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Author Topic: [1200 TH] EMC: 0 Fee DGM. Anonymous PPS. US & EU servers. No Registration!  (Read 461466 times)
Inaba
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April 16, 2012, 12:42:35 PM
 #2241

Looks like the PPS bug has finally been eradicated (thanks to a clue from Meni!) ...

So... what more do I need to add to PPS for people to be comfortable with it?  I think I am going to add the ability to also switch your miners to PPS from DGM on your account.  I need to work out the details though, so I'm not promising this 100%.


If you're searching these lines for a point, you've probably missed it.  There was never anything there in the first place.
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ordy
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April 18, 2012, 11:31:47 AM
 #2242

hello, is there anything i can do on my side to improve my reject rate to this pool?  i like many of the features and i am strongly considering throwing 1/2 of my hashes to it but i am getting literally 10x the reject % as compared to my incumbent pool.  i thought it was a fluke until i took a 4 gpu miner and pointed 2 toward emc and 2 to the other and got 1.2% here with .12% to the other.  then i flipped the gpu -> pool for each with the same results.  if it matters i currently have 6 miners running a mix of BAMT (phoenix) , Win7 (cgminer), and Xubuntu (cgminer) that are 2-5 gpus each, with each gpu being 200-375 Mh/s and i am in the northeast US.  thanks.
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April 18, 2012, 12:39:19 PM
 #2243

Hiho!

Just found 2 Blocks in a row with only 3,6 ghash :-)

Btw. Thema Account at emc Shows 5 solved blocks instead of 6, perhaps a Bug?

Greetz
Networkerz
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April 18, 2012, 01:55:44 PM
 #2244

What is your incumbent pool? Some pools fudge stale numbers to look better... I we report your actual stale rate, without tricks or magic number massaging.

If you're searching these lines for a point, you've probably missed it.  There was never anything there in the first place.
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April 18, 2012, 02:21:20 PM
 #2245

What is your incumbent pool? Some pools fudge stale numbers to look better... I we report your actual stale rate, without tricks or magic number massaging.

ozcoin.  my miner's stats pretty closely match their site's stats. the comparison is off my local miner's stats as i haven't found them on your site for my account/workers to compare.

i am a semi-noob so i may be misinterpreting some of this data but going off local reporting of invalid share % i seem to struggle with your pool as compared to others - especially ozcoin.
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April 18, 2012, 02:38:38 PM
 #2246

Which emc server are you connecting to?

If you're searching these lines for a point, you've probably missed it.  There was never anything there in the first place.
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April 18, 2012, 02:49:36 PM
 #2247

Which emc server are you connecting to?

us2.eclipsemc.com:8337 - which resolves to 208.110.68.115 for me right now (in case you have some type of load balancing).  network connectivity seems very good from me -> you with minimal hops, no drops, and good latency. 
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April 18, 2012, 05:00:00 PM
 #2248

Which emc server are you connecting to?

us2.eclipsemc.com:8337 - which resolves to 208.110.68.115 for me right now (in case you have some type of load balancing).  network connectivity seems very good from me -> you with minimal hops, no drops, and good latency. 

here are my local 'invalid' stats for the gpu's going to you over the last ~12 hours.


248.06 Mh/s   2926 / 36   1.22%
258.63 Mh/s   3099 / 33   1.05%      
248.11 Mh/s   2946 / 32   1.07%      
258.75 Mh/s   3081 / 33   1.06%      
257.88 Mh/s   3101 / 48   1.52%   
258.77 Mh/s   3236 / 46   1.40%   
P_Shep
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April 20, 2012, 04:55:30 PM
 #2249

Some wonderful luck we're having. Me likey Smiley
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April 20, 2012, 05:14:54 PM
 #2250

Some wonderful luck we're having. Me likey Smiley
I know! I've been thinking about switching from PPS back to DGS.

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Inaba
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April 20, 2012, 05:53:20 PM
 #2251

Yeah it's nice!  I wish everyone was mining PPS at the moment! Smiley

If you're searching these lines for a point, you've probably missed it.  There was never anything there in the first place.
FreshJR
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April 28, 2012, 10:04:29 PM
 #2252

Hi Eclipse,

You said that the pool is 0%, but then what is the 10% in the tooltip when  I hover over the cash out button?
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April 29, 2012, 12:54:02 AM
 #2253

Hi Eclipse,

You said that the pool is 0%, but then what is the 10% in the tooltip when  I hover over the cash out button?

That's the immediate cash out button that includes the amounts you are unconfirmed. It's if you want to straight up leave. Otherwise if you want to just be paid what's already confirmed. You click under that where it says "Pay Me". And says My BTC as ... Btc/ Paypal and My NMC as ... NMC/ BTC as red buttons.

Heard of TripleMining? Join my minipool at thatonegirlt.triplemining.com/register

If you feel in a donating mood, fyi:
BTC: 1Aojiin3eXgDoEmSKkCaec1kh678Q96BmH
NMC: N16kRfVy43shrE1jnrFP7hzwfFcvb9UHrM
LTC: LMk3hTQVNZdKsKYEf1VViVYepgm8F5GVnj
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April 29, 2012, 01:00:40 AM
 #2254

I think I am going to add the ability to also switch your miners to PPS from DGM on your account.  I need to work out the details though, so I'm not promising this 100%.



I would like this. I don't like mining without an account so if I could use my DGM account I'd feel better ha.

Heard of TripleMining? Join my minipool at thatonegirlt.triplemining.com/register

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Inaba
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April 29, 2012, 04:16:12 AM
 #2255

It's definitely on my to-do list.  I have actually been working on rewriting a lot of the backend code so that there is one server for PPS, Anonymous PPS and DGM instead of the two separate codebases I have now.  The requirements keep blossoming as I try to incorporate the two into one unified codeset.

If you're searching these lines for a point, you've probably missed it.  There was never anything there in the first place.
FreshJR
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April 29, 2012, 08:39:52 AM
 #2256

I have a question on the block history table.



In the image I posted.  

Are the top three blocks, the blocks we are presently working on, and are the bottom 3 (*and beyond) blocks that we already solved?

How come my contributed shares are zero?  Do my contributed shares get added up after we solve the block?

Also does anyone have a simple explanation of DGM, and how it deals with respect to people only mining at the beginning of every new block.  IE: The pool hoppers that ensure that they get the most "LUCK" when using a prop payout system.

I have full understanding of how score based and PPS mining resolve's this issue.  But I am left in the dark about what DGM actually is.
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April 29, 2012, 05:16:04 PM
 #2257

...I am left in the dark about what DGM actually is.
Think of it like solo mining. You don't get paid until the block is cracked open. Well that is what happens here, although on a larger scale. Hundreds of users are working on one block at a time, and the 50 coins are distributed to everyone once the block is done (and finished validating). You aren't paid for each individual share like with PPS.

So some times it will only take a few minutes (if the pool is lucky), using only a few thousand shares from everyone to crack the block open. So even though you may have only submitted lets say 20 shares, you will get a lot of BTC for it since it was solved fast. So you might get something like 0.2 BTC for that block if you were mining at 2GH/s. So getting paid 0.2BTC for 20 shares is incredible. However, sometimes the pool might be unlucky and solve a block after 16 hours. So you will still be paid 0.2 BTC for 16 hours worth of shares mining at 2GH/s (which is what... 30,000 shares maybe?).

This is still how other PPS pools operate, and in fact all pools worldwide. Just instead of you being lucky or unlucky, you are always paid at a constant rate (PPS). So it's the pool operator that is making a fortune, or losing a fortune (depending on what the luck was behind the curtains), even though a pool is using the PPS method.

DGM saves the pool operator's (Inaba) butt because he's never really going to have to worry about going into debt for awhile when there is a bunch of unlucky blocks. So the pools that run PPS, their operators can have both good days, and bad ones.

tl;dr
DGM is like solo mining. You are paid once the block is opened, and shared with the whole pool. You aren't Payed Per Share.

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The00Dustin
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April 29, 2012, 05:25:03 PM
 #2258

Think of it like solo mining. ...[/quote]Wow...

I'm sure this has been previously linked in this thread, but for information on DGM, go here:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=39497.0
This hasn't been previously mentioned...  For information/research on several methods, go here:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=32814.0

Regarding the confusion about the block history chart, the key word is history.  That said, "Valid" in that chart is the same as "Confirmed" at any other pool, and for instance, 106/120 = 106 confirmations (which I would expect to also be shown at a score-based pool).
FreshJR
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April 29, 2012, 06:04:32 PM
 #2259

Think of it like solo mining. You don't get paid until the block is cracked open. Well that is what happens here, although on a larger scale. Hundreds of users are working on one block at a time, and the 50 coins are distributed to everyone once the block is done (and finished validating). You aren't paid for each individual share like with PPS.

So some times it will only take a few minutes (if the pool is lucky), using only a few thousand shares from everyone to crack the block open. So even though you may have only submitted lets say 20 shares, you will get a lot of BTC for it since it was solved fast. So you might get something like 0.2 BTC for that block if you were mining at 2GH/s. So getting paid 0.2BTC for 20 shares is incredible. However, sometimes the pool might be unlucky and solve a block after 16 hours. So you will still be paid 0.2 BTC for 16 hours worth of shares mining at 2GH/s (which is what... 30,000 shares maybe?).


So what is the difference between DGM and prop in the example you gave me?

In solo mining,  you have an equal chance getting lucky or unlucky when solving a block.  This makes its completely fair so in the long run your luck should be "50%".

Except their is a problem when you are collectively mining with others.  This problem lies in the way how the coins get distributed to the miners depending on their work input.  

So here is a summary:

PROP: If everyone was constantly mining without leaving the pool then this paypout system would be fair.  In this case everyone would get paid for their share of work.  The miners luck would vary from block to block, but it would follow the same exact concept  as solo luck.

But lets say I only mine the prop pools when I get notified that they started working on a new block.  So at this moment, lets say I go over their and I mine the fresh block only for an hour  (this is lower than the average solve time).  After this hour I then switch to a PPS pool.  In this scenario, since I only mine at the beginning of the blocks on the prop pools I have a high chance of getting the high payout.  Given that the the block is short.  If the block is long, I still get a fair payment for my short amount of work submitted to the block.  Now after this hour I go to a PPS pool.  In the PPS pool the variance is swallowed by the pool operator.  

In this case, I get a high chance to get overpaid on the prop pool.  And then I get paid at 50% luck **minus the pool operator fee**.  My extra profits come by ripping off the long term users of the prop pool.

PPS: In this situation I get paid at 50% luck, minus the fee since the mining operator has a chance to lose depending on the long run of the pools average luck.

Score  Its a formula where beginning shares are not worth as much as the later shares.  This throws off the pool hoopers since its the opposite on what happens on prop.  In this case, miners gets paid less on lucky blocks, and gets paid more on long blocks.  This is okay since it all balance outs just like solo, and hoppers trying get an unfair advantage are eliminated.

DGM  From what you explained, its exactly the same as prop!!! Which has some serious flaws.  What is the mechanism to deter hoppers?

EDIT:  Went to the link.  Explained everything.

DGM is nothing like prob.  I cannot find any holes in the theory.
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April 29, 2012, 06:51:45 PM
 #2260


DGM  From what you explained, its exactly the same as prop!!! Which has some serious flaws.  What is the mechanism to deter hoppers?

The difference is that if you leave the pool, your earnings start going down at a rather fast rate and those earnings that you lost will go to the rest of the pool.

Heard of TripleMining? Join my minipool at thatonegirlt.triplemining.com/register

If you feel in a donating mood, fyi:
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