[ActiveMining] The Official Active Mining Discussion Thread [Self-Moderated]

[LorenzoMoney]

Agreement?

We had an initial conversation. We had an agreement to look into how to arrange a stock transfer given the current conditions. We had nothing signed, no handshake, no finalization of terms.

We were in a negotiation and some other better offers came along. New information became available.

Once terms are agreed upon, and digital signatures are exchange, the deal is closed. Until that moment, it is merely a conversation of interest.

Ken has leaked out new information. He posted new things. Contingencies have changed. Hope is renewed.
Prices change.

One must be agile, fluid and flexible in the bitcoin world. All signed contracts and agreements will be honored. Otherwise, it is just negotiation.

YOU believe in the future and in the future of Active Mining. We all believe things will improve and the price will go up. New data informs us that the shares are worth more. Current data informs us that Ken is not currently able to do person to person trades. Further negotiations are required.


I want to walk away from all the sadness of Active Mining for 1328 bitcoin. Someone else can have all my sadness and joy and the 169,000 shares I have. Contracts will need to be drawn up. Once signed, contracts will be binding.

Someone doesn't want all 169000 shares?... then provide an offer for 69000 shares. Say, 542.2 bitcoin for 69,000 shares.

Make an offer. Make it ridiculous and I will laugh. Make it serious, and we all can talk.  We are always friends.
Tell you what, 271.1 bitcoin for 69,000 shares. We work on the contract for the sale together.

Money talks.  B*** S**T walks.

Peace, Love and Profit.

Someone contacted me about purchasing some of my shares.

All sales offers will be anonymous until sales contracts are signed by both parties.

The offer was for a partial number of the shares being offered.

Here is my response to the offer and in addition, this is an offer to anyone else who is interested in buying lots of 20,000 shares from me.

--------------------------------------------------
Thank you for your kind offer of buying 13800 shares.
The only sized lot that if being offered is 69000 shares.
Nothing smaller. (Note: since writing that, I have decided that I will sell lots of 20K shares at a price of 0.0016 per share.)
The only accepted price for that lot of 69000 shares is 100 bitcoin.
Ken is not able to actually implement any trades.
The escrow person whom I would trust would be Kleeck. If there is someone else whom you would prefer, please suggest him or her and we can talk about it.

The way I propose doing this is you and I talk to Kleeck. Kleeck is generally well known on the irc channel and on the thread as level headed and sober and balanced. You and I write up a formal contract. We both sign the contract using our public bitcoin addresses. We then create a thread on Bitcointalk where we post the sales contract and the bitcoin verification hashes of the contract.

By doing that, it makes our trade public and forces me to uphold my end of things. You send me the bitcoin and the moment there is a public exchange, Kleeck monitors that I transfer the shares to you.

In our contract, we put terms together for what happens if Ken never opens an exchange, if ActM totally fails and if I fail to follow my end of the agreement. I will privately provide you with all my personal contact information so that you have a means of addressing any legal satisfaction should you feel that I have not upheld my end of the deal. If you send me the bitcoin, I will be totally transparent to you so that you will be able to identify me and be able to take me to court. On transfer of the shares, I will ask you to use bitcoin to sign a release saying that you are satisfied with the transaction.  I will also ask that we both sign a bill of sale in hard copy and fax it to each other or send it in PDF.

Also, I will ask that a small fee be paid to Kleeck, by both of us, to be agreed to in the sales contract for his escrow services to be paid upon completion of the sale. Really, the seller, me, should pay the escrow, but by us both paying, it insures that the escrow will be unbiased.

 Since there is a possibility that Ken and ActM might fail, that has to be written into our sales contract. There also is the possibility that the price of ActM shares will go up should an Ken get the shares to an exchange, so the contract should obligate me to transfer the shares to you regardless of what the value is after you send me the bitcoin. The way to guarantee that and reduce your risk is for me to sign a contract that would be binding in the courts of law in both the US state where I live and the place where you live.

I would consider small lots than 69000, but only at a higher per price share than 0.001449275
per share.

So what happened to our agreement LorenzoMoney that we made on IRC and then continued via emails?

We already had an agreement, and were working out the transfer/escrow side.

You just walked away, say nothing, start making new offers?

[1715658983]

1715658983

[1715658983]

1715658983

[1715658983]

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[1715658983]

1715658983

[bigdude]

Agreement?

We had an initial conversation. We had an agreement to look into how to arrange a stock transfer given the current conditions. We had nothing signed, no handshake, no finalization of terms.

We were in a negotiation and some other better offers came along. New information became available.

Once terms are agreed upon, and digital signatures are exchange, the deal is closed. Until that moment, it is merely a conversation of interest.

Ken has leaked out new information. He posted new things. Contingencies have changed. Hope is renewed.
Prices change.

One must be agile, fluid and flexible in the bitcoin world. All signed contracts and agreements will be honored. Otherwise, it is just negotiation.

YOU believe in the future and in the future of Active Mining. We all believe things will improve and the price will go up. New data informs us that the shares are worth more. Current data informs us that Ken is not currently able to do person to person trades. Further negotiations are required.


I want to walk away from all the sadness of Active Mining for 1328 bitcoin. Someone else can have all my sadness and joy and the 169,000 shares I have. Contracts will need to be drawn up. Once signed, contracts will be binding.

Someone doesn't want all 169000 shares?... then provide an offer for 69000 shares. Say, 542.2 bitcoin for 69,000 shares.

Make an offer. Make it ridiculous and I will laugh. Make it serious, and we all can talk.  We are always friends.
Tell you what, 271.1 bitcoin for 69,000 shares. We work on the contract for the sale together.

Money talks.  B*** S**T walks.

Peace, Love and Profit.

Someone contacted me about purchasing some of my shares.

All sales offers will be anonymous until sales contracts are signed by both parties.

The offer was for a partial number of the shares being offered.

Here is my response to the offer and in addition, this is an offer to anyone else who is interested in buying lots of 20,000 shares from me.

--------------------------------------------------
Thank you for your kind offer of buying 13800 shares.
The only sized lot that if being offered is 69000 shares.
Nothing smaller. (Note: since writing that, I have decided that I will sell lots of 20K shares at a price of 0.0016 per share.)
The only accepted price for that lot of 69000 shares is 100 bitcoin.
Ken is not able to actually implement any trades.
The escrow person whom I would trust would be Kleeck. If there is someone else whom you would prefer, please suggest him or her and we can talk about it.

The way I propose doing this is you and I talk to Kleeck. Kleeck is generally well known on the irc channel and on the thread as level headed and sober and balanced. You and I write up a formal contract. We both sign the contract using our public bitcoin addresses. We then create a thread on Bitcointalk where we post the sales contract and the bitcoin verification hashes of the contract.

By doing that, it makes our trade public and forces me to uphold my end of things. You send me the bitcoin and the moment there is a public exchange, Kleeck monitors that I transfer the shares to you.

In our contract, we put terms together for what happens if Ken never opens an exchange, if ActM totally fails and if I fail to follow my end of the agreement. I will privately provide you with all my personal contact information so that you have a means of addressing any legal satisfaction should you feel that I have not upheld my end of the deal. If you send me the bitcoin, I will be totally transparent to you so that you will be able to identify me and be able to take me to court. On transfer of the shares, I will ask you to use bitcoin to sign a release saying that you are satisfied with the transaction.  I will also ask that we both sign a bill of sale in hard copy and fax it to each other or send it in PDF.

Also, I will ask that a small fee be paid to Kleeck, by both of us, to be agreed to in the sales contract for his escrow services to be paid upon completion of the sale. Really, the seller, me, should pay the escrow, but by us both paying, it insures that the escrow will be unbiased.

 Since there is a possibility that Ken and ActM might fail, that has to be written into our sales contract. There also is the possibility that the price of ActM shares will go up should an Ken get the shares to an exchange, so the contract should obligate me to transfer the shares to you regardless of what the value is after you send me the bitcoin. The way to guarantee that and reduce your risk is for me to sign a contract that would be binding in the courts of law in both the US state where I live and the place where you live.

I would consider small lots than 69000, but only at a higher per price share than 0.001449275
per share.

So what happened to our agreement LorenzoMoney that we made on IRC and then continued via emails?

We already had an agreement, and were working out the transfer/escrow side.

You just walked away, say nothing, start making new offers?

On IRC you made a request to sell your shares for a very specific amount of bitcoin. I agreed to that.

The only thing that was being 'discussed' was the 'how to'. The amount of btc for the amount of shares was concluded.

Wiggle, worm, do what you want to get out of it.

True colours have been shown, and all can see what will happen if you deal with LorenzoMoney

[knybe]

...
Ken has leaked out new information. He posted new things.
...

do tell?

[LorenzoMoney]

Sorry, we were only in negotiations and talking.
Nothing was signed. Nothing was firm.
We agreed to investigate further the means for completing a transaction.
It was all contingent on that.
A conversation is not a final agreement.

I always honor signed commitments.

As EVERYONE can see from the text you quoted below, we were still talking about drawing up a contract and the terms of the escrow. No contract had been exchanged between us.

A movie producer talks to a director and makes an offer. The director states how much he wants. They talk at lunch. The producer talks to another director who also makes a statement of how much he wants. No contracts are signed yet.

Now that you see how high ActM shares will go, you are not willing to continue negotiations.

Too bad for you. Bitcoin is a wild world.

One must be honest also in describing what the level of negotiation is.

Signed contracts must always be honored. Conversation is always exploration.

Agreement?

We had an initial conversation. We had an agreement to look into how to arrange a stock transfer given the current conditions. We had nothing signed, no handshake, no finalization of terms.

We were in a negotiation and some other better offers came along. New information became available.

Once terms are agreed upon, and digital signatures are exchange, the deal is closed. Until that moment, it is merely a conversation of interest.

Ken has leaked out new information. He posted new things. Contingencies have changed. Hope is renewed.
Prices change.

One must be agile, fluid and flexible in the bitcoin world. All signed contracts and agreements will be honored. Otherwise, it is just negotiation.

YOU believe in the future and in the future of Active Mining. We all believe things will improve and the price will go up. New data informs us that the shares are worth more. Current data informs us that Ken is not currently able to do person to person trades. Further negotiations are required.


I want to walk away from all the sadness of Active Mining for 1328 bitcoin. Someone else can have all my sadness and joy and the 169,000 shares I have. Contracts will need to be drawn up. Once signed, contracts will be binding.

Someone doesn't want all 169000 shares?... then provide an offer for 69000 shares. Say, 542.2 bitcoin for 69,000 shares.

Make an offer. Make it ridiculous and I will laugh. Make it serious, and we all can talk.  We are always friends.
Tell you what, 271.1 bitcoin for 69,000 shares. We work on the contract for the sale together.

Money talks.  B*** S**T walks.

Peace, Love and Profit.

Someone contacted me about purchasing some of my shares.

All sales offers will be anonymous until sales contracts are signed by both parties.

The offer was for a partial number of the shares being offered.

Here is my response to the offer and in addition, this is an offer to anyone else who is interested in buying lots of 20,000 shares from me.

--------------------------------------------------
Thank you for your kind offer of buying 13800 shares.
The only sized lot that if being offered is 69000 shares.
Nothing smaller. (Note: since writing that, I have decided that I will sell lots of 20K shares at a price of 0.0016 per share.)
The only accepted price for that lot of 69000 shares is 100 bitcoin.
Ken is not able to actually implement any trades.
The escrow person whom I would trust would be Kleeck. If there is someone else whom you would prefer, please suggest him or her and we can talk about it.

The way I propose doing this is you and I talk to Kleeck. Kleeck is generally well known on the irc channel and on the thread as level headed and sober and balanced. You and I write up a formal contract. We both sign the contract using our public bitcoin addresses. We then create a thread on Bitcointalk where we post the sales contract and the bitcoin verification hashes of the contract.

By doing that, it makes our trade public and forces me to uphold my end of things. You send me the bitcoin and the moment there is a public exchange, Kleeck monitors that I transfer the shares to you.

In our contract, we put terms together for what happens if Ken never opens an exchange, if ActM totally fails and if I fail to follow my end of the agreement. I will privately provide you with all my personal contact information so that you have a means of addressing any legal satisfaction should you feel that I have not upheld my end of the deal. If you send me the bitcoin, I will be totally transparent to you so that you will be able to identify me and be able to take me to court. On transfer of the shares, I will ask you to use bitcoin to sign a release saying that you are satisfied with the transaction.  I will also ask that we both sign a bill of sale in hard copy and fax it to each other or send it in PDF.

Also, I will ask that a small fee be paid to Kleeck, by both of us, to be agreed to in the sales contract for his escrow services to be paid upon completion of the sale. Really, the seller, me, should pay the escrow, but by us both paying, it insures that the escrow will be unbiased.

 Since there is a possibility that Ken and ActM might fail, that has to be written into our sales contract. There also is the possibility that the price of ActM shares will go up should an Ken get the shares to an exchange, so the contract should obligate me to transfer the shares to you regardless of what the value is after you send me the bitcoin. The way to guarantee that and reduce your risk is for me to sign a contract that would be binding in the courts of law in both the US state where I live and the place where you live.

I would consider small lots than 69000, but only at a higher per price share than 0.001449275
per share.

So what happened to our agreement LorenzoMoney that we made on IRC and then continued via emails?

We already had an agreement, and were working out the transfer/escrow side.

You just walked away, say nothing, start making new offers?

On IRC you made a request to sell your shares for a very specific amount of bitcoin. I agreed to that.

The only thing that was being 'discussed' was the 'how to'. The amount of btc for the amount of shares was concluded.

Wiggle, worm, do what you want to get out of it.

True colours have been shown, and all can see what will happen if you deal with LorenzoMoney

[drawingthesun]

I think the extra hashrate is from ActiveMining going online!! Thanks Ken!

[zumzero]

I think the extra hashrate is from ActiveMining going online!! Thanks Ken!

What makes you think that?

[VolanicEruptor]

> When will you list Activemining?
>
>
> 3rd Dec,2013 05:22:05 am
>
 
Hello,
 
Thank you for contacting us.
 
The only people able to list activemining on crypto trade is the issuer of
activemining himself
 
We'll be happy to welcome them if they decide to list here.
 
Regards, Carlos.


.........................


Looks like the ball has been in Kens court the whole time.  They are waiting on him.


and he keeps deleting this message of course

[drawingthesun]

We'll be happy to welcome them if they decide to list here.

I always knew we were waiting on Ken for listing on CT, however I had no idea that he has not even begun to set it up. By the sounds of this they are not even aware he wants to list!

Ken please list us, we need a chance to trade.

[drawingthesun]

Anyone want my shares for 0.001747 per share?

114,425 for 200 bitcoin.

[bigdude]

We'll be happy to welcome them if they decide to list here.
 
Regards, Carlos.
.........................

Looks like the ball has been in Kens court the whole time.  They are waiting on him.

Interesting indeed.

My hope ... ditch even thinking about getting on CryptoTrade which looks small time and there is no volume AT ALL.

And list on Havelock instead which seems to be the biggest and most professional at the moment.

There is no way CryptoTrade is the best exchange for shareholders interests

[Jasun7211]

Hummm....

[wasubii]

Well, that is interesting, because, one day, you will be telling me how you wished you had taken me up on my offer.

I hope so buddy. We all do.

[shadallion]

I wish I had the discipline to magically forget that this site even exists.  I cannot help but check it throughout the day, but it is never a positive experience.

I wish the next time I heard of ActiveMining, it's via a plump dividend directly into my wallet.  

Or the notice that the shares are going for 0.01 on Crypto-Trade

[drawingthesun]

drawingthesun:

How dare you! How dare you steal my buyers from me! BACK! BACK! Back in your box.

BUY my shares from me for 0.001747 a share first before you go to that back stabbing, LiteCoin loving basic with line numbers coding drawingthesun.

BUY FROM LORENZO MONEY FIRST!

MY shares are sweeter and fresher and better quality and more loved by Ken than drawingthesun.

Anyone want my shares for 0.001747 per share?

114,425 for 200 bitcoin.

I now offer all my shares for 171.6 Bitcoin

A per share price of 0.0015

Please PM

Let the race to bottom begin.

Also if anyone is really confident in Active, 0.0015 is surely cheap. Like they say, I will get 0 offers because money talks and no one here has any faith left. Even the cheerleaders will vomit at a 0.0015 price as being too expensive, just shows the cheerleaders are all talk and no action!

EDIT: I am not sure if I am allowed to offer smaller amounts of shares,, I think Ken is too "busy". I will PM Ken again about being allowed to trade smaller amounts because he can't block us from trading, it's not fair he could of had us on an exchange ages ago.

[shadallion]

drawingthesun:

How dare you! How dare you steal my buyers from me! BACK! BACK! Back in your box.

BUY my shares from me for 0.001747 a share first before you go to that back stabbing, LiteCoin loving basic with line numbers coding drawingthesun.

BUY FROM LORENZO MONEY FIRST!

MY shares are sweeter and fresher and better quality and more loved by Ken than drawingthesun.

Anyone want my shares for 0.001747 per share?

114,425 for 200 bitcoin.

I now offer all my shares for 171.6 Bitcoin

A per share price of 0.0015

Please PM

Let the race to bottom begin.

Also if anyone is really confident in Active, 0.0015 is surely cheap. Like they say, I will get 0 offers because money talks and no one here has any faith left. Even the cheerleaders will vomit at a 0.0015 price as being too expensive, just shows the cheerleaders are all talk and no action!

DTS that's a good price, but the fact is forking over the equivalent of a Ferrari in bitcoin is a tough psychological task.  Break it up into smaller chunks.

[drawingthesun]

DTS that's a good price, but the fact is forking over the equivalent of a Ferrari in bitcoin is a tough psychological task.  Break it up into smaller chunks.

I will PM Ken about being allowed to transfer smaller amount of shares. Ken now has to honour us because he failed the simple task that a 12 year old could do; list on an exchange.

[wasubii]

Hi wasubii,

I'm interested to know why you think this is a very high risk investment.  Do you think this business has always been a very high risk investment or do you think it started as a very high risk investment, became less risky during it's development, and then became very high risk again?  

I think it started as a very high risk investment when it walled being called a scam in the AMC days.  The risk since then has reduced immeasurably with time.  With the very bullish 'game changer' attitude and desire to win through, I think this business will be priced much higher than Lorenzo's 'Offer of the Month' and see his shares as a real steal.  My advice to Lorenzo is;  be strong and hold, you will see those 69,000 shares worth 500 btc within days of the exchange opening.   There is a whole load of new money about to come into this space and bitcoin mining shares are becoming very sought after.  

Yes, I agree with you mostly. I see it like this:

Beginning period: High risk but with good prospects for a high reward:
The deal with eASIC was supposed to give us a below average chip (compared to full custom) at a lower price ($1m instead of $4-5m) in a very fast time, which would allow us to establish ourselves and sort out our PCB, cooling and power supply issues. It would give us an income with which to pursue a better, 2nd gen chip. We had a rough timescale from eASIC and there was a lot of excitement over ActM. During this period the shares went to 0.007+

Middle period: Lower risk as people think ActM is less and less a scam, and everything is in order, just waiting for news from eASIC on the chips. Problems with share exchanges and avalon chips keep us all occupied while we wait for news on the chips.

Current period: High risk again with diminishing prospects of a high reward in an increasingly competitive mining environment. The shareholder morale is at a low point and this is mainly due to us not hashing with any eASIC chips, not seeing any chips for the immediate future and not having enough information from Ken on when the chips will be finished (or what their final performance specs will be). It is looking more an more like we paid a low amount from an under-par chip with a longer delivery than a typical full-custom (look how quickly KnC got their 156GH/s full custom chip! shits all over our 16Gh/s non-existent chip). So the only benefit from using eASIC is the lower NRE and perhaps a faster turnaround for new chip orders.

I think once we are back trading there will be a big upswing in the share price to around 0.002 as new money enters the market and newbies with no experience and big ideas of retiring on mining divs push the demand up. The price would go higher if less people wanted to GTFO of their share position or if there was a decent announcement from Ken with some real information and dates.

Personally, I made my bet and I'm going to see it through to the end - be it boom or be it bust. I've always had a high appetite for risk and i haven't bet the house or anything stupid. Of course if the trolls win and mass dumping of shares occurs when we start trading, then i wouldn't rule out doubling down! My jupiter is still kicking out BTC1 every 52 hours or so and ROI was achieved a while back - so I've got BTC available to pull the trigger if the right opportunity arrises.

My two satoshis for you zumzero

[arousedrhino]

I think the extra hashrate is from ActiveMining going online!! Thanks Ken!

Umm... No its KNC Shipping the November orders.

The divs have not increased at all. https://blockchain.info/charts/balance?timespan=30days&showDataPoints=true&daysAverageString=1&show_header=true&scale=0&address=1DJpsvnM7xTnQbWEhLYyCyfxQyxwupEzCa

[hobbymd]

I think the extra hashrate is from ActiveMining going online!! Thanks Ken!

Umm... No its KNC Shipping the November orders.

The divs have not increased at all. https://blockchain.info/charts/balance?timespan=30days&showDataPoints=true&daysAverageString=1&show_header=true&scale=0&address=1DJpsvnM7xTnQbWEhLYyCyfxQyxwupEzCa

not sure if he was being sarcastic about it     so much for eASIC fast turn around bull crap we got fed !!! 

[zumzero]

Thanks wasubii, that was a great post.