NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information

[wesleyh]

@wesleyh: when issuing an asset, i have a red exclamation mark next to FEE,but i try to put the mouse over or click everywhere and i cant find any text or advertise.

Imho about nodecoin,i think it would be a huge mistake to make Nxt rely on Nodecoins so much.
Nxt needs to stand for itself first,and then if something can be added,perfect.But not have PoW to make the PoS safe.

Ah there isn't any I should probably add something, thanks. "Minimum fee is 1000 nxt, be warned!"

[Anon136]

hey cfb did you ever see my post here? https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=345619.msg5665022#msg5665022

[grandpa_seth]

Yes because it reduces utility of Nxt by taking its place for what sounds like it will be many purposes. Anything that nodecoins will do could/should be done using Nxt. Therefore this statement is true.
I know In gonna get flack for this but,  If I were to be a jerk about it, I could say "nodecoin is the lazy, inflationary, d**khead way of solving these issues." (I DO NOT mean to imply that James or anyone working on these issues is lazy or a d**khead. You guys are putting in hard work that everyone ought to respect and appreciate. However there is clearly a fundamental schism on this issue. Many including myself stand on the opposite side from you and I need to push my point that this has much more affect than you realize and should be considered with great care and thought).

Let me ask this: Why was a fee structure to reward nodes with Nxt not implemented instead of usurping Nxt's functions and introducing inflation with nodecoin?

I just can't let this go it bothers me. I am going to reiterate my idea again. Nxts should be the only reward for forging. So if James is going to issue an asset called nodecoin that automatically gets distributed for free to anybody who forges with their client open, then these nodecoins must only
be able to be redeemed for nxt via a program by James funded by donations or committee.

Think of it as airline miles from your credit card. You earn miles or points that are completely worthless except that the card issuer will
redeem a certain amount you accumulate for airline tickets. If these nodecoins are to exist then it must follow a similar procedure and be marketed as such. As I said before nxters must think of nodecoins as "miles" or "points" and solely exist to be converted into nxt which is our precious.

The nxt currency must be King, the center of our universe. Anybody
issuing assets pay nxt fees and should want to be paid in nxt and issue dividends in nxt.

I believe it is this way or simply scrap nodecoin. James is the issuer he simply can choose not to issue them when we're live. I do not believe
anybody else will issue a similar coin because nodecoins are virtually free. Who besides James, who was trying to solve the forging problem, will
issue a coin that gives itself out for doing nothing? Future asset issuances of coins will be ipos and will ask for money for it and therefore must
prove the value of the coin. Nodecoins were not asked for and will be given out for free from day 1.

[wesleyh]

You are a machine-beast, Wesley. Donation sent -- your work is appreciated!

Thank you!!! Appreciate it a lot

[redsn0w]

Hi,

I would like to test the AE, can i get some testnxt?

8262800206954725703

Thanks in advance!

Sent 15k TestNxt , enjoy it .

[Damelon]

- Start a Reddit Marketing Campaign. The funds weren't allocate to someone of us.

ehm

TwinWinNerD is probably our new reddit guy after passions leaving, so here is passion's project that should be fullfilled:

salsacz, when nexerns client is published for a few days and we filled the subreddit /r/Nxt with many quality links, I want to start a reddit ad campaign.

http://de.reddit.com/wiki/selfserve
http://www.reddit.com/ad_inq

I will create pictures, other users can create pictures as well. We get 1000 views for 0,75$. We can target specific subreddits like /r/Bitcoin with 100k user or /r/litecoin with 18k user. But we can also target the whole frontpage.

For only 75$ or 1000 NXT we could create 100k views. From interested persons or from every person world wide.

I think it would be nice if we can get a minimum of 24.000 NXT for this. I would use 250 NXT per week to generate about 20000 views each week. In the beginning only on cryptocurrency subreddits. Later I would rotate it, so the "normal" ppl see the ad also.

This campaign I would run for 2 years. What do you guys think?

TwinWinNerD has got 5k Nxt for this now, so it should bring 500k views, if passions numbers were correct.

http://87.230.14.1/nxt/nxt.cgi?action=3000&acc=13190601918595664606

thanks, I sent a little "reminder" to TwinWinNerD

reddit was funded weeks ago, problem is with activity of current organisator. The only active Nxt reddit mod is Damelon and only thanks to his summaries. Have we got any other reddits experts? If not, I can learn it too, I just learned how to deal with wiki.org  

I am on reddit daily, and answer where needed. Fortunately, we have some active Nxters that do, too

I'd gladly have you there, too. Just give me your reddit nick and we'll set you up as a moderator

If people want to help out, they just need to contact me here or on reddit and I can give them moderator powers, if they are willing to be there at least once a day.
There is not much to do at the moment, but we steadily gain subscribers.
I have frequently asked for technical people to help out, as that is what is needed the most there. People post questions about errors, and we cannot always handle those, but we send them to the forums.

Also, unrelated: I am rather surprised no-one posted this yet: https://github.com/dmkaplan2000/nxt_state/blob/master/nxt_state.md

Good read, posted on the nxtcrypto forums here: https://forums.nxtcrypto.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=867

[salsacz]

Damelon: Thanks to my proposal we are listed here on the side pannel: http://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/.

What we could do is to complete the reddit campaign Passion was talking about and I was quoting. Funds are in TwinWinNerD's wallet, so if he knows how to do it, he can start..

[Passion_ltc]

- Start a Reddit Marketing Campaign. The funds weren't allocate to someone of us.

ehm

TwinWinNerD is probably our new reddit guy after passions leaving, so here is passion's project that should be fullfilled:

salsacz, when nexerns client is published for a few days and we filled the subreddit /r/Nxt with many quality links, I want to start a reddit ad campaign.

http://de.reddit.com/wiki/selfserve
http://www.reddit.com/ad_inq

I will create pictures, other users can create pictures as well. We get 1000 views for 0,75$. We can target specific subreddits like /r/Bitcoin with 100k user or /r/litecoin with 18k user. But we can also target the whole frontpage.

For only 75$ or 1000 NXT we could create 100k views. From interested persons or from every person world wide.

I think it would be nice if we can get a minimum of 24.000 NXT for this. I would use 250 NXT per week to generate about 20000 views each week. In the beginning only on cryptocurrency subreddits. Later I would rotate it, so the "normal" ppl see the ad also.

This campaign I would run for 2 years. What do you guys think?

TwinWinNerD has got 5k Nxt for this now, so it should bring 500k views, if passions numbers were correct.

http://87.230.14.1/nxt/nxt.cgi?action=3000&acc=13190601918595664606

thanks, I sent a little "reminder" to TwinWinNerD

reddit was funded weeks ago, problem is with activity of current organisator. The only active Nxt reddit mod is Damelon and only thanks to his summaries. Have we got any other reddits experts? If not, I can learn it too, I just learned how to deal with wiki.org 

I am on reddit daily, and answer where needed. Fortunately, we have some active Nxters that do, too

I'd gladly have you there, too. Just give me your reddit nick and we'll set you up as a moderator

If people want to help out, they just need to contact me here or on reddit and I can give them moderator powers, if they are willing to be there at least once a day.
There is not much to do at the moment, but we steadily gain subscribers.
I have frequently asked for technical people to help out, as that is what is needed the most there. People post questions about errors, and we cannot always handle those, but we send them to the forums.

Also, unrelated: I am rather surprised no-one posted this yet: https://github.com/dmkaplan2000/nxt_state/blob/master/nxt_state.md

Good read, posted on the nxtcrypto forums here: https://forums.nxtcrypto.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=867

Sorry, Salsa. I don't follow this thread actively. I was just creating a post to give a few hints how everyone should react to the current situation. I think TwinWinNerD is still also very active.

[Come-from-Beyond]

hey cfb did you ever see my post here? https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=345619.msg5665022#msg5665022

Yes. I borrowed the idea about service providers and going to create a website widget that will let to "resell" goods for small %.

[Come-from-Beyond]

Also, unrelated: I am rather surprised no-one posted this yet: https://github.com/dmkaplan2000/nxt_state/blob/master/nxt_state.md

Too many words, I "read" only charts.

[jl777]

I am quite surprised at some people who are worried that nodecoin will take over NXT. I am writing software to make it look like a coin, act like a coin and it seems I've done a pretty good job

I plan on using my 180+ servers to implement Ddos protection and guarding of the pool server and multigateway servers from direct contact with random clients. While this wont be as good as a 20,000 node NXT network, it should pose quite a barrier to Ddosers who want to disrupt the pool server or multigateway servers.

Since I will be incurring real world costs for the servers to host pool servers and one of the multigateway servers (need to find two non-USA hosts for the others) and I will be getting 1% of nodecoins mined for pool costs and 1% as royalty, it is in my interest to make nodecoins worth more than nothing. After all, if I cant make it self-funding, who will pay for the 180+ servers? Therefore, I liked the suggestion of pricing multigateway services and any other services that the servers I am paying for provide, in nodecoins. Assuming a .01NXT value for a nodecoin, the 2% will generate around 2000 NXT per day. This will be far short of covering the server costs, but at least its a start. nodecoin is a private token that just happens to reward people who operate NXT nodes and can be used for multigateway services. Already there is an account that is trying to get more nodecoins by submitting once per second. I need a way to prevent spam and charging nodecoins is a good way. For normal usage, all the nodecoins you need to be able to use the services will be obtainable just by running nodeminer.

It is clear that nodecoins are very polarizing, I might as well call it a globalwarming-coin!

Like it or not, if ~10% of the people run nodeminer, I estimate EVERYONE with an active node will get their nodecoins. Around 5 per day! just imagine the giant market dumps the big holders will be able to do. A sell wall of 50 nodecoins. The horrors.

nodecoin is a subset of multigateway, with a simple PoN (proof of node). Anybody can do this in a day or two like I did. nodecoin cannot replace NXT. That is like saying that Delta airline bonus miles will replace USD. At 100,000 coins per day, it will take 10,000 days to be fully released, thats 27 years.  You can believe the people that claim that somehow nodecoin will magically replace NXT even though it is built on top of NXT, or you can believe me.

A few weeks back there was all this angst and worry that with transaction fees dropping there would be no incentive to forge. I said I know of an idea that will fix that. I did.

James

P.S. If somebody wants to pay me to kill nodecoin all you have to do is pay the server costs.

[Passion_ltc]

3.) Launch a SMF forum there with a few sections (General, Projects in development, Finished projects, Technical Discussion (Sub: Brainstorming), Promotion, META and 1 forum for each different languages)

Not necessarily wise to launch yet another forum when we have SMF at nextcoin.org with 32606 Posts in 3743 Topics by 5043 members already.
We will be happy to have the nxt.org forum directed to nextcoin.org and change the nextcoin.org brand to co-support nxt.org

Your forum is not independent. We need independence.

If you have this, even beginner can start NRS and handle it! They just have to start the program, click on the button and they are in the wallet. Nothing more.. (They even don't need to know that this is not a "wallet")

http://offspring.dgex.com has all of this and more.

It's not included in the official releases. All these clients can't be released directly with the new version from Jean-Luc. But we need this until the release circles get bigger. Right now you need to update to the newest NRS version pretty fast or else you get on a fork, I hope this will change in the future, so alternative clients will become sustainable.

My suggestion can easily be included with each release and you don't need to change anything with new releases, because it's just a launcher not a full client.

[Eadeqa]

Question about public key thingie;

Don't users only get a public key after they made an outgoing transaction? So their first transaction, if they use an online client, would be insecure?

Right, or you will have to calculate the public key from the secret phrase on the client side too.

Ah ok, cool.

Hi, make this implementation a top priority. This is key to introducing Nxt to masses without them having to download java and understand "batch" files". Marketers can then promote your client as the only requirement to use Nxt. You can upload them on Chrome and Firefox app stores.

This will change the tone here where people think Nxt is too complicated.

[msin]

Crypto Review Completed, please read.  Thanks to Jesse James for completing with thorough review and BloodyRookie for reference.

From Jesse James:

"I spent some quality time reviewing the core crypto NXT relies on.  As part of my review I re-implemented the relevant algorithms https://gist.github.com/doctorevil/9521126 using a different approach in a different language to make sure I understood everything deeply.  Although the implementation NXT uses doesn't follow certain algorithm specifications to the letter, the deviations noted (motivated by simplicity and/or performance) seemed reasonable and in general nothing stuck out as a red flag.  There was one bug in the signature generation function (that NXT is aware of and currently working around) for which I've provided a patch (or more precisely tweaked BloodyRookie's proposed patch).  It should be should be safe for devs to incorporate this patch at their convenience.

Review: https://gist.github.com/doctorevil/9521116

Code: https://gist.github.com/doctorevil/9521126 "

[grandpa_seth]

Crypto Review Completed, please read.  Thanks to Jesse James for completing with thorough review and BloodyRookie for reference.

From Jesse James:

"I spent some quality time reviewing the core crypto NXT relies on.  As part of my review I re-implemented the relevant algorithms https://gist.github.com/doctorevil/9521126 using a different approach in a different language to make sure I understood everything deeply.  Although the implementation NXT uses doesn't follow certain algorithm specifications to the letter, the deviations noted (motivated by simplicity and/or performance) seemed reasonable and in general nothing stuck out as a red flag.  There was one bug in the signature generation function (that NXT is aware of and currently working around) for which I've provided a patch (or more precisely tweaked BloodyRookie's proposed patch).  It should be should be safe for devs to incorporate this patch at their convenience.

Review: https://gist.github.com/doctorevil/9521116

Code: https://gist.github.com/doctorevil/9521126 "

Thank you Doctor evil/Jesse James so much.

[Damelon]

Crypto Review Completed, please read.  Thanks to Jesse James for completing with thorough review and BloodyRookie for reference.

From Jesse James:

"I spent some quality time reviewing the core crypto NXT relies on.  As part of my review I re-implemented the relevant algorithms https://gist.github.com/doctorevil/9521126 using a different approach in a different language to make sure I understood everything deeply.  Although the implementation NXT uses doesn't follow certain algorithm specifications to the letter, the deviations noted (motivated by simplicity and/or performance) seemed reasonable and in general nothing stuck out as a red flag.  There was one bug in the signature generation function (that NXT is aware of and currently working around) for which I've provided a patch (or more precisely tweaked BloodyRookie's proposed patch).  It should be should be safe for devs to incorporate this patch at their convenience.

Review: https://gist.github.com/doctorevil/9521116

Code: https://gist.github.com/doctorevil/9521126 "

Bloody big thanks to both of these awesome people!
Thank you very, very much! 

[bidji29]

I am quite surprised at some people who are worried that nodecoin will take over NXT. I am writing software to make it look like a coin, act like a coin and it seems I've done a pretty good job

I plan on using my 180+ servers to implement Ddos protection and guarding of the pool server and multigateway servers from direct contact with random clients. While this wont be as good as a 20,000 node NXT network, it should pose quite a barrier to Ddosers who want to disrupt the pool server or multigateway servers.

Since I will be incurring real world costs for the servers to host pool servers and one of the multigateway servers (need to find two non-USA hosts for the others) and I will be getting 1% of nodecoins mined for pool costs and 1% as royalty, it is in my interest to make nodecoins worth more than nothing. After all, if I cant make it self-funding, who will pay for the 180+ servers? Therefore, I liked the suggestion of pricing multigateway services and any other services that the servers I am paying for provide, in nodecoins. Assuming a .01NXT value for a nodecoin, the 2% will generate around 2000 NXT per day. This will be far short of covering the server costs, but at least its a start. nodecoin is a private token that just happens to reward people who operate NXT nodes and can be used for multigateway services. Already there is an account that is trying to get more nodecoins by submitting once per second. I need a way to prevent spam and charging nodecoins is a good way. For normal usage, all the nodecoins you need to be able to use the services will be obtainable just by running nodeminer.

It is clear that nodecoins are very polarizing, I might as well call it a globalwarming-coin!

Like it or not, if ~10% of the people run nodeminer, I estimate EVERYONE with an active node will get their nodecoins. Around 5 per day! just imagine the giant market dumps the big holders will be able to do. A sell wall of 50 nodecoins. The horrors.

nodecoin is a subset of multigateway, with a simple PoN (proof of node). Anybody can do this in a day or two like I did. nodecoin cannot replace NXT. That is like saying that Delta airline bonus miles will replace USD. At 100,000 coins per day, it will take 10,000 days to be fully released, thats 27 years.  You can believe the people that claim that somehow nodecoin will magically replace NXT even though it is built on top of NXT, or you can believe me.

A few weeks back there was all this angst and worry that with transaction fees dropping there would be no incentive to forge. I said I know of an idea that will fix that. I did.

James

P.S. If somebody wants to pay me to kill nodecoin all you have to do is pay the server costs.

180+ servers seems like an overkill.
OVH is a good server provider in europe, and it have a built-in DDOS protection

[klee]

Nodecoins are a cancer - time will tell if I am right or wrong...

[Jeff Jefferson]

can i please haz some testNXT?

thanks

879518353350760929

[wesleyh]

Nodecoins are a cancer - time will tell if I am right or wrong...

Cancer? Why? Nxt is meant to have coins built on top of it.