[DVC]DevCoin - Official Thread - Moderated

[Bittzy78]

Yay! Look at the current price per devcoin! https://vircurex.com/welcome/index?alt=dvc&base=btc&locale=en
-AM

It's the volume that is amazing me. Will it get to 100 Bitcoins on just Vircurex?


~ Ninja Edit ~

I just checked the volume again and it is 65 Bitcoin at Vircurex and 51 at Crypsy. If you sprinkle in the Litecoin trading, we are certainly headed in the right direction as far as liquidity goes.

Heck, just being the #2 traded coin on Vircurex for a couple of days in a row might get people really talking about it.

If this volume holds, I would expect to see wild price swings as the market tries to settle on what Devcoin is worth.

[itsonlikedonkeykong]

Hi all,

Is anyone working on an update to the Mac OS X GUI wallet client?

I recall FuzzyBear mentioning something about it in December.

I would be more than happy to help test it out.

The latest version dated August 2013 only works one time before you need to reinstall it.

thank you,

ionldk

[hypersire]

Yay! Look at the current price per devcoin! https://vircurex.com/welcome/index?alt=dvc&base=btc&locale=en
-AM

Indeed, nice jump. Last price 103 satoshis. Perhaps a DOGE-style shot to the moon is in order. 

This could also be due to DVC / BTC now trading on Cryptsy too! My petition was not in vain

+1! Nice job psybits! I had no doubt that the LTC/DVC only pair on Cryptsy was holding it back.

Now we've got the BTC pair on Cryptsy, the new web site, a new web installer coming up... can't wait to see what happens when you launch the new press release!

It's been my feeling for a long time now that there is going to be a flood of money coming into cryptocurrencies and a full blown stampede of people pouring into a number of good ones. When I see the trading volumes for DOGE I start to think that the stampede is starting. Devcoin is definitely in the top tier of cryptocurrencies and has such a great philosophy behind it that I am constantly recommending it to all my friends and family 

[Unthinkingbit]

Collecting bounty:

Also, 48 shares plus six million devcoins for the option for the Original Poster to add moderators.

coinzen.org now supports the OP of a thread adding their own moderators - including themselves, to their posts.

When you create a new post you will have an option below your name in your posts "Set Thread Moderators"

After clicking it you'll be able to add & remove moderators for your topics.

I tested it and it worked perfectly, the Adding Moderators bounty is awarded to Tenthirtyone. The adding moderators bounty is finished. I sent him my pledge of 6 million devcoins. Smeagol, please add him to the bounty list at:
devticker.pw/business_bounty/business_bounty_32.csv

I was able as Unthinkingbit to moderate a thread where I was added as a moderator:
http://coinzen.org/index.php?topic=4.msg45#msg45

I was able to add Llama as a moderator on an Unthinkingbit thread, and as Llama I could edit posts:
http://coinzen.org/index.php?topic=3.msg3#msg3

I was not able to moderate on threads were I was not added as a moderator.

..
Hello, are all key feature of coinzen finished? I am eager to see that we have officially moved to the new forum

Enough features have been finished, the only thing lacking before I move over is to make subforums for other coins. Even though devcoin is funding the forum, the forum is meant for all coins. I want the subforums to be made before we move, because some subforums could be eliminated when stuff is moved around.

[Athanasios Motok]

I propose a 48 share bounty for whoever creates a devcoin wallet similar to that of the TREZOR Bitcoin wallet (http://www.bitcointrezor.com/).
Does anybody object to this?

Thanks,
-AM

[smeagol]

I tested it and it worked perfectly, the Adding Moderators bounty is awarded to Tenthirtyone. The adding moderators bounty is finished. I sent him my pledge of 6 million devcoins. Smeagol, please add him to the bounty list.

Done, to see the awarded shares visit
http://devticker.pw/business_bounty/business_bounty_32.csv

[weisoq]

Hi all,

Is anyone working on an update to the Mac OS X GUI wallet client?

I recall FuzzyBear mentioning something about it in December.

I would be more than happy to help test it out.

The latest version dated August 2013 only works one time before you need to reinstall it.

thank you,

ionldk

Updates are being worked done for all clients. Apologies that's still going on - assumed it had been resolved.

Is anyone else having this problem with a mac?

[weisoq]

I propose a 48 share bounty for whoever creates a devcoin wallet similar to that of the TREZOR Bitcoin wallet (http://www.bitcointrezor.com/).
Does anybody object to this?

Thanks,
-AM

Yeah probably. What is it? What's the rationale? What steps would be required? etc

[ranlo]

I propose a 48 share bounty for whoever creates a devcoin wallet similar to that of the TREZOR Bitcoin wallet (http://www.bitcointrezor.com/).
Does anybody object to this?

Thanks,
-AM

Yeah probably. What is it? What's the rationale? What steps would be required? etc

I'm against this as well right now. We have a lot of work to do before a hardware wallet is really needed. I could see this being something for the future though.

[sidhujag]

Yay! Look at the current price per devcoin! https://vircurex.com/welcome/index?alt=dvc&base=btc&locale=en
-AM

Indeed, nice jump. Last price 103 satoshis. Perhaps a DOGE-style shot to the moon is in order. 

This could also be due to DVC / BTC now trading on Cryptsy too! My petition was not in vain

+1! Nice job psybits! I had no doubt that the LTC/DVC only pair on Cryptsy was holding it back.

Now we've got the BTC pair on Cryptsy, the new web site, a new web installer coming up... can't wait to see what happens when you launch the new press release!

It's been my feeling for a long time now that there is going to be a flood of money coming into cryptocurrencies and a full blown stampede of people pouring into a number of good ones. When I see the trading volumes for DOGE I start to think that the stampede is starting. Devcoin is definitely in the top tier of cryptocurrencies and has such a great philosophy behind it that I am constantly recommending it to all my friends and family 

Yea i said this in the dogecoin thread yesterday that the institutional investor era has now begun, they lookin for cheap coins to pump... and probably dump but we should see level stepping upwards on the long term charts. Funny that the very next day devcoin takes a leap.

[Hunterbunter]

I agree that 50 would be good if it were done correctly, 100 - 150 would be better if it were done correctly. The thing is that through all the talking about it, the only thing that really stuck out was the idea was brought up and the first thing people wanted to talk about about was the name of the site. Really?! What about legal, the business rules / document, the data requirements, the security requirements, the payment processing and tax implications on the business. These are just a few of the things that have to be thought about. Is it going to be developed as an open source project and then let out in the wild for others to implement with their business rules? Was it going to be a business venture? There was no discussion about any of that, just really how the auctions would be held (which can't compete with Quibids, period) and about the name of the site. Can't see that being worth 50 shares when it was done. There would be too many problems with it. That is just that one particular project.

If there is a good project planned and put into action, I don't have a problem with giving them 200-500 shares if it is done correctly and shown that it will be maintained in the best interest of Devcoin. If iti s a piece of crap thrown together to get a bounty, then that isn't going to be in the best interest of the community in any way what so ever. It will just show that the community is out to make money at any cost (and I believe that 80-90% of the contributors are in this category) and the quality and effectiveness will suffer greatly.

Would it be better to then assign an admin (or team of) on a project management payroll, and have them build the project? They would serve as the connection to devcoin, and maybe have an allocation of shares per month or so to create bounties for work snippets. Devcoin bounties are great for getting snippets of code done, but not projects. All projects need some sort of project management to work well.

[dalamar96]

Would it be better to then assign an admin (or team of) on a project management payroll, and have them build the project? They would serve as the connection to devcoin, and maybe have an allocation of shares per month or so to create bounties for work snippets. Devcoin bounties are great for getting snippets of code done, but not projects. All projects need some sort of project management to work well.

This may be doable. Depends on the group of admins chosen or who step forward I guess.

[tenthirtyone]

::raises hand:: I have project management experience

[Hunterbunter]

Collecting bounty:

Also, 48 shares plus six million devcoins for the option for the Original Poster to add moderators.

coinzen.org now supports the OP of a thread adding their own moderators - including themselves, to their posts.

When you create a new post you will have an option below your name in your posts "Set Thread Moderators"

After clicking it you'll be able to add & remove moderators for your topics.

Cool,

a question about moderators - is anyone able to add anyone as a moderator? or just themselves? or just from a list of official forum mods?

I made one and put myself as moderator, seemed to work fine, but is that the intended design? Just curious how it's going to work.

::raises hand:: I have project management experience

Awesome, although should we see if someone who's not already an admin is willing to step up to the role? There is the factotum title too, for the extra staff behind a project...I don't know...Unthinkingbit? What's the deal with this? Is this a feasible idea to prototype a devcoin-managed business?

[markm]

I agree that 50 would be good if it were done correctly, 100 - 150 would be better if it were done correctly. The thing is that through all the talking about it, the only thing that really stuck out was the idea was brought up and the first thing people wanted to talk about about was the name of the site. Really?! What about legal, the business rules / document, the data requirements, the security requirements, the payment processing and tax implications on the business. These are just a few of the things that have to be thought about. Is it going to be developed as an open source project and then let out in the wild for others to implement with their business rules? Was it going to be a business venture? There was no discussion about any of that, just really how the auctions would be held (which can't compete with Quibids, period) and about the name of the site. Can't see that being worth 50 shares when it was done. There would be too many problems with it. That is just that one particular project.

If there is a good project planned and put into action, I don't have a problem with giving them 200-500 shares if it is done correctly and shown that it will be maintained in the best interest of Devcoin. If iti s a piece of crap thrown together to get a bounty, then that isn't going to be in the best interest of the community in any way what so ever. It will just show that the community is out to make money at any cost (and I believe that 80-90% of the contributors are in this category) and the quality and effectiveness will suffer greatly.

Would it be better to then assign an admin (or team of) on a project management payroll, and have them build the project? They would serve as the connection to devcoin, and maybe have an allocation of shares per month or so to create bounties for work snippets. Devcoin bounties are great for getting snippets of code done, but not projects. All projects need some sort of project management to work well.

If the project is the creation of free open source software, fine, like bitcoin and Open Transactions it can, if it is mission-critical to Devcoin's mission, have some of its key developers receiving a share every round. (I am still not convinced it is mission-critical in any way though, quite the contrary I think it is a foolishly wasteful idea, that the publicity effort it would need to get anywhere would be far far better spent on trying to convince existing established auction sites to accept cryptocoins.)

If though you are still thinking of doing an auction site startup, probably the most important thing is how many hundreds of thousands of interested parties you have on your mailing list, how good your capture pages are at getting people onto your mailing list in the first place, how good your autoresponder series (the series of messages people on the mailing list automatically get sent in sequence once they are on the list) at eventually "converting" them and at getting them to come back to buy more stuff, what the retention rate is (how long before they unsubscribe/quit), and the average amount of money you end up extracting from each person before they unsubscribe/quit.

Advertising, aka "customer acquisition" is horribly expensive, often dollars per customer. Heck even just getting a visitor costs dollars per visitor in some fields, presumably someone will have already looked up how much e.g. Adwords charges per visitor for keywords related to auctions? Care to let us in on that little secret?

So you need someone very very experienced at getting hundreds of thousands of people to sign up for mailing lists and websites and at keeping them on the list and getting them back regularly to the website and extracting money from them while they are there.

I bought my house with money made from websites but that was back before the adult entertainment industry started buying up search engines and turning them into pay per click traffic engines. Nowadays it is really hard to get "natural" (as in "gratis") search engine traffic in any field that is commonly known to involve some nice amounts of money. Heck even "the long tail" is probably heavily congested, all kinds of obscure search phrases less and less obviously relating to auctions are probably being "worked" heavily already.

It would quite likely be much more effective to focus all that effort into "converting" existing sites into accepting Devcoin than to try to go up against them on their own keywords, their own field, their own years of search engine optimisation, their own years of A/B testing of capture pages and auto-responder sequences and so on and so on.

Probably a heck of a lot cheaper too.

We don't need more holes in the net to throw money into. Its not like we have more moeny than we can spend so need to come up with far fetched ideas like "lets try to go head to head against e-bay or quibids" to find ways to throw our money away.

The very fact that no one thinks it a good enough idea to "just do it" but instead keeps trying to get us to throw money at it kind of stinks. If it had an reasonable chance of being profitable someone would do it. Evidently only people who are imagining someone else's money being thorwn away instead of their own seem keen on the idea.

So how about instead come up with an idea you are so sure will be profitable that you are willign to pay for it yourself?

Or that you can so convincingly prove the profitability of that some Angel Investors will get on board and help you through to your first 'A' round of venture capital investment?

By the way, has everyone forgotten we already have quite a few websites on our road-map, domains already secured for a number of them, but that our market cap is not yet high enough for us to afford to start any of them yet?

I wonder if we will be able to start on one of them if this current exchange rate doesn't collapse too darn far too darn fast? Or are we also going to wait until we have Devtome at least covering its own cost before moving on to the next planned website?

Or is the forum going to be eating quite a bit of the website-subsidy budget?

-MarkM-

[smeagol]

@Hunterbunter, I set the BTC I wanted to put up as 0 in the shotgun bot and put DVC in as my entire balance, but when it placed the BTC/DVC buy orders, the bot cmd window closed.

Is that normal?

[Hunterbunter]

The very fact that no one thinks it a good enough idea to "just do it" but instead keeps trying to get us to throw money at it kind of stinks. If it had an reasonable chance of being profitable someone would do it. Evidently only people who are imagining someone else's money being thorwn away instead of their own seem keen on the idea.

So how about instead come up with an idea you are so sure will be profitable that you are willign to pay for it yourself?

I see your point, but regarding this part, it's about who's going to profit. If the devcoin project is looking to obtain 100% of the profits, then they should be taking the capital risk. Like you say if someone else sees it as profitable, then they should be taking the capital risk.

I'm not particularly keen on the quibit style auctions; I think they're very poor value for money for customers and seem to be in the vein of gambling/free2play style games with microtransactions and whale hunting. Having said that, though, I obviously have a different value of it than all the people actually making Quibits lots of money, so there is a market there. Perhaps you're right about it being a saturated niche market already, and not the most effective use of funds, but it will cost a lot less than devtome, though, so the risk is relatively small (3-5 management shares per round + a budget of something like 30 per round for bounties).

I think the real value in something like this is developing a system of running projects for profit, with the devcoin project being the main benefactor. Devtome is, as far as I can see, a huge investment with an equally huge risk. Open Transactions are really hard to understand for the average person, but have tremendous potential. On the wayside, while Open Transactions are being subsidized by devcoin, is there going to be any return on investment from it?

By the way, has everyone forgotten we already have quite a few websites on our road-map, domains already secured for a number of them, but that our market cap is not yet high enough for us to afford to start any of them yet?

I wonder if we will be able to start on one of them if this current exchange rate doesn't collapse too darn far too darn fast? Or are we also going to wait until we have Devtome at least covering its own cost before moving on to the next planned website?

Or is the forum going to be eating quite a bit of the website-subsidy budget?

Is this road-map of future websites listed anywhere? I'd be interested to see it.

The things like the auction site are just suggestions on ways to get the market cap higher so we can attempt more meaty ones. I think the infrastructure on project management needs work, though, to be honest.

@Hunterbunter, I set the BTC I wanted to put up as 0 in the shotgun bot and put DVC in as my entire balance, but when it placed the BTC/DVC buy orders, the bot cmd window closed.

Is that normal?

Hey Smeagol, yep that's normal if you run the script by double clicking it or with ./shotgunbot.py. If you run it from command line itself, and use the command "python shotgunbot.py" it'll run the script in the open window (as opposed to opening a new command window and closing it when it's done).

You can put 0 and it'll work fine.

EDIT: It seems vircurex changed a key on their api, so errors weren't being returned correctly. Changed the key title and uploaded the working version to github, git pull should get that fixed. Also, I just threw in an "press key to exit" so you can run it either way, now, and see any feedback before losing the window.

[sidhujag]

The very fact that no one thinks it a good enough idea to "just do it" but instead keeps trying to get us to throw money at it kind of stinks. If it had an reasonable chance of being profitable someone would do it. Evidently only people who are imagining someone else's money being thorwn away instead of their own seem keen on the idea.

So how about instead come up with an idea you are so sure will be profitable that you are willign to pay for it yourself?

I see your point, but regarding this part, it's about who's going to profit. If the devcoin project is looking to obtain 100% of the profits, then they should be taking the capital risk. Like you say if someone else sees it as profitable, then they should be taking the capital risk.

I'm not particularly keen on the quibit style auctions; I think they're very poor value for money for customers and seem to be in the vein of gambling/free2play style games with microtransactions and whale hunting. Having said that, though, I obviously have a different value of it than all the people actually making Quibits lots of money, so there is a market there. Perhaps you're right about it being a saturated niche market already, and not the most effective use of funds, but it will cost a lot less than devtome, though, so the risk is relatively small (3-5 management shares per round + a budget of something like 30 per round for bounties).

I think the real value in something like this is developing a system of running projects for profit, with the devcoin project being the main benefactor. Devtome is, as far as I can see, a huge investment with an equally huge risk. Open Transactions are really hard to understand for the average person, but have tremendous potential. On the wayside, while Open Transactions are being subsidized by devcoin, is there going to be any return on investment from it?

By the way, has everyone forgotten we already have quite a few websites on our road-map, domains already secured for a number of them, but that our market cap is not yet high enough for us to afford to start any of them yet?

I wonder if we will be able to start on one of them if this current exchange rate doesn't collapse too darn far too darn fast? Or are we also going to wait until we have Devtome at least covering its own cost before moving on to the next planned website?

Or is the forum going to be eating quite a bit of the website-subsidy budget?

Is this road-map of future websites listed anywhere? I'd be interested to see it.

The things like the auction site are just suggestions on ways to get the market cap higher so we can attempt more meaty ones. I think the infrastructure on project management needs work, though, to be honest.

@Hunterbunter, I set the BTC I wanted to put up as 0 in the shotgun bot and put DVC in as my entire balance, but when it placed the BTC/DVC buy orders, the bot cmd window closed.

Is that normal?

Hey Smeagol, yep that's normal if you run the script by double clicking it or with ./shotgunbot.py. If you run it from command line itself, and use the command "python shotgunbot.py" it'll run the script in the open window (as opposed to opening a new command window and closing it when it's done).

You can put 0 and it'll work fine.

Exactly! I was saying that what would drive me here is the goal of having a business thats bringing in profits to the project.. it would set us apart and let people see the real value of devcoin share system. Its a niche yes but people are looking to spend their coins on somethig and since we are early adopters all businesses related to
crypto are also early adopters.. howver niche. We are providing a service for coins that diesnt exist. If another site opens up so be it.. but profits would be made until then atleast.

I do also agree with some of what markm says that it is expensive to bring in and convert people into customers and part of that is rectified with the idea of a penny auction being so lucrative as a customer. The ebay template offers a mailing list of 4.5 million interested parties in a marketing campaign that they offer help with.

The market may be saturated for fiat penny auction sites which is why they really arent working but not for one specifically targeting coin holders. If we convert one of the big players to take in our coins Id consider that good news not competition thats bad.

It will take some good marketing and everyone on board
and I am even thinking if going ahead myself privately if devcoin doesnt accept
but I kinda think it would be cool to offer a business giving back profits indirectly benefiting us who hold coins.. and help from community here as valuable feedback amd
development consulting.

[sidhujag]

Its funny that person who dumped 25 million or so devcoins on vircurex last week seem to set a low in price..always seems to be that way in the market finding pain thresholds and punishing those who dont have patience. Ive seen this in all forms of markets all the time.. psycology is the same in all markets dealing with money I guess.

[Hunterbunter]

Its funny that person who dumped 25 million or so devcoins on vircurex last week seem to set a low in price..always seems to be that way in the market finding pain thresholds and punishing those who dont have patience. Ive seen this in all forms of markets all the time.. psycology is the same in all markets dealing with money I guess.

Yeah I thought so too. It seems to have something to do with "testing the support". If the price barely budged with that sort of volume, whoever still have large amounts of coins aren't in the mood to sell right now. It's a way of discovering other's intentions.