[ANN][DASH] Dash (dash.org) | First Self-Funding Self-Governing Crypto Currency

[ddink7]

Isn't this the basis of the current political system? Maybe one day Dash will be big enough to have Dash political parties and Masternode Senators! 

Walter

Democracy is terrible. Delegative democracy is probably less terrible. Delegative democracy without egalitarianism(you have to have 1000 dash to vote) might actually work.

You are absolutely correct. As Churchill once said:

"Indeed it has been said that democracy is the worst form of Government except for all those other forms that have been tried from time to time.…"

But until somebody invents a better system, we keep coming back to it =)

Dash isn't a democrracy.  Votes are based on the amount invested.  More like shareholders.

There will only be 6000 or less masternodes.  It isn't unreasonable for each of those to research and vote on each proposal when each masternode is worth $100k.  And then each node will probably be shared by a few owners.  Each node owner may hire advisors to help read and decipher proposals.  Each node may have an internal voting strategy between owners.  And it is also possible to have each proposal be a group of projects that internally decide how they move forward.  So those 2000 proposals may be 20 with 100 projects under them.

The core voting mechanism needs to be done by those actually risking capital.  Every project is kept honest by the threat of losing funds, every voter has a vested interest and votes in the best interest of Dash.

You are more than welcome to do everything yourself and make all the votes yourself. The beauty of what we have is that nothing ever needs to be added to the code. If people get too busy to make all the decisions themselves, then they can simply give their mnprivkey to a trusted representative who will vote for them. No funds are ever at risk, no code needs to be added to the protocol. If for some reason a person wants to rescind their proxy, they could change their mnprivkey (a little bit of work, granted, but a possibility).

I don't expect that I'd ever give up voting control either. But as Evan says below, there may be areas I don't understand, and I may be willing to take the advice of people I trust in those areas. I'm not a monetarist, but toknormal is, and when he says Proof of Labor is a good proposal, I may choose to go ahead and cast my votes in favor.

So I see three types of MN owners in the future:

a) Do it all yourself. Do all the research, do all the voting, do all the follow up to make sure projects are on task.
b) Take the advice of trusted community members who specialize in various areas
c) Give trusted community members your proxy and they can vote for you

Solar, you are more than free to be a). I will probably be b). Some others may choose to be c). Evan never has to add a single line of code to enable all three options. In fact, they already exist, and will certainly grow organically.

Cheers!

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[Solarminer]

Isn't this the basis of the current political system? Maybe one day Dash will be big enough to have Dash political parties and Masternode Senators!  

Walter

Democracy is terrible. Delegative democracy is probably less terrible. Delegative democracy without egalitarianism(you have to have 1000 dash to vote) might actually work.

You are absolutely correct. As Churchill once said:

"Indeed it has been said that democracy is the worst form of Government except for all those other forms that have been tried from time to time.…"

But until somebody invents a better system, we keep coming back to it =)

Dash isn't a democrracy.  Votes are based on the amount invested.  More like shareholders.

There will only be 6000 or less masternodes.  It isn't unreasonable for each of those to research and vote on each proposal when each masternode is worth $100k.  And then each node will probably be shared by a few owners.  Each node owner may hire advisors to help read and decipher proposals.  Each node may have an internal voting strategy between owners.  And it is also possible to have each proposal be a group of projects that internally decide how they move forward.  So those 2000 proposals may be 20 with 100 projects under them.

The core voting mechanism needs to be done by those actually risking capital.  Every project is kept honest by the threat of losing funds, every voter has a vested interest and votes in the best interest of Dash.

Masternode operators are going to always lack specific domain knowledge that is required to make competent decisions about where to spend the money. Governments solve this issue by having boards of advisors, such as the administrative cabinet, the counsel on foreign relations, the economic advisory committees, etc. Can't we just alter this strategy slightly for our purposes?  For us, we're going to need to setup some kind of simple advisory boards for business, economics, technology and other things. What if at a few billion dollars we have four or five of these types of committees, where the masternodes are electing whoever they want into the roles. After that these people would do the research and publish reports.

These advisors could be expensive later on as well, I think they'll need significant experience in the domain in question. For economics, it might mean you have a PhD and have published. Those types of people are going to be too expensive to hire alone, I think it makes more sense for the network to band together.

If we use a setup like that, the masternodes could start by reading the research done by these committees about various decisions they need to make, then they could make up their own mind.

I am A OK with advisors helping masternode owners make decisions.  That could be a project voted in by masternodes or a private subsciption service.  But this should never be a situation of voting for 10 people with no stake in Dash to make decisions on behalf of all masternodes.

[ddink7]

I am A OK with advisors helping masternode owners make decisions.  That could be a project voted in by masternodes or a private subsciption service.  But this should never be a situation of voting for 10 people with no stake in Dash to make decisions on behalf of all masternodes.

I completely agree! I believe that some people will voluntarily assign their proxies to third parties, but it should never be forced on the entire network.

[tungfa]

Bitcoin and the Rise of the Cypherpunks
(dash mentioned)
http://www.coindesk.com/the-rise-of-the-cypherpunks/

[TaoOfSaatoshi]

The highest compliment I could ever receive as an epic thread winds down...

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1430587.msg14485328#msg14485328

[busterzzz]

Hello everybody,

fernando myself and oaxaca have been working hard to set the schedule for the Dash Round Table shows in the month of April. We are 2/3 of the way full and should secure our 3rd spot soon. Below you will find information about the three upcoming shows scheduled for this month. All of these shows are live and we take questions from the listeners via the slack channel. You can get an invite at this link:
https://digitalcash.signup.team/

Entire Schedule is Here
http://dashroundtable.org/#calendar

Dash Round Table: Ep.03
Streaming live on April 10, 2016 In Episode three Bill Cassidy, Dan aka 'Oaxaca' and Fernando G. Interview Robert Wiecko aka 'kot' who works as DASH Project Manager.
Time:
1:00 p.m. PST
Information:
http://dashroundtable.org/episodes/ep03/

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dash Round Table: Ep.04
Streaming live on April 17, 2016 We Interview Somebody TBD
Time:
1:00 p.m. PST
Information:
http://dashroundtable.org/episodes/ep04/

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dash Round Table: Ep.05
Streaming live on April 24, 2016 In Episode five the guys interview Evan Duffield Founder and Lead Developer of DASH. v12.1 is right around the corner and Evan is going to tell us all about the effort he and the rest of the team have been putting in. He says 'This is turning into a huge deal, it should be exciting.' (More info coming soon).
Time:
1:00 p.m. PST
Information:
http://dashroundtable.org/episodes/ep05/


Dash Round Table Hosts:
-Bill Cassidy
-Fernando Gutierrez
XeSVn8cqtSimrbpXJcWgw8BBvHQq1BXSX3
-Dan aka 'Oaxaca'
XfjGv4seimoeFkY91ztYixD8Hhupb9AZb9

Thanks for tuning in

[BagHolder010]

The highest compliment I could ever receive as an epic thread winds down...

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1430587.msg14485328#msg14485328

The XMR troll crew were like flies on shit in that thread.  Cheered on and encouraged by smooth of course.

Blinded by their own sense of destiny and zealots to the core.

It seems the more they hate the more their coin value go down; Still don't get why they don't focus on developing & doing some positive PR under their coin name instead.

[kointrend]

Bitcoin and the Rise of the Cypherpunks
(dash mentioned)
http://www.coindesk.com/the-rise-of-the-cypherpunks/

Coindesk speaking about Dash?! They have to got crazy.

[toknormal]

Alt-coin bloodbath.

Pump & dumps exposed.

[qwizzie]

Alt-coin bloodbath.

Pump & dumps exposed.

yep, we have blood in the streets. i wouldnt be surprised if some loose 50% of their value.

[toknormal]

[noobtrader]

i think i just lost 10% of my investment  


EDIT : oh btw, i still profit from Dash atm... i lost 10% from other coin

[Macrochip]

Back down the shitter it came crawling out of. Don't clog the pipe on your way out! #MoneroProlapse2016

Meanwhile Dash showing unsurpassed resilience and stability. How about another "COLLAPSE" post, Eduardo?

[stan.distortion]

Isn't this the basis of the current political system? Maybe one day Dash will be big enough to have Dash political parties and Masternode Senators!  

Walter

Democracy is terrible. Delegative democracy is probably less terrible. Delegative democracy without egalitarianism(you have to have 1000 dash to vote) might actually work.

You are absolutely correct. As Churchill once said:

"Indeed it has been said that democracy is the worst form of Government except for all those other forms that have been tried from time to time.…"

But until somebody invents a better system, we keep coming back to it =)

Dash isn't a democrracy.  Votes are based on the amount invested.  More like shareholders.

There will only be 6000 or less masternodes.  It isn't unreasonable for each of those to research and vote on each proposal when each masternode is worth $100k.  And then each node will probably be shared by a few owners.  Each node owner may hire advisors to help read and decipher proposals.  Each node may have an internal voting strategy between owners.  And it is also possible to have each proposal be a group of projects that internally decide how they move forward.  So those 2000 proposals may be 20 with 100 projects under them.

The core voting mechanism needs to be done by those actually risking capital.  Every project is kept honest by the threat of losing funds, every voter has a vested interest and votes in the best interest of Dash.

Masternode operators are going to always lack specific domain knowledge that is required to make competent decisions about where to spend the money. Governments solve this issue by having boards of advisors, such as the administrative cabinet, the counsel on foreign relations, the economic advisory committees, etc. Can't we just alter this strategy slightly for our purposes?  For us, we're going to need to setup some kind of simple advisory boards for business, economics, technology, etc. What if at a few billion dollars we have four or five of these types of committees, where the masternodes are electing whoever they want into the roles. After that these people would do the research and publish reports.

These advisors could be expensive later on as well, I think they'll need significant experience in the domain in question. For economics, it might mean you have a PhD and have published. Those types of people are going to be too expensive to hire alone, I think it makes more sense for the network to band together.

If we use a setup like that, the masternodes could start by reading the research done by these committees about various decisions they need to make, then they could make up their own mind.

Depends how nominations and elections are done, "official" research could open up the same kind of vulnerabilities as corporate lobbying of government. I'm fairly sure Liquid Feedback have gone over this area in detail, I know they had a lot of teething troubles getting just this kind of thing up and running smoothly.

A few thoughts, voters will have some idea of who's opinion they'd value on individual proposals and if those individuals have an ID they could be delegated, after a few links there'd be a leaderboard of sorts on who had influence on individual proposals and that could be presented to others to see how they align with their own views. Over time that would lead to self-categorisation of proposals, some individuals or groups with a lot of influence in PR, some on development and quite likely a few surprise groupings that cant really be confined to a single category but would likely be dynamically mappable. Maybe that could be incentivised, a reward for voting and split rewards for delegating votes or something along those lines but imho the recognition alone would create a far better incentive structure and with far less complications. EDIT: The delegation wouldn't necessarily have to be an ID, if one can be attached and chained then all the better but a link to something like a paper or article would be enough to reference common support.

One thing I'd be dead against is placing any kind of third party requirements on any of that though, education, standards bodies etc. Fine if individual groups insist on those kind of requirements but not the network, it would amount to discrimination even if that just means one persons country doesn't have an equivalent certificate to another's.

[Its About Sharing]

Can anyone tell me on the Dash Android wallet, how long does it take for a transaction to go through after sweeping some paper wallets in?
They are swept in (show completed green circle) and for 30 minutes now says "This payment has not been transmitted yet."?
I notice the fee is .001 Dash, was that ok?

Thx in advance,
IAS

[Gi01]

Interesting fact:

With the massive dump on ALL alt coins, the number of MN active went 20 up (and Dash is actually one of the few not losing 15-20%)

So it's just someone dumping, the Dash user base is totally stable

[Macno]

Interesting fact:

With the massive dump on ALL alt coins, the number of MN active went 20 up (and Dash is actually one of the few not losing 15-20%)

So it's just someone dumping, the Dash user base is totally stable

Yes, DASH is remarkably stable although it`s being shorted like crazy on Polo (lending rates exploding again).

[spatula]

Interesting fact:

With the massive dump on ALL alt coins, the number of MN active went 20 up (and Dash is actually one of the few not losing 15-20%)

So it's just someone dumping, the Dash user base is totally stable

Yes, DASH is remarkably stable although it`s being shorted like crazy on Polo (lending rates exploding again).

Yep, which is completely fine. Shorters have to buy back in eventually, and I would bet they thought DASH was going down like the rest of them. If DASH price stays (relatively) stable, they will pump our price right back to where it was or above.

[qwizzie]

Can anyone tell me on the Dash Android wallet, how long does it take for a transaction to go through after sweeping some paper wallets in?
They are swept in (show completed green circle) and for 30 minutes now says "This payment has not been transmitted yet."?
I notice the fee is .001 Dash, was that ok?

Thx in advance,
IAS

if this problem is still happening and after some time no answer has been provided, i suggest you make a thread here :

https://dashtalk.org/forums/miscellaneous-dash-support-questions.74/

[Macno]

Interesting fact:

With the massive dump on ALL alt coins, the number of MN active went 20 up (and Dash is actually one of the few not losing 15-20%)

So it's just someone dumping, the Dash user base is totally stable

Yes, DASH is remarkably stable although it`s being shorted like crazy on Polo (lending rates exploding again).

Yep, which is completely fine. Shorters have to buy back in eventually, and I would bet they thought DASH was going down like the rest of them. If DASH price stays (relatively) stable, they will pump our price right back to where it was or above.

I`m working hard on my first masternode made of DASH-shorty-tears (interest on DASH loans).