2x rewards. Every time the ghash.io jumps, waffle hash loses 20gh. Could be a single miner or could be proxying to ghash. I'm just going on observation and the announcement.

It's a Chinese group - they have posted on these forums as 'sfire' - that is moving the ~20GH/s back and forth.  PoolWaffle disabled proxying to GHash as soon as they implemented the tiered bonus scheme.

@PoolWaffle: WafflePool's profitability does seem to consistently climb a bit whenever sfire leaves.  Is this really just due to luck?  Seems weird to me.

Unlikely due to luck.  I mentioned a few posts back about rewriting the stratum endpoints, I think it has something to do with some lag/delays in processing immediately after finding a block, and with 20GHs, that few seconds of delay becomes a much more significant portion of block finding time.  Working on rewriting the whole thing now to try to speed it up

[poolwaffle]

Another quick thing, since I'm sure there are people out there scraping our stats page for it (our heaviest page to load of course):

http://wafflepool.com/stats_api
Index is # days ago.  So first index (0) is "today", 1 is yesterday, etc.

[grendel25]

Another quick thing, since I'm sure there are people out there scraping our stats page for it (our heaviest page to load of course):

http://wafflepool.com/stats_api
Index is # days ago.  So first index (0) is "today", 1 is yesterday, etc.

is it supposed to look like this?

[{"earned":17.299778240001,"hashrate":12526024174.502,"permhs":0.0057097294099871},{"earned":141.28783517,"hashrate":21304972159.962,"permhs":0.0066316836327775},{"earned":94.60423253,"hashrate":15655875758.835,"permhs":0.0060427301536685},{"earned":180.71696251,"hashrate":33680342525.974,"permhs":0.0053656509689779},{"earned":145.062423,"hashrate":24912626638.848,"permhs":0.0058228473899173},{"earned":224.34342899,"hashrate":36551658150.796,"permhs":0.0061377086660326},{"earned":223.2047698,"hashrate":35310771339.978,"permhs":0.0063211524792519}]

[phzi]

is it supposed to look like this?

<snip>

Yes.  It is an API interface to the stats table (so other programs can access the information without needing to pull the more detailed stats and html information).

[MrNight]

PW, what's about SpainCoin? new coin on coinwarz, 180% Profitability over LTC, Netw. Diff 800+

So, I asking again... Why we not mining this coin? It's 175% Profitability over LTC right now.
PS: Sorry for my English, it's not my native language.

[SirGeekalot]

PW, what's about SpainCoin? new coin on coinwarz, 180% Profitability over LTC, Netw. Diff 800+

So, I asking again... Why we not mining this coin? It's 175% Profitability over LTC right now.
PS: Sorry for my English, it's not my native language.

eh, no its not. its price has plummetted over the last 24 hrs as people have dumped the coins and the difficulty has dropped by 50% as people have stopped mining it and its only on a coiuple of smaller exchanges.

i mined it for about 18 hrs and got very little back.

[MrNight]

eh, no its not. its price has plummetted over the last 24 hrs as people have dumped the coins and the difficulty has dropped by 50% as people have stopped mining it and its only on a coiuple of smaller exchanges.
i mined it for about 18 hrs and got very little back.

Yes, but, is it very important for WP, because we mine and immediately change it on btc on currently exchange rates?
And I think so EarthCoin & Flappycoin not more profitable then Spaincoin, and we can move some part of our hashrate on spaincoin too.
PS: I'm not PR-manager of SpainCoin, I just want more profit for all WP and me too))

[poolwaffle]

eh, no its not. its price has plummetted over the last 24 hrs as people have dumped the coins and the difficulty has dropped by 50% as people have stopped mining it and its only on a coiuple of smaller exchanges.
i mined it for about 18 hrs and got very little back.

Yes, but, is it very important for WP, because we mine and immediately change it on btc on currently exchange rates?
And I think so EarthCoin & Flappycoin not more profitable then Spaincoin, and we can move some part of our hashrate on spaincoin too.
PS: I'm not PR-manager of SpainCoin, I just want more profit for all WP and me too))

Just a matter of not jumping on it quickly enough.  MintPal doesn't have the APIs we need to trade, so everything has to be done manually, which means a huge amount of risk depending on how long we have to hold the coins (and if I have to manually trade, that means holding them for 8hrs while I sleep, etc).  I was also buried in code yesterday getting a new version of the stratum server ready to go, and in that time, that coin lost a bit over half its value.  So there really isn't any reason we couldn't have mined it, just that we didn't.

[nem2k]

Another quick thing, since I'm sure there are people out there scraping our stats page for it (our heaviest page to load of course):

http://wafflepool.com/stats_api
Index is # days ago.  So first index (0) is "today", 1 is yesterday, etc.

is there api access to the pools current profitability anywhere? i.e. BTC/MH/day at the current moment?

[poolwaffle]

Another quick thing, since I'm sure there are people out there scraping our stats page for it (our heaviest page to load of course):

http://wafflepool.com/stats_api
Index is # days ago.  So first index (0) is "today", 1 is yesterday, etc.

is there api access to the pools current profitability anywhere? i.e. BTC/MH/day at the current moment?

That API is giving you exactly what you're asking for...

[zureman90]

Could there be something wrong with the share counting? I'm only submitting 1 or 2 shares per minute with my 670kh, but the website reports a lot more.

Code:

ID	Ended	Shares (yours / total)	Blocks Found
14468	OPEN	12800 / 598881058	23
14467	2014-03-18 11:06:22	39936 / 753357798	4
14466	2014-03-18 10:54:01	27648 / 752247133	28
14465	2014-03-18 10:42:01	39936 / 773460473	0
14464	2014-03-18 10:29:32	39424 / 752870351	7
14463	2014-03-18 10:16:32	39936 / 758936519	10
14462	2014-03-18 10:02:52	43520 / 755157469	8
14461	2014-03-18 09:49:01	44544 / 754043309	13
14460	2014-03-18 09:35:06	56320 / 760331255	2
14459	2014-03-18 09:21:11	37888 / 755024321	10

[poolwaffle]

Alrighty guys.

I spent all of yesterday frantically hacking out a new stratum server.  It looks to be stable, looks to be a TON faster than our existing one, and should allow us to increase profitability overall.

That last part needs some explaining.  And I want to make sure everyone reads this closely and fully understands the reasons behind what is going to change before spewing out the comments that I know will follow.

Our previous (currently running) stratum server had a bit of forgiveness built into the share rejecting algorithm.  This came to be as a way to handle shares that were submitted on the boundary of switching coins.  So when we switched coins, if you submitted a share immediately following a chain switch, we would still accept the share and check against that chain.  This had the unfortunate (but seemingly minimal) effect of allowing shares in split second after seeing a new block on the same coin chain as well.  Didn't seem like a major thing, so it was left (and everyone was happy with the lower reject rates).

While testing the new stratum server, it has become apparent that this may have had a decent bit of effect on our profitability (especially in regards to being able to mine smaller coins).  What this bit of leeway did, was make it so that miners could crank up their intensity on their miners to a point where the miner would be so busy looking for new shares, that it would delay the submitting of found shares by a slight margin ("slight" being undefined here).  However, when a coin switch happened, or when a new block was found, and we sent new work to the miner, the miner would be forced to do a pipeline flush (read "stop working" for a very short bit).  During that time, these jacked up miners would submit the shares they hadn't submitted yet.  We would accept them because they were coming in just after a switch, and we were being forgiving.  However, in most cases (block changes are far more often than coin switches), these shares had a 0% profitability (they were stale).

This became extremely apparent when watching share timings with the new stratum endpoint.  Assuming normal mining, shares should be submitted at a very even rate over time, with slight drops in valid shares immediately following a work restart (new block, coin switch), and a bump in stales during that time.  With the new server (which rejects these stale shares by default), we see a reasonably even amount of shares, and a huge bump (30-40%) of shares submitted immediately following a block change.  On faster coins, these block changes are every few seconds, and that delay makes a huge difference in profitability.

So, while everyone had lower reject rates due to this, miners taking advantage of it were getting more than their fair share of shares, and were dropping our profitability of the whole pool by not submitting shares as soon as they were found, as well as making mining small coins exponentially less profitable.

What does that mean for you?
When the new stratum servers go into production, you will see a bump in rejected shares, however this bump in rejected shares will be across the entire pool.  And in a PPLNS environment, all that matters is your rejected rate compared to everyone else's.  The second part of this is that miners that are currently taking advantage of the pool will either have insane reject rates, or need to configure their miner to actually submit shares on time, causing our overall profitability to go up.

I'm going to bet a lot of the miners doing this don't actually know they're doing it (and neither did I until recently obviously), they've most likely kept pushing their device further and further, and since they never got higher reject rates, everything seemed fine.  If you're one of these miners, when the new servers go live, you'll likely see a decent bump in reject rate (more in line with other pools).  You'll need to re-tune your miner to aim for more accepted shares (rather than just raw number of shares).

This new stratum server is in testing, and will likely be released later today/tomorrow assuming everything goes fine.

Let the hate spewing begin.

[DrunkenDonkey]

So happy about it. I'm always fan of optimal configuration with the minimum possible intensity (currently using xi:4 on 7950s doing 660 for example). Hiding rejected is actually a bad thing, always better to see the real state and optimize for the best, than be blinded about it, switch to the new code already

[CrystalCoin]

insert the long new info here
Just trying to lower the length of the page!

Great to hear! So I'm getting a little mixed up I think, so if you're getting some rejects now you'll get more with the new server and you'll have to retune. But if you're already gettingn a very low amount, I think I'm getting maybe .3% of 24+ hours, would I need to do much tuning with the new server? Or would I be set to go.
Thanks! Your pools been great, its getting hard to follow what coin is most profitable when you're busy with school and a girlfriend!

[cebb]

Any one having any regrets for not mining at dedicated litecoin pool? Litecoin is rising fast on huobi news.