Scientific proof that God exists?

[Przemax]

Watch this movie:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gCqMMWEdVg

God is defined in the Bible as governing the physical forces, that a simple shephards could not know to exist.

Nuclear force as in 1:1 genesis

Gravity force as in 7:4 genesis

Act 17:28 Electro magnetism force

Deu 6:4 Unified field.

I would say those sheephard were advanced, we do not give them enough credits.

[NOVAN ADI PUTRA]

I believe there is a god, the evidence of the earth and the universe

[Astargath]

I guess you ran out of retarded arguments to defend the evil god that you worship which is also non existent

Yes we ran out of arguments that evil God exist. I fully agree with you - Evil God does not exist.

Your BoogeyGod that:

- enjoy torture
- abuse children
- want to kill for silly reasons
- want women to be raped
- want people to be slaves

DOES NOT EXIST. So... There could be only Good God.

I know people that had been proven wrong with their thinking are creating a straw man arguments. Your straw God is completly and utterly false.

For example - slaves. Definition of slave in hebrew is not what we picture we abolished. We picture slave as a commodity that could be killed and tortured. We picture slaves that are forever, and that they are innocent.

The worst that could happen to a Hebrew was being an industred servant as we could define now. Volontary servitude of a guy with no obligation we would call now a serving in military, or servitude for God, or even a job contract.

If someone wanted, they could become a lackey (volontarily) - they would be lackey and serve home for life. Exactly how it was after the abolishion of slavery.

I could go on forever... but whats the point. You guys clearly want to believe your straw God. So be it.

Btw as for a someone that does not believe, you are a strong believer. You believe that something that does not exist, you believe is evil, and therefor you believe you are an upgraded monkey, because everything was proven to upgraede itself as a believe in progress. You have 4 times more the ammount of believes than I do.

P.S BTW yeah its a progress. We have agreed on 2 things already. That should be celebrated somehow. I hope you will cease to hate your straw man that is evil deranged mentally ill moron that you think is me. Being hateful makes you die faster on hearth diseases.

A god that uses eternal torture, kills everyone because they don't believe in him, accepts slavery, says being gay is a sin because he says so, no other real reason is not a good god. Is an evil and stupid god because the people who wrote the bible were also stupid so they couldn't make god look like a god. I would write a better bible than them.

However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you.  You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land.  You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance.  You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way. (Leviticus 25:44-46

Clearly doesn't support slavery, right?


When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are.  If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again.  But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her.  And if the slave girl’s owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter.  If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife.  If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21:7-11

BUT HEY THE BIBLE IS NOT JUST AN EVIL STUPID BOOK, RIGHT?

Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, 21 but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property.

but hey if they recover, nothing happens since is their property hehe.

However: An owner who hits a male or female slave in the eye and destroys it must let the slave go free to compensate for the eye. 27 And an owner who knocks out the tooth of a male or female slave must let the slave go free to compensate for the tooth.

Makes total sense so far

Also : “Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.

You can beat your slaves if they don't die but don't you dare cursing your mother because you will be put to death. Seriously, are you this delusional?

[bailey01]

I am not against your theory. And I dont believe in any religion, as I read many of the Holy books.
But I have some research also. When there was nothing is the universe .. not a single particle just the darkness .. these was a sound. All the things are produced by it. If you name any god just go back to that age when there was not a single planet . What was there ? God may be as we say. But with no shape or color or a material. But something happened and all the production cycle started. Try to think about it. Its something practically sound.

A sound exists today also within all of us. Can be heard in a deep silence. also under water.. everywhere . Its in every living thing .. inside us .. Can be named as god.

And yes he exists. As per my practical observation, anyone can experience it

[kingsleytailors]

i agree with all post

_______________
Famous Tailor in Hong Kong Digital SLR Camera Lens UK Send Money to Foreign

[mmfiore]

First Santa Klaus, after, God !

[Przemax]

I guess you ran out of retarded arguments to defend the evil god that you worship which is also non existent

Yes we ran out of arguments that evil God exist. I fully agree with you - Evil God does not exist.

Your BoogeyGod that:

- enjoy torture
- abuse children
- want to kill for silly reasons
- want women to be raped
- want people to be slaves

DOES NOT EXIST. So... There could be only Good God.

I know people that had been proven wrong with their thinking are creating a straw man arguments. Your straw God is completly and utterly false.

For example - slaves. Definition of slave in hebrew is not what we picture we abolished. We picture slave as a commodity that could be killed and tortured. We picture slaves that are forever, and that they are innocent.

The worst that could happen to a Hebrew was being an industred servant as we could define now. Volontary servitude of a guy with no obligation we would call now a serving in military, or servitude for God, or even a job contract.

If someone wanted, they could become a lackey (volontarily) - they would be lackey and serve home for life. Exactly how it was after the abolishion of slavery.

I could go on forever... but whats the point. You guys clearly want to believe your straw God. So be it.

Btw as for a someone that does not believe, you are a strong believer. You believe that something that does not exist, you believe is evil, and therefor you believe you are an upgraded monkey, because everything was proven to upgraede itself as a believe in progress. You have 4 times more the ammount of believes than I do.

P.S BTW yeah its a progress. We have agreed on 2 things already. That should be celebrated somehow. I hope you will cease to hate your straw man that is evil deranged mentally ill moron that you think is me. Being hateful makes you die faster on hearth diseases.

A god that uses eternal torture, kills everyone because they don't believe in him, accepts slavery, says being gay is a sin because he says so, no other real reason is not a good god. Is an evil and stupid god because the people who wrote the bible were also stupid so they couldn't make god look like a god. I would write a better bible than them.

However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you.  You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land.  You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance.  You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way. (Leviticus 25:44-46

Clearly doesn't support slavery, right?


When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are.  If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again.  But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her.  And if the slave girl’s owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter.  If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife.  If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21:7-11

BUT HEY THE BIBLE IS NOT JUST AN EVIL STUPID BOOK, RIGHT?

Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, 21 but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property.

but hey if they recover, nothing happens since is their property hehe.

However: An owner who hits a male or female slave in the eye and destroys it must let the slave go free to compensate for the eye. 27 And an owner who knocks out the tooth of a male or female slave must let the slave go free to compensate for the tooth.

Makes total sense so far

Also : “Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.

You can beat your slaves if they don't die but don't you dare cursing your mother because you will be put to death. Seriously, are you this delusional?

Read Jesus - he have an answer for all your doubts. If you do not understand yet - read again if again no understanding .... oh well....

Then you cannot understand the laws of the God's protection. Why would God protect the ones that refuse him? If someone is not under his law he could be in the human law. And all the "evil" you portrait is the laws outside of israel at that times. So yeah... why a person should not be treated with human law if he is not agreeing with the God law?

If you do not understand the word protection and distinction between human law and divine protection and allowing foreigners to be treated with human law of that time. What can I say....

I can only say read Jesus again... If you still does not understand..... You can always try again. Jesus was ONLY talking about torah and how to interpret it. Nothing else in his ministry.

If you still don't understand - ask some pastor. If you still are not satisfied - ask another.

If you want to prove your point at all costs - you will not get it, you have too hard neck.

[Astargath]

I guess you ran out of retarded arguments to defend the evil god that you worship which is also non existent

Yes we ran out of arguments that evil God exist. I fully agree with you - Evil God does not exist.

Your BoogeyGod that:

- enjoy torture
- abuse children
- want to kill for silly reasons
- want women to be raped
- want people to be slaves

DOES NOT EXIST. So... There could be only Good God.

I know people that had been proven wrong with their thinking are creating a straw man arguments. Your straw God is completly and utterly false.

For example - slaves. Definition of slave in hebrew is not what we picture we abolished. We picture slave as a commodity that could be killed and tortured. We picture slaves that are forever, and that they are innocent.

The worst that could happen to a Hebrew was being an industred servant as we could define now. Volontary servitude of a guy with no obligation we would call now a serving in military, or servitude for God, or even a job contract.

If someone wanted, they could become a lackey (volontarily) - they would be lackey and serve home for life. Exactly how it was after the abolishion of slavery.

I could go on forever... but whats the point. You guys clearly want to believe your straw God. So be it.

Btw as for a someone that does not believe, you are a strong believer. You believe that something that does not exist, you believe is evil, and therefor you believe you are an upgraded monkey, because everything was proven to upgraede itself as a believe in progress. You have 4 times more the ammount of believes than I do.

P.S BTW yeah its a progress. We have agreed on 2 things already. That should be celebrated somehow. I hope you will cease to hate your straw man that is evil deranged mentally ill moron that you think is me. Being hateful makes you die faster on hearth diseases.

A god that uses eternal torture, kills everyone because they don't believe in him, accepts slavery, says being gay is a sin because he says so, no other real reason is not a good god. Is an evil and stupid god because the people who wrote the bible were also stupid so they couldn't make god look like a god. I would write a better bible than them.

However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you.  You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land.  You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance.  You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way. (Leviticus 25:44-46

Clearly doesn't support slavery, right?


When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are.  If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again.  But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her.  And if the slave girl’s owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter.  If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife.  If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21:7-11

BUT HEY THE BIBLE IS NOT JUST AN EVIL STUPID BOOK, RIGHT?

Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, 21 but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property.

but hey if they recover, nothing happens since is their property hehe.

However: An owner who hits a male or female slave in the eye and destroys it must let the slave go free to compensate for the eye. 27 And an owner who knocks out the tooth of a male or female slave must let the slave go free to compensate for the tooth.

Makes total sense so far

Also : “Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.

You can beat your slaves if they don't die but don't you dare cursing your mother because you will be put to death. Seriously, are you this delusional?

Read Jesus - he have an answer for all your doubts. If you do not understand yet - read again if again no understanding .... oh well....

Then you cannot understand the laws of the God's protection. Why would God protect the ones that refuse him? If someone is not under his law he could be in the human law. And all the "evil" you portrait is the laws outside of israel at that times. So yeah... why a person should not be treated with human law if he is not agreeing with the God law?

If you do not understand the word protection and distinction between human law and divine protection and allowing foreigners to be treated with human law of that time. What can I say....

I can only say read Jesus again... If you still does not understand..... You can always try again. Jesus was ONLY talking about torah and how to interpret it. Nothing else in his ministry.

If you still don't understand - ask some pastor. If you still are not satisfied - ask another.

If you want to prove your point at all costs - you will not get it, you have too hard neck.

Yeah I thought so, I understand it perfectly mate. Why would god allow such barbaric and retarded rules? Even if all of them didn't accept god it still makes no sense that he would set such retarded rules which are not just evil but retarded as well. You have no argument here, you are just rambling with your ''read jesus'' I have read the bible plenty of times, it's full of shit as indicated above, you are delusional.

Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, 21 but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property.

When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are.  If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again.  But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her

You can sell your daughter as a slave, god thinks is fine. You also seem to think is fine because you are delusional.

If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father.  Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her.

What kind of lunatic would make a rape victim marry her attacker?  Answer: God.

And be aware that the woman didn't do anything wrong, she may even be a believer but it doesn't matter.

God is perfectly just, and yet he sentences the imperfect humans he created to infinite suffering in hell for finite sins. Clearly, a limited offense does not warrant unlimited punishment. God’s sentencing of the imperfect humans to an eternity in hell for a mere mortal lifetime of sin is infinitely more unjust than this punishment. The absurd injustice of this infinite punishment is even greater when we consider that the ultimate source of human imperfection is the God who created them.

And what is the point of eternal torture anyways, what is accomplished?

Jesus is quoted many times in the Bible saying that a believer can ask for anything through prayer and receive it.  He even goes so far as to say that mountains and trees can be thrown into the sea simply by praying for it.  This is clearly a lie, and can be proven to be a lie by any believer.  Simply pray for me to be converted to Christianity right away.  Or better yet ask God to move the mountains behind my house.

[ahtremblay]

I dont believe in this. if he really exits why he make me like this

[Przemax]

I guess you ran out of retarded arguments to defend the evil god that you worship which is also non existent

Yes we ran out of arguments that evil God exist. I fully agree with you - Evil God does not exist.

Your BoogeyGod that:

- enjoy torture
- abuse children
- want to kill for silly reasons
- want women to be raped
- want people to be slaves

DOES NOT EXIST. So... There could be only Good God.

I know people that had been proven wrong with their thinking are creating a straw man arguments. Your straw God is completly and utterly false.

For example - slaves. Definition of slave in hebrew is not what we picture we abolished. We picture slave as a commodity that could be killed and tortured. We picture slaves that are forever, and that they are innocent.

The worst that could happen to a Hebrew was being an industred servant as we could define now. Volontary servitude of a guy with no obligation we would call now a serving in military, or servitude for God, or even a job contract.

If someone wanted, they could become a lackey (volontarily) - they would be lackey and serve home for life. Exactly how it was after the abolishion of slavery.

I could go on forever... but whats the point. You guys clearly want to believe your straw God. So be it.

Btw as for a someone that does not believe, you are a strong believer. You believe that something that does not exist, you believe is evil, and therefor you believe you are an upgraded monkey, because everything was proven to upgraede itself as a believe in progress. You have 4 times more the ammount of believes than I do.

P.S BTW yeah its a progress. We have agreed on 2 things already. That should be celebrated somehow. I hope you will cease to hate your straw man that is evil deranged mentally ill moron that you think is me. Being hateful makes you die faster on hearth diseases.

A god that uses eternal torture, kills everyone because they don't believe in him, accepts slavery, says being gay is a sin because he says so, no other real reason is not a good god. Is an evil and stupid god because the people who wrote the bible were also stupid so they couldn't make god look like a god. I would write a better bible than them.

However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you.  You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land.  You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance.  You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way. (Leviticus 25:44-46

Clearly doesn't support slavery, right?


When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are.  If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again.  But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her.  And if the slave girl’s owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter.  If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife.  If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21:7-11

BUT HEY THE BIBLE IS NOT JUST AN EVIL STUPID BOOK, RIGHT?

Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, 21 but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property.

but hey if they recover, nothing happens since is their property hehe.

However: An owner who hits a male or female slave in the eye and destroys it must let the slave go free to compensate for the eye. 27 And an owner who knocks out the tooth of a male or female slave must let the slave go free to compensate for the tooth.

Makes total sense so far

Also : “Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.

You can beat your slaves if they don't die but don't you dare cursing your mother because you will be put to death. Seriously, are you this delusional?

Read Jesus - he have an answer for all your doubts. If you do not understand yet - read again if again no understanding .... oh well....

Then you cannot understand the laws of the God's protection. Why would God protect the ones that refuse him? If someone is not under his law he could be in the human law. And all the "evil" you portrait is the laws outside of israel at that times. So yeah... why a person should not be treated with human law if he is not agreeing with the God law?

If you do not understand the word protection and distinction between human law and divine protection and allowing foreigners to be treated with human law of that time. What can I say....

I can only say read Jesus again... If you still does not understand..... You can always try again. Jesus was ONLY talking about torah and how to interpret it. Nothing else in his ministry.

If you still don't understand - ask some pastor. If you still are not satisfied - ask another.

If you want to prove your point at all costs - you will not get it, you have too hard neck.

Yeah I thought so, I understand it perfectly mate. Why would god allow such barbaric and retarded rules? Even if all of them didn't accept god it still makes no sense that he would set such retarded rules which are not just evil but retarded as well. You have no argument here, you are just rambling with your ''read jesus'' I have read the bible plenty of times, it's full of shit as indicated above, you are delusional.

Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, 21 but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property.

When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are.  If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again.  But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her

You can sell your daughter as a slave, god thinks is fine. You also seem to think is fine because you are delusional.

If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father.  Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her.

What kind of lunatic would make a rape victim marry her attacker?  Answer: God.

And be aware that the woman didn't do anything wrong, she may even be a believer but it doesn't matter.

God is perfectly just, and yet he sentences the imperfect humans he created to infinite suffering in hell for finite sins. Clearly, a limited offense does not warrant unlimited punishment. God’s sentencing of the imperfect humans to an eternity in hell for a mere mortal lifetime of sin is infinitely more unjust than this punishment. The absurd injustice of this infinite punishment is even greater when we consider that the ultimate source of human imperfection is the God who created them.

And what is the point of eternal torture anyways, what is accomplished?

Jesus is quoted many times in the Bible saying that a believer can ask for anything through prayer and receive it.  He even goes so far as to say that mountains and trees can be thrown into the sea simply by praying for it.  This is clearly a lie, and can be proven to be a lie by any believer.  Simply pray for me to be converted to Christianity right away.  Or better yet ask God to move the mountains behind my house.

I have a question - do you want to understand or you just going to nitpick. If you want to understand I can try to make you understand.

Btw with this rape its a very bad translation. It is not even near of this in the original. If one would be cought raping a woman he will have to leave the Izraelites or die.

You have your own idea and you will not give it up. Why should I waste time on you? Those whole issues are answered everywhere in the Bible. Taking those things into account without the possibility of bad translation is just wrong.

Everything bad or evil is more or less the result of free will. I could explain that to you - but you would not want to understand. You just want to accuse. So be it.

[BADecker]

I dont believe in this. if he really exits why he make me like this

To show you that you make yourself worse by willingly not believing in Him.

[BADecker]

Cute response that has nothing to do with what I said. I guess you ran out of retarded arguments to defend the evil god that you worship which is also non existent

BADecker and Przemax will not engage seriously with any argument, their opinions about the honesty and truth of the Bible are not subject to change, but the wise know that you should never believe in anything "too much".
Astargath, your opinions about the parapsychology research I presented are also not subject to change, so you are not a true skeptic either

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=737322.msg21071285#msg21071285

How many copies of the Phoenix Journals are there? If we didn't have the printing press, and copy and paste in the computer, there would be only one copy... the original. Why? Because nobody would ever re-copy that crap by hand.

The Bible has strength. There are some 25,000 copies of the Old Testament that were done by hand before the printing press was invented. The Bible has power.

[Przemax]

You also seem to think is fine because you are delusional.

Speaking about delusion. Oh the irony... A book God delusion by R. Dawkins is deluded 160 times. That makes one lie every 2 page

http://christthetao.homestead.com/articles/thegoddelusion.pdf



Early atomism/materialism/epicureism/atheism against the monotheistic/spirituality Bible . Science verification monotheism 100% correct. Early epicurean atheism 100% incorrect.

Now atheists will never tell you that the early form of atheism was 100% wrong. They claim that atheism had never existed before the XX century.

Bible stand true after so many years. There is no reason to assume it will change. Even if the earth is not 6k years old but 12k or even 50k. Or any other details. There was no signification of time scale. Its just calculated how much time should pass since the genesis. Those calculations could be done wrong as far as I know. It would not change anything.

[popcorn1]

Moses was a prince of Egypt for the first 40 years of his life. He had access to all kinds of info that we do not have today..

A shame Egypt never had info like this and then maybe they would of built the pyramids in no time..

Simple building. Stonehenge Reloaded by only one white man ...
Video for man moving big boulders by himself▶ 6:12
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-K7q20VzwVs
9 Sep 2007 - Uploaded by giorkos3
What makes this so special is that he does it using only himself, gravity, ..

Badecker stop please because scientist must be laughing so much they are wetting themselves ..

Scientist don't even dispute that evolution is a hoax they know it to be a fact..

We as humans know the earth made us..
We evolved over many many years to become a human and we evolved on this planet ..

No magic sky gods went zap and made a human the earth made us plain and simple..

Now the questions we ask is how did humans evolve on this planet but we know we evolved on this planet and that's why we have evolution theories ..

Now if you teach your children if you have any that a man like being went zap and everything was so then you are so cruel to your children for not giving them the knowledge they so deserve ..

Badecker i am all for you saying something out there looking over us BUT please don't teach your children lies please ..

Teach them science because god wants you to know the truth.. 
Even though no god if your going to pump religion in your children's brains then at least teach them the truth..

Good for jobs you see instead of some dumb ass saying god made everything..

[Przemax]

Moses was a prince of Egypt for the first 40 years of his life. He had access to all kinds of info that we do not have today..

A shame Egypt never had info like this and then maybe they would of built the pyramids in no time..

Simple building. Stonehenge Reloaded by only one white man ...
Video for man moving big boulders by himself▶ 6:12
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-K7q20VzwVs
9 Sep 2007 - Uploaded by giorkos3
What makes this so special is that he does it using only himself, gravity, ..

Badecker stop please because scientist must be laughing so much they are wetting themselves ..

Scientist don't even dispute that evolution is a hoax they know it to be a fact..

We as humans know the earth made us..
We evolved over many many years to become a human and we evolved on this planet ..

No magic sky gods went zap and made a human the earth made us plain and simple..

Now the questions we ask is how did humans evolve on this planet but we know we evolved on this planet and that's why we have evolution theories ..

Now if you teach your children if you have any that a man like being went zap and everything was so then you are so cruel to your children for not giving them the knowledge they so deserve ..

Badecker i am all for you saying something out there looking over us BUT please don't teach your children lies please ..

Teach them science because god wants you to know the truth..  
Even though no god if your going to pump religion in your children's brains then at least teach them the truth..

Good for jobs you see instead of some dumb ass saying god made everything..

Bible still hold true that animals and humans are giving offspring with their kinds after the creation. Do not say lies that some mytical sanhendryn of the elders are overvoted that evolution is science. Science does not work like that.

There are not a single shred of evidence that there was any new kind after the creation. NONE, ZILCH, NADA. There are just microevolved and adapted old kinds after the creation. Yes there are some evidences of that. That could easily be within the existing genome of species. They are not so much different that they still can make offsprings with their fellow kind. For example a zebra and a horse. Lion and Tiger, even with a house cat and so on and so forth.

I don't even know what to say about what you wrote. No substance in this, wrong thread, no quotation. Wtf is this?

You just morally terrorise poor Baddecker for thinking on his own.... Thats... bad man... thats bad.

Is thats the best you have? Moral terror?

[Astargath]

I guess you ran out of retarded arguments to defend the evil god that you worship which is also non existent

Yes we ran out of arguments that evil God exist. I fully agree with you - Evil God does not exist.

Your BoogeyGod that:

- enjoy torture
- abuse children
- want to kill for silly reasons
- want women to be raped
- want people to be slaves

DOES NOT EXIST. So... There could be only Good God.

I know people that had been proven wrong with their thinking are creating a straw man arguments. Your straw God is completly and utterly false.

For example - slaves. Definition of slave in hebrew is not what we picture we abolished. We picture slave as a commodity that could be killed and tortured. We picture slaves that are forever, and that they are innocent.

The worst that could happen to a Hebrew was being an industred servant as we could define now. Volontary servitude of a guy with no obligation we would call now a serving in military, or servitude for God, or even a job contract.

If someone wanted, they could become a lackey (volontarily) - they would be lackey and serve home for life. Exactly how it was after the abolishion of slavery.

I could go on forever... but whats the point. You guys clearly want to believe your straw God. So be it.

Btw as for a someone that does not believe, you are a strong believer. You believe that something that does not exist, you believe is evil, and therefor you believe you are an upgraded monkey, because everything was proven to upgraede itself as a believe in progress. You have 4 times more the ammount of believes than I do.

P.S BTW yeah its a progress. We have agreed on 2 things already. That should be celebrated somehow. I hope you will cease to hate your straw man that is evil deranged mentally ill moron that you think is me. Being hateful makes you die faster on hearth diseases.

A god that uses eternal torture, kills everyone because they don't believe in him, accepts slavery, says being gay is a sin because he says so, no other real reason is not a good god. Is an evil and stupid god because the people who wrote the bible were also stupid so they couldn't make god look like a god. I would write a better bible than them.

However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you.  You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land.  You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance.  You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way. (Leviticus 25:44-46

Clearly doesn't support slavery, right?


When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are.  If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again.  But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her.  And if the slave girl’s owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter.  If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife.  If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21:7-11

BUT HEY THE BIBLE IS NOT JUST AN EVIL STUPID BOOK, RIGHT?

Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, 21 but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property.

but hey if they recover, nothing happens since is their property hehe.

However: An owner who hits a male or female slave in the eye and destroys it must let the slave go free to compensate for the eye. 27 And an owner who knocks out the tooth of a male or female slave must let the slave go free to compensate for the tooth.

Makes total sense so far

Also : “Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.

You can beat your slaves if they don't die but don't you dare cursing your mother because you will be put to death. Seriously, are you this delusional?

Read Jesus - he have an answer for all your doubts. If you do not understand yet - read again if again no understanding .... oh well....

Then you cannot understand the laws of the God's protection. Why would God protect the ones that refuse him? If someone is not under his law he could be in the human law. And all the "evil" you portrait is the laws outside of israel at that times. So yeah... why a person should not be treated with human law if he is not agreeing with the God law?

If you do not understand the word protection and distinction between human law and divine protection and allowing foreigners to be treated with human law of that time. What can I say....

I can only say read Jesus again... If you still does not understand..... You can always try again. Jesus was ONLY talking about torah and how to interpret it. Nothing else in his ministry.

If you still don't understand - ask some pastor. If you still are not satisfied - ask another.

If you want to prove your point at all costs - you will not get it, you have too hard neck.

Yeah I thought so, I understand it perfectly mate. Why would god allow such barbaric and retarded rules? Even if all of them didn't accept god it still makes no sense that he would set such retarded rules which are not just evil but retarded as well. You have no argument here, you are just rambling with your ''read jesus'' I have read the bible plenty of times, it's full of shit as indicated above, you are delusional.

Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, 21 but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property.

When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are.  If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again.  But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her

You can sell your daughter as a slave, god thinks is fine. You also seem to think is fine because you are delusional.

If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father.  Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her.

What kind of lunatic would make a rape victim marry her attacker?  Answer: God.

And be aware that the woman didn't do anything wrong, she may even be a believer but it doesn't matter.

God is perfectly just, and yet he sentences the imperfect humans he created to infinite suffering in hell for finite sins. Clearly, a limited offense does not warrant unlimited punishment. God’s sentencing of the imperfect humans to an eternity in hell for a mere mortal lifetime of sin is infinitely more unjust than this punishment. The absurd injustice of this infinite punishment is even greater when we consider that the ultimate source of human imperfection is the God who created them.

And what is the point of eternal torture anyways, what is accomplished?

Jesus is quoted many times in the Bible saying that a believer can ask for anything through prayer and receive it.  He even goes so far as to say that mountains and trees can be thrown into the sea simply by praying for it.  This is clearly a lie, and can be proven to be a lie by any believer.  Simply pray for me to be converted to Christianity right away.  Or better yet ask God to move the mountains behind my house.

I have a question - do you want to understand or you just going to nitpick. If you want to understand I can try to make you understand.

Btw with this rape its a very bad translation. It is not even near of this in the original. If one would be cought raping a woman he will have to leave the Izraelites or die.

You have your own idea and you will not give it up. Why should I waste time on you? Those whole issues are answered everywhere in the Bible. Taking those things into account without the possibility of bad translation is just wrong.

Everything bad or evil is more or less the result of free will. I could explain that to you - but you would not want to understand. You just want to accuse. So be it.

Wouldn't a god make sure the only ''evidence'' for his existence would be properly translated? What about all the other points? Tell me what the real document says then. What about jesus lying about prayers or selling your daughter as a slave, you are just avoiding at this point because you know you can't explain all that.

[Vod]

You just morally terrorise poor Baddecker for thinking on his own.... Thats... bad man... thats bad.

Is thats the best you have? Moral terror?

We are trying to help BD to think on his own.  :/

Right now his mindset is 2,000 years ago with the outdated morals and beliefs they had back then.

We don't kill blacks or gays today.
We don't beat our pets because they are our property.
We don't whore out our attractive sisters.
Finally, we don't kill people anymore for not believing in fairy tales.

It will be a lot of work, but I've been where BD is, so I emphasize with his belief structure.  Eventually he will realize it is wrong.  

[Vod]

The Bible has strength. There are some 25,000 copies of the Old Testament that were done by hand before the printing press was invented. The Bible has power.

People had no evidence there wasn't a god back then, so they believed what their parents told them.  It's only once the printing press was invented, and facts became available to the masses, that religion started to fail.

The bible is just another book.  It has no significance today.  No one believes the bible unless they are told to as trusting children by their lying parents.
 

[Przemax]

Wouldn't a god make sure the only ''evidence'' for his existence would be properly translated?

I have proper polish translation. I could translate from polish to english - took, not rape. So if someone took some woman like you take a your own woman (by her love handles if you know what I mean ) he have to make her his wife.

So its some problem with you english, and you allowing such a blatant translation. Maybe find some better translated bible or something.

What about all the other points?

1. Divine protection is only for the ones that obey divinity. For the rest there is a man law. And the law of the land around Izrael was cruel. There is no commandment to have slaves, or not to have them. God ignores the ones that ignore him.
2. Im not sure about selling your daughter. So yeah... its puzzling for me. But it was not a sex slave. It would be fornication that would be a transition from divine protection. You have to know that its not what God wants, he allows that. I don't know why. Probably some cultural reason. Its completly not applicable in todays world. My guess is that would be the way to legalise the multitude of wifes. As you can see secondary wifes in the Bible and etc. That was probably because man died more times than woman, and a parents would not find a husband for her, so they "sold" her as a secondary wife or something like that. I am not sure, but there should be some reason to do that.
3. You need to know that Moses probably had mixed human law taken from Egypt with God Law. The only thing was the decalogue that God had made himself. How can we know if other things are not mixed up as well? Well... they are as Bible then debunk itself. But that doesn't mean Bible contradict itself. Those are left for a pedagogical reasons. To read the bible you need to find 2 witnesses that says the same thing. That means its inspired.
4. Killing your child. Well... That was only in one case in the Bible. And it was not about the child. It was about the grown up men. You know. No parents want to kill their kids. Thats why it was not recorded in the Bible. If a grown up person did not like the Izraeli ways he could imigrate, and that was the most common 99,9999% of cases. It was always as every law with a trial. And if trials would be like Jesus was saying they should - mercyful, everything would be interpreted the right way.
5. Bible being against sacrificing children implies that the death is a scare crow for adults not to shame their parents. And yes it protects the parents from shame. So you see the theme of divine protection.


But to be honest if you are not grateful to the ones that gave you life, you are not worthy of it. Thats a truism. That doesn't mean there will not be many if any not merciful father or mather. Thats a "law" that was to put a test of Izraelis. If you are mercyful why should I not be as your father. Its a pedagogical tool to make people understand they were on their mercy alone, thats why they are alive.

Its even in the prayer. Forgive us as we forgive our trespassers. You get it?

Just because the torah involves even the most controversial subjects, does not mean that its a manual of how to be gruesome. Is it?

Even the guy that is not protected by God's law or any men's law God had said not to kill - foreign slave or he would be angry. You need to understand that a fate of that unfortunate men would be far worse as wage slave as abolishion of slaves had proven.

Nothing can justify slavery. But God is not justifying anything. JUstice is opposite to justification. And the justice of the Lord is simple. You do not want him - you will not get him. You are on your own. And if the world is cruel like the world was at that time - you will get some.

[BADecker]

The Bible has strength. There are some 25,000 copies of the Old Testament that were done by hand before the printing press was invented. The Bible has power.

People had no evidence there wasn't a god back then, so they believed what their parents told them.  It's only once the printing press was invented, and facts became available to the masses, that religion started to fail.

The bible is just another book.  It has no significance today.  No one believes the bible unless they are told to as trusting children by their lying parents.
 

People have scientific evidence today that God exists. Consider cause and effect. Both your conversation and mine have been pre-programmed by cause and effect. Scientifically there is no way to get away from that.

So, what set up the complex cause and effect that makes everything work like it does? The tremendous complexity that cause and effect has produced doesn't come about in entropy except that there was greater complexity in the past. And anything that could set up cause and effect to maintain complexity in the universe after thousands of years, had to be very complex within itself.

Science with its suggestion that the universe is billions of years old, is simply attributing to God far more power and ability than the Bible that suggests the universe is a little over 6,000 years old.