[ANN][CLAM] CLAMs, Proof-Of-Chain, Proof-Of-Working-Stake, a.k.a. "Clamcoin"

[SuperClam]

I'm kinda dumb, so I'm having a hard time understanding what happens to alt coin prices when bitcoin goes sky high.  It seems to me like the main conversion for alt coins is into bitcoin, so when bitcoin goes crazy and if the price of the alt to bitcoin remains the same, then that's essentially a bump in price for the alt (if you look at it in fiat).  Does that mean that the CLAM price basically went up 100% alongside bitcoin last week?  Or am I missing something?

CLAM has been having a rough month or so due to the digger - but, you are essentially correct.

This depends on a number of factors. 
Some 'altcoins' move inversely with BTC while some correlate positively. 

But, assuming the base BTC price of a market remains the same, and the base Fiat price of BTC increases, then what you have said is true.

Of course, it is rarely that simple.

[SebastianJu]

I'm kinda dumb, so I'm having a hard time understanding what happens to alt coin prices when bitcoin goes sky high.  It seems to me like the main conversion for alt coins is into bitcoin, so when bitcoin goes crazy and if the price of the alt to bitcoin remains the same, then that's essentially a bump in price for the alt (if you look at it in fiat).  Does that mean that the CLAM price basically went up 100% alongside bitcoin last week?  Or am I missing something?

I thought so first too but clam is more of a coin pegged to bitcoin. The clam price does not care about the fiat price of bitcoins, only the amount of bitcoins are of interest. So when you hold clams and the bitcoin price drops then you will lose value. Since normally clams don't react on the change in bitcoinprice.

I only can assume that no one exploits these changes. Normally it should look like an arbitrage possibility but it might be the volume is too low to exploit it.

Of course there are other altcoins that clearly correlate invers with the bitcoin fiat price. Not perfect but good enough to see it.

Edit: I would have hold clams longer if this connection would not have been. If you hold clams, they remain at the same value in bitcoins, but the bitcoin price drops, then you lose. So you always have to keep 2 currencies in view.

[SuperClam]

I'm kinda dumb, so I'm having a hard time understanding what happens to alt coin prices when bitcoin goes sky high.  It seems to me like the main conversion for alt coins is into bitcoin, so when bitcoin goes crazy and if the price of the alt to bitcoin remains the same, then that's essentially a bump in price for the alt (if you look at it in fiat).  Does that mean that the CLAM price basically went up 100% alongside bitcoin last week?  Or am I missing something?

I thought so first too but clam is more of a coin pegged to bitcoin. The clam price does not care about the fiat price of bitcoins, only the amount of bitcoins are of interest. So when you hold clams and the bitcoin price drops then you will lose value. Since normally clams don't react on the change in bitcoinprice.
I only can assume that no one exploits these changes. Normally it should look like an arbitrage possibility but it might be the volume is too low to exploit it.
Of course there are other altcoins that clearly correlate invers with the bitcoin fiat price. Not perfect but good enough to see it.
Edit: I would have hold clams longer if this connection would not have been. If you hold clams, they remain at the same value in bitcoins, but the bitcoin price drops, then you lose. So you always have to keep 2 currencies in view.

If you had faith in CLAM maintaining it's value against Bitcoin in the long-term, it would be beneficial to hold CLAM given the ability to stake.

[tspacepilot]

Some 'altcoins' move inversely with BTC while some correlate positively. 

Why would this be the case?  Given coin A and coin B, say they're both exchangable for the same amount of bitcoin on day 1.  If the bitcoin to fiat rate changes, why would that drive two coins in opposite directions?

[SuperClam]

Some 'altcoins' move inversely with BTC while some correlate positively. 

Why would this be the case?  Given coin A and coin B, say they're both exchangable for the same amount of bitcoin on day 1.  If the bitcoin to fiat rate changes, why would that drive two coins in opposite directions?

Any attempt to guess at a positive or negative price correlation in a market is just that: a guess.

That said, some "coins" have direct to Fiat markets, sometimes you likely have a self-fulfilling prophecy, some users need to liquidate to cover short/long positions, mining expenses, etc.

[galbros]

There s no point buying until the digger s out of the picture

That's a beautiful paradox.

Is there is thread that tracks the progress of the dig whale?

Is the end of this year still the best estimate given his current pace of selling?

Thanks!

[dooglus]

Is there is thread that tracks the progress of the dig whale?

Is the end of this year still the best estimate given his current pace of selling?

Thanks!

I occasionally post charts showing the digging activity in this thread. I don't know of another one.



It has taken him over 2 months to dig up an estimated 34% of the wallet he is working through. The rate of digging has slowed during that time. At the current pace the digging could continue for another year. And then he could start on another wallet.

I don't see the price recovering any time soon, but doing anything to address the issue seems to be unpopular so it looks like we're stuck with things how they are.

[uvwvj]

End the clam experiment bring back jd as bitcoins

[galbros]

It has taken him over 2 months to dig up an estimated 34% of the wallet he is working through. The rate of digging has slowed during that time. At the current pace the digging could continue for another year. And then he could start on another wallet.

I don't see the price recovering any time soon, but doing anything to address the issue seems to be unpopular so it looks like we're stuck with things how they are.

Thanks dooglus. 

That was a little worse than I had thought - I had expected he'd be done by the end of this year.  I'll keep checking this thread for updates.

[BayAreaCoins]

It has taken him over 2 months to dig up an estimated 34% of the wallet he is working through. The rate of digging has slowed during that time. At the current pace the digging could continue for another year. And then he could start on another wallet.

I don't see the price recovering any time soon, but doing anything to address the issue seems to be unpopular so it looks like we're stuck with things how they are.

Thanks dooglus. 

That was a little worse than I had thought - I had expected he'd be done by the end of this year.  I'll keep checking this thread for updates.

If there was a wall for them to sell into... I bet they'd be done by next week.

They are more scared of us than they are of them. 

I'd rate them closer to fucktards than geniuses judging by how they are digging.

It's almost like they are guilty they cheated in a card game, so they are showing us their hand and playing easy... very strange.

[gamblingbad]

Digger should have a clam auction. Just dig up all and sell everything to 0.001-0.002 each clam and sell 10k to each user who want buy. I think many would buy if knew the digger was finnished. People dont want buy so long digger still digging. He destroys the clam with use so long time.

[andulolika]

Digger should have a clam auction. Just dig up all and sell everything to 0.001-0.002 each clam and sell 10k to each user who want buy. I think many would buy if knew the digger was finnished. People dont want buy so long digger still digging. He destroys the clam with use so long time.

i said something similar since the beginning yet got no support, there is a decent bunch of people that would do the same, yet i think thats useless now, im sure that if each of the ones that wanted this got their buy orders on it would be filled.

[Esally]

It has taken him over 2 months to dig up an estimated 34% of the wallet he is working through. The rate of digging has slowed during that time. At the current pace the digging could continue for another year. And then he could start on another wallet.

I don't see the price recovering any time soon, but doing anything to address the issue seems to be unpopular so it looks like we're stuck with things how they are.

The digger has enough and it is time to switch to stake-only )

I think the best solution is for you to update your staking copy of clam to not mine dig transactions and reject blocks with dig transactions if it is the current best block. If it is the second-best and has dig-transactions, it becomes your local best block.

This removes the possibility of prolonged fork, while applying pressure for people to also not accept dig transactions. Most importantly this can be done without modifying upstream or getting into committee driven consensus.

I originally believe in clam because i was told the initial distribution was fair, the fairest you said. But if the only point of clam is to now make a digger rich and get tokens to play on just-dice then count me out.

[gamblingbad]

Digger should have a clam auction. Just dig up all and sell everything to 0.001-0.002 each clam and sell 10k to each user who want buy. I think many would buy if knew the digger was finnished. People dont want buy so long digger still digging. He destroys the clam with use so long time.

i said something similar since the beginning yet got no support, there is a decent bunch of people that would do the same, yet i think thats useless now, im sure that if each of the ones that wanted this got their buy orders on it would be filled.

Okey, lets agree on a price floor. If digger have 350k clam left, we need 350btc with price 0.001. I can do 10% of that so if 9 others can do 10% to.
If not get enough funds can set a lower price as floor. Anyone else interested?

[P-Funk]

Considering the price is currently scraping .001 I'd say put the floor somewhere between .0005 and .00075

[wdnj]

BTC price has much lower now is this good for Clams price getting up?

[crazyivan]

Digger should have a clam auction. Just dig up all and sell everything to 0.001-0.002 each clam and sell 10k to each user who want buy. I think many would buy if knew the digger was finnished. People dont want buy so long digger still digging. He destroys the clam with use so long time.

i said something similar since the beginning yet got no support, there is a decent bunch of people that would do the same, yet i think thats useless now, im sure that if each of the ones that wanted this got their buy orders on it would be filled.

Okey, lets agree on a price floor. If digger have 350k clam left, we need 350btc with price 0.001. I can do 10% of that so if 9 others can do 10% to.
If not get enough funds can set a lower price as floor. Anyone else interested?

I think the digger s got much more CLAM. Where did you get this number from?

[dooglus]

People dont want buy so long digger still digging. He destroys the clam with use so long time.

Maybe that's the whole point. It could be someone who hates altcoins in general or CLAM in particular.

[DrkLvr_]

What about limiting the dig period to 2 years from the CLAM launch date?

[almightyruler]

What about limiting the dig period to 2 years from the CLAM launch date?

I like this idea, perhaps with a decreasing reward rather than a sudden cutoff, but I don't think it's possible to implement it now. Digging links your wallet to existing funds - transactions already in the chain - rather than mining new coins in new blocks. To retroactively implement such a rule, say by blocking any transactions with unspent outputs from the original distribution, would force everyone to spend (including sending back to themselves) their original funds before that cutoff date. Anyone who started their wallet to claim their CLAM, but never actually spent them, would lose their funds.