MtGox withdrawal delays [Gathering]

[zeroblock]

It's not MtGox's fault! They are just a completely innocent victim of US govt!

REMAIN CALM, ALL IS WELL https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDAmPIq29ro

02:42 < cyro432> I am aware of a number of delayed wire transfers over 3 weeks old
02:42 <@MagicalTux> cyro432: not much we can do right now because of US govt

This cyro432 needs to get out more. I am aware of a delayed wire transfer that is over 8 weeks old: mine.

Can anyone confirm this conversation?  If this is true, then we need to escalate this to a major news source.  Gox needs to be outed for the fraud that it really is.

[samson]

It's not MtGox's fault! They are just a completely innocent victim of US govt!

REMAIN CALM, ALL IS WELL https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDAmPIq29ro

02:42 < cyro432> I am aware of a number of delayed wire transfers over 3 weeks old
02:42 <@MagicalTux> cyro432: not much we can do right now because of US govt

This cyro432 needs to get out more. I am aware of a delayed wire transfer that is over 8 weeks old: mine.

Can anyone confirm this conversation?  If this is true, then we need to escalate this to a major news source.  Gox needs to be outed for the fraud that it really is.

I can confirm it - it's on my screen now in the #mtgox channel on freenode.

[07:40] * cyro432 has joined #mtgox
[07:40] <cyro432> MagicalTux, people in this forum are saying they are going to go to SEC over not receiving money
[07:40] <cyro432> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=179586.500
[07:41] <Title> [ MtGox withdrawal delays [Gathering] ]
[07:41] <DBordello> MagicalTux, that would be great.  I am sure it'd help reduce the load
[07:42] <cyro432> I am aware of a number of delayed wire transfers over 3 weeks old
[07:42] <@MagicalTux> cyro432: not much we can do right now because of US govt
[07:44] * torment has joined #mtgox
[07:49] * sheldonthomas has joined #mtgox
[07:53] <phantomcircuit> cyro432, irony of ironies going to the us gov to fix a problem they largely created

The differences in time shown here are due to the IRC program displaying local time. My timezone is GMT+7, Bangkok time.

[Ban Curtain]

hehe, gox still have problems with withdraws...
about month ago I've contacted their support and they canceled my withdrawal (they returned money to mtgox account), I converted them into btcs and withdrawn.

So I think that problem is not in lack of money in mtgox but in law restrictions.

Modern financial laws are too totalitarian)

[Ban Curtain]

Seems that my experience is already outdated.
I have problems with withdraw of bitcoins.
Web site writes me that bitcoin address where I trying to send money to is invalid ("Invalid bitcoin address, please confirm your input"), I  tried 3 addresses - the same error (I used the same address as used before ).
No support in chat, i hope they'll response me by email.

Very suspicious that they stopped to withdraw bitcoins...

[zeroblock]

It's not MtGox's fault! They are just a completely innocent victim of US govt!

REMAIN CALM, ALL IS WELL https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDAmPIq29ro

02:42 < cyro432> I am aware of a number of delayed wire transfers over 3 weeks old
02:42 <@MagicalTux> cyro432: not much we can do right now because of US govt

This cyro432 needs to get out more. I am aware of a delayed wire transfer that is over 8 weeks old: mine.

Can anyone confirm this conversation?  If this is true, then we need to escalate this to a major news source.  Gox needs to be outed for the fraud that it really is.

I can confirm it - it's on my screen now in the #mtgox channel on freenode.

[07:40] * cyro432 has joined #mtgox
[07:40] <cyro432> MagicalTux, people in this forum are saying they are going to go to SEC over not receiving money
[07:40] <cyro432> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=179586.500
[07:41] <Title> [ MtGox withdrawal delays [Gathering] ]
[07:41] <DBordello> MagicalTux, that would be great.  I am sure it'd help reduce the load
[07:42] <cyro432> I am aware of a number of delayed wire transfers over 3 weeks old
[07:42] <@MagicalTux> cyro432: not much we can do right now because of US govt
[07:44] * torment has joined #mtgox
[07:49] * sheldonthomas has joined #mtgox
[07:53] <phantomcircuit> cyro432, irony of ironies going to the us gov to fix a problem they largely created

The differences in time shown here are due to the IRC program displaying local time. My timezone is GMT+7, Bangkok time.

Whoa, alright time to hit up some media contacts everyone! 

[manfred]

It's not MtGox's fault! They are just a completely innocent victim of US govt!

REMAIN CALM, ALL IS WELL https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDAmPIq29ro

02:42 < cyro432> I am aware of a number of delayed wire transfers over 3 weeks old
02:42 <@MagicalTux> cyro432: not much we can do right now because of US govt

This cyro432 needs to get out more. I am aware of a delayed wire transfer that is over 8 weeks old: mine.

People waiting over 4 Months for EUR withdrawal.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=271597.msg2909636#msg2909636

[sturle]

Can anyone confirm this conversation?  If this is true, then we need to escalate this to a major news source.  Gox needs to be outed for the fraud that it really is.

I can confirm it - it's on my screen now in the #mtgox channel on freenode.

[07:40] * cyro432 has joined #mtgox
[07:40] <cyro432> MagicalTux, people in this forum are saying they are going to go to SEC over not receiving money
[07:40] <cyro432> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=179586.500
[07:41] <Title> [ MtGox withdrawal delays [Gathering] ]
[07:41] <DBordello> MagicalTux, that would be great.  I am sure it'd help reduce the load
[07:42] <cyro432> I am aware of a number of delayed wire transfers over 3 weeks old
[07:42] <@MagicalTux> cyro432: not much we can do right now because of US govt
[07:44] * torment has joined #mtgox
[07:49] * sheldonthomas has joined #mtgox
[07:53] <phantomcircuit> cyro432, irony of ironies going to the us gov to fix a problem they largely created

The differences in time shown here are due to the IRC program displaying local time. My timezone is GMT+7, Bangkok time.

Whoa, alright time to hit up some media contacts everyone! 

I don't get it.  What is new here?  The Dwolla seizure has been known for a while.  Have you been living in a cave for the last three months?

[zeroblock]

Can anyone confirm this conversation?  If this is true, then we need to escalate this to a major news source.  Gox needs to be outed for the fraud that it really is.

I can confirm it - it's on my screen now in the #mtgox channel on freenode.

[07:40] * cyro432 has joined #mtgox
[07:40] <cyro432> MagicalTux, people in this forum are saying they are going to go to SEC over not receiving money
[07:40] <cyro432> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=179586.500
[07:41] <Title> [ MtGox withdrawal delays [Gathering] ]
[07:41] <DBordello> MagicalTux, that would be great.  I am sure it'd help reduce the load
[07:42] <cyro432> I am aware of a number of delayed wire transfers over 3 weeks old
[07:42] <@MagicalTux> cyro432: not much we can do right now because of US govt
[07:44] * torment has joined #mtgox
[07:49] * sheldonthomas has joined #mtgox
[07:53] <phantomcircuit> cyro432, irony of ironies going to the us gov to fix a problem they largely created

The differences in time shown here are due to the IRC program displaying local time. My timezone is GMT+7, Bangkok time.

Whoa, alright time to hit up some media contacts everyone! 

I don't get it.  What is new here?  The Dwolla seizure has been known for a while.  Have you been living in a cave for the last three months?

No.  What Karpeles is confirming is that the USD withdraws are being halted by the US gov.  NOT due to problems with Mt.Gox's banking connections, which they have used as an excuse the last 2 months.  This essentially means that USD withdraws will not resume for quite some time, if ever.   

[Nagle]

No.  What Karpeles is confirming is that the USD withdraws are being halted by the US gov.  NOT due to problems with Mt.Gox's banking connections, which they have used as an excuse the last 2 months. 

That's what he's claiming. Or that someone is interpreting that he's claiming.

Whether that's true is something else entirely. When an agency of the U.S. Government clamps down on some fraud or money laundering scheme, it's very obvious. When the SEC shut down "pirate"'s Ponzi scheme, there were press releases, news coverage, and arrests. When Liberty Reserve was shut down for money laundering, there were arrests and news coverage. When Mt. Gox screwed up dealing with CoinLab, there was a $75 million dollar lawsuit.

All we have here are more excuses from a probably-broke company. If you have money, and need to send it somewhere, there are many ways to do it. If you don't have money...

[ab8989]

No.  What Karpeles is confirming is that the USD withdraws are being halted by the US gov.  NOT due to problems with Mt.Gox's banking connections, which they have used as an excuse the last 2 months.  This essentially means that USD withdraws will not resume for quite some time, if ever.  

These two explanations can both be true at the same time so I don't see a big controversy here.

My personal guess is that the problems arrived when Gox registered as a money transmitter at the federal level, but they lack the necessary licensing from state level.

Before they were not registered as a money transmitter they could fly under the radar for some of the banks as some kind of strange business selling some bits on the net. Now that they are officially money transmitter that explanation does not fly anymore but since they do not have licensing to operate as such no bank wants to touch their business with a ten foot pole and it gets more difficult each day as they seem like a very untrustworthy unlicensed money transmitter.

Their immediate problem is that they cannot find a bank that wants to do USD based business with an unlicensed money transmitter.

Maybe Gox wants to say that the root cause is US gov being evil by seizing their funds and creating silly rules. Somebody else could say that the root cause for the problems is Gox entering this limbo status on their own actions.

Just my guess.

[zeroblock]

No.  What Karpeles is confirming is that the USD withdraws are being halted by the US gov.  NOT due to problems with Mt.Gox's banking connections, which they have used as an excuse the last 2 months.  This essentially means that USD withdraws will not resume for quite some time, if ever.  

These two explanations can both be true at the same time so I don't see a big controversy here.

My personal guess is that the problems arrived when Gox registered as a money transmitter at the federal level, but they lack the necessary licensing from state level.

Before they were not registered as a money transmitter they could fly under the radar for some of the banks as some kind of strange business selling some bits on the net. Now that they are officially money transmitter that explanation does not fly anymore but since they do not have licensing to operate as such no bank wants to touch their business with a ten foot pole and it gets more difficult each day as they seem like a very untrustworthy unlicensed money transmitter.

Their immediate problem is that they cannot find a bank that wants to do USD based business with an unlicensed money transmitter.

Their problems stem from incompetency, not because the registered as an MSB with FinCEN.  Their immediate problem is also their relatively permanent problem.  Not only will it take at least a year to get their Money transmitter licenses in all 50 states, but they exchanged liberty reserve dollars, and they have a $75MM lawsuit over their heads.  Good luck having a US bank willing to take on that kind of risk... ever. 

[geetee]

First; longtime reader, first-time caller, love the show.

I completely agree with the last statement about gox putting us in this condition by it's own actions, whether by being completely incompetent, or willfully trying to evade the multi-million-dollar cost of a Licensed-Money-Transmitter-Registration Requirements is a side note. It's done, and now we're all in a box. Is the year-long waiting period to be registered in all 50 states as a money transmitter a legitimate guess? Doesn't that also mean we could just get the money out *technically* after the first state has allowed them to operate? Cause in my case I would just drive to that state, get a bank account set up, and withdraw.

That idea seems... dubious... I would think you get access to all 50 states or none, if you were granted federal money-transmitter status. one state at a time? Arg, really?

What I would love, is if someone could ask ol' Mark Karp what the status of the Registered Money Transmitter License is. Has it been granted? Is it going to be granted? how long do these things take? Could it be that the Dept O HomelandSSec could just permanently invoke a 'you will never be registered' amount of red tape on Gox?

It's my understanding that they (mtgox/Karpeles) finally read some rules after the dwolla link got shut off, and realized you can't transfer a few million in and out of your dwolla acct each day without having to register somewhere with someone, and finally got the ball rolling. for heavens sake, my cat could run a company better.

But now, to the banks, it looks like you are running a fly-by-night operation, and no doubt to the EU banks too. Problem is, after the US and EU, there aren't really any global banks left... paypal? TD bank?(toronto dominion) [not really an option] Bank of the republic of congo?

Are they even looking? Also, i don't think anyone ever replied to the question of JPN withdrawals being delayed - or when a last successful withdrawal to a JPN account was made. This could be the smoking gun, since in Gox's cryptic Aug 5th statement they made some reference about the japanese government assuring them they could operate normally and they're not under suspicion - what the hell? Sooo the author's inferring that other governments ARE viewing gox with suspicion...? Can i haz elaborationz plz. [you can read that silly statement on their facebook update page along with their other nonsense] Anyway, it seems like if you can get Yen, gox can't be trusted with anything. Since the US has nothing to do with JPN banks. the US can't interfere with them. soooo - where the crap are the yen withdrawals.

Can we start a global thread similar to the bitcoin vs. country-GDP-parity-watch, but instead we can list when the hell the last time a withdrawal was actually completed to a country? 'Cause at this point, I WILL go to Canada/Mexico/screw it-Japan and set up a f*ing bank account to get this paper out. [and yes i know about localbitcoins and coinbase]
i also have a close childhood friend in Australia, who I may be able to ask the favor of a lifetime of, to get it out for me.

I can start;

USA
oldest known pending withdrawal: June 27th

Canada
oldest known pending withdrawal:

Japan
oldest known pending withdrawal:

Australia:
oldest known pending withdrawal:

Mexico:
oldest known pending withdrawal:

Thank you for all your attention in this regard.

[idee2013]

Seems that my experience is already outdated.
I have problems with withdraw of bitcoins.
Web site writes me that bitcoin address where I trying to send money to is invalid ("Invalid bitcoin address, please confirm your input"), I  tried 3 addresses - the same error (I used the same address as used before ).
No support in chat, i hope they'll response me by email.

Very suspicious that they stopped to withdraw bitcoins...

i have withdrawn 10 btcs today without any problems from gox

[prophetx]

Seems that my experience is already outdated.
I have problems with withdraw of bitcoins.
Web site writes me that bitcoin address where I trying to send money to is invalid ("Invalid bitcoin address, please confirm your input"), I  tried 3 addresses - the same error (I used the same address as used before ).
No support in chat, i hope they'll response me by email.

Very suspicious that they stopped to withdraw bitcoins...

i have withdrawn 10 btcs today without any problems from gox

i just tried it with a few addresses and same problem...

[italeffect]

I think the fact the Gox was supposed to sell their US business to Coinlab has to play into this. They never had any intention of being registered in the US. Perhaps they still don't and are stalling to try to sell that business off to another US player. However, there is no one in the US (that I know of) that currently has all the potential state registrations to take it on.

I still do believe they are likely insolvent (or have projected they will be soon without putting the breaks on) due to the numerous issues in many countries. If this was a US only issue none of the other problems folks are having in Europe and elsewhere would be happening.

In typical Gox fashion they seem to have made the issues much worse for themselves due to their terrible communication.

[bucktotal]

just got this reply:


"
Hello,

Thank you for the email. It appears for some reason this error is triggered from the platform for few BTC withdrawals specially, we are currently investigating on the cause and the solution. However please drop a line if you were able to withdraw after a while. We appreciate your patience and sincere apologies for the inconveniences caused.

Best regards,

Mt.Gox Team
https://www.mtgox.com
"

[justusranvier]

However, there is no one in the US (that I know of) that currently has all the potential state registrations to take it on.

There is at least one company in the process of obtaining those state registrations with the goal of taking over from Mt Gox in the US, which is something Coinlab apparently never even tried to do.

[Nagle]

There's been a sudden jump in the spread between Mt. Gox and Bitstamp.  It's gone from 11% to 14% in the last hour.

[ArticMine]

The question in my mind is that if the United States and USD are the real issue here what are the wire transfer withdrawal delays of
1) CAD to a Canadian bank?
2) EUR to a European bank?
3) GBP to an UK bank?
4) AUD to an Australian bank?

... etc.

The spread between MTGox CAD and Virtex CAD is over 17% for example. If wires that bypass the US banking system can flow then arbitrage from non US persons outside the United States can go a long way towards solving the problem of the "trapped" USD while MTGox gets its US compliance in order.

[sturle]

I don't get it.  What is new here?  The Dwolla seizure has been known for a while.  Have you been living in a cave for the last three months?

No.  What Karpeles is confirming is that the USD withdraws are being halted by the US gov.  NOT due to problems with Mt.Gox's banking connections, which they have used as an excuse the last 2 months.  This essentially means that USD withdraws will not resume for quite some time, if ever.   

This is pure speculation.  From the context I assumed, and still assume, he was referring to the Dwolla case which significantly increased the load on USD bank wires.  Why don't you ask him yourself?  He is frequently active and answering questions in #mtgox on freenode.  I'm sure he would have been there a lot more if it hadn't been for the zombies nagging about scamcoins they want on MtGox whenever he types something.  It is early morning in Japan now.  He'll be there soon.