[ANN][DASH] Dash (dash.org) | First Self-Funding Self-Governing Crypto Currency

[TanteStefana2]

https://forum.ethereum.org/discussion/447/democracy-dao

How does this solve the tyranny of the majority?  This solves nothing in my opinion, though it may make a nicer and easier to use voting system.  I ask you, in the 1860's, would a popular vote have freed the slaves in America?

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[aigeezer]

https://forum.ethereum.org/discussion/447/democracy-dao

How does this solve the tyranny of the majority?  This solves nothing in my opinion, though it may make a nicer and easier to use voting system.  I ask you, in the 1860's, would a popular vote have freed the slaves in America?

No voting system solves the tyranny of the majority issue if the voters are bound by the outcome of votes. In crypto, unlike in the political realm, such binding is gentle because one can always choose to replace one coin/resource with another more to one's liking - there may or may not be profit/loss consequences but there is an exit path available. There is no opt-out provision in the nation-state voting model - each voting cycle guarantees that approximately half of a population will be frustrated or disappointed with the binding outcome, leading to ever-increasing festering resentments. In crypto, the safety valve takes the form of "I used to hodl X but now I hodl Y" - relatively painless by comparison, even if switching from X to Y incurs a cost.

I like DASH a lot but I'm not married to it. I don't like ETH, but it doesn't concern me that others do - I have no stake in how others choose their priorities, which is one of my favourite features about crypto-world. Choice - real choice - is a wonderful thing.       

   

[TanteStefana2]

https://forum.ethereum.org/discussion/447/democracy-dao

How does this solve the tyranny of the majority?  This solves nothing in my opinion, though it may make a nicer and easier to use voting system.  I ask you, in the 1860's, would a popular vote have freed the slaves in America?

No voting system solves the tyranny of the majority issue if the voters are bound by the outcome of votes. In crypto, unlike in the political realm, such binding is gentle because one can always choose to replace one coin/resource with another more to one's liking - there may or may not be profit/loss consequences but there is an exit path available. There is no opt-out provision in the nation-state voting model - each voting cycle guarantees that approximately half of a population will be frustrated or disappointed with the binding outcome, leading to ever-increasing festering resentments. In crypto, the safety valve takes the form of "I used to hodl X but now I hodl Y" - relatively painless by comparison, even if switching from X to Y incurs a cost.

I like DASH a lot but I'm not married to it. I don't like ETH, but it doesn't concern me that others do - I have no stake in how others choose their priorities, which is one of my favourite features about crypto-world. Choice - real choice - is a wonderful thing.       

   

Agreed.  Also, Rome never fell, it simply adapted ;P  No system will ever be perfect, and it will swing to extremes.  The people get lazy, then get up in arms in cycles, with most things chugging along well enough for most to hopefully thrive.  We all simply want to expand the thrivability to all of the earth's population. Perfection / Utopia can never be because we are each different and have slightly different values, even within a single family.  My Mother loves authority, it makes her feel secure, I hate it, it makes me feel smothered.  So compromise and flexibility are the only way, not one person's view of perfection or utopia

[HinnomTX]

anybody got some eth TA links?
i wonder how this could continue ^^
the volume is almost equal to btc  

im also curious what vita and the rest will do with their ethers, i mean they are committed to sell at these insane prices

Unless I've missed a big announcement, it looks like the ETH rise is because of a) TheDAO crowdsale, and b) FOMO from the rapid increase itself. "TheDAO" has collected $157 million so far in its crowdsale, with more than a week to go. The only way to invest is with ETH, so people who want to get a share of "TheDAO" are buying ETH as fast as humanly possible.

My theory is that we'll see a rapid decline as soon as the crowdsale ends, though I could be wrong.

I think "TheDAO" is going to be one of the most spectacular collapses in the history of crypto...but it will probably FOMO a lot more before that happens. It's basically a venture capital fund that invests in other Ethereum-based businesses.

P.S. It looks like there is a big rumor about Coinbase adding ETH, but I'm not seeing an official announcement yet.

There's also the theory that ETH is rising because it's being tied up increasingly in the DAO, leaving fewer ETH's to trade.
 

[Comodore]

Anybody notice all the commotion on dash forums? Seems like we got quite a few upset individuals about the DGBB system. Trying to get a better idea of what's going on if anybody has any insights.

"Distributed Governance By Blockchain" was always a hopeless pipe dream at odds with the actual reality that Duffield 100% controls Dash.

The recursive "reinvent all the things, with moar shiny blockchains and trendy decentralizations" was never going to lead anywhere but endless frustration.

Unlike an open-ended, pay-what-you-want project funding system, Dash's centralized, inflationary budget blocks create a zero-sum outcome where the incentive structure requires successful proposals to defeat other ones in order to be funded.  That's a recipe for conflict.

forking is the only solution for the discontent

Yes, only a hard fork away from Duffield, secret X11 ASIC mines, THE DARKCOIN FOUNDATION, INC., and the [problematic early emission] can save this project.

That's why Dash Classic is being implemented as a Bitcoin side chain.  It will enjoy all the benefits of Dash's masternode tier and Bitcoin's POW network, without the burden of fake "DGBB" gimmicks and legacy of snake oil marketing.

I hate this kind of spam. There are many comunities of similiarly-biased people attacking dash from absolutely volatile and unfounded ground.

If any of your claims were true then they would actualy make zero sense.
If Evan was a sole investor than it would have meant that he bringed 50 milion USD of his own money into the project. Now he is at stake to bring more money into the project.


Utterly great bullshit by monero-payed shills. Probably the only useful thing of monero anonymity is to pay those shills without evidence.

Actualy what you are saying is the same as saying that bitcoin is in hands of few. In fact the money is distributed in some way, it means nothing. It is not implying anything. One adress can be owned by company that is actualy owned by many more people and the money inside is belonging to many many more people.

You guys try to attack dash via its strong aspects but with total misinterpration of incentives that are at play.

Please leave this forum and go to your guru. We are building something good here.

[iCEBREAKER]

each voting cycle guarantees that approximately half of a population will be frustrated or disappointed with the binding outcome, leading to ever-increasing festering resentments. In crypto, the safety valve takes the form of "I used to hodl X but now I hodl Y"

That's a fine explanation of the winnowing consequences of an iterated zero-sum game, such as Masternode-voting-based Budget Blocks.

We're already seeing the Dash community fighting over the budget like jackals over a dead pig.

The result is an endless Dash Civil War, with (at least) two sides being relegated to Winner and Loser status in each voting cycle.  As you note, the Losers slither away to some other coin leaving a smaller number of combatants for the next budget battle.

That negative feedback loop is exactly why I'm highly skeptical of all formal crypto-democracy governance systems.  IMO only informal, dynamic structures may adequately support the invisible hand of the market (for technical reasons relating to information/incentive degradation via reification).

Decred has the best approach to solving these problems, such as requiring tickets to stake but also supporting stake pools.

Dash should have had protocol-level stake pooling long ago, so users with less than 1000 DRK don't have to depend on commercial 3rd party Masternode sharing services.

[ddink7]

anybody got some eth TA links?
i wonder how this could continue ^^
the volume is almost equal to btc  

im also curious what vita and the rest will do with their ethers, i mean they are committed to sell at these insane prices

Unless I've missed a big announcement, it looks like the ETH rise is because of a) TheDAO crowdsale, and b) FOMO from the rapid increase itself. "TheDAO" has collected $157 million so far in its crowdsale, with more than a week to go. The only way to invest is with ETH, so people who want to get a share of "TheDAO" are buying ETH as fast as humanly possible.

My theory is that we'll see a rapid decline as soon as the crowdsale ends, though I could be wrong.

I think "TheDAO" is going to be one of the most spectacular collapses in the history of crypto...but it will probably FOMO a lot more before that happens. It's basically a venture capital fund that invests in other Ethereum-based businesses.

P.S. It looks like there is a big rumor about Coinbase adding ETH, but I'm not seeing an official announcement yet.

There's also the theory that ETH is rising because it's being tied up increasingly in the DAO, leaving fewer ETH's to trade.
 

But that's the thing...it's not tied up. TheDAO is an investment fund that will eventually release every single ETH that's given to it...

[aigeezer]

... So compromise and flexibility are the only way, not one person's view of perfection or utopia

We seem to be on a similar wavelength, although the devil is in the details as always. For example, I don't endorse compromise if it takes the form "I'll wear a funny hat because you want me to if you wear goofy shoes because I want you to." Such compromises tend to result in growing brooding resentments and such compromises are a hallmark of contemporary society - "you can't fight city hall", "hell is other people", "shoganai" and so forth.

I am a fan of compromises of the form "I won't interfere with your life if you don't interfere with mine." The urge to meddle with other people is extremely strong in our species for some reason. I suppose it had evolutionary survival value - collective herd wisdom - I don't mean that disparagingly - it must have worked more often than not, but I try not to do it (he preached).            

So far DASH lines up well with my own fantasies of what money should be - especially its non-coercive aspects. It is what it is, a huge improvement over fiat at the very least. It will become what it will become. Heckuva ride, regardless.

[HinnomTX]

There's also the theory that ETH is rising because it's being tied up increasingly in the DAO, leaving fewer ETH's to trade.
 

But that's the thing...it's not tied up. TheDAO is an investment fund that will eventually release every single ETH that's given to it...

Fair point. In the long run you're absolutely right. I mean for the moment, lots of ETH is being locked up in the DAO crowdfund. Even a refund request is supposed to take 37 days or something, right?

I think it's very interesting to see the correlated rise of ETH and DASH since The DAO crowdfund started. Maybe Mr. Market is acknowledging that DAO structures, including DASH's own, are the way to go.

[dEBRUYNE]

anybody got some eth TA links?
i wonder how this could continue ^^
the volume is almost equal to btc  

im also curious what vita and the rest will do with their ethers, i mean they are committed to sell at these insane prices

Unless I've missed a big announcement, it looks like the ETH rise is because of a) TheDAO crowdsale, and b) FOMO from the rapid increase itself. "TheDAO" has collected $157 million so far in its crowdsale, with more than a week to go. The only way to invest is with ETH, so people who want to get a share of "TheDAO" are buying ETH as fast as humanly possible.

My theory is that we'll see a rapid decline as soon as the crowdsale ends, though I could be wrong.

I think "TheDAO" is going to be one of the most spectacular collapses in the history of crypto...but it will probably FOMO a lot more before that happens. It's basically a venture capital fund that invests in other Ethereum-based businesses.

P.S. It looks like there is a big rumor about Coinbase adding ETH, but I'm not seeing an official announcement yet.

There's also the theory that ETH is rising because it's being tied up increasingly in the DAO, leaving fewer ETH's to trade.
 

But that's the thing...it's not tied up. TheDAO is an investment fund that will eventually release every single ETH that's given to it...

He is partly right since the funds are locked-up for the next 10 days if I recall correctly, thereby reducing potential selling pressure during these 10 days.

[ddink7]

anybody got some eth TA links?
i wonder how this could continue ^^
the volume is almost equal to btc  

im also curious what vita and the rest will do with their ethers, i mean they are committed to sell at these insane prices

Unless I've missed a big announcement, it looks like the ETH rise is because of a) TheDAO crowdsale, and b) FOMO from the rapid increase itself. "TheDAO" has collected $157 million so far in its crowdsale, with more than a week to go. The only way to invest is with ETH, so people who want to get a share of "TheDAO" are buying ETH as fast as humanly possible.

My theory is that we'll see a rapid decline as soon as the crowdsale ends, though I could be wrong.

I think "TheDAO" is going to be one of the most spectacular collapses in the history of crypto...but it will probably FOMO a lot more before that happens. It's basically a venture capital fund that invests in other Ethereum-based businesses.

P.S. It looks like there is a big rumor about Coinbase adding ETH, but I'm not seeing an official announcement yet.

There's also the theory that ETH is rising because it's being tied up increasingly in the DAO, leaving fewer ETH's to trade.
 

But that's the thing...it's not tied up. TheDAO is an investment fund that will eventually release every single ETH that's given to it...

He is partly right since the funds are locked-up for the next 10 days if I recall correctly, thereby reducing potential selling pressure during these 10 days.

Good point to both of you. Short term, the coins are locked...so is the rise only for the short-term?

[dEBRUYNE]

anybody got some eth TA links?
i wonder how this could continue ^^
the volume is almost equal to btc  

im also curious what vita and the rest will do with their ethers, i mean they are committed to sell at these insane prices

Unless I've missed a big announcement, it looks like the ETH rise is because of a) TheDAO crowdsale, and b) FOMO from the rapid increase itself. "TheDAO" has collected $157 million so far in its crowdsale, with more than a week to go. The only way to invest is with ETH, so people who want to get a share of "TheDAO" are buying ETH as fast as humanly possible.

My theory is that we'll see a rapid decline as soon as the crowdsale ends, though I could be wrong.

I think "TheDAO" is going to be one of the most spectacular collapses in the history of crypto...but it will probably FOMO a lot more before that happens. It's basically a venture capital fund that invests in other Ethereum-based businesses.

P.S. It looks like there is a big rumor about Coinbase adding ETH, but I'm not seeing an official announcement yet.

There's also the theory that ETH is rising because it's being tied up increasingly in the DAO, leaving fewer ETH's to trade.
 

But that's the thing...it's not tied up. TheDAO is an investment fund that will eventually release every single ETH that's given to it...

He is partly right since the funds are locked-up for the next 10 days if I recall correctly, thereby reducing potential selling pressure during these 10 days.

Good point to both of you. Short term, the coins are locked...so is the rise only for the short-term?

Who knows, if Coinbase and/or OKcoin will really add ETH the rise is probably sustainable.

[qwizzie]

Dash Masternodes Study: Rising Crypto Bonds of the Future
by Tungfa
date : 18th of may 2016
Article written by Roman Latkovic and published by Vanbex.

https://www.dash.org/news/dash-masternodes-study-rising-crypto-bonds-of-the-future/

[Minotaur26]

Volume on BTC-e seems to be picking up, they are #2 in volume today. That is really good news in my opinion as we were in need of other good exchanges besides Polo with good liquidity. Hopefully the trend continues and volume there keeps rising.

http://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/dash/#markets

[alex-ru]

Am I the only one who see this similar pattern?

[Comodore]

Volume on BTC-e seems to be picking up, they are #2 in volume today. That is really good news in my opinion as we were in need of other good exchanges besides Polo with good liquidity. Hopefully the trend continues and volume there keeps rising.

http://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/dash/#markets

That's very good news.


I am not gona feed trolls. Just the monero guys are going to dash forums but it does not work the other way. There is definitely some black fund being used to pay for this multi-level type of marketing.

Look at the monetary base and incentivization. That thing look like some kind of invisible pyramide. That's the final inovation of monero.

[TanteStefana2]

... So compromise and flexibility are the only way, not one person's view of perfection or utopia

We seem to be on a similar wavelength, although the devil is in the details as always. For example, I don't endorse compromise if it takes the form "I'll wear a funny hat because you want me to if you wear goofy shoes because I want you to." Such compromises tend to result in growing brooding resentments and such compromises are a hallmark of contemporary society - "you can't fight city hall", "hell is other people", "shoganai" and so forth.

I am a fan of compromises of the form "I won't interfere with your life if you don't interfere with mine." The urge to meddle with other people is extremely strong in our species for some reason. I suppose it had evolutionary survival value - collective herd wisdom - I don't mean that disparagingly - it must have worked more often than not, but I try not to do it (he preached).            

So far DASH lines up well with my own fantasies of what money should be - especially its non-coercive aspects. It is what it is, a huge improvement over fiat at the very least. It will become what it will become. Heckuva ride, regardless.

Yah, we're still on exactly the same wave length.

[jiggytom]

It's official, ETH being added to coinbase and they are rebranding as GDAX, which stands for Global Digital Asset Exchange.  How do we get them to add DASH?

http://www.coindesk.com/coinbase-exchange-rebrand-ethereum-trading/

edit: To be clear, it's just the exchange that is rebranding. Coinbase.com remains Coinbase.

[HinnomTX]

It's official, ETH being added to coinbase and they are rebranding as GDAX, which stands for Global Digital Asset Exchange.  How do we get them to add DASH?

http://www.coindesk.com/coinbase-exchange-rebrand-ethereum-trading/

edit: To be clear, it's just the exchange that is rebranding. Coinbase.com remains Coinbase.

No worries. Coinbase is just starting to diversify, and ETH is the natural starting point. The Lawnmower prophecy is coming true.
https://www.reddit.com/r/dashpay/comments/4bwxa0/screenshot_from_latest_update_of_lawnmowerio/
 

[Johnny00]

Anyone have an idea of why dash has jumped up these past couple weeks?