Bitcoin Forum
May 21, 2018, 12:05:07 PM *
News: Latest stable version of Bitcoin Core: 0.16.0  [Torrent]. (New!)
 
   Home   Help Search Donate Login Register  
Pages: « 1 ... 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 [72] 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 ... 349 »
  Print  
Author Topic: MtGox withdrawal delays [Gathering]  (Read 855595 times)
rampantparanoia
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 510
Merit: 282



View Profile
September 16, 2013, 07:53:11 PM
 #1421

1526904307
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1526904307

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1526904307
Reply with quote  #2

1526904307
Report to moderator
1526904307
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1526904307

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1526904307
Reply with quote  #2

1526904307
Report to moderator
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction. Advertise here.
1526904307
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1526904307

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1526904307
Reply with quote  #2

1526904307
Report to moderator
1526904307
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1526904307

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1526904307
Reply with quote  #2

1526904307
Report to moderator
1526904307
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1526904307

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1526904307
Reply with quote  #2

1526904307
Report to moderator
Nagle
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1204
Merit: 1000


View Profile WWW
September 16, 2013, 08:41:50 PM
 #1422

Who actually believe the issues with USD withdrawals are really due to technical issued with their banking partners?  I think it is obvious that they are operating a fractional reserve and do not have close to enough funds if everyone wanted to pull out their fiat.  A real-life exchange or investment bank is required to put customer funds in segregated accounts, but this is not the case with Mt. Gox.
Mt. Gox does have the obligation to segregate customer funds and have 100% of them on deposit under the Japan Payment Services Act, or guaranteed by a bank. It's appropriate to ask the Japan Financial Services Agency to audit Mt. Gox.
I think you are wrong.  MtGox isn't a financial institution, and aren't registered under Japan Financial Services Agency.  There is no category for companies like MtGox.  Only banks and other companies involved in payment services, financial instruments, insurance, etc, are.
That's wishful thinking. Of course they're a financial institution. They take deposits and hold customer money. (And don't pay it back when they should.) If they're lucky, the FSA will just consider them a payment services firm. Those rules aren't hard to comply with, although there's a transaction size limit (1 million yen). If they're not lucky, the FSA will treat them as an unlicensed broker or an unlicensed bank.

In the US (where Mt. Gox does have a legal presence, in Delaware), they're probably a broker/dealer, and need to qualify as a broker/dealer under US law to deal with US customers. That means SEC registration, audits, insurance, capital requirements, and background checks. Read "Who is a broker" from the SEC.
tvbcof
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2506
Merit: 1002


View Profile
September 16, 2013, 09:14:45 PM
 #1423

...
That's wishful thinking. Of course they're a financial institution. They take deposits and hold customer money. (And don't pay it back when they should.) If they're lucky, the FSA will just consider them a payment services firm. Those rules aren't hard to comply with, although there's a transaction size limit (1 million yen). If they're not lucky, the FSA will treat them as an unlicensed broker or an unlicensed bank.

In the US (where Mt. Gox does have a legal presence, in Delaware), they're probably a broker/dealer, and need to qualify as a broker/dealer under US law to deal with US customers. That means SEC registration, audits, insurance, capital requirements, and background checks. Read "Who is a broker" from the SEC.

Not very many businesses do not 'take and hold customer money.'

Regardless of whether or not Mt. Gox should be required to obtain reasonable certifications for the business that they are engaged in, there is no legitimate reason to appropriate money which ultimately belongs to their customers.  If this was a state sponsored event, I expect that the state will disgorge the money eventually.  If Peter Vessenes spent the money on hookers and blow, I expect that he will end up being incarcerated.  Again, I look forward to doing my part to see that that happens.


dlasher
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 466
Merit: 250



View Profile WWW
September 16, 2013, 10:34:48 PM
 #1424


since I can only speak for myself personally:

- withdrawal requested as international wire to US on 6/11/2013
- multiple requests for status, all with lame responses.
- MtGox CS actually suggested canceling request
- canceled 9/13/2013 - USD returned to MtGox account.
- immediately bought BTC and withdrew it

In my opinion, MtGox has turned into an accidental Ponzi scheme, and they no longer have cash to fund withdrawals. Get out while you can.

mechs
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 210
Merit: 100



View Profile
September 17, 2013, 12:06:56 AM
 #1425


since I can only speak for myself personally:

- withdrawal requested as international wire to US on 6/11/2013
- multiple requests for status, all with lame responses.
- MtGox CS actually suggested canceling request
- canceled 9/13/2013 - USD returned to MtGox account.
- immediately bought BTC and withdrew it

In my opinion, MtGox has turned into an accidental Ponzi scheme, and they no longer have cash to fund withdrawals. Get out while you can.


I think this is the truth.  I think the 10% risk premium for Mt. Gox cash is greatly underestimated.  This will end badly and those stating here they are not concerned will be left holding the bag when the shit hits the fan, the value of Mt. Gox USD really plummets and they lose a lot more than they current have.
calian
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 354
Merit: 250



View Profile
September 17, 2013, 12:54:59 AM
 #1426

When was the last time someone received a manual 5% fee withdrawal?
mechs
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 210
Merit: 100



View Profile
September 17, 2013, 12:56:15 AM
 #1427

When was the last time someone received a manual 5% fee withdrawal?
Does that require actually flying to japan?
joekov
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 9
Merit: 0


View Profile
September 17, 2013, 03:01:30 AM
 #1428

are you guys able to get your bitcoins out? or are you guys waiting for that too?
prophetx
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1400
Merit: 1000


he who has the gold makes the rules


View Profile WWW
September 17, 2013, 03:48:10 AM
 #1429

has anyone gone to the IRC chat channel to ask what is current status?

WINGS Beta is live - list your ICO for only 5000 WINGS at https://wings.ai - over $650 Million raised by ICOs with WINGS
sturle
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1444
Merit: 1001

https://bitmynt.no


View Profile WWW
September 17, 2013, 10:51:32 AM
 #1430

I think you are wrong.  MtGox isn't a financial institution, and aren't registered under Japan Financial Services Agency.  There is no category for companies like MtGox.  Only banks and other companies involved in payment services, financial instruments, insurance, etc, are.
That's wishful thinking. Of course they're a financial institution. They take deposits and hold customer money. (And don't pay it back when they should.) If they're lucky, the FSA will just consider them a payment services firm.
MtGox is a place to buy and sell bitcoins.  When you transfer money to MtGox is it for the purpose of buying bitcoins. This makes MtGox more like a shop than a financial institution.   MtGox never advertised themselves as a place to store money.  And they are definetly not doing payment services, since you are unable to withdraw to other peoples accounts. Just your own.

Quote
In the US (where Mt. Gox does have a legal presence, in Delaware), they're probably a broker/dealer, and need to qualify as a broker/dealer under US law to deal with US customers. That means SEC registration, audits, insurance, capital requirements, and background checks. Read "Who is a broker" from the SEC.
I would like to see the law stating they "probably" are.  Laws are usually very specific.  Either you are or you are not.  Their legal presence in Delaware don't make USSAnian laws apply to their Japanese operations in any way.  Otherwise it would be impossible for e.g. banks to have offices in Switzerland, where there are strict privacy laws regarding banks and their customers, and in other countries where the government demand that banks release information on their customers holdings.

Sjå https://bitmynt.no for veksling av bitcoin mot norske kroner.  Trygt, billig, raskt og enkelt sidan 2010.
I buy with EUR and other currencies at a fair market price when you want to sell.  See http://bitmynt.no/eurprice.pl
Warning: "Bitcoin" XT, Classic, Unlimited and the likes are scams. Don't use them, and don't listen to their shills.
sturle
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1444
Merit: 1001

https://bitmynt.no


View Profile WWW
September 17, 2013, 10:55:04 AM
 #1431

In my opinion, MtGox has turned into an accidental Ponzi scheme, and they no longer have cash to fund withdrawals. Get out while you can.
They are processing withdrawals in JPY (domestic) and EUR (SEPA), so they must have funds.  I doubt they are getting much fiat in to fund withdrawals from, which means they have reserves as well.

Sjå https://bitmynt.no for veksling av bitcoin mot norske kroner.  Trygt, billig, raskt og enkelt sidan 2010.
I buy with EUR and other currencies at a fair market price when you want to sell.  See http://bitmynt.no/eurprice.pl
Warning: "Bitcoin" XT, Classic, Unlimited and the likes are scams. Don't use them, and don't listen to their shills.
sturle
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1444
Merit: 1001

https://bitmynt.no


View Profile WWW
September 17, 2013, 11:23:22 AM
 #1432

has anyone gone to the IRC chat channel to ask what is current status?
Current status for SEPA.  Unfortunately it looks like the queue is getting longer again.  People have discovered that SEPA works:

  • Lower than 400 EUR about a week
  • Higher amounts take about 10 business days (i.e. two weeks)
  • 20 business days between withdrawals

All SEPA withdrawals from August and earlier have been processed, with the exception of some users who had more than one withdrawal in the queue.

New information: 400 EUR is dynamic (was 1000 EUR last time I talked to support).  It depends on how they can fill the daily quota most efficiently.

Sjå https://bitmynt.no for veksling av bitcoin mot norske kroner.  Trygt, billig, raskt og enkelt sidan 2010.
I buy with EUR and other currencies at a fair market price when you want to sell.  See http://bitmynt.no/eurprice.pl
Warning: "Bitcoin" XT, Classic, Unlimited and the likes are scams. Don't use them, and don't listen to their shills.
howdoin
Jr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 35
Merit: 0


View Profile
September 17, 2013, 05:03:04 PM
 #1433

USD still VERY problematic (CITIBANk customers)... I have been trying to withdraw since June, I had to issue several withdrawals due to limits - at first they were cancelled in June (By MtGox) due to the problems with Citibank in the US. Reissued the withdrawals order, which once again MtGox cancelled after a month because they said they had too many request to process and did not make sense for me to have so many >> they cancelled all requests and upped my limit so that I only had one large withdrawal... fast forward 2 months later they have now cancelled my request from 8/8 claiming that they will no longer process withdrawal request to Citi accounts.

>>> their proposed solution >>> that I open an account in a different bank with no guarantee for the withdrawal to be processed anytime soon.... I now believe that the amount will just be stuck there indefinitely and have very little chance of ever seeing it back (which I kinda of assumed before but still had some hope).

My only option left is to use the fiat, buy Bitcoin and transfer it so my wallet (done)

>>>> in the end they win as they make commission on my Bitcoin purchase and I no longer have fiat on the account / sneaky but this is where the cash for you other guy comes from basically....

prophetx
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1400
Merit: 1000


he who has the gold makes the rules


View Profile WWW
September 17, 2013, 05:39:51 PM
 #1434

has anyone gone to the IRC chat channel to ask what is current status?
Current status for SEPA.  Unfortunately it looks like the queue is getting longer again.  People have discovered that SEPA works:

  • Lower than 400 EUR about a week
  • Higher amounts take about 10 business days (i.e. two weeks)
  • 20 business days between withdrawals

All SEPA withdrawals from August and earlier have been processed, with the exception of some users who had more than one withdrawal in the queue.

New information: 400 EUR is dynamic (was 1000 EUR last time I talked to support).  It depends on how they can fill the daily quota most efficiently.

thanks.

if you are on there again anytime soon, you should ask him what is the status/progress of fincen and related state compliance

WINGS Beta is live - list your ICO for only 5000 WINGS at https://wings.ai - over $650 Million raised by ICOs with WINGS
davidspitzer
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 602
Merit: 500


View Profile
September 17, 2013, 06:29:43 PM
 #1435


since I can only speak for myself personally:

- withdrawal requested as international wire to US on 6/11/2013
- multiple requests for status, all with lame responses.
- MtGox CS actually suggested canceling request
- canceled 9/13/2013 - USD returned to MtGox account.
- immediately bought BTC and withdrew it

In my opinion, MtGox has turned into an accidental Ponzi scheme, and they no longer have cash to fund withdrawals. Get out while you can.


I think this is the truth.  I think the 10% risk premium for Mt. Gox cash is greatly underestimated.  This will end badly and those stating here they are not concerned will be left holding the bag when the shit hits the fan, the value of Mt. Gox USD really plummets and they lose a lot more than they current have.

I am on week 4 heading to week 5 waiting for US funds to my bank after selling 1 bitcoin
CYPER
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 756
Merit: 500



View Profile
September 17, 2013, 07:16:13 PM
 #1436

I have 1500USD and want them in my UK bank account and I'm unsure what to do.

My bank told me they support SEPA even though the account is in GBP, but Gox support says they can't send SEPA.
So I'm left with International Wire Sad

If this post helped you and you feel generous you know what to do: 1P9tXFy9bVgzrfPGeV7F8np26ZtFdCCWvz
davidspitzer
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 602
Merit: 500


View Profile
September 17, 2013, 07:55:27 PM
 #1437

I have 1500USD and want them in my UK bank account and I'm unsure what to do.

My bank told me they support SEPA even though the account is in GBP, but Gox support says they can't send SEPA.
So I'm left with International Wire Sad

international wires are taking an extremely long time - weeks/months? I have not heard of a successful international wire since the Dwolla issues in the US  - I am not saying that there has not been any, but I have not seen it and I have been waiting almost 5 weeks for an international wire transfer myself. If there is anyone here that has been successful perhaps they could speak to your expected wait but as for me  - I would cash out your US dollars for BTC and transfer the BTC to your own wallet and seek greener pastures. you will see your money faster selling locally to other bitcoin people or buying gold or silver online with someone like Amagimetals.com.

I dont know what is going on with MTGOX but I am staying away until they have sorted it out (if they ever do)

manfred
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 966
Merit: 1000


Energy is Wealth


View Profile
September 17, 2013, 08:06:06 PM
 #1438

Quote
I think you are wrong.  MtGox isn't a financial insistitution, and aren't registered under Japan Financial Services Agency.  There is no category for companies like MtGox.  Only banks and other companies involved in payment services, financial instruments, insurance, etc, are.
Good one, a league of there one.

They should be registered as a financial institution because they are. If I sent them some Money a halve a year ago and never brought a coin for one reason or another and now want my money back then all this time they save kept it for me = Financial institution.
davidspitzer
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 602
Merit: 500


View Profile
September 17, 2013, 08:17:40 PM
 #1439

Quote
I think you are wrong.  MtGox isn't a financial insistitution, and aren't registered under Japan Financial Services Agency.  There is no category for companies like MtGox.  Only banks and other companies involved in payment services, financial instruments, insurance, etc, are.
Good one, a league of there one.

They should be registered as a financial institution because they are. If I sent them some Money a halve a year ago and never brought a coin for one reason or another and now want my money back then all this time they save kept it for me = Financial institution.

Quite clearly the US sees them and will hold them to the financial laws that govern money exchanges. They are akin to any other currency exchange, it matters not that that one of the currencies they deal with is Bitcoin.  However they view themselves and no matter how unique their services, they are classified and will be accountable like any other currency exchange/money transmitter. A lesson painfully learned just recently
sturle
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1444
Merit: 1001

https://bitmynt.no


View Profile WWW
September 17, 2013, 09:28:31 PM
 #1440

Quite clearly the US sees them and will hold them to the financial laws that govern money exchanges. They are akin to any other currency exchange, it matters not that that one of the currencies they deal with is Bitcoin.  However they view themselves and no matter how unique their services, they are classified and will be accountable like any other currency exchange/money transmitter. A lesson painfully learned just recently
Why should MtGox, operating from Japan, follow USSA laws instead of Japanese laws?  Does USSA law apply to all bitcoin exchanges because what?  I think MtGox will get closed pretty quickly if they start operating according to a different set of laws than what governs them in Japan.

MtGox has never been accused of operating as a money transmitter in the USSA.  Mutum Sigillum was.  You should read the warrant.  Have you ever read anything about law, or just pretending?

Sjå https://bitmynt.no for veksling av bitcoin mot norske kroner.  Trygt, billig, raskt og enkelt sidan 2010.
I buy with EUR and other currencies at a fair market price when you want to sell.  See http://bitmynt.no/eurprice.pl
Warning: "Bitcoin" XT, Classic, Unlimited and the likes are scams. Don't use them, and don't listen to their shills.
Pages: « 1 ... 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 [72] 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 ... 349 »
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Sponsored by , a Bitcoin-accepting VPN.
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!