New Official AMT Thread

[captin crunch]

Since they are sending me back the miner, I will have my technical guys look at it again. For some reason only half the boards work.  In order to make it easier on us, I will try to just ask for the parts I need if that is a possibility. The RasPi works, its just only half the boards work. Either its the cables or the backplane that was damaged in shipping.  I will just not worry about the case if I can get it to hash at 1.2Th/s with support. Thank You.

Okay, keep me us up to date with you return process.  I got a 48lb brick in my basement that needs to be sent out.   I don't want to have the trouble of it being shipped and being bounced around several times to a non-accepting location.

AMT.... what address is best place to send RMA equipment.  Is the FEDEX location the best?

Carlos,

Hold on to your miner for a bit and we'll let you in the near future of how to RMA it alright.

My mistake. I guess they were talking to Frictionless but you were also in the quote. Told you it probably wouldn't help

Captain, the problem was when they told Frictionless coin, my miner had already shipped to them. They told me to RMA it, but there was no one in the PA office to accept it.  This was April 11th mind you... No problem...

Yes, I have totally been fallowing the drama / AMT thread. I guess what I was trying to say is would you rather have them take back your fucked up machines and replace them with other fucked up machines of the same type or see what your other options are for getting a more stable machine or whatever your choice may be.

I wasn't trying to stir the pot, in fact now, after thinking about it I can't believe I even said anything based on AMT's long history of never fallowing through with anything. But it does appear they are making an attempt to get things back on track. I guess we will all see what happens as this thing plays itself out.

I certainly didn't mean to offend you. I apologize if I did. I totally feel for you, They are into me for three of them and I am way lower number than you.

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[FrictionlessCoin]

Yes, I have totally been fallowing the drama / AMT thread. I guess what I was trying to say is would you rather have them take back your fucked up machines and replace them with other fucked up machines of the same type or see what your other options are for getting a more stable machine or whatever your choice may be.

I wasn't trying to stir the pot, in fact now, after thinking about it I can't believe I even said anything based on AMT's long history of never fallowing through with anything. But it does appear they are making an attempt to get things back on track. I guess we will all see what happens as this thing plays itself out.

I certainly didn't mean to offend you. I apologize if I did. I totally feel for you, They are into me for three of them and I am way lower number than you.

So why is it only now that they are making an effort? 

The Consumer Affairs folks were already communicating with them and the best they could do was ship us non-working miners.

The Lawsuit was filled almost about a month ago however it was only 2 weeks ago that they decided to ink a deal with Technobit.

There seems to be a high level of cluelessness here in that AMT seems to think that shipping electronics straight out of their assembly plant doesn't require some level of testing and rework.

There seems also like they are unaware of all the consumer protection laws that exist in the U.S.    You can pull this stunt off in other countries,  but in the U.S.?   I mean if they set shop in Bulgaria, they might have a chance to get away with it.   

[plp]

Well,  has everyone signed up yet with the lawyers yet?

Here are the details:

http://www.chimicles.com/lawsuit-filed-against-advanced-mining-technology-for-failure-to-deliver-bitcoin-miners

Give them a call: 
Kimberly Donaldson Smith
Phone: 610-642-8500

Try to figure out what the status is.

My take in all this,  AMT fortunately doesn't appear to be a complete scam.

Nevertheless, they have failed miserably in providing poor customer relations and non working products.

Can they be charged for 'Federal Wire Fraud'? If they refuse to refund customers, then without a doubt.

Can they declare bankruptcy?  I doubt it. 

Just called them a little while ago they said we are all involved in the class action law suite and if you want to file for a individual lawsuit you can also do this .

Looks Like I am going to file a small claims lawsuit against them I am tired of emailing these pricks I just want my $ back ..

If any one has done a small claims already please let me know . thanks

[opieum2]

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Carlos,

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My mistake. I guess they were talking to Frictionless but you were also in the quote. Told you it probably wouldn't help

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Yes, I have totally been fallowing the drama / AMT thread. I guess what I was trying to say is would you rather have them take back your fucked up machines and replace them with other fucked up machines of the same type or see what your other options are for getting a more stable machine or whatever your choice may be.

I wasn't trying to stir the pot, in fact now, after thinking about it I can't believe I even said anything based on AMT's long history of never fallowing through with anything. But it does appear they are making an attempt to get things back on track. I guess we will all see what happens as this thing plays itself out.

I certainly didn't mean to offend you. I apologize if I did. I totally feel for you, They are into me for three of them and I am way lower number than you.

captain, you are not wrong in what you are saying. They certainly should be offering us something else. Its like getting a shitty car returning it only to get another shitty car. They should be willing to financially compensate us back or buy a competitors hardware for the equal amount of money that we spent with them. This is a more than fair offer.....

OTOH, now we are stuck waiting for other designs that may or may not work. BUT considering the legal pressure they are under, it would be stupid of them to screw this up. This would create a crapload of problems for them and potentially become a contempt of court issue.....not to mention open the door to other legal problems as well.

It's 4:56PM EST.....still not a peep from AMT on things. We are still waiting.

[opieum2]

Yes, I have totally been fallowing the drama / AMT thread. I guess what I was trying to say is would you rather have them take back your fucked up machines and replace them with other fucked up machines of the same type or see what your other options are for getting a more stable machine or whatever your choice may be.

I wasn't trying to stir the pot, in fact now, after thinking about it I can't believe I even said anything based on AMT's long history of never fallowing through with anything. But it does appear they are making an attempt to get things back on track. I guess we will all see what happens as this thing plays itself out.

I certainly didn't mean to offend you. I apologize if I did. I totally feel for you, They are into me for three of them and I am way lower number than you.

So why is it only now that they are making an effort? 

The Consumer Affairs folks were already communicating with them and the best they could do was ship us non-working miners.

The Lawsuit was filled almost about a month ago however it was only 2 weeks ago that they decided to ink a deal with Technobit.

There seems to be a high level of cluelessness here in that AMT seems to think that shipping electronics straight out of their assembly plant doesn't require some level of testing and rework.

There seems also like they are unaware of all the consumer protection laws that exist in the U.S.    You can pull this stunt off in other countries,  but in the U.S.?   I mean if they set shop in Bulgaria, they might have a chance to get away with it.   

The irony in that statement is....if you look at some of the foreign companies like bitmain and spondoolies, they don't have many legal obligations to provide stellar service....they just do. Because they know its far more money in the long term. Repeat business.  We have these laws and companies try to pull that crap here. Now its biting them in the ass in a huge way.

All I want are those terms to know if I accept the settlement terms or not. And if what they said about those terms are valid. They keep pulling this childish crap where they say one thing and do nor deliver. I expect that behavior from my 6 year old.....not grown adults running a corporation.

[FrictionlessCoin]

Captain, I have no hard feelings buddy. The only one I have hard feelings here is AMT because I paid $6,000 in 2013 and nothing to show for it but a bunch of broken parts which keep getting returned to me.

Maybe you should send it again.

This will just highlight the absurdity of how you are being treated as a customer.

[FrictionlessCoin]

AMT_Miners, should I send this back again? Please advise? I have all the records that I am telling the truth about calling you for a week to pick up this miner when you did not. I also have the records it sat in the FedEx warehouse for another full week. It would be in your best interest at this point to get a move on things here.

I recommend sending it back at least 3 times.  This will be ample evidence to invoke the "Federal Lemon Law" on them.

Which does remind me,  I need to also send then back broken equipment.

[FrictionlessCoin]

Just called them a little while ago they said we are all involved in the class action law suite and if you want to file for a individual lawsuit you can also do this .

Looks Like I am going to file a small claims lawsuit against them I am tired of emailing these pricks I just want my $ back ..

If any one has done a small claims already please let me know . thanks

Well, use this info:  http://www.montcopa.org/index.aspx?NID=300  to setup a date to file a small claims lawsuit.  Note: Should be under $12,000.

I think it probably is worth it to do so since it'll cost you only $200, however AMT needs to bring in their expensive lawyer to defend the case.

I think in terms of demands,  basically if you bought one unit,  the purchase price and shipping ($6,000), plus two months worth of mining based on difficulty at the time.  So that's probably around $2,500 in BTC.   

[Syke]

I think it probably is worth it to do so since it'll cost you only $200, however AMT needs to bring in their expensive lawyer to defend the case.

This is AMT we are talking about. They won't show up and you'll win a default judgement. The trouble will be collecting on the judgement.

[plp]

I am sure with a judgement which ever bank there banking at will have to give me the $

[Syke]

I am sure with a judgement which ever bank there banking at will have to give me the $

Every day that goes by means less and less $$$ in their bank account. Eventually it will reach 0. So time is of the essence if you want to get your money back.

[FrictionlessCoin]

I am sure with a judgement which ever bank there banking at will have to give me the $

I don't think it works that way.  I think it works by hiring a collections agency that convinces the debtor to fork over the money.

Now whether you have to win in small claims court or not is an open question.

[sirminesalot]

I'm sure Joshua Zipkin will rear his ugly head again soon - and give another excuse as to the delay on this particular update/plan. It will be more "talked about solutions" with no substance or anything you can take to the bank. This has been the case with EVERY so-called "update" for the past 6 months.

Joshua will continue to do this as he has each time in the past, buying himself more time.

Anyone that hasn't talked with a lawyer yet, has made a large error based on false trust. Do not get duped into holding off any longer, you can always cancel on the suit if AMT miraculously does right by everyone (not looking like that will happen).

AMT founder Joshua Zipkin deserves to be in jail and/or heavily fined and charged with fraud. Anyone else involved with this RUSE that is AMT should also be held accountable.

[opieum2]

I'm sure Joshua Zipkin will rear his ugly head again soon - and give another excuse as to the delay on this particular update/plan. It will be more "talked about solutions" with no substance or anything you can take to the bank. This has been the case with EVERY so-called "update" for the past 6 months.

Joshua will continue to do this as he has each time in the past, buying himself more time.

Anyone that hasn't talked with a lawyer yet, has made a large error based on false trust. Do not get duped into holding off any longer, you can always cancel on the suit if AMT miraculously does right by everyone (not looking like that will happen).

AMT founder Joshua Zipkin deserves to be in jail and/or heavily fined and charged with fraud. Anyone else involved with this RUSE that is AMT should also be held accountable.

@AMT...we were expecting an update today based on your word. At this point all of us are holding AMT accountable for this...considering that this is more of the same misrepresentation, you are legally liable while in the middle of a lawsuit for presenting this information to us. You cannot expect us to not be angry when you back out on your word yet again. I have to concur with sirminesalot on this position. We all have been waiting an incredible amount of time and being strung along with what should have been a simple transaction.

We still have no information on process for RMA, or what will replace the current product....will the MPP be honored? and if so why not? We have been asking what are valid questions here and considering the circumstances it is incumbent upon you to provide some answers for us. We have all tried to be very patient some more than others, but with this latest break in word, its getting old. While you have had marto validate that you will be using his designs, the concern is that he is not making them and instead we are again relying on you to provide us with hardware (because the first time did not go so well so can you blame us).....also it appears now you have the FBI investigating you based on Mrparks source. Considering his background which you publicly posted, I would not consider that a bluff.

I personally tried to help out for the sake of the customers but it does not appear you really want to try to make this right. Communication is key in all this and we are just seeing more words with little or no substance. If you say you will post an announcement then post it when you say you will. At this point the chips fall where they may. I had hoped keeping order in this thread would actually help get you to communicate more, but its only lead to alot more of the same misleading and stringing along statements.

[eightcylinders]

Can someone who has received one of the 1.2 Th/s miners confirm that the heatsink on the A1 chip is only on the top (e.g., there is no heatsink on the backside of the PCB)?  I ask because it is clear looking at Innosilicon specs that a majority of the heat is designed to go to the PCB side (back) and heatsinks on both back and front are *required* by spec... that could explain the meltdowns.  Sorry if that was covered before.

[opieum2]

I'm sure Joshua Zipkin will rear his ugly head again soon - and give another excuse as to the delay on this particular update/plan. It will be more "talked about solutions" with no substance or anything you can take to the bank. This has been the case with EVERY so-called "update" for the past 6 months.

Joshua will continue to do this as he has each time in the past, buying himself more time.

Anyone that hasn't talked with a lawyer yet, has made a large error based on false trust. Do not get duped into holding off any longer, you can always cancel on the suit if AMT miraculously does right by everyone (not looking like that will happen).

AMT founder Joshua Zipkin deserves to be in jail and/or heavily fined and charged with fraud. Anyone else involved with this RUSE that is AMT should also be held accountable.

BTW credit is due you posted something useful so thanks for that. I am not above giving credit where its due...whether you care or not I am putting it out there anyway.
FYI with the class action we don't need to talk to a lawyer...we already got one. The class affects everyone. That said separate complaints can be brought if the existing settlement is not adequate...which we don't really know as we don't have the actual details they were supposed to give us today.

[FrictionlessCoin]

Can someone who has received one of the 1.2 Th/s miners confirm that the heatsink on the A1 chip is only on the top (e.g., there is no heatsink on the backside of the PCB)?  I ask because it is clear looking at Innosilicon specs that a majority of the heat is designed to go to the PCB side (back) and heatsinks on both back and front are *required* by spec... that could explain the meltdowns.  Sorry if that was covered before.

There should be a heat sink on both sides.  The top side however should have a heat sink that should transfer 30% of the heat.  Unfortunately, AMT design has tiny heat sinks that aren't even close to twice the size of the back side heat sink.

[FrictionlessCoin]

I'm sure Joshua Zipkin will rear his ugly head again soon - and give another excuse as to the delay on this particular update/plan. It will be more "talked about solutions" with no substance or anything you can take to the bank. This has been the case with EVERY so-called "update" for the past 6 months.

Joshua will continue to do this as he has each time in the past, buying himself more time.

Anyone that hasn't talked with a lawyer yet, has made a large error based on false trust. Do not get duped into holding off any longer, you can always cancel on the suit if AMT miraculously does right by everyone (not looking like that will happen).

AMT founder Joshua Zipkin deserves to be in jail and/or heavily fined and charged with fraud. Anyone else involved with this RUSE that is AMT should also be held accountable.

BTW credit is due you posted something useful so thanks for that. I am not above giving credit where its due...whether you care or not I am putting it out there anyway.
FYI with the class action we don't need to talk to a lawyer...we already got one. The class affects everyone. That said separate complaints can be brought if the existing settlement is not adequate...which we don't really know as we don't have the actual details they were supposed to give us today.

Yes,  I'm curious of how that works.   If someone say does not agree with the settlement,  I gather he has the right to have his own lawsuit?   Also, how do we all collectively agree on an acceptable remedy?

I gather that AMT must come out with a settlement.  I seriously doubt they have a winnable case.  I mean,  what is their argument for not providing a refund?   

[opieum2]

Can someone who has received one of the 1.2 Th/s miners confirm that the heatsink on the A1 chip is only on the top (e.g., there is no heatsink on the backside of the PCB)?  I ask because it is clear looking at Innosilicon specs that a majority of the heat is designed to go to the PCB side (back) and heatsinks on both back and front are *required* by spec... that could explain the meltdowns.  Sorry if that was covered before.

The chips appear to be assembled properly. BUT one problem is the amount of thermal grease too much and too little and general build quality of the hardware. It seems like there is no uniformity in the build batches. one could have one voltage and another board another....so if you run cgminer on one voltage you will have a board or 4 burn out on you. So any uniform or standard setting (which in actuality was the default bitmine settings that were much higher and would cause the boards to fry almost as soon as they came online) could cause the boards to fry.

I ran into this with one miner that had 3 boards pretty much die on me in 5 minutes and then a 4th shortly and I was able to salvage a 5th onto my working miner that had one dead board....that 4th board died a couple of days later while leaving me now with 4 out of 10 working boards..at this point i am expecting them to die at some point. But knock on wood they are still working. So the design is a working design. But the build quality and general QA testing was pretty much non-existent hence the problems.

[opieum2]

I'm sure Joshua Zipkin will rear his ugly head again soon - and give another excuse as to the delay on this particular update/plan. It will be more "talked about solutions" with no substance or anything you can take to the bank. This has been the case with EVERY so-called "update" for the past 6 months.

Joshua will continue to do this as he has each time in the past, buying himself more time.

Anyone that hasn't talked with a lawyer yet, has made a large error based on false trust. Do not get duped into holding off any longer, you can always cancel on the suit if AMT miraculously does right by everyone (not looking like that will happen).

AMT founder Joshua Zipkin deserves to be in jail and/or heavily fined and charged with fraud. Anyone else involved with this RUSE that is AMT should also be held accountable.

BTW credit is due you posted something useful so thanks for that. I am not above giving credit where its due...whether you care or not I am putting it out there anyway.
FYI with the class action we don't need to talk to a lawyer...we already got one. The class affects everyone. That said separate complaints can be brought if the existing settlement is not adequate...which we don't really know as we don't have the actual details they were supposed to give us today.

Yes,  I'm curious of how that works.   If someone say does not agree with the settlement,  I gather he has the right to have his own lawsuit?   Also, how do we all collectively agree on an acceptable remedy?

I gather that AMT must come out with a settlement.  I seriously doubt they have a winnable case.  I mean,  what is their argument for not providing a refund?  

There isn't an argument. And most courts frown upon bankruptcy to avoid a consumer debt. Most courts wont even grant it until the consumers have been made whole. Its been tried before. There are plenty of cases like that. And yea you can go and sue....as for agreeing collectively that largely depends on the terms they propose. If they say you will get X and we are mostly all ok with it....then great we move on....if not.....we can state that to the lawfirm.....at the end of the day tho I think the plantiffs registered clenell and the other dude (forget his username) would kinda speak on everyone behalf in that regard. They might push for better terms. But if an agreement can't be made in settlement it goes to trial which honestly could go either way BUT considering things it could work heavily in our favor with all the evidence and written documentation there is. But anyone not in agreement with whatever settlement they got would be free to find their own lawyer and get that litigated. The problem is you can't come at them for the same thing or you start to run afoul of double jeopardy and the case gets tossed out.