Black Arrow 28nm 100Ghash Bitcoin ASIC from $0.49/GH/s

[eightcylinders]

 I guess the 6k+ I spent out of my own pocket to gather information at my own expense, I might as well go home.

You mean your own pockets, that are lined with the money from all the sales you took? Or do you do this for charity, because you just love to help people 

Are we really going to insult the only person fighting for us. I would bet that there wouldn't even be a compensation package if it wasn't for bobsag.  Look at his prices and BA's prices.  Do you see a big difference?  I am sure he makes a small amount on each order, but I doubt it is enough that he can throw 6k around willy nilly .  Bobsag has been straight and forward with everything, and even puts his business on the line as he is subject to US regulations, whereas BA is not.

Now I hope as much as anyone else that he is able to talk some sense into these guys, but insulting him is no way to do it.  He is our best hope of making our money back on these machines, and I for one will continue to support him, his work, and his business.

Thank you bobsag, please do not get discouraged and please continue to give us updates and fight for us.  You have proven to me that you are a good business man, and I respect that, and for that I support you as all a man has over the internet is his reputation and you sir have certainly earned a good one in my book.

++++1

I am not happy having been ripped off by AMT, BFL and now BA who I thought was a really good manufacturer but turned out to be just like the rest.

But minersource is not the problem here.  If you take account of fully loaded costs, I doubt minersource is going to make anything off of these X-3s, at least not on pre-orders considering all of the extra effort they are going to have to put in (sourcing power supplies, repeat travel, time spent in negotiations with BA, responses to irate customers, etc.).   I am not happy with the compensation either, but I would rather have minersource in there trying to improve it (and get orders shipped asap) vs trying to deal with BA myself.

We will see how this all plays out.  As it stands, I would never buy from BA again, but I would buy (a different product) from minersource. 

I would like to hear the updates from minersource and put our support behind minersource, rather than undercutting them.

[sirsmokesalot]

 I guess the 6k+ I spent out of my own pocket to gather information at my own expense, I might as well go home.

You mean your own pockets, that are lined with the money from all the sales you took? Or do you do this for charity, because you just love to help people 

Are we really going to insult the only person fighting for us. I would bet that there wouldn't even be a compensation package if it wasn't for bobsag.  Look at his prices and BA's prices.  Do you see a big difference?  I am sure he makes a small amount on each order, but I doubt it is enough that he can throw 6k around willy nilly .  Bobsag has been straight and forward with everything, and even puts his business on the line as he is subject to US regulations, whereas BA is not.

Now I hope as much as anyone else that he is able to talk some sense into these guys, but insulting him is no way to do it.  He is our best hope of making our money back on these machines, and I for one will continue to support him, his work, and his business.

Thank you bobsag, please do not get discouraged and please continue to give us updates and fight for us.  You have proven to me that you are a good business man, and I respect that, and for that I support you as all a man has over the internet is his reputation and you sir have certainly earned a good one in my book.

How is what i said insulting? Is it not the truth? I hope he will make something off of it, if he hasn't yet, other wise, what was the point of the whole thing. I am bitter, i want a refund. My heart does not weep that he has a 6k dollar business expense. I don't get why he would have such a vested interest in this unless he stood to gain, or that he stands to lose substantially, i suppose that is an issue for him as well, where he is just some poor middle man who got snookered in with all this shit. Thinking about it, yeah that seems about right. At the same time, i don't seek to become a mining hardware sales man because of the inherent risks involved.  That was the path that he chose to take.

How do you know what black arrow stands to make on each unit? Are you privy to this information? Do you know what they are selling them to bob for, like i said, this is a business for him, not a charity. Or is he just doing the selling for black arrow for a % of the total sales? I really don't care. He is the one running a business. Of course any money is "coming from his own pocket" when he is the business owner. His statement just really irked me, complaining about cost, don't run a business then? You can't have the luxury of being your own boss and "living the dream" and then complaining about exotic 6k dollar trips to foreign lands 

Sorry to be so rude?? I am not fabricating anything, it is my perspective.   

[thomas_s]

 I guess the 6k+ I spent out of my own pocket to gather information at my own expense, I might as well go home.

You mean your own pockets, that are lined with the money from all the sales you took? Or do you do this for charity, because you just love to help people 

Are we really going to insult the only person fighting for us. I would bet that there wouldn't even be a compensation package if it wasn't for bobsag.  Look at his prices and BA's prices.  Do you see a big difference?  I am sure he makes a small amount on each order, but I doubt it is enough that he can throw 6k around willy nilly .  Bobsag has been straight and forward with everything, and even puts his business on the line as he is subject to US regulations, whereas BA is not.

Now I hope as much as anyone else that he is able to talk some sense into these guys, but insulting him is no way to do it.  He is our best hope of making our money back on these machines, and I for one will continue to support him, his work, and his business.

Thank you bobsag, please do not get discouraged and please continue to give us updates and fight for us.  You have proven to me that you are a good business man, and I respect that, and for that I support you as all a man has over the internet is his reputation and you sir have certainly earned a good one in my book.

That might be true, but not everyone is being compensated. The customers with only 1 x1 are not being compensated. Sorry but a coupon towards your next purchase is not compensation its more money for Black Arrow.

I agree with you, and am even on your side.  Trying to at least get them transferable so people like me can pay you for yours so you at least get something.  Just remember, Bobsag didn't set that, BA did.  My ultimate goal, and what would make me happy right now, is getting shipped 2X our current orders, and getting a 25%+ coupon off of future orders.  Complete miners too, with power supply included.  All we can do is keep on them about it.  Other companies are paving the way, lets hope BA follows.

We won't be limiting the 50% value one to accounts, you can do what you wish with it, however it will be a one time use coupon.

At this time all Batch 1 orders should be listed under the minersource.net accounts (if you purchased from us) Orders are numbered XXXXA or XXXXB you can calculate the amount of units you will be receiving by adding up units in those orders. As for refunds they will be removed from shipping over the next day or two but will still display on the account until the refund is issued.

[TechByPC]

-1 last time he flew to BA UK office, the update largely consisted of being told he couldn't say anything because of NDA he had to sign! but plenty of hints of pots of gold at the end of the rainbow. So don't get your hopes up to much!

Yes, that let-down is what caused me to cancel my purchase with Minersource and involvement in the DZ group buy. It was a whole lot of bluster about getting something done, then "be patient," "he's tried from traveling," and then eventually no information came from it. As it turns out I may have not been patient enough since there were changes at BA quite a while after, but I see signs of repetition this time. As someone who has traveled internationally before, I know it can be taxing, but not so much that status updates can't be posted.

I hope you all get your updates this time and bobsag3 is able to provide something positive, or at least informative, here on the forum or (preferably also) in email to patiently waiting customers who need to be reminded every now and then that someone hasn't just run off with their money. That's the best way to keep customers loyal.

My travel to the UK is the single reason you guys now have weekly updates, and actual real information. I speant 2 days arguing and discussing how to change things form here on out, and most of the changes they made between early feb right after the delay was announced, and now, are due to the changes I recommended/forced them to make. Your disparaging comments only show how little you know about the situation. Plenty of information came from it, it just was not spoon fed to the masses.

But I guess info is all yall want, I specifically said I would not be leaving until I have a working unit in my hand, and since my travel is just a whole bunch of bluster I guess the 6k+ I spent out of my own pocket to gather information at my own expense, I might as well go home.

As I said, I was not patient enough. I can only take your word on what happened in the UK because no one has said up until this point that you were our hero. I wish you had been able to sell yourself better on your return and not been forced to keep your mouth shut. A customer directed email or two on your successes from the first trip would have gone miles. I've purchased from Minersource before and after this BA thing. I'm sure this isn't directed specifically against me as I've said several times that I'm a very small potatoes and only ordered a single X1 from you. I'm wishing that you had been more successful, not less. I hope it is different this time, and so far you do seem to be posting quite a bit more than last time. Anyway, I no longer have any skin in this game, so I'm going to stop replying at this point.

Your customers will make or break you. Not everyone is as optimistic and loyal as a lapdog, and those lapdog customers tend to not be very long-lived anyway. BA has made it clear they have thin skin. They want to play favorites with the future discounts. They veil information in jargon. They pretend to be too busy to spend 2 minutes to post an update. That's very childish. I understand it's in line with the average in this infant industry, but there are companies who are raising and will continue to raise that bar.

My last piece of advice: Don't play BA's game - treat all your customers with respect and as much information as you can provide them and you'll enjoy more success than BA ever will. You don't need to like your customers to make money off them, but you do need them.

[blackarrow]

We have received the SMT assembled boards.
 
We are now proud to announce that Black Arrow has the most power efficient Bitcoin ASIC on the market today.
 
A single dual chip board is hashing with absolutely no errors at 1Ghz while using 150Watt at the wall, including the PSU loss.
 
We have better efficiency than 0.75Watts/ghash at the wall.

[jimmothy]

We have received the SMT assembled boards.
 
We are now proud to announce that Black Arrow has the most power efficient Bitcoin ASIC on the market today.
 
A single dual chip board is hashing with absolutely no errors at 1Ghz while using 150Watt at the wall, including the PSU loss.
 
We have better efficiency than 0.75Watts/ghash at the wall.

I don't believe this. What's the hashrate per chip at that efficiency?

Can we get some pics/vids?

[jimmothy]

They don't mention what the hashrate is for that configuration though..

Just extrapolating here. 2 chips at 0.75w/gh = 200gh at 150w or 100gh per chip.

Would love some clarification/pics.

[bobsag3]

They don't mention what the hashrate is for that configuration though..

Just extrapolating here. 2 chips at 0.75w/gh = 200gh at 150w or 100gh per chip.

Would love some clarification/pics.

I have pics of the 2 chips running @ 210gh @ 160w at the wall, uploading is soooo slooow.

[kaerf]

We have received the SMT assembled boards.
 
We are now proud to announce that Black Arrow has the most power efficient Bitcoin ASIC on the market today.
 
A single dual chip board is hashing with absolutely no errors at 1Ghz while using 150Watt at the wall, including the PSU loss.
 
We have better efficiency than 0.75Watts/ghash at the wall.

excellent! blackarrow, any updates about the 'technical solution' to power the units with our own power supplies? how much overclocking will the stock PSU allow?

[MrTeal]

They don't mention what the hashrate is for that configuration though..

Just extrapolating here. 2 chips at 0.75w/gh = 200gh at 150w or 100gh per chip.

Would love some clarification/pics.

I have pics of the 2 chips running @ 210gh @ 160w at the wall, uploading is soooo slooow.

That would be a pretty good result to get that at the rated hashrate. Has there been any testing to see how low it can go at lower hashrates? I have a Habanero with the HF chip running at 0.7J/GH at the wall and it could probably go down a little more with a purpose built low power board, but I'm not sure how much room there is below that. I'd be very interested if closing in on 0.5J/GH at the wall was possible.

Bob, is there a timeline on the website being updated, and will an updated price to reflect the reality of the market be coming out? I'm interested in some chips, but I can't imagine spending the time and money doing the design if the $1.7/GH/s for chips in qty 5000 isn't cut at least in half.

[topminingcontracts]

They don't mention what the hashrate is for that configuration though..

Just extrapolating here. 2 chips at 0.75w/gh = 200gh at 150w or 100gh per chip.

Would love some clarification/pics.

I have pics of the 2 chips running @ 210gh @ 160w at the wall, uploading is soooo slooow.

Congrats looks in few days we will finally see the BA.

My personal opinion is BA and MinerSource are doing their very best and soon we will see the results of their hard work.

Juan

[y_boonstra]

DebitMe.. i have PMed you some questions..

[bobsag3]

More coming.

[nexus99]

Anyone have a batch 2 Minersource order for X-1 units marked fulfilled? I've got an order in for 4 batch 2 units and its sitting in fulfilled status.

[bobsag3]

Anyone have a batch 2 Minersource order for X-1 units marked fulfilled? I've got an order in for 4 batch 2 units and its sitting in fulfilled status.

See here:
http://minersource.net/blogs/news/14105713-5-11-2014-shipping-site-updates
Explains it.

[nexus99]

Thanks for the info. It went into fulfilled status a month or two ago. Was just curious if anyone else has a batch 2 order in the same status.

I'm really looking forward to these units. I flew over China a couple of days ago and waved to my chips on the way by :-)

My immediate future mining equipment will consist of BA and Habanero equipment. I think I have made good choices.

[Vcore]

Bobsag3 thanks for all your efforts and blackarrow, great progress, those numbers are great!.

I don't know if my last questions have been lost but bobsag3, can you ask them?:

Hi, I see that the power supplies are in the blackarrow store but I have a couple of questions.

1: It shows a shipping and handling fee, can't it be shipped with the main order if I pay with btc?

2: If it can't, can I order 2 psus? (A friend also has an order for an X3)

Thanks.

[bobsag3]

Bobsag3 thanks for all your efforts and blackarrow, great progress, those numbers are great!.

I don't know if my last questions have been lost but bobsag3, can you ask them?:

Hi, I see that the power supplies are in the blackarrow store but I have a couple of questions.

1: It shows a shipping and handling fee, can't it be shipped with the main order if I pay with btc?

2: If it can't, can I order 2 psus? (A friend also has an order for an X3)

Thanks.

All compensation units and or power supplies will be shipped together if possible, but otherwise the PSU may need to be shipped separate and hence the separate shipping charge.

[bobsag3]

Can we get a video or picture of the chips hashing?

Theres a picture of them hashing on my previous post, but this china internet is only allowing me to a picture every 10 min or so

[y_boonstra]

Can we get a video or picture of the chips hashing?

Theres a picture of them hashing on my previous post, but this china internet is only allowing me to a picture every 10 min or so

then plug your laptop in @ BA's office, im sure the have a better quality line