Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[HairyMaclairy]

Sometimes I seriously wonder if people have some unconscious desire to be poor and mediocre. I just cannot fathom how somebody could wish to be more than they are without trying to work towards that goal with even the tiniest increments.

This bothers me a lot about people. I can't get why they are not willing to change up their lifestyle and mindset to reach the goals they desire. My theory on why so far, is that they are easier satisfied and they are happy enough with things staying like the way they are. Therefore don't feel the need to work on oneself. Some people just don't need much in life and are perfectly fine being mediocre. It's something that I sometimes I admire in people, the simplicity of being satisfied with less.

I have run into this a lot, especially in foreign countries, when I need something and I am willing to pay for it. The difficulty of getting so many services makes me keep thinking in my head "do you hate money!?!". In Germany when I was looking for an apartment I felt like just driving down the street with a wad of euros in my hand shouting "I will pay you to rent a place, hell I'll over-pay!". I ended up just using AirBnB to find a place.

You need a leasing agent who is working for you to take you around. 

[sirazimuth]

I thought this was a really good comparison: Striking similarity between Ellen DeGeneres' 2018 "Bitcoin Explanation" and 1994 Today's Show "What is the Internet, Anyway?"

Perhaps 2018 is bitcoin's 1994.

Hopefully not to the tee. If the timeline was the same we'd be quite far off from mainstream adoption. Wouldn't mind seeing it a bit earlier than that. Wasn't the internet fairly unpopular until 2012ish and on? Don't really remember when it exploded anymore since I kept doing my thing unphased.

Not sure of the year but I think it exploded when the 56k modem finally arrived and you didn't have to wait 30 minutes for a playboy pic to load anymore.

around 1995
got me my monster WIN 95 2 Gb HD (twice as much as most others at the time) system and 200MHertz processor
or something.
I got me my 56k modem and trolled on the Prodigy niteshift chat rooms when I worked 2nd shift.
I loved trolling the chatrooms. One in particular I'll never forget called "Prodigy Polite Chat"
my chat buddy dared me to go in there and type in all caps
HEY IS THIS WHERE ALL YOU POLITE MOTHERFUCKERS SHOOT THE SHIT!!?  
It was late I'd had a few and I'm a nerdy young asshat so I did   ...lol
Some dude answered back and I quote "no this is where we shoot assholes!! " lmao, great comeback bud!!
Anyway got banned for a week but we had a good laugh about it, and I can tell my grand kids the story when I'm in the nursing home....

[Biodom]

There were several polls where people tried to find a correlation between the income and happiness.
The population of US as a whole indicated that increases up to 75K/year would make them happier, but further increase would not (average US family income is about 50-53K).

Anyone earning ridiculous amounts of money will make people jealous. Coping with that jealousy would make most people miserable and depressed. Imagine parking your lambo then returning and finding someone jealous has scratched the paint work.

It does not seem to happen around here (south of US) as there are lots of good cars around (mostly beemers and jags, though).
Not many lambos.

[ChinkyEyes]

I thought this was a really good comparison: Striking similarity between Ellen DeGeneres' 2018 "Bitcoin Explanation" and 1994 Today's Show "What is the Internet, Anyway?"

Perhaps 2018 is bitcoin's 1994.

Hopefully not to the tee. If the timeline was the same we'd be quite far off from mainstream adoption. Wouldn't mind seeing it a bit earlier than that. Wasn't the internet fairly unpopular until 2012ish and on? Don't really remember when it exploded anymore since I kept doing my thing unphased.

Not sure of the year but I think it exploded when the 56k modem finally arrived and you didn't have to wait 30 minutes for a playboy pic to load anymore.

Maybe the US was different, but I remember the internet still being very much fringe even when the first DSL flat rates were just coming out.

Sometimes I seriously wonder if people have some unconscious desire to be poor and mediocre. I just cannot fathom how somebody could wish to be more than they are without trying to work towards that goal with even the tiniest increments.

This bothers me a lot about people. I can't get why they are not willing to change up their lifestyle and mindset to reach the goals they desire. My theory on why so far, is that they are easier satisfied and they are happy enough with things staying like the way they are. Therefore don't feel the need to work on oneself. Some people just don't need much in life and are perfectly fine being mediocre. It's something that I sometimes I admire in people, the simplicity of being satisfied with less.

But why would they complain so much if they were satisfied? And why would depression and suicide rates both be climbing?

That is a very good question, but we cannot just assume that it's because the whole population of the poor and mediocre are all depressed and suicidal deep inside. Even smart people seem to be more likely to be depressed and doubt one self. Because they tend to live more in their head and overthink things.

With the arrival of the information age I think we have produced way more smart people than ever before. The internet has become such a powerful tool to educate yourself, anybody with an cellphone has a tremendous amount of knowledge in their pocket. Too bad many people choose to not use it to it's fullest potential. So that could be one of the reasons why depression and suicide rates are climbing. I'm not sure I have not done research on this matter.

I overthink 24/7. It's what I enjoy the most, even when it gets frustrating at times. Also, having information available or even knowing it by heart doesn't mean that you're going to be great at assimilating it or at creating things by drawing from your knowledge and reshaping it into something new. It's why schools utterly fail to produce outstanding people.

But you're right, depression isn't just common among mediocre people. I believe there was a study that concluded that people with much less (e.g. those that are basically starving and have nothing) tend to be happier on average than people in first world countries. Not sure how rigorous that study was though.

I agree, schools are only focusing on one way of teaching. It feels like how I imagine a car must feel like when it is being assembled in the factory.

[BTCMILLIONAIRE]

In terms of awareness it is probably 1998 but adoption wise it is probably around 1995 with just the university kids on the Net. Cool colleagues have just started trading crypto but the rest is still ignoring it. Some probably will the rest of their lives 

I'm not even sure if the mainstream will get into crypto the same way as us. I could see them using it as a replacement for Paypal and credit cards in the "far" future or in some more sophisticated form of cryptokittes. But the general population isn't into risks, especially if they aren't very obvious and layed out for you as if you were braindead (like modern games). And crypto is inherently fuzzy and unpredictable without an understanding of real world Economics or at least Statistics.

[HairyMaclairy]

...
Perhaps 2018 is bitcoin's 1994.

...By 1998 things had changed alot.  Win 95/98 IE/Netscape made it much more useful and simple to use the internet and sites began to proliferate.  I had dropped out to take a 35k job at a search engine optimization company (which seemed like alot at the time) that quickly went out of biz, but my connections from that job led to other connections that have kept me working for the 20 years since.

tldr; if it's 1994,  buckle up, things will be unrecognizable in 4 years.

What would be our Netscape moment? Or AOL temporary dominance?
Is Lightning a.k.a Netscape (without the IPO) and is Coinbase/Binance/Bitfinex, perhaps, the AOL equivalent?
Or, would it be something else out of left field?

We need a third layer solution with a stable unit of account.  Or a way of using Lightning but pricing everything in local currrency so it is fully automated and no one has to think in BTC or Satoshis. 

[bitserve]

In terms of awareness it is probably 1998 but adoption wise it is probably around 1995 with just the university kids on the Net. Cool colleagues have just started trading crypto but the rest is still ignoring it. Some probably will the rest of their lives 

It makes sense. Almost everybody has already heard of Bitcoin the same as Internet in 95-97. But way less than 1% got/use, so it is 93-95 in that.

Also in terms of development it is like when we only had telnet, ftp, email and irc (I always considered gopher useless).... and everything was command line/shell only.

It was the development of HTPP what transformed it into something "ready" for mainstream people.

I think we still lack that "http" of Bitcoin... but LN is surely a step in the right direction.

And it was major players like AOL what helped in its adoption... I am not sure Bitcoin already have its "AOL" or if we could consider Coinbase to be the equivalent.

[BTCMILLIONAIRE]

...
Perhaps 2018 is bitcoin's 1994.

...By 1998 things had changed alot.  Win 95/98 IE/Netscape made it much more useful and simple to use the internet and sites began to proliferate.  I had dropped out to take a 35k job at a search engine optimization company (which seemed like alot at the time) that quickly went out of biz, but my connections from that job led to other connections that have kept me working for the 20 years since.

tldr; if it's 1994,  buckle up, things will be unrecognizable in 4 years.

What would be our Netscape moment? Or AOL temporary dominance?
Is Lightning a.k.a Netscape (without the IPO) and is Coinbase/Binance/Bitfinex, perhaps, the AOL equivalent?
Or, would it be something else out of left field?

We need a third layer solution with a stable unit of account.  Or a way of using Lightning but pricing everything in local currrency so it is fully automated and no one has to think in BTC or Satoshis. 

I actually expect the latter to happen in one form or another. The blockchain being the backbone of the financial world, but the mainstream believing that they are still using fiat. People don't like instability and uncertainty, even if it's beneficial to them.

[Last of the V8s]

I really have a man crush on your ideology Jimmie. Refreshing to know I am not alone.

Something else to ponder...This Wall we observe...this is a historical document..one wonders what will be thought about it in the future. Some of the replies and responses left here will potentially guide future generations.

Think about these things as you glibly type down what ever stray thought comes to mind. We are the forerunners of a paradigm shift in not only the world of financial markets but in the basic fundamental structure of society.

tl;dr  Raise the bar.

Why not start with yourself and leave the moralising to others till you have thought it through.

On glibness, start with yourself. Your stirring little speech coins the phrase 'to really have a man crush on s.o.'s ideology.' Glib. Let's hope future generations don't 'pick it up and run with it'. It's ugly, sloppy.

You descend into self-importance ('We';'historical';'guide';'forerunners'), and trite platitude ('the forerunners...society'), and error (your 'what ever' should arguably be 'whatever', your 'basic fundamental' is tautologous and downright annoying).

could say much more/can't be arsed

[suchmoon]

And it was major players like AOL what helped in its adoption... I am not sure Bitcoin already have its "AOL" or if we could consider Coinbase to be the equivalent.

Coinbase support (or lack thereof) is very much AOL-esque. As is their infuriating slowness at times. Adoption - not so much. They insist on using less favorable exchange rates AND charging much higher fees on Coinbase than on GDAX. Makes no sense. As if they're deliberately trying to piss users off.

[marcus_of_augustus]

With the arrival of the information age I think we have produced way more smart people than ever before. The internet has become such a powerful tool to educate yourself, anybody with an cellphone has a tremendous amount of knowledge in their pocket. Too bad many people choose to not use it to it's fullest potential.

you might be confusing 'smartness' with something else entirely ... idiots educated beyond the level of their intellectual capacity is not a new phenomena .... probably the internet has just created a swag more of these dangerous fools .... case in point take jbreher with his dunning-kruger tendencies now leading him to write in overly-eloquent verbiage to convey trivial, and usually erroneous, meandering thoughts; then hops on his high-horse about a computer science and networking design matter that is clearly well-outside his grasp, and follows up to defend his bruised ego by championing a cause that is clearly to his economic detriment ... that fact alone encapsulates educated beyond their intelligence.

[El duderino_]

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UPDATE     AND GOOD LUCK

[bitserve]

And it was major players like AOL what helped in its adoption... I am not sure Bitcoin already have its "AOL" or if we could consider Coinbase to be the equivalent.

Coinbase support (or lack thereof) is very much AOL-esque. As is their infuriating slowness at times. Adoption - not so much. They insist on using less favorable exchange rates AND charging much higher fees on Coinbase than on GDAX. Makes no sense. As if they're deliberately trying to piss users off.

It's a common business practice to raise prices (fees in this case) when you can't service all the demand. So it is somewhat fair what they are doing, presumably until they scale enough to (adequately) attend a bigger user base. AOL was also more expensive than what earlier Internet users had (ie: free for one reasons or another).

So yes... maybe coinbase is our AOL. Let's just hope they do things right and other competitors also rise.

[BTCMILLIONAIRE]

With the arrival of the information age I think we have produced way more smart people than ever before. The internet has become such a powerful tool to educate yourself, anybody with an cellphone has a tremendous amount of knowledge in their pocket. Too bad many people choose to not use it to it's fullest potential.

you might be confusing 'smartness' with something else entirely ... idiots educated beyond the level of their intellectual capacity is not a new phenomena .... probably the internet has just created a swag more of these dangerous fools .... case in point take jbreher with his dunning-kruger tendencies now leading him to write in overly-eloquent verbiage to convey trivial, and usually erroneous, meandering thoughts; then hops on his high-horse about a computer science and networking design matter that is clearly well-outside his grasp, and follows up to defend his bruised ego by championing a cause that is clearly to his economic detriment ... that fact alone encapsulates educated beyond their intelligence.

I've been meaning to ask, but what is the product series in your avatar?

The only things that come to mind are sine and cosine, but those are sums and have 2pi in their summands. So I thought it could be something along the lines of a log of a negative exponential due to the -1 factor that doesn't appear in the standard expression for the exponential series and the product could've been a result of a logarithm.
But that wouldn't really make sense either, unless you were deliberately trying to create a series that looks complicated, makes some references, but ultimately is just a fancy way to write something like "1".

Don't really feel like refreshing my analysis to figure out the limit of the series, hence my question.

[marcus_of_augustus]

In terms of awareness it is probably 1998 but adoption wise it is probably around 1995 with just the university kids on the Net. Cool colleagues have just started trading crypto but the rest is still ignoring it. Some probably will the rest of their lives  

I'm not even sure if the mainstream will get into crypto the same way as us. I could see them using it as a replacement for Paypal and credit cards in the "far" future or in some more sophisticated form of cryptokittes. But the general population isn't into risks, especially if they aren't very obvious and layed out for you as if you were braindead (like modern games). And crypto is inherently fuzzy and unpredictable without an understanding of real world Economics or at least Statistics.

Globally, 1% of the population controls 80% of the wealth, in USA 0.1% of the population controls the same amount of wealth as the bottom 90%.

Bitcoin is money. Although money is used by the mainstream, bitcoin wealth is unlikely to be adopted by the mainstream, and does not need to be to compete in the market of existing currencies. Wealth inequality means if current wealth holders adopt bitcoin it has succeeded, it clearly does not need to "go mainstream' in the way that SV is thinking of previous adoptions of new technologies and networks.

[elg]

wow, such se reflechier, wisdom in the last pages, no shouting, no war , unreal
but a good read  

[Torque]

...
Perhaps 2018 is bitcoin's 1994.

...By 1998 things had changed alot.  Win 95/98 IE/Netscape made it much more useful and simple to use the internet and sites began to proliferate.  I had dropped out to take a 35k job at a search engine optimization company (which seemed like alot at the time) that quickly went out of biz, but my connections from that job led to other connections that have kept me working for the 20 years since.

tldr; if it's 1994,  buckle up, things will be unrecognizable in 4 years.

What would be our Netscape moment? Or AOL temporary dominance?
Is Lightning a.k.a Netscape (without the IPO) and is Coinbase/Binance/Bitfinex, perhaps, the AOL equivalent?
Or, would it be something else out of left field?

At this point, I think Bitcoin's "internet" or "Netscape" moment won't have much to do with a bunch of tech advancements to either Bitcoin or 2nd layer solutions. Personally I think it's going to be Bitcoin ETFs that define the turning point.

When Wall Street and corporations start singing the praises of Bitcoin ETFs, hedge fund investors can begin to invest directly through those vehicles, and Mom and Pop suddenly find a Bitcoin ETF as part of their company's Mutual Fund 401k portfolio offerings... then look the fk out.

Money will come pouring in. And Average Joes on the street will suddenly start buying in as well.

And possibly something like Bitcoin being added as a payment option to EBay or Amazon. That would also be huge.

[suchmoon]

And it was major players like AOL what helped in its adoption... I am not sure Bitcoin already have its "AOL" or if we could consider Coinbase to be the equivalent.

Coinbase support (or lack thereof) is very much AOL-esque. As is their infuriating slowness at times. Adoption - not so much. They insist on using less favorable exchange rates AND charging much higher fees on Coinbase than on GDAX. Makes no sense. As if they're deliberately trying to piss users off.

It's a common business practice to raise prices (fees in this case) when you can't service all the demand. So it is somewhat fair what they are doing, presumably until they scale enough to (adequately) attend a bigger user base. AOL was also more expensive than what earlier Internet users had (ie: free for one reasons or another).

So yes... maybe coinbase is our AOL. Let's just hope they do things right and other competitors also rise.

So all we need now is a book store named after a river...

Edit:

Amazon

LOL

[marcus_of_augustus]

I've been meaning to ask, but what is the product series in your avatar?

The only things that come to mind are sine and cosine, but those are sums and have 2pi in their summands. So I thought it could be something along the lines of a log of a negative exponential due to the -1 factor that doesn't appear in the standard expression for the exponential series and the product could've been a result of a logarithm.

it is the series for a function I discovered that has some useful and interesting properties. PM me if you want to know any more.

[BTCMILLIONAIRE]

I've been meaning to ask, but what is the product series in your avatar?

The only things that come to mind are sine and cosine, but those are sums and have 2pi in their summands. So I thought it could be something along the lines of a log of a negative exponential due to the -1 factor that doesn't appear in the standard expression for the exponential series and the product could've been a result of a logarithm.

it is the series for a function I discovered that has some useful and interesting properties. PM me if you want to know any more.

PM sent.