[$XVG] VERGE [POW][MultiAlgo][TOR/i2P][no premine/ico!]

[ooeygooeygold]

The announcement was never posted on the web wallet my coins are really not recoverable? wtf....

The best thing to do is move on and start again. When you fall off the horse just get back on.

^ It is completely ridiculous that this is the message the devs are giving us.

you didn't own your coins, and we aren't responsible for anything we don't host. we announced 5 weeks ago we were going to end support for it, since the host wasn't ours and was donated.

Yes but you are responsible for managing the web wallet!!!!!! Annouced 5 weeks ago on channels that many people will not have seen given how many people have asked in the last 3 days...... maybe a message on the web wallet itself would have been a good idea? Or maybe a few weeks after the "closure" of the web wallet to withdraw but not deposit might have a good idea? This whole issue has been handled very exteremly badly and the fall out is now being handled very shadily too.

Also, the devs can help us but are choosing not to: https://www.reddit.com/r/vergecurrency/comments/6oayae/web_wallet_problem/dkgs6oq/

I wonder why.....?

that server where it was no longer exists. so you are wrong at this point, no one can help you. we made the announcement it was going offline 5 WEEKS AGO. this discussion is now over.

WHY WOULDN'T YOU PUT IT IN BOLD RED LETTERS ON THE VERGE WEB WALLET?!?

BECAUSE WE WERE NOT ABLE TO ACCESS THE SITE TO MAKE CHANGES TO THE HTML

No wonder this coin will never be worth even a penny

[drewid]

i guess that 16.5 billion just dwindled down quite a bit.  good thing i chose tor webwallet from the beginning.  i knew having a webwallet on clearnet would not be a good option for long term.  easily hacked, etc.  guess i lucked out by a hair

you really shouldnt store coins on any service that you dont actually own them. i would suggest keeping your coins on an android, core, or electrum wallet.

will a market ever materialize such as whats on tor already?

[bitspill]

If blockchain.info went down would you all go attack the developers behind bitcoin core?

Not every projects is under the control of the coin developer.

[Dogedarkdev]

i guess that 16.5 billion just dwindled down quite a bit.  good thing i chose tor webwallet from the beginning.  i knew having a webwallet on clearnet would not be a good option for long term.  easily hacked, etc.  guess i lucked out by a hair

you really shouldnt store coins on any service that you dont actually own them. i would suggest keeping your coins on an android, core, or electrum wallet.

will a market ever materialize such as whats on tor already?

there are markets on tor, and there is an exchange on i2p that has verge available for trading. (exchanged.i2p)

[CRonaldo7]

If blockchain.info went down would you all go attack the developers behind bitcoin core?

Not every projects is under the control of the coin developer.

Yes, but in this case, the devs made a decision to remove the clearnet wallet..... which was created and managed by the devs. Now, they claim that they do not have access to the wallet inteface code which is really hard to believe when it was supported and created by the developers in the first place.

And I see that posts from users that lost coins from the wallet are still being removed moderated..... guess alot of us lost coins and have to get back on our horses.

[Dogedarkdev]

If blockchain.info went down would you all go attack the developers behind bitcoin core?

Not every projects is under the control of the coin developer.

Yes, but in this case, the devs made a decision to remove the clearnet wallet..... which was created and managed by the devs. Now, they claim that they do not have access to the wallet inteface code which is really hard to believe when it was supported and created by the developers in the first place.

And I see that posts from users that lost coins from the wallet are still being removed moderated..... guess alot of us lost coins and have to get back on our horses.

the vps was one of 3 we were donated, whos hosting was paid for a year last year. im surprised it didnt go offline faster to be honest. it's unfortunate you didn't read our main thread until after the fact, since it was announced 5 weeks ago.

[CRonaldo7]

?? Why do you keep removing my post??

i tried to check my verge coins today and saw the site down. came here and saw that the wallet been deleted? WTF? what level of incompetence is this??

Because the developers do not care.... hope that new users coming onto the forum to research on the coin do not see this as a problem.... and hope to moderate us into submission until this problem is over.....

the vps was one of 3 we were donated, whos hosting was paid for a year last year. im surprised it didnt go offline faster to be honest. it's unfortunate you didn't read our main thread until after the fact, since it was announced 5 weeks ago.

Not only I did not read, many in the past few days did not and many in the coming few days will come on here to complain and be moderated away. If I was an isolated incident..... fine, I will get back on my horse... if you ask the commnity for donations, I believe many of us will donate to keep the clearnet wallet running until you figure out a proper solution of removing it and allowing stranglers to withdraw from it over a period of time..... instead nope, you all decide to just pull the plug.

BUt whatever.... we are beating on a dead horse here now..... I hope you can see why this is a bad action and the reaction from your team is equally horrible...

[Shintax]

Let me be the first to say that because of this thread and because of the devs consistent activity in this thread I was given more than enough time to pull my XVG out of the web wallet. Keep up the good work guys 

[Dogedarkdev]

Let me be the first to say that because of this thread and because of the devs consistent activity in this thread I was given more than enough time to pull my XVG out of the web wallet. Keep up the good work guys  

thanks. i wasn't really sure when it would go offline, which is why we planned/annoucned to remove it from our site and such 5 weeks ago.

literally rule #1 in crypto, is always keep your coins. don't leave them on sites where you cant control them via privatekey/seedphrase/.dat file

anywho, just so everyone knows, the new core update will be out before july is over, and so will the tor-only android.

RSK is still in testnet with bitcoin's smart contracts, so we're still watching that progress.

[minerbro]

IS there any benefit for long-term Verge holders?

I mean, something like stake/masternodes/harvest/fees/revenue

Can I actually gain something from keeping XVG's on my wallet?

[Dogedarkdev]

IS there any benefit for long-term Verge holders?

I mean, something like stake/masternodes/harvest/fees/revenue

Can I actually gain something from keeping XVG's on my wallet?

hodling has it's own advantages/disadvantages. our shop opens up soon and will be accepting xvg.

we dont have masternodes, because it's a network weakness/centralization point. we can/may incorporate PoS one day, if we can come up with a fair system, that doesnt reward by amount in balance, but a flat reward that is fair. we'll see. right now our multi algo mining is fine though.

[Dogedarkdev]

IS there any benefit for long-term Verge holders?

I mean, something like stake/masternodes/harvest/fees/revenue

Can I actually gain something from keeping XVG's on my wallet?

hodling has it's own advantages/disadvantages. our shop opens up soon and will be accepting xvg.

we dont have masternodes, because it's a network weakness/centralization point. we can/may incorporate PoS one day, if we can come up with a fair system, that doesnt reward by amount in balance, but a flat reward that is fair. we'll see. right now our multi algo mining is fine though.

If Verge ever incorporates PoS I'm out completely.

like i said, if we did, it would be a flat reward, not a reward based on the users balance. we have no interest in making the large holders even more money.

what would you have against that?

[Dogedarkdev]

IS there any benefit for long-term Verge holders?

I mean, something like stake/masternodes/harvest/fees/revenue

Can I actually gain something from keeping XVG's on my wallet?

hodling has it's own advantages/disadvantages. our shop opens up soon and will be accepting xvg.

we dont have masternodes, because it's a network weakness/centralization point. we can/may incorporate PoS one day, if we can come up with a fair system, that doesnt reward by amount in balance, but a flat reward that is fair. we'll see. right now our multi algo mining is fine though.

If Verge ever incorporates PoS I'm out completely.

like i said, if we did, it would be a flat reward, not a reward based on the users balance. we have no interest in making the large holders even more money.

what would you have against that?

A bunch of reasons, but number one is miners invest a lot into their rigs. Some miners might even buy or build their rig intending to mine mostly this coin, knowing it is multialgo minable. As soon as it goes PoS in the least bit they lose out on their investment. So if we want to keep getting more miners to join we can only use PoW, and keep adding new PoW algorithms to increase the pool of miners who can participate with their existing equipment. Namely, PoS ruins miners' incentives and thus creates a perverse incentive to create a PoS nonminer network that destroys the existing network.

From the beginning, like when Peercoin came out, my first problem with PoS is it in a way opens fractional reserves as it uses an interest rate. It's usury in the original definition of the word. It's even forbidden in certain religions because of its immorality. An interest rate is an arbitrary invention. It might not look like debt at first, but it is the rest of the network owing the holders a fraction of their investment in real terms (not nominal terms, as user balances do not decrease).

And as much as trying to figure out what would be fair at a group level sounds virtuous, it unavoidably comes at the expense of other individuals.

i agree with most of what you are saying, but im not sure if you are aware of two things... 1: we can still have pow while having pos. 2. i said if we even considered it, it would be a flat reward, not a percentage rate of a users balance. everyone would get an equal amount.

[Krenarbi]

i tried to check my verge coins today and saw the site down. came here and saw that the wallet been deleted? WTF? what level of incompetence is this??

have you not read the thread? the web wallet DOES NOT EXIST ANYMORE. it was announced 5 weeks ago it was going offline soon. i contacted the host to see if it could be restored and the answer was no. we did not want to keep it anyway, since the first rule in crypto is make sure YOU own your coins.

THEN STOP REMOVING MY POST!! the community deserves to see how incompetent your team is when they can't even deal with taking off a wallet offline properly

you can keep posting that, but we'll keep deleting it. it isn't our fault you didn't read the thread 5 weeks ago.

we've moved on, we already wasted two pages discussing it over and over.

NOPE. i will keep posting to show how incompetent your team is

[TheMostGhost]

If you are a serious "HODLER" than it is your duty to check your coins/ forum-related posts / website weekly.

It is completely your fault - and you are the one who is incompetent.

Sincerely,

TMG

[FYIcryptoz]

IS there any benefit for long-term Verge holders?

I mean, something like stake/masternodes/harvest/fees/revenue

Can I actually gain something from keeping XVG's on my wallet?

hodling has it's own advantages/disadvantages. our shop opens up soon and will be accepting xvg.

we dont have masternodes, because it's a network weakness/centralization point. we can/may incorporate PoS one day, if we can come up with a fair system, that doesnt reward by amount in balance, but a flat reward that is fair. we'll see. right now our multi algo mining is fine though.

If Verge ever incorporates PoS I'm out completely.

like i said, if we did, it would be a flat reward, not a reward based on the users balance. we have no interest in making the large holders even more money.

what would you have against that?

A bunch of reasons, but number one is miners invest a lot into their rigs. Some miners might even buy or build their rig intending to mine mostly this coin, knowing it is multialgo minable. As soon as it goes PoS in the least bit they lose out on their investment. So if we want to keep getting more miners to join we can only use PoW, and keep adding new PoW algorithms to increase the pool of miners who can participate with their existing equipment. Namely, PoS ruins miners' incentives and thus creates a perverse incentive to create a PoS nonminer network that destroys the existing network.

From the beginning, like when Peercoin came out, my first problem with PoS is it in a way opens fractional reserves as it uses an interest rate. It's usury in the original definition of the word. It's even forbidden in certain religions because of its immorality. An interest rate is an arbitrary invention. It might not look like debt at first, but it is the rest of the network owing the holders a fraction of their investment in real terms (not nominal terms, as user balances do not decrease).

And as much as trying to figure out what would be fair at a group level sounds virtuous, it unavoidably comes at the expense of other individuals.

i agree with most of what you are saying, but im not sure if you are aware of two things... 1: we can still have pow while having pos. 2. i said if we even considered it, it would be a flat reward, not a percentage rate of a users balance. everyone would get an equal amount.

Wouldnt this have a flaw by hosting multiple wallets with very little coins in it. If youre getting the same reward anyways?

[Slemicek]

You, who have lost xvg on web wallet, can blame only yourself. It was said month ago here, I was said so many times on telegram, it was on slack. I had some xvg on web wallet also, although it's not safe, but I had month to transfer them to my electrum, which I did, because I care about my investments. I'm  reading what is new, I'm part of community at channels...etc. So if you're that type of hodler who doesn't care about coins after buying it and just hodl for long term why do you even used web wallet? Web wallets are dangerous and if used then only temporarily.  And if you are not that type of hodler I bet you were online at least thousands times in those 5 weeks and you could easily read that web wallet is not recommended and that it's going to b offline. I'm sorry for your lost xvg, but it's your fault, now you just fake blame dev and whole verge team. And that's pathetic. 

[ceasarpolar]

i tried to check my verge coins today and saw the site down. came here and saw that the wallet been deleted? WTF? what level of incompetence is this??

have you not read the thread? the web wallet DOES NOT EXIST ANYMORE. it was announced 5 weeks ago it was going offline soon. i contacted the host to see if it could be restored and the answer was no. we did not want to keep it anyway, since the first rule in crypto is make sure YOU own your coins.

THEN STOP REMOVING MY POST!! the community deserves to see how incompetent your team is when they can't even deal with taking off a wallet offline properly

you can keep posting that, but we'll keep deleting it. it isn't our fault you didn't read the thread 5 weeks ago.

we've moved on, we already wasted two pages discussing it over and over.

NOPE. i will keep posting to show how incompetent your team is

Have you ever been on Telegram Verge group? Anyone that asks there about verge online wallet was informed about verge online wallet was going off line & that was completely unsecure of leaving your coins there since you dont control your private keys. Plenty of options were available to you, coinomi wallet, core wallet, or finally just leave THEM IN THE DAMN EXCHANGE.

You decided otherwise and went ahead placed them in online wallet, and forgot about them for sometime, without checking about your investment, which is completely unthinkable if you were to care about your investment.
I personally check with the community everyday, the Dev is great and always helpful, answers all the questions you ask him & he is in fact way more patient than what i would have been if i were to be in his spot. That being said Kudos to the Dev.

You cant blame the developpers or the team since you are the one that decided to go to online wallet solution knowingly that you won't control your private keys, that s insane to me. You should ALWAYS control your private keys.
In crypto your private keys is your money...

Sorry for your loss but it s entirely your fault.

Hope you can make it back...

[chilly2k]

IS there any benefit for long-term Verge holders?

I mean, something like stake/masternodes/harvest/fees/revenue

Can I actually gain something from keeping XVG's on my wallet?

hodling has it's own advantages/disadvantages. our shop opens up soon and will be accepting xvg.

we dont have masternodes, because it's a network weakness/centralization point. we can/may incorporate PoS one day, if we can come up with a fair system, that doesnt reward by amount in balance, but a flat reward that is fair. we'll see. right now our multi algo mining is fine though.

What about adding POS as another algo? 

Also Clams does POS and the reward is 1 clam per block.  You do have a higher chance of staking a block with more coins, but the reward is fixed.  You would also have control over the minimum stake age, so folks would have to commit holding coins for x amount of time before they can stake.  <- has the feel of locking coins in a masternode, without an actual mastermode. 

[Dogedarkdev]

IS there any benefit for long-term Verge holders?

I mean, something like stake/masternodes/harvest/fees/revenue

Can I actually gain something from keeping XVG's on my wallet?

hodling has it's own advantages/disadvantages. our shop opens up soon and will be accepting xvg.

we dont have masternodes, because it's a network weakness/centralization point. we can/may incorporate PoS one day, if we can come up with a fair system, that doesnt reward by amount in balance, but a flat reward that is fair. we'll see. right now our multi algo mining is fine though.

What about adding POS as another algo? 

Also Clams does POS and the reward is 1 clam per block.  You do have a higher chance of staking a block with more coins, but the reward is fixed.  You would also have control over the minimum stake age, so folks would have to commit holding coins for x amount of time before they can stake.  <- has the feel of locking coins in a masternode, without an actual mastermode. 

the type of PoS i have in mind, is something similar, but with an extraordinarily low reward. maybe something like .001 per block, so that there would be no way to take advantage of it. this way the PoS would be more voluntarily than "for profit".