Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[afbitcoins]

The graphic tries to show how funding a channel is like funding a 'hot wallet'. A more accurate description is that funding a channel is like depositing money with a bank.

Explain why you think that statement is true, and I will explain why you are wrong.

The graphic showed nodes which would be represented by the likes of Amazon, Bitcoin Exchanges and Banks as 'Massively connected Hubs'. Opening a channel with a massivly connected hub like Amazon, a bitcoin Exchange or a bank is more like depositing money with a bank than sending some bitcoin to another wallet, (a hot wallet if you like). I don't know how to explain it more clearly than that. Feel free to show me why I'm wrong. I'm often wrong about a great many things

The graphic tries to show how funding a channel is like funding a 'hot wallet'. A more accurate description is that funding a channel is like depositing money with a bank.

Explain why you think that statement is true, and I will explain why you are wrong.

Afbitcoins is a Bcash shill/shit noob.

Where do you even get that from? Being a sceptic of offchain scaling immediately makes you a bcash shill/shit noob ?? I don't follow that logic. Therefore I conclude you are a ripple noob shit turnip brain. If you must know I have a little bcash left over that I haven't sold. But mostly I'm not invested in it currently. I reserve the right to add more to my portfolio if I like, I still don't think that would make me a bitcoin cash, sorry bcash noob/ shit all shit noob. whatever. Get some facts before you spout shit

[afbitcoins]

I actually would regard using LN as the natural progression of scaling up peer to peer payments. Consider that much of the peer to peer traffic on the internet itself which we used to have has moved more to peer - "cloud" - peer system.

Good parallel.

Can't remember the last time I used a torrent program to get data.

... but if some data should get censored everywhere from "cloud peer" systems, it would spread through torrents like wildfire. That is, base blockchain transfers will always be an option, no matter what.

Not sure if I understood that correctly but if I did, I could view torrents being replaced by cloud services as a regression from a decentralised system back towards a more centralised one. Cloud services are provided by a small number of large companies.

You're right.

I expressed my thought clumsily. By "good parallel" I meant to make a point with those that are afraid LN means more centralization. It will also reduce costs, as peer-cloud-peer systems do: most peers don't need to keep seeding the torrent.

Anyway I still find torrents useful.

I also still use them, even if they're not that fashionable anymore. What I failed to convey is that they will still be ready to use, and back in high demand, if (when!) circumstances (censorship) will make them necessary again.

But anyway, thanks for a civilised response. I prefer reasoned debate than being told to fuck off.

Oh, well, fuck off then.


(J/k hehe...)

Sometimes being told to fuck off isn't that bad. JJG chose a nice big colourful font for it the other day which I quite liked. lol

[keyboard warrior]

Is anyone still not blown away that we are still 15X up from where we were a year before?  

Last year at this time, I guessed we would end 2017 between $1600-1800. And I was so wrong.

So Ima make the same prediction, I say we will end 2018 somewhere ~$22k-26k.  Even that would be a great year to me.

The November/December price rocket shocked me. I never expected such huge gains so fast.

[ghandi]

3day chart seems to be drawing the perfect bubble...

[thisisntbic]

3day chart seems to be drawing the perfect bubble...

In what way? Looks exactly like December 26th-28th, almost exactly where it is today except a bit higher. So, breaking bubbling upwards... again?

_{edit: further thoughts/ramblings, and grammar}

[katoon123]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTf5j9LDObk

[ghandi]

3day chart seems to be drawing the perfect bubble...

In what way? Looks exactly like December 26th-28th, almost exactly where it is today except a bit higher. So, breaking bubbling upwards... again?

_{edit: further thoughts/ramblings, and grammar}

In the way the perfect anatomy of a bubble is described. Doesn't certainly mean we are going to crash. But currently it's not looking to bright.

[JimboToronto]

Are these Mexico prices, brother. Are you still hitting the bricks soonish?

No. Just regular USD/CAD quotes from the usual sources.

I'm not going to Mexico until Thursday. That's why my presence here has been spotty lately. Busy making preps.

I hate selling any Bitcoin but I wanted some extra travel cash so I sold a little on Saturday. Not only did I luck out on catching a peak, but I got a great fee. Not only was it my first negative sell fee, it did it all in one transaction for one transaction fee.



Life is good.

[fluidjax]

Explain why you think that statement is true, and I will explain why you are wrong.

The graphic showed nodes which would be represented by the likes of Amazon, Bitcoin Exchanges and Banks as 'Massively connected Hubs'. Opening a channel with a massivly connected hub like Amazon, a bitcoin Exchange or a bank is more like depositing money with a bank than sending some bitcoin to another wallet, (a hot wallet if you like). I don't know how to explain it more clearly than that. Feel free to show me why I'm wrong. I'm often wrong about a great many things

Opening a channel is not the same as depositing money in a bank.
Depositing money implies you are trusting someone with your coins.
This is not the case, a channel is completely trustless.
In the entirety of a Lightning transaction there is no point at which an attacker can steal you coins. The worst that can happen, if they behave maliciously, is they force you to wait for a timeout, but at the end of the timeout you get all that is owed.
During the lifetime of a transaction and a channel, there is no point at which you need to trust any 3rd party.
If a 3rd party acts maliciously, they will effectively perform a denial of service attack upon you.
This DOS attack will damage the nodes/recipients reputation and so will probably not be a desirable course of action for them.
In the very rare instance where one is performed, you can simply make the transaction via a different route.

So I don't see how an comparison with a bank is valid.

Everyone needs to connect to the network via at least 1 node, possibly more, you are obviously going to connect to nodes with good onward connections, so the idea of hubs developing may well be valid, but the network topolgy claimed by Jonald Fyookball is completly unproven and the recent network diagrams from the Lightning testnet do not support it.


The big blockers have attacked Lightning at every turn, mostly without evidence and understanding, I suggest you retain an open mind until the network is up and running then we can judge it in reality.

[thisisntbic]

3day chart seems to be drawing the perfect bubble...

In what way? Looks exactly like December 26th-28th, almost exactly where it is today except a bit higher. So, breaking bubbling upwards... again?

_{edit: further thoughts/ramblings, and grammar}

In the way the perfect anatomy of a bubble is described. Doesn't certainly mean we are going to crash. But currently it's not looking to bright.

Elaborate. There are multiple phases of a bubble, which do you see/think we are in? First sell off? Return to the mean? Both of those are right before great increases => bullish.

[flynn]

UPDATE   (thanx to fluidjax for working exchanges and gentlemand for missing btx)
 
name - homesite - wallet - exchange

BTG  - https://bitcoingold.org - https://github.com/BTCGPU/BTCGPU - https://hitbtc.com
BCH  - https://www.bitcoincash.org/ - https://www.bitcoinabc.org/ - https://hitbtc.com
BCD  - http://btcd.io - https://github.com/eveybcd/BitcoinDiamond - https://gate.io/
SBTC - http://supersmartbitcoin.com/ - https://github.com/superbitcoin/SuperBitcoin - https://www.okex.com/ or gate.io
BTX  -  https://www.bitcore.cc/ - https://github.com/LIMXTEC/BitCore/releases - https://hitbtc.com
BTW  - http://www.btw.one - https://github.com/btwone/btwcore ? - ?
UBTC -  https://www.ub.com/ - https://www.ub.com/project/wallet - https://www.okex.com/

Update is about the last one BTW :
I didn't find any git repo on the homesite, that one is one I found, not sure if legit, but the names sound right.
So far it does not compile unless you install libsodium.
Once it's compiling, it doesn't not run unless you find and install the very latest libsodium.so lib.
Once it's running, it doesn't download the blockchain, because I guess i am the only one on Earth to run this, or something.

That is all.

[RealMachasm]

UPDATE   (thanx to fluidjax for working exchanges and gentlemand for missing btx)
 
name - homesite - wallet - exchange

BTG  - https://bitcoingold.org - https://github.com/BTCGPU/BTCGPU - https://hitbtc.com
BCH  - https://www.bitcoincash.org/ - https://www.bitcoinabc.org/ - https://hitbtc.com
BCD  - http://btcd.io - https://github.com/eveybcd/BitcoinDiamond - https://gate.io/
SBTC - http://supersmartbitcoin.com/ - https://github.com/superbitcoin/SuperBitcoin - https://www.okex.com/
BTX  -  https://www.bitcore.cc/ - https://github.com/LIMXTEC/BitCore/releases - https://hitbtc.com
BTW  - http://www.btw.one - https://github.com/btwone/btwcore ? - ?

Update is about the last one BTW :
I didn't find any git repo on the homesite, that one is one I found, not sure if legit, but the names sound right.
So far it does not compile unless you install libsodium.
Once it's compiling, it doesn't not run unless you find and install the very latest libsodium.so lib.
Once it's running, it doesn't download the blockchain, because I guess i am the only one on Earth to run this, or something.

That is all.

If you use Bither and bitpie you can get your BTW that way although they seem completely useless for the moment since there is no working Exchange to dump them.

[flynn]

If you use Bither and bitpie you can get your BTW that way although they seem completely useless for the moment since there is no working Exchange to dump them.

thank you for this. I just don't trust Android or Iphones for that matter.

I wonder how bitpie managed to get connected to that blockchain without any source for a full node;

[Dabs]

Do you guys remember SatoshiDice? It was all on-chain.

Then came PrimeDice, Rolling-Something, and Just-Dice. They are all off-chain. PD and JD are still around, and there are a dozen other off-chain casinos.

You buy your "poker chips" with 1 on-chain transaction. You play hundreds, or even thousands of times (or in my case, I actually did 1.3 million rolls). When you've finally lost it all, you can top up again with 1 on-chain transaction.

If you manage to win more than you began with, or you just want to stop, you can withdraw to "cold storage" with 1 on-chain transaction.

Except with LN, you can now fund/play any casino even if you first "deposited" with any other casino.


That's how I see it. Replace casino with purse.io / amazon / starblocks / coffee / walmart / microsoft / sony ps4 / bitpay / coinbase / steam / battlenet / etc.

[keyboard warrior]

UPDATE   (thanx to fluidjax for working exchanges and gentlemand for missing btx)
 
name - homesite - wallet - exchange

BTG  - https://bitcoingold.org - https://github.com/BTCGPU/BTCGPU - https://hitbtc.com
BCH  - https://www.bitcoincash.org/ - https://www.bitcoinabc.org/ - https://hitbtc.com
BCD  - http://btcd.io - https://github.com/eveybcd/BitcoinDiamond - https://gate.io/
SBTC - http://supersmartbitcoin.com/ - https://github.com/superbitcoin/SuperBitcoin - https://www.okex.com/
BTX  -  https://www.bitcore.cc/ - https://github.com/LIMXTEC/BitCore/releases - https://hitbtc.com
BTW  - http://www.btw.one - https://github.com/btwone/btwcore ? - ?

Update is about the last one BTW :
I didn't find any git repo on the homesite, that one is one I found, not sure if legit, but the names sound right.
So far it does not compile unless you install libsodium.
Once it's compiling, it doesn't not run unless you find and install the very latest libsodium.so lib.
Once it's running, it doesn't download the blockchain, because I guess i am the only one on Earth to run this, or something.

That is all.

There's also Bitcoin Candy, a new Bitcoin Cash fork.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2715832.0

It says this exchange will support it.

https://www.coinex.com/

However it sounds dubious as it somehow has a 1% premine, and I don't understand how a legit fork can have a premine.

[ssmc2]

UPDATE   (thanx to fluidjax for working exchanges and gentlemand for missing btx)
 
name - homesite - wallet - exchange

BTG  - https://bitcoingold.org - https://github.com/BTCGPU/BTCGPU - https://hitbtc.com
BCH  - https://www.bitcoincash.org/ - https://www.bitcoinabc.org/ - https://hitbtc.com
BCD  - http://btcd.io - https://github.com/eveybcd/BitcoinDiamond - https://gate.io/
SBTC - http://supersmartbitcoin.com/ - https://github.com/superbitcoin/SuperBitcoin - https://www.okex.com/
BTX  -  https://www.bitcore.cc/ - https://github.com/LIMXTEC/BitCore/releases - https://hitbtc.com
BTW  - http://www.btw.one - https://github.com/btwone/btwcore ? - ?

Update is about the last one BTW :
I didn't find any git repo on the homesite, that one is one I found, not sure if legit, but the names sound right.
So far it does not compile unless you install libsodium.
Once it's compiling, it doesn't not run unless you find and install the very latest libsodium.so lib.
Once it's running, it doesn't download the blockchain, because I guess i am the only one on Earth to run this, or something.

That is all.

Awesome info thanks! Fyi to any US people here, you can also use gate.io to get rid of your SBTC. Okex doesn't  allow anyone with a US cell phone to register.

[Toxic2040]

Do you guys remember SatoshiDice? It was all on-chain.

Then came PrimeDice, Rolling-Something, and Just-Dice. They are all off-chain. PD and JD are still around, and there are a dozen other off-chain casinos.

You buy your "poker chips" with 1 on-chain transaction. You play hundreds, or even thousands of times (or in my case, I actually did 1.3 million rolls). When you've finally lost it all, you can top up again with 1 on-chain transaction.

If you manage to win more than you began with, or you just want to stop, you can withdraw to "cold storage" with 1 on-chain transaction.

Except with LN, you can now fund/play any casino even if you first "deposited" with any other casino.


That's how I see it. Replace casino with purse.io / amazon / starblocks / coffee / walmart / microsoft / sony ps4 / bitpay / coinbase / steam / battlenet / etc.

Ahh..SD...1.3 mio rolls    You got it bad Dabs. Miss it terribly...another one I miss is SwC.  One of my fav dives from the way back machine.  Is that bitcoin tx bubble thingy still going? Used to stare at it for hours while listening to music and doing paperwork.

And regarding legacy accounts at bittrex..I went thru the same thing last year. But you can contact support via slack or email and establish a deposit/withdrawal limit that fits your portfolio.

*edit*

Found it..looks like it has evolved some...still fun.
http://www.bitlisten.com/

[Last of the V8s]

cannot find a link for the bitcoin cash whitepaper. anyone?

[Toxic2040]

cannot find a link for the bitcoin cash whitepaper. anyone?

https://www.bitcoincash.org/bitcoin.pdf

*edit*
Bleh..seems this is just Satoshi's.  Looking further..

*edit* to the *edit*


AFAICT...BTC and BCH share the original Satoshi white paper. Which makes sense since BCH is just a clone. I have zero information as to what their roadmap looks like nor do I care tbh.

[keyboard warrior]

https://i.imgur.com/x8U0HoG.png
Life is good.

17% buyers fee ? -2% sellers fee ? That's outrageous !

You're getting fucked both ways !

Sheeeeit !!!

He might be getting fucked both ways, but he's not getting goxxed.