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Author Topic: Scientific proof that God exists?  (Read 804250 times)
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September 25, 2017, 03:48:59 PM
 #8301

God is incomprehensible, even there were materialistic signs,they would not define the whole picture,dont you think
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September 25, 2017, 03:58:09 PM
 #8302

God is incomprehensible, even there were materialistic signs,they would not define the whole picture,dont you think

Absolutely true. But we can still understand that God exists. There are many things right in the universe that we know exist, but don't understand. How much less will we ever understand God, Who was able to make all these universe things?

Cool
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September 25, 2017, 04:27:18 PM
 #8303

Absolutely true. But we can still understand that God exists. There are many things right in the universe that we know exist, but don't understand. How much less will we ever understand God, Who was able to make all these universe things?

If you can't understand your own fairy tale, how do you expect others to?  :/

I'm into creating universes, smiting people, writing holy books and listening to Prayer Messages (PMs).
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September 25, 2017, 04:56:00 PM
 #8304

God is incomprehensible, even there were materialistic signs,they would not define the whole picture,dont you think

Absolutely true. But we can still understand that God exists. There are many things right in the universe that we know exist, but don't understand. How much less will we ever understand God, Who was able to make all these universe things?

Cool

you are approaching this with the assumption that a god even exists. If you were intellectually honest and revisited everything without that bias, you would see that a god is 100% unnecessary
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September 25, 2017, 05:11:19 PM
 #8305

phreeksta showed us at https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=737322.msg22166759#msg22166759 that outer space exists. What wasn't shown was what outer space is. What is outer space?

Outer space is nothingness. It is emptiness. It is nothing.

Inside of nothing exists a whole bunch of materials and energies. We analyze these materials and energies, and how they react with each other. But we haven't found a way to analyze the "substance" that is nothing.

The only real thing we know about nothing is that it exists. Again, how do we know this? Because we can analyze the various materials and energies within nothing.

Same thing with God. We can analyze the fundamental science laws of cause and effect, entropy, and complexity. The only way these things can exist combined is that a Great, Intelligent, Power caused them to exist.

We have no other explanation for the combined existence of these 3 basic, fundamental, scientific laws. The word "God" fits the Great, Intelligent, Power that cause the universe to exist.

We can't see God, just like we can't see emptiness/nothing. But we understand that God exists in ways similar to understanding that nothing exists.

So you see, outer space - which is emptiness/nothing/lack of every "thing" - is the non-thing that helps to confirm that God exists.

Cool

I don't think you understand what nothing is. Empty space is not nothing, it's empty space. Space is something. If you have a box and you throw out everything inside of it, even air and particles and atoms, there is still something inside the box, space.

''The only way these things can exist combined is that a Great, Intelligent, Power caused them to exist.'' How do you know the only way for those things to exist is that a great intelligent power caused them to exist? ''We have no other explanation for the combined existence of these 3 basic'' You have no explanation either, you are just saying it's god


Dig around in your evacuated box, and what do you find? Nothing? No, you find your digger. Remove your digger, and there is nothing in the box. It's empty space.

We have intelligence. Entropy shows that there was greater intelligence in the past. Cause and effect show that the intelligence was great enough to be way beyond the understanding of man's intelligence. How much closer do you want to go to demonstrate God?

Do you need to look at the fantastic machines of nature that we are only beginning to duplicate, and imperfectly I might add? How about looking at the language of mathematics that man develops to imperfectly explain the complexity of the universe to himself?

Find a place where this all comes from randomness. We haven't found pure random. It doesn't exist, except, perhaps, in God.

"God" is a word. But the identity of the Being behind the word is way beyond the word "God." So, yes, I am just saying it is God, because there is no way to explain how intelligent and powerful He is. He is beyond understanding, and the word "God" is simply man's imperfect word to describe Him a little.

Cool

No, stop talking about entropy, you don't understand what it is or how it works at least regarding the earth. It is important to note that the earth is not an isolated system: it receives energy from the sun, and radiates energy back into space. The second law doesn't claim that the entropy of any part of a system increases: if it did, ice would never form and vapor would never condense, since both of those processes involve a decrease of entropy. Rather, the second law says that the total entropy of the whole system must increase. Any decrease of entropy (like the water freezing into ice cubes in your freezer) must be compensated by an increase in entropy elsewhere (the heat released into your kitchen by the refrigerator).
Entropy doesn't show that there was greater intelligence in the past, are you really saying humans were more intelligent in the past? You surely aren't, right?




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September 25, 2017, 08:31:02 PM
 #8306

phreeksta showed us at https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=737322.msg22166759#msg22166759 that outer space exists. What wasn't shown was what outer space is. What is outer space?

Outer space is nothingness. It is emptiness. It is nothing.

Inside of nothing exists a whole bunch of materials and energies. We analyze these materials and energies, and how they react with each other. But we haven't found a way to analyze the "substance" that is nothing.

The only real thing we know about nothing is that it exists. Again, how do we know this? Because we can analyze the various materials and energies within nothing.

Same thing with God. We can analyze the fundamental science laws of cause and effect, entropy, and complexity. The only way these things can exist combined is that a Great, Intelligent, Power caused them to exist.

We have no other explanation for the combined existence of these 3 basic, fundamental, scientific laws. The word "God" fits the Great, Intelligent, Power that cause the universe to exist.

We can't see God, just like we can't see emptiness/nothing. But we understand that God exists in ways similar to understanding that nothing exists.

So you see, outer space - which is emptiness/nothing/lack of every "thing" - is the non-thing that helps to confirm that God exists.

Cool

I don't think you understand what nothing is. Empty space is not nothing, it's empty space. Space is something. If you have a box and you throw out everything inside of it, even air and particles and atoms, there is still something inside the box, space.

''The only way these things can exist combined is that a Great, Intelligent, Power caused them to exist.'' How do you know the only way for those things to exist is that a great intelligent power caused them to exist? ''We have no other explanation for the combined existence of these 3 basic'' You have no explanation either, you are just saying it's god


Dig around in your evacuated box, and what do you find? Nothing? No, you find your digger. Remove your digger, and there is nothing in the box. It's empty space.

We have intelligence. Entropy shows that there was greater intelligence in the past. Cause and effect show that the intelligence was great enough to be way beyond the understanding of man's intelligence. How much closer do you want to go to demonstrate God?

Do you need to look at the fantastic machines of nature that we are only beginning to duplicate, and imperfectly I might add? How about looking at the language of mathematics that man develops to imperfectly explain the complexity of the universe to himself?

Find a place where this all comes from randomness. We haven't found pure random. It doesn't exist, except, perhaps, in God.

"God" is a word. But the identity of the Being behind the word is way beyond the word "God." So, yes, I am just saying it is God, because there is no way to explain how intelligent and powerful He is. He is beyond understanding, and the word "God" is simply man's imperfect word to describe Him a little.

Cool

No, stop talking about entropy, you don't understand what it is or how it works at least regarding the earth. It is important to note that the earth is not an isolated system: it receives energy from the sun, and radiates energy back into space. The second law doesn't claim that the entropy of any part of a system increases: if it did, ice would never form and vapor would never condense, since both of those processes involve a decrease of entropy. Rather, the second law says that the total entropy of the whole system must increase. Any decrease of entropy (like the water freezing into ice cubes in your freezer) must be compensated by an increase in entropy elsewhere (the heat released into your kitchen by the refrigerator).
Entropy doesn't show that there was greater intelligence in the past, are you really saying humans were more intelligent in the past? You surely aren't, right?



That is exactly what he is saying.  That is part of his 'God delusion'.
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September 25, 2017, 09:31:22 PM
 #8307

God is incomprehensible, even there were materialistic signs,they would not define the whole picture,dont you think

Absolutely true. But we can still understand that God exists. There are many things right in the universe that we know exist, but don't understand. How much less will we ever understand God, Who was able to make all these universe things?


you are approaching this with the assumption that a god even exists. If you were intellectually honest and revisited everything without that bias, you would see that a god is 100% unnecessary

God is concept of inconceivability. If we can conceive it, then it is not God as assumption. Religion is just pretending that almighty god is an assumption, while secular god is presuming own exemption. Science has no problem because needs not to prove that God exists. This because the definition of the word "God" is: "God is anything that is missing!". We will always miss the answer who and what stays before start of universe expansion. Thus the God will always exist as a missing answer!
If we answer it, well, then the god will not exist anymore!

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September 26, 2017, 09:36:51 AM
 #8308

But I disagree about the idea of life that come out of nothing.

So think about where your god came from.  Nothing?

That is one of many question I have in my mind. Grin
If God exist, why evil exist ?
If God created us all, who or what created God ?
God is limitless, my mind is limited. Grin
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September 26, 2017, 10:48:31 AM
 #8309

I dont thnk that god exists. There is no proof!

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September 26, 2017, 05:26:42 PM
 #8310

God is incomprehensible, even there were materialistic signs,they would not define the whole picture,dont you think

Absolutely true. But we can still understand that God exists. There are many things right in the universe that we know exist, but don't understand. How much less will we ever understand God, Who was able to make all these universe things?


you are approaching this with the assumption that a god even exists. If you were intellectually honest and revisited everything without that bias, you would see that a god is 100% unnecessary

God is concept of inconceivability. If we can conceive it, then it is not God as assumption. Religion is just pretending that almighty god is an assumption, while secular god is presuming own exemption. Science has no problem because needs not to prove that God exists. This because the definition of the word "God" is: "God is anything that is missing!". We will always miss the answer who and what stays before start of universe expansion. Thus the God will always exist as a missing answer!
If we answer it, well, then the god will not exist anymore!


Hey.... All of your sentences are logically wrong. Are you proud of yourself?

concept of inconceivability? oxymoron? If you conceive something its not an assumption? Oxymoron again. All religions are false in definition, they try to close the God in the box. That kind of behaviour can never end good. You always need a bigger box. Religions are the only reason that people laugh from faith, they do not laugh from God but from the silly box of the pharisee.

Secular god? Oxymoron again. You seem to like them.

You know what is missing here? Your arguments lol.
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September 26, 2017, 05:34:47 PM
 #8311

God is incomprehensible, even there were materialistic signs,they would not define the whole picture,dont you think

Absolutely true. But we can still understand that God exists. There are many things right in the universe that we know exist, but don't understand. How much less will we ever understand God, Who was able to make all these universe things?


you are approaching this with the assumption that a god even exists. If you were intellectually honest and revisited everything without that bias, you would see that a god is 100% unnecessary

God is concept of inconceivability. If we can conceive it, then it is not God as assumption. Religion is just pretending that almighty god is an assumption, while secular god is presuming own exemption. Science has no problem because needs not to prove that God exists. This because the definition of the word "God" is: "God is anything that is missing!". We will always miss the answer who and what stays before start of universe expansion. Thus the God will always exist as a missing answer!
If we answer it, well, then the god will not exist anymore!


Hey.... All of your sentences are logically wrong. Are you proud of yourself?

concept of inconceivability? oxymoron? If you conceive something its not an assumption? Oxymoron again. All religions are false in definition, they try to close the God in the box. That kind of behaviour can never end good. You always need a bigger box. Religions are the only reason that people laugh from faith, they do not laugh from God but from the silly box of the pharisee.

Secular god? Oxymoron again. You seem to like them.

You know what is missing here? Your arguments lol.

Well we are also missing your scientific arguments for the proof of god and badecker seems to be silent again after my response to his bullshit, no surprise there.



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September 26, 2017, 05:46:35 PM
 #8312

There is no evidence and no counterevidence, so it is up to everybody what to believe
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September 26, 2017, 10:00:08 PM
 #8313

There is no evidence and no counterevidence, so it is up to everybody what to believe

That would be fine, except for the idiots like Badecker who try to push their fairy tale on others.  :/

I'm into creating universes, smiting people, writing holy books and listening to Prayer Messages (PMs).
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September 27, 2017, 01:33:12 AM
 #8314

God is incomprehensible, even there were materialistic signs,they would not define the whole picture,dont you think

That is absolutely correct. It is also correct for a human, at least from the viewpoint of another human.

In a simple way we feel the wind. We know that it is moving air. But without chemical analysis, we don't know that the air is made up of carbon, nitrogen and oxygen. So, we can't know what God is, except if He reveals Himself to us.

In nature, God has revealed Himself scientifically through cause and effect, entropy, and complexity, combined. In a simple way he has revealed Himself by the fact that nature exists. We have no other answer for how nature can exist except through a God-like Being.

God has been gracious enough to us that He has given us the Bible to reveal a great amount of information about Himself and why He made the universe to us. The simple answer is for His glory. The more complex answer is that we glorify Him even more when we see the complexity and love He shows us, through the body that He has given us, and the support of our life that He handles all day long. A far greater answer is that we glorify Him a lot more when we see the great salvation - Jesus salvation - He is providing for us even after we rejected Him and corrupted His universe.

If we don't praise and glorify Him, He doesn't really have any use for us. Since we reject Him and His purpose for making us if we don't glorify Him, He will ultimately reject us... even though He waits patiently a long time for us to change.

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September 27, 2017, 01:43:31 AM
 #8315

God is incomprehensible, even there were materialistic signs,they would not define the whole picture,dont you think

Absolutely true. But we can still understand that God exists. There are many things right in the universe that we know exist, but don't understand. How much less will we ever understand God, Who was able to make all these universe things?

Cool

you are approaching this with the assumption that a god even exists. If you were intellectually honest and revisited everything without that bias, you would see that a god is 100% unnecessary


A scientist doesn't simply approach something from a single point of view. He asks his questions with the expectation that the answer could be anything.

If a dog has babies, they are dogs. If a duck has babies, they are ducks. If people have babies, they are people. Like begets like.

Where does intelligence and emotion come from? What is the start of everything. What caused it all to happen. Whatever the cause was, it had all these things within itself. Like begets like. We see nothing else in the universe.

Big bang as a theory doesn't have any explanation for how intelligence and emotion could emerge. All it says is that it did. If big bang happens to be real, even though we don't really have any proof that it is, then big bang is God. Why? Because the definition of God fits everything that big bang suggests, and a whole lot more.

Do you have any other answer to where things came from that is better than God?

Cool
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September 27, 2017, 01:53:12 AM
 #8316

phreeksta showed us at https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=737322.msg22166759#msg22166759 that outer space exists. What wasn't shown was what outer space is. What is outer space?

Outer space is nothingness. It is emptiness. It is nothing.

Inside of nothing exists a whole bunch of materials and energies. We analyze these materials and energies, and how they react with each other. But we haven't found a way to analyze the "substance" that is nothing.

The only real thing we know about nothing is that it exists. Again, how do we know this? Because we can analyze the various materials and energies within nothing.

Same thing with God. We can analyze the fundamental science laws of cause and effect, entropy, and complexity. The only way these things can exist combined is that a Great, Intelligent, Power caused them to exist.

We have no other explanation for the combined existence of these 3 basic, fundamental, scientific laws. The word "God" fits the Great, Intelligent, Power that cause the universe to exist.

We can't see God, just like we can't see emptiness/nothing. But we understand that God exists in ways similar to understanding that nothing exists.

So you see, outer space - which is emptiness/nothing/lack of every "thing" - is the non-thing that helps to confirm that God exists.

Cool

I don't think you understand what nothing is. Empty space is not nothing, it's empty space. Space is something. If you have a box and you throw out everything inside of it, even air and particles and atoms, there is still something inside the box, space.

''The only way these things can exist combined is that a Great, Intelligent, Power caused them to exist.'' How do you know the only way for those things to exist is that a great intelligent power caused them to exist? ''We have no other explanation for the combined existence of these 3 basic'' You have no explanation either, you are just saying it's god


Dig around in your evacuated box, and what do you find? Nothing? No, you find your digger. Remove your digger, and there is nothing in the box. It's empty space.

We have intelligence. Entropy shows that there was greater intelligence in the past. Cause and effect show that the intelligence was great enough to be way beyond the understanding of man's intelligence. How much closer do you want to go to demonstrate God?

Do you need to look at the fantastic machines of nature that we are only beginning to duplicate, and imperfectly I might add? How about looking at the language of mathematics that man develops to imperfectly explain the complexity of the universe to himself?

Find a place where this all comes from randomness. We haven't found pure random. It doesn't exist, except, perhaps, in God.

"God" is a word. But the identity of the Being behind the word is way beyond the word "God." So, yes, I am just saying it is God, because there is no way to explain how intelligent and powerful He is. He is beyond understanding, and the word "God" is simply man's imperfect word to describe Him a little.

Cool

No, stop talking about entropy, you don't understand what it is or how it works at least regarding the earth. It is important to note that the earth is not an isolated system: it receives energy from the sun, and radiates energy back into space. The second law doesn't claim that the entropy of any part of a system increases: if it did, ice would never form and vapor would never condense, since both of those processes involve a decrease of entropy. Rather, the second law says that the total entropy of the whole system must increase. Any decrease of entropy (like the water freezing into ice cubes in your freezer) must be compensated by an increase in entropy elsewhere (the heat released into your kitchen by the refrigerator).
Entropy doesn't show that there was greater intelligence in the past, are you really saying humans were more intelligent in the past? You surely aren't, right?


Hey, thanks for giving me orders to stop talking about entropy. LOL!

The universe is a system.

Entropy absolutely DOES show that there was greater intelligence in the past. Only in these times of science have we attempted to reject the idea of God. Yet we can go through nature and view the cause and effect, and the complexity... all of which shout "God." This shows that our intelligence is decreasing, and science is becoming a god in God's place... but only in our atrophied minds.

Entropy is one of your best friends! LOL.

Cool
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September 27, 2017, 01:55:41 AM
 #8317

phreeksta showed us at https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=737322.msg22166759#msg22166759 that outer space exists. What wasn't shown was what outer space is. What is outer space?

Outer space is nothingness. It is emptiness. It is nothing.

Inside of nothing exists a whole bunch of materials and energies. We analyze these materials and energies, and how they react with each other. But we haven't found a way to analyze the "substance" that is nothing.

The only real thing we know about nothing is that it exists. Again, how do we know this? Because we can analyze the various materials and energies within nothing.

Same thing with God. We can analyze the fundamental science laws of cause and effect, entropy, and complexity. The only way these things can exist combined is that a Great, Intelligent, Power caused them to exist.

We have no other explanation for the combined existence of these 3 basic, fundamental, scientific laws. The word "God" fits the Great, Intelligent, Power that cause the universe to exist.

We can't see God, just like we can't see emptiness/nothing. But we understand that God exists in ways similar to understanding that nothing exists.

So you see, outer space - which is emptiness/nothing/lack of every "thing" - is the non-thing that helps to confirm that God exists.

Cool

I don't think you understand what nothing is. Empty space is not nothing, it's empty space. Space is something. If you have a box and you throw out everything inside of it, even air and particles and atoms, there is still something inside the box, space.

''The only way these things can exist combined is that a Great, Intelligent, Power caused them to exist.'' How do you know the only way for those things to exist is that a great intelligent power caused them to exist? ''We have no other explanation for the combined existence of these 3 basic'' You have no explanation either, you are just saying it's god


Dig around in your evacuated box, and what do you find? Nothing? No, you find your digger. Remove your digger, and there is nothing in the box. It's empty space.

We have intelligence. Entropy shows that there was greater intelligence in the past. Cause and effect show that the intelligence was great enough to be way beyond the understanding of man's intelligence. How much closer do you want to go to demonstrate God?

Do you need to look at the fantastic machines of nature that we are only beginning to duplicate, and imperfectly I might add? How about looking at the language of mathematics that man develops to imperfectly explain the complexity of the universe to himself?

Find a place where this all comes from randomness. We haven't found pure random. It doesn't exist, except, perhaps, in God.

"God" is a word. But the identity of the Being behind the word is way beyond the word "God." So, yes, I am just saying it is God, because there is no way to explain how intelligent and powerful He is. He is beyond understanding, and the word "God" is simply man's imperfect word to describe Him a little.

Cool

No, stop talking about entropy, you don't understand what it is or how it works at least regarding the earth. It is important to note that the earth is not an isolated system: it receives energy from the sun, and radiates energy back into space. The second law doesn't claim that the entropy of any part of a system increases: if it did, ice would never form and vapor would never condense, since both of those processes involve a decrease of entropy. Rather, the second law says that the total entropy of the whole system must increase. Any decrease of entropy (like the water freezing into ice cubes in your freezer) must be compensated by an increase in entropy elsewhere (the heat released into your kitchen by the refrigerator).
Entropy doesn't show that there was greater intelligence in the past, are you really saying humans were more intelligent in the past? You surely aren't, right?



That is exactly what he is saying.  That is part of his 'God delusion'.

At least Astargath attempts to show how God science is wrong from a scientific standpoint. You barely understand anything.

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BADecker
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September 27, 2017, 01:59:53 AM
 #8318

God is incomprehensible, even there were materialistic signs,they would not define the whole picture,dont you think

Absolutely true. But we can still understand that God exists. There are many things right in the universe that we know exist, but don't understand. How much less will we ever understand God, Who was able to make all these universe things?


you are approaching this with the assumption that a god even exists. If you were intellectually honest and revisited everything without that bias, you would see that a god is 100% unnecessary

God is concept of inconceivability. If we can conceive it, then it is not God as assumption. Religion is just pretending that almighty god is an assumption, while secular god is presuming own exemption. Science has no problem because needs not to prove that God exists. This because the definition of the word "God" is: "God is anything that is missing!". We will always miss the answer who and what stays before start of universe expansion. Thus the God will always exist as a missing answer!
If we answer it, well, then the god will not exist anymore!


God will be the missing answer from a scientific standpoint, at least until science becomes countless times more capable than it is today. That's why revelation from God is necessary.

We can't understand God. But He understands us completely, because He made us. So, He is able to reveal Himself to us. He has done this in the Bible.

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September 27, 2017, 02:01:51 AM
 #8319

I dont thnk that god exists. There is no proof!

Scientific proof for the existence of God:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=737322.msg10718395#msg10718395
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1355109.msg14047133#msg14047133
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1662153.40
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1054513.msg16803380#msg16803380.

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September 27, 2017, 02:05:21 AM
 #8320

God is incomprehensible, even there were materialistic signs,they would not define the whole picture,dont you think

Absolutely true. But we can still understand that God exists. There are many things right in the universe that we know exist, but don't understand. How much less will we ever understand God, Who was able to make all these universe things?


you are approaching this with the assumption that a god even exists. If you were intellectually honest and revisited everything without that bias, you would see that a god is 100% unnecessary

God is concept of inconceivability. If we can conceive it, then it is not God as assumption. Religion is just pretending that almighty god is an assumption, while secular god is presuming own exemption. Science has no problem because needs not to prove that God exists. This because the definition of the word "God" is: "God is anything that is missing!". We will always miss the answer who and what stays before start of universe expansion. Thus the God will always exist as a missing answer!
If we answer it, well, then the god will not exist anymore!


Hey.... All of your sentences are logically wrong. Are you proud of yourself?

concept of inconceivability? oxymoron? If you conceive something its not an assumption? Oxymoron again. All religions are false in definition, they try to close the God in the box. That kind of behaviour can never end good. You always need a bigger box. Religions are the only reason that people laugh from faith, they do not laugh from God but from the silly box of the pharisee.

Secular god? Oxymoron again. You seem to like them.

You know what is missing here? Your arguments lol.

Well we are also missing your scientific arguments for the proof of god and badecker seems to be silent again after my response to his bullshit, no surprise there.

Since God reveals Himself to all of us through science and simple observation of the universe and nature, but you constantly would rather resist God than accept the proof, there comes a time when it is beneficial to let you go on in your way, and die in your self-induced ignorance.

Cool
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