[Archive] BFL trolling museum

[crazyates]

also known as Nexus7 in a Box^TM

1) Cut a hole in a box.
2) Put  your junk in the box.
3) Make her open the box.
And that's the way we do it!

[greyhawk]

also known as Nexus7 in a Box^TM

1) Cut a hole in a box.
2) Put  your junk in the box.
3) Make her open the box.
And that's the way we do it!

You know it's CES and my wallet is open wide
Gonna show you something so you know what's on my mind
A gift real special, so take off the top
Take a look inside -- it's Nexus in a box
Not gonna get you a mining rig
That sort of gift don't mean anything

[aTg]

also known as Nexus7 in a Box^TM

1) Cut a hole in a box.
2) Put  your junk in the box.
3) Make her open the box.
And that's the way we do it!

You know it's CES and my wallet is open wide
Gonna show you something so you know what's on my mind
A gift real special, so take off the top
Take a look inside -- it's Nexus in a box
Not gonna get you a mining rig
That sort of gift don't mean anything

What is clear is that this company seeks above all the aesthetics of its products, and that alone does not give me much confidence.
If you wanted to add a host on minirig (which should be cast from the first day) was more practical to include something like a RaspberryPi or similar accessible via ssh but is easier to put a mobile phone embedded with nice graphics and touch screen, leave that pileup running 24/7 for months to see what happens ...


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I forgot, some silicone too.

[SgtSpike]

also known as Nexus7 in a Box^TM

1) Cut a hole in a box.
2) Put  your junk in the box.
3) Make her open the box.
And that's the way we do it!

You know it's CES and my wallet is open wide
Gonna show you something so you know what's on my mind
A gift real special, so take off the top
Take a look inside -- it's Nexus in a box
Not gonna get you a mining rig
That sort of gift don't mean anything

What is clear is that this company seeks above all the aesthetics of its products, and that alone does not give me much confidence.
If you wanted to add a host on minirig (which should be cast from the first day) was more practical to include something like a RaspberryPi or similar accessible via ssh but is easier to put a mobile phone embedded with nice graphics and touch screen, leave that pileup running 24/7 for months to see what happens ...

It could be argued that they also care about features and ease-of-use.  Many people do not know SSH, do not want to learn it, and would much rather have a "self contained" device with built-in display that tells them if anything's gone wrong.

I do agree that I'd be worried about the longevity of such a setup, and whether it would run reliably for months on end without requiring human intervention.  However, BFL must believe that the tradeoff for that potentially questionable reliability is worth the feature set it offers.

[crazyates]

also known as Nexus7 in a Box^TM

1) Cut a hole in a box.
2) Put  your junk in the box.
3) Make her open the box.
And that's the way we do it!

You know it's CES and my wallet is open wide
Gonna show you something so you know what's on my mind
A gift real special, so take off the top
Take a look inside -- it's Nexus in a box
Not gonna get you a mining rig
That sort of gift don't mean anything

See I'm wise enough to know
When an ASIC needs shippin',
and I'll send just the one
Overnight to you, ya all those Jalapenos.
To all the Singles out there with upgrades to replace,
It's easy to mine follow these steps:

Christmas, Nexus in a box
Hanukkah, Nexus in a box
Kwanzaa, Nexus in a box
Every single holiday Nexus in a box.
Over at your parents' house, Nexus in a box
Mid-day at the grocery store, Nexus in a box
Backstage at the CMA's, Nexus in a box

[tvbcof]

It could be argued that they also care about features and ease-of-use.  Many people do not know SSH, do not want to learn it, and would much rather have a "self contained" device with built-in display that tells them if anything's gone wrong.

I do agree that I'd be worried about the longevity of such a setup, and whether it would run reliably for months on end without requiring human intervention.  However, BFL must believe that the tradeoff for that potentially questionable reliability is worth the feature set it offers.

An alternate hypothesis is that BFL may recognize that this is a more effective strategy to rope in the simpletons who would be likely to send them 'pre-order' funds without any tangible evidence that BFL will ever be delivering anything.  People who don't want to 'learn ssh' are likely a super-set of the 'have money, will send to strangers' group.

[SgtSpike]

It could be argued that they also care about features and ease-of-use.  Many people do not know SSH, do not want to learn it, and would much rather have a "self contained" device with built-in display that tells them if anything's gone wrong.

I do agree that I'd be worried about the longevity of such a setup, and whether it would run reliably for months on end without requiring human intervention.  However, BFL must believe that the tradeoff for that potentially questionable reliability is worth the feature set it offers.

An alternate hypothesis is that BFL may recognize that this is a more effective strategy to rope in the simpletons who would be likely to send them 'pre-order' funds without any tangible evidence that BFL will ever be delivering anything.  People who don't want to 'learn ssh' are likely a super-set of the 'have money, will send to strangers' group.

A valid hypothesis if you believe BFL hasn't given tangible evidence of future delivery.

[aTg]

It could be argued that they also care about features and ease-of-use.  Many people do not know SSH, do not want to learn it, and would much rather have a "self contained" device with built-in display that tells them if anything's gone wrong.

I do agree that I'd be worried about the longevity of such a setup, and whether it would run reliably for months on end without requiring human intervention.  However, BFL must believe that the tradeoff for that potentially questionable reliability is worth the feature set it offers.

An alternate hypothesis is that BFL may recognize that this is a more effective strategy to rope in the simpletons who would be likely to send them 'pre-order' funds without any tangible evidence that BFL will ever be delivering anything.  People who don't want to 'learn ssh' are likely a super-set of the 'have money, will send to strangers' group.

Exactly, if you want to make available to tablet users rather than computer users, it is because they seek to dupe suckers ... Mining is not as download an android app and give mining. As much as I want to sell well.

[SgtSpike]

Mining is not as download an android app and give mining. As much as I want to sell well.

Did you miss writing a few words, or something?   

[aTg]

Mining is not as download an android app and give mining. As much as I want to sell well.

Did you miss writing a few words, or something?  

English is not my native language, I think the message is clear no?
Mining is not like download a app from PlayStore for people that leftover $30,000.

PD: I leave a link to the only products that have now BFL for sale: http://www.cafepress.es/butterflylabs

[SgtSpike]

Mining is not as download an android app and give mining. As much as I want to sell well.

Did you miss writing a few words, or something?  

English is not my native language, I think the message is clear no?
Mining is not like download a app from PlayStore for people that leftover $30,000.

PD: I leave a link to the only products that have now BFL for sale: http://www.cafepress.es/butterflylabs

My apologies.

I gather what you are trying to say is that people who buy a $30,000 rig aren't generally the same people who need an "easy to use" mining device.  I can agree to that, but I have a couple of responses:

1)  BFL would like to expand the audience of miners from just including the absolute technogeekiest to more of an average user "hey, I want to check this Bitcoin thing out!"  I don't know how much that'll happen at the $30,000 level, but one could argue that if even only one or two more minirig customers were capture because of the tablet integration, BFL could call it a success.

2)  There are some hardcore Bitcoin enthusiasts who do take aesthetics and ease-of-use into account, even though it might not be true of the group as a whole.  Myself, for instance.  I wasn't about to buy an ASIC miner that wasn't enclosed in some case, and it is a bonus that the case looks good (I bought two Single SC's).  If I had the funds for a minirig, I absolutely would have preordered one, and I would have much rather had a tablet integrated as they have done than had an SSH requirement or other non-GUI solution for maintaining the mining.  TBH, I really dislike command-line anything.  It isn't the way I like to work with computers.  I also currently use BitMinter - again, because it is GUI-based, not command-line based like CGMiner and some of the other popular options.  Though I may not fit the profile of the typical Bitcoin miner, I am a Bitcoin miner, and I do spend money on equipment.  With the tablet integration, BFL is attempting to capture the market of people like me who do not want to deal with command-line anything, and want statistics and graphs to be automatically calculated and shown without any intervention on my part.

[punin]

They should send these to all those with preorders. Even a stopped clock gives the right time twice a day

[aTg]

Mining is not as download an android app and give mining. As much as I want to sell well.

Did you miss writing a few words, or something?  

English is not my native language, I think the message is clear no?
Mining is not like download a app from PlayStore for people that leftover $30,000.

PD: I leave a link to the only products that have now BFL for sale: http://www.cafepress.es/butterflylabs

My apologies.

I gather what you are trying to say is that people who buy a $30,000 rig aren't generally the same people who need an "easy to use" mining device.  I can agree to that, but I have a couple of responses:

1)  BFL would like to expand the audience of miners from just including the absolute technogeekiest to more of an average user "hey, I want to check this Bitcoin thing out!"  I don't know how much that'll happen at the $30,000 level, but one could argue that if even only one or two more minirig customers were capture because of the tablet integration, BFL could call it a success.

2)  There are some hardcore Bitcoin enthusiasts who do take aesthetics and ease-of-use into account, even though it might not be true of the group as a whole.  Myself, for instance.  I wasn't about to buy an ASIC miner that wasn't enclosed in some case, and it is a bonus that the case looks good (I bought two Single SC's).  If I had the funds for a minirig, I absolutely would have preordered one, and I would have much rather had a tablet integrated as they have done than had an SSH requirement or other non-GUI solution for maintaining the mining.  TBH, I really dislike command-line anything.  It isn't the way I like to work with computers.  I also currently use BitMinter - again, because it is GUI-based, not command-line based like CGMiner and some of the other popular options.  Though I may not fit the profile of the typical Bitcoin miner, I am a Bitcoin miner, and I do spend money on equipment.  With the tablet integration, BFL is attempting to capture the market of people like me who do not want to deal with command-line anything, and want statistics and graphs to be automatically calculated and shown without any intervention on my part.

Ok, I am 100% agree with you, but not with them. If the intention is to provide a friendlier interface for miners not so geeks like these should have worked a bit on hardware itself. Simply a micro PC and touch screen, a tablet with android will engage customers in a particular profile but expelled more than it has managed to capture, by the lack of options and the bad image created by poorly designed product.

[Frizz23]

They should send these to all those with preorders. Even a stopped clock gives the right time twice a day

Can I have one of those instead?

[Frizz23]

They don't have a prototype. The world would see it at CES: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ZUPniBo5UQ

I don't f*cking understand why all of a sudden everyone is talking about a Nexus7 tablet. And black boxes. And fans.

The whole interview is hot air: "Nexus7 ... bfgminer ... Android ... bla bla bla ... Nexus7 ... bfgminer ... bla bla bla ...".

Can someone in Vegas please visit BFLs booth and kick them in the nuts? One kick per shipment delay.

[SgtSpike]

Ok, I am 100% agree with you, but not with them. If the intention is to provide a friendlier interface for miners not so geeks like these should have worked a bit on hardware itself. Simply a micro PC and touch screen, a tablet with android will engage customers in a particular profile but expelled more than it has managed to capture, by the lack of options and the bad image created by poorly designed product.

Well, and that is really what it boils down to.  Has the decision they made brought in more customers than have left because of it?  Has anyone who has a minirig on order decided to cancel the order because they integrated a Nexus 7 into it?

I haven't heard of anyone canceling because of this, but that doesn't mean no one has.  Likewise, I haven't heard of anyone ordering because of this, but that doesn't mean no one has.  It's all a big unknown right now.  Something that we'll probably never know the answer to, but can at least attempt to speculate upon, if for no other reason than to stimulate interesting discussion and thought about why customers of a particular demographic may choose one brand of product vs another.

[nathanrees19]

So they show up at CES without a single working device. Not even a Jalapeno -> not even one working ASIC chip.

Um, you never produce "one" ASIC chip. If they had one, they would have thousands, and they would have already shipped.

I never said ASICs are produced by the piece.

You said "not even one". This implies that there are situations where you would expect them to have only one working chip. You should have said "not even a prototype batch" if that is what you meant.

But you can have a test wafer (with a couple hundred chips, depending on die size) that's processed with another batch (so 49 wafers of product A and 1 wafer with my test chips).

...Then they would have a couple hundred chips, and they would have done demos of prototype units and sent some to mining software developers to ensure compatibility. This would all have happened weeks or months ago. It would be all over the forums.

It's quite likely that they did a test run, found a minor issue, and corrected it for the real production run.

You never do 50 wafers with a design where you actually don't know if it's working or not. If the chips are borked you'd lose some 100K USD!

You always "lose" a lot if an ASIC doesn't work. That is the reality of ASIC development; you burn through a lot of cash before you can actually start making working chips.

I feel like I'm repeating myself...

Possibly. That's why you are a troll.

Rofl. Calling someone a troll when your sig contains the word "Asshamster"... 0/10.

[nathanrees19]

They don't have a prototype. The world would see it at CES: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ZUPniBo5UQ

I don't f*cking understand why all of a sudden everyone is talking about a Nexus7 tablet. And black boxes. And fans.

The whole interview is hot air: "Nexus7 ... bfgminer ... Android ... bla bla bla ... Nexus7 ... bfgminer ... bla bla bla ...".

Can someone in Vegas please visit BFLs booth and kick them in the nuts? One kick per shipment delay.

Um, do you even know what most companies show off at CES these days? Did you hear about the WiFi rifle? It's all "lol android tablet" and vaporware. Every booth is the same.

[tvbcof]

...

2)  There are some hardcore Bitcoin enthusiasts who do take aesthetics and ease-of-use into account, even though it might not be true of the group as a whole.  Myself, for instance.  I wasn't about to buy an ASIC miner that wasn't enclosed in some case, and it is a bonus that the case looks good (I bought two Single SC's).  If I had the funds for a minirig, I absolutely would have preordered one, and I would have much rather had a tablet integrated as they have done than had an SSH requirement or other non-GUI solution for maintaining the mining.  TBH, I really dislike command-line anything.  It isn't the way I like to work with computers.  I also currently use BitMinter - again, because it is GUI-based, not command-line based like CGMiner and some of the other popular options.  Though I may not fit the profile of the typical Bitcoin miner, I am a Bitcoin miner, and I do spend money on equipment.  With the tablet integration, BFL is attempting to capture the market of people like me who do not want to deal with command-line anything, and want statistics and graphs to be automatically calculated and shown without any intervention on my part.

Saved by (unsurprisingly) being broke.  A practical advantage of being in such a condition.

Anyway, if I were running a pre-order scam, I'd be targetting people much like yourself...albeit with more disposable income.  Cook up some simple mock-up apps and watch the money pour in.

[Transisto]

This is the only monitoring device I'd want to check if a minirig had stopped working.

Minirigs will most likely be held in a safe inside vault inside a secret room.  I'd prefer a 199$ refund than a Nexus 7 I wouldn't use.