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Author Topic: SatoshiDICE.com - The World's Most Popular Bitcoin Game  (Read 398485 times)
kano
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September 29, 2012, 12:58:52 PM
 #741

No - it's not a free bump - it's you trying to steal his customers and using his popularity without paying for it and then making up excuses for it.

... hopefully you lose business for doing this, not gain from it ...

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SRoulette
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September 29, 2012, 02:52:57 PM
 #742

No - it's not a free bump - it's you trying to steal his customers and using his popularity without paying for it and then making up excuses for it.

... hopefully you lose business for doing this, not gain from it ...

No, it is just us letting people know these games are currently available. We hope to see SatoshiDice.com expand their select soon Cheesy

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September 29, 2012, 04:02:36 PM
 #743

Can you develop an alternative game where the I can win what I actually rolled? for example, I rolled a 18, but my bet was on lessthan 64000, so I missed out on a potentially big payout. In this alternative game, if I roll a 16, then I get paid the 1998.853x multiplier or whatever multiplier that would be mathematically correct. I'd like to play this style.

If they paid 64000x for every zero, 31981.573x for every 1, etc. using the current payouts, the expected return per 1 BTC bet would be 9.3 BTC.

So to make a game with a small positive (1.9%) expectation for the house, but with the same proportions of the payouts, we need to scale the current multipliers back by 9.3 / 0.981.  I left the 'losing' return at 0.005, and slightly adjusted the 3rd decimal place of the payouts to make it work.  Then we get:

Code:
lessthan 1 6750.942x
lessthan 2 3373.527x
lessthan 4 1686.764x
lessthan 8 843.382x
lessthan 16 421.691x
lessthan 32 210.846x
lessthan 64 105.423x
lessthan 128   52.712x
lessthan 256   26.356x
lessthan 512   13.178x
lessthan 1000    6.747x
lessthan 1500    4.498x
lessthan 2000    3.374x
lessthan 3000    2.249x
lessthan 4000    1.687x
lessthan 6000    1.125x
lessthan 8000    0.844x
lessthan 12000    0.563x
lessthan 16000    0.422x
lessthan 24000    0.282x
lessthan 32000    0.211x
lessthan 32768    0.206x
lessthan 48000    0.141x
lessthan 52000    0.130x
lessthan 56000    0.121x
lessthan 60000    0.113x
lessthan 64000    0.106x
64000 or more    0.005x

Which gives pretty much the correct house edge:

Code:
>>> (
     1 * 6750.942 +
     1 * 3373.527 +
     2 * 1686.764 +
     4 *  843.382 +
     8 *  421.691 +
    16 *  210.846 +
    32 *  105.423 +
    64 *   52.712 +
   128 *   26.356 +
   256 *   13.178 +
   488 *    6.747 +
   500 *    4.498 +
   500 *    3.374 +
  1000 *    2.249 +
  1000 *    1.687 +
  2000 *    1.125 +
  2000 *    0.844 +
  4000 *    0.563 +
  4000 *    0.422 +
  8000 *    0.282 +
  8000 *    0.211 +
   768 *    0.206 +
 15232 *    0.141 +
  4000 *    0.130 +
  4000 *    0.121 +
  4000 *    0.113 +
  4000 *    0.106 +
  1536 *    0.005) / 65536

0.9810327911376953

Would people be willing to play a game where you need to roll less than 6000 to 'win'?  It means that less than one ticket in ten is a winning ticket.

No actually, this is a good idea!

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Herbert
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September 30, 2012, 09:51:50 PM
 #744

After skimming through this whole thread and not finding the answer:
I don't understand why you pay that small amount even when losing. What is the motivation?

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kano
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October 01, 2012, 01:26:13 AM
 #745

After skimming through this whole thread and not finding the answer:
I don't understand why you pay that small amount even when losing. What is the motivation?
You can't use a transaction twice ... without a lot of effort and only if done very soon after the original transaction.

Pool: https://kano.is BTC: 1KanoiBupPiZfkwqB7rfLXAzPnoTshAVmb
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Bjork
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October 01, 2012, 02:14:07 AM
 #746

lol, was going to play for a little bit and lost 7 times in a row as soon as i started.

 That's all for today  Tongue

Herbert
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October 01, 2012, 08:44:57 AM
 #747

After skimming through this whole thread and not finding the answer:
I don't understand why you pay that small amount even when losing. What is the motivation?
You can't use a transaction twice ... without a lot of effort and only if done very soon after the original transaction.
So this is for protecting against double-spend attacks? How does it help?

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dooglus
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October 01, 2012, 04:19:17 PM
 #748

After skimming through this whole thread and not finding the answer:
I don't understand why you pay that small amount even when losing. What is the motivation?

Imagine you send a bet and get nothing back.  Did you lose, or did your bet get lost or stuck somewhere?  You can't tell.

So they send a small amount back when you lose to let you know that the bet was processed successfully, and that you lost.

That way you're not left wondering whether their server is just being slow.

I just read what http://www.satoshidice.com/bits.php has to say about it:

Quote
If you lose, the return your bet times 0.005

which looks like a typo to me - perhaps it should say 'they return your bet'?  Either way, the losing payment is half of 1 percent of your bet.

evoorhees
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October 02, 2012, 12:37:02 AM
 #749

No - it's not a free bump - it's you trying to steal his customers and using his popularity without paying for it and then making up excuses for it.

... hopefully you lose business for doing this, not gain from it ...

No, it is just us letting people know these games are currently available. We hope to see SatoshiDice.com expand their select soon Cheesy

Please let people know about your games without spamming other games' threads. It's in bad taste.

I won't be posting on your thread that SatoshiDice's new website is about to launch... for example.
SRoulette
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October 02, 2012, 02:09:53 AM
 #750

Please let people know about your games without spamming other games' threads. It's in bad taste.

Speaking of comments made in bad taste

yawn

Man... if you're going to rip off my site, at least make a better looking one. Yours is an uglier version with a chat window and no ability to bet over 1btc   Cry

We did take your feed back on board and revamped most of our site, All games support bitcoin links for easy betting and we borrowed your idea of having a blockchain.info link for each address. The chat window and log window will be the last to get a face lift Cheesy

We will not spam our games to your clients in your thread when players are asking for our games whose description  matches ours, but will will comment to say we do have those games.

We look forward to seeing your new site launch Cheesy

kano
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October 02, 2012, 04:00:25 AM
 #751

After skimming through this whole thread and not finding the answer:
I don't understand why you pay that small amount even when losing. What is the motivation?
You can't use a transaction twice ... without a lot of effort and only if done very soon after the original transaction.
So this is for protecting against double-spend attacks? How does it help?
Well - sort of Smiley But not really ...

It means that the transaction process is complete - once the payment has been made, there will be no other transactions coming off your bet.

dooglus I guess worded it differently but better - you actually know the status of your bet - even when you lose.

But it goes one step further, the status can't change either.

Pool: https://kano.is BTC: 1KanoiBupPiZfkwqB7rfLXAzPnoTshAVmb
CKPool and CGMiner developer, IRC FreeNode #ckpool and #cgminer kanoi
Help keep Bitcoin secure by mining on pools with Stratum, the best protocol to mine Bitcoins with ASIC hardware
Herbert
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October 02, 2012, 09:09:40 AM
 #752

After skimming through this whole thread and not finding the answer:
I don't understand why you pay that small amount even when losing. What is the motivation?

Imagine you send a bet and get nothing back.  Did you lose, or did your bet get lost or stuck somewhere?  You can't tell.

So they send a small amount back when you lose to let you know that the bet was processed successfully, and that you lost.

That way you're not left wondering whether their server is just being slow.

It means that the transaction process is complete - once the payment has been made, there will be no other transactions coming off your bet.

dooglus I guess worded it differently but better - you actually know the status of your bet - even when you lose.

But it goes one step further, the status can't change either.

Ahh, that makes sense. Thanks for clearing it up!

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evoorhees
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Democracy is the original 51% attack


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October 02, 2012, 07:50:49 PM
 #753


September's dividend of 206.53002089 BTC has been paid on MPEX (and the GLBSE passthrough has been paid as well)

To buy shares on MPEX - click here
To buy shares on GLBSE - click here
fireduck
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October 04, 2012, 05:40:10 PM
 #754

Can you develop an alternative game where the I can win what I actually rolled? for example, I rolled a 18, but my bet was on lessthan 64000, so I missed out on a potentially big payout. In this alternative game, if I roll a 16, then I get paid the 1998.853x multiplier or whatever multiplier that would be mathematically correct. I'd like to play this style.

If they paid 64000x for every zero, 31981.573x for every 1, etc. using the current payouts, the expected return per 1 BTC bet would be 9.3 BTC.

So to make a game with a small positive (1.9%) expectation for the house, but with the same proportions of the payouts, we need to scale the current multipliers back by 9.3 / 0.981.  I left the 'losing' return at 0.005, and slightly adjusted the 3rd decimal place of the payouts to make it work.  Then we get:

Code:
lessthan 1 6750.942x
lessthan 2 3373.527x
lessthan 4 1686.764x
lessthan 8 843.382x
lessthan 16 421.691x
lessthan 32 210.846x
lessthan 64 105.423x
lessthan 128   52.712x
lessthan 256   26.356x
lessthan 512   13.178x
lessthan 1000    6.747x
lessthan 1500    4.498x
lessthan 2000    3.374x
lessthan 3000    2.249x
lessthan 4000    1.687x
lessthan 6000    1.125x
lessthan 8000    0.844x
lessthan 12000    0.563x
lessthan 16000    0.422x
lessthan 24000    0.282x
lessthan 32000    0.211x
lessthan 32768    0.206x
lessthan 48000    0.141x
lessthan 52000    0.130x
lessthan 56000    0.121x
lessthan 60000    0.113x
lessthan 64000    0.106x
64000 or more    0.005x

Which gives pretty much the correct house edge:

Code:
>>> (
     1 * 6750.942 +
     1 * 3373.527 +
     2 * 1686.764 +
     4 *  843.382 +
     8 *  421.691 +
    16 *  210.846 +
    32 *  105.423 +
    64 *   52.712 +
   128 *   26.356 +
   256 *   13.178 +
   488 *    6.747 +
   500 *    4.498 +
   500 *    3.374 +
  1000 *    2.249 +
  1000 *    1.687 +
  2000 *    1.125 +
  2000 *    0.844 +
  4000 *    0.563 +
  4000 *    0.422 +
  8000 *    0.282 +
  8000 *    0.211 +
   768 *    0.206 +
 15232 *    0.141 +
  4000 *    0.130 +
  4000 *    0.121 +
  4000 *    0.113 +
  4000 *    0.106 +
  1536 *    0.005) / 65536

0.9810327911376953

Would people be willing to play a game where you need to roll less than 6000 to 'win'?  It means that less than one ticket in ten is a winning ticket.

That sounds like a really cool game and I don't see a crypto problem or any large barriers to implementation.
evoorhees
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Democracy is the original 51% attack


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October 06, 2012, 05:39:56 PM
 #755


Great news, the new SatoshiDICE site is now ready for some testing!!

http://src.satoshidice.com/rev2/

There is now live-feed data coming through. I'd be very grateful to anyone who checks out this new design and provides feedback (either technical issues or suggestions or any kind of comments).

After some feedback and after we've watched performance, we'll put this on the normal SatoshiDice.com domain.

Cheers!


sgravina
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October 06, 2012, 06:49:00 PM
 #756

New site is pretty.

I still won't play.  Not until I get the 100 bitcoins I lost back.  And that is going to have to be by magic.  No more dice for me.

Even if I crack SHA256 and start mining all the bitcoins I still won't bet them on SatoshiDICE.
dooglus
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October 06, 2012, 07:33:29 PM
 #757

I'd be very grateful to anyone who checks out this new design and provides feedback (either technical issues or suggestions or any kind of comments).

I sent you a PM with a bunch of comments a couple of weeks ago and received no response.  Not sure if you got it.

There's an issue with the live display of big losses:

* the amounts displayed are obviously too big
* the text doesn't fit in the box


evoorhees
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Democracy is the original 51% attack


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October 06, 2012, 08:59:29 PM
 #758

I'd be very grateful to anyone who checks out this new design and provides feedback (either technical issues or suggestions or any kind of comments).

I sent you a PM with a bunch of comments a couple of weeks ago and received no response.  Not sure if you got it.

There's an issue with the live display of big losses:

* the amounts displayed are obviously too big
* the text doesn't fit in the box



Ah thanks Dooglus!

Yes I did receive that message and many of those suggestions will be included. I really appreciate the feedback Smiley
22bones
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October 06, 2012, 10:13:39 PM
 #759

Yeah, a game needs to be made that more closely mimics a scratch off lotto ticket.  Multiple different prize levels to win with on transaction, and every transaction has a chance at a jackpot prize level.

Voila: BTCMultiplier.com.  The jackpot is a good idea...
Lurk
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October 18, 2012, 07:35:05 AM
 #760

hey i just placed a couple bets...they both showed up as a win with a pop up on my bottom task bar.  when i looked at my transactions one of the wins disappeared? so it only paid me out for 1 win instead of 2.
tx numbers:    
       bet:          79f7b303876f2872d675748da3f366e7c5e44c35e1ef4a9677db47e8d2646aa2
    
1 win received:  99a65d5177ec912ffe7fc2996ae364e11bea2ae45cfc6aa9b22e10982b3f25af

  missing a winner payout.   Thanks

 [edit]

  wen i look up the payment transaction is says does not exist.    cbf22b626b12fdff8768be7287fd37a2c7f6830a482de3b62511fe85d8460d5e

[edit]  ok so it happened again  payment hash:
          1a52e53113de780ebb7f18e7fcfda3b43533cdf64653fd13c9f07fca7ec19e1b

 Think im done until this gets figured out.....please take a look eevorhees
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