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Author Topic: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP.  (Read 1804593 times)
tvbcof
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June 15, 2014, 06:51:06 PM
 #8701


Not at all.  Taint is not an issue.  The important thing is control of taint.  Obviously there will be mechanisms to remove it.  That'll be the incentive to register and pay one's taxes and so forth.  Eventually.  This will be ratcheted in over time of course.


More idiotic socialist drivel from you.

Why are you even in Bitcoin? You don't seem  to understand what is being attempted here. If you give gov't the right to be the final arbiter about which  coins are clean versus which are tainted, you've lost any advantage over fiat.

You might as well admit you're an opportunist. And don't come back with some bs about being a pragmatist.

It's not a matter of 'giving' the gov't any rights.  It's a matter of what they are willing and able to take.  It's a fair assumption that they'll take as much as they can, and it's important to understand what that might be.  Don't be thick.

You and I are both very much opportunists.  So what?  Who isn't?  My hopes for Bitcoin as a beneficial social phenomenon vary and are currently at a relative low point.  So yes, I want to profit as I can and am distinctly an 'opportunist'.  Calling out the potential threats is not helpful in this pump-n-dump, but I don't stroke my ego by believing that what I write on this board makes much of a difference one way or another.

My argument for Bitcoin has always been that it was likely under-valued and a good speculative play.  Now, 100x profits later, I still make that argument but more weakly.  I argue strenuously on this thread (being on-topic) that gold has some very real advantages in some very possible failure mode scenarios and they should be considered for those deciding their financial strategies.  Relatedly, there are some legitimate threats to Bitcoin and they should be considered as well.

I have zero shame about being either a 'pragmatist' or a 'realist', and people will find that I am a staunch defender of Bitcoin in cases where it is being ignorantly, dishonestly, or unfairly maligned.

At the end of the day, I've benefited mightily from Bitcoin already and at this point I'd just as soon walk away with a clear conscience than with even more of a windfall.  But I'd take either.


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June 15, 2014, 07:34:39 PM
 #8702


Apple is not the only good news : yahoo, expedia and paypal come to mind as well

I just bought an Android, I may buy an Iphone next if Bitcoin app are kept on the Apple Store that Apple is controlling

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June 15, 2014, 08:15:50 PM
 #8703

Quote from: rebuilder link=topic=68655.msg7329479#msg7329479
That's what I'd like clarified - has such a statement been made, and where?

Short answer:  no

The government is not going to give up all that revenue by tainting coins.  Besides, they couldn't do it directly.  They would just have to follow UTXOs, which would be much easier said than done if privacy protocols are used such as coinjoin.  Tainting is out of their control.

Counterfeit:  made in imitation of something else with intent to deceive:  merriam-webster
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June 15, 2014, 09:25:10 PM
 #8704

Erdogan: Governments confiscating assets and taint seem like entirely different things to me. I read cypherdoc's post as implying a US Government agency has stated they will consider some bitcoins illegal to use due to their having reviously been associated with activities frowned upon by the US gov't. That's what I'd like clarified - has such a statement been made, and where?

Not that I know of.

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June 15, 2014, 10:08:04 PM
 #8705

Erdogan: Governments confiscating assets and taint seem like entirely different things to me. I read cypherdoc's post as implying a US Government agency has stated they will consider some bitcoins illegal to use due to their having reviously been associated with activities frowned upon by the US gov't. That's what I'd like clarified - has such a statement been made, and where?

No, but imo they've been skirting very close to that position.

Look at the Silk Road clients who lost their coins but weren't supposedly buying drugs. Also Shrem who's being prosecuted by association.
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June 15, 2014, 10:09:34 PM
 #8706

Erdogan: Governments confiscating assets and taint seem like entirely different things to me. I read cypherdoc's post as implying a US Government agency has stated they will consider some bitcoins illegal to use due to their having reviously been associated with activities frowned upon by the US gov't. That's what I'd like clarified - has such a statement been made, and where?
No official public statements, just lots of indirect evidence:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=333824.0
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June 15, 2014, 10:14:54 PM
 #8707


Not at all.  Taint is not an issue.  The important thing is control of taint.  Obviously there will be mechanisms to remove it.  That'll be the incentive to register and pay one's taxes and so forth.  Eventually.  This will be ratcheted in over time of course.


More idiotic socialist drivel from you.

Why are you even in Bitcoin? You don't seem  to understand what is being attempted here. If you give gov't the right to be the final arbiter about which  coins are clean versus which are tainted, you've lost any advantage over fiat.

You might as well admit you're an opportunist. And don't come back with some bs about being a pragmatist.

It's not a matter of 'giving' the gov't any rights.  It's a matter of what they are willing and able to take.  It's a fair assumption that they'll take as much as they can, and it's important to understand what that might be.  Don't be thick.

You and I are both very much opportunists.  So what?  Who isn't?  My hopes for Bitcoin as a beneficial social phenomenon vary and are currently at a relative low point.  So yes, I want to profit as I can and am distinctly an 'opportunist'.  Calling out the potential threats is not helpful in this pump-n-dump, but I don't stroke my ego by believing that what I write on this board makes much of a difference one way or another.

My argument for Bitcoin has always been that it was likely under-valued and a good speculative play.  Now, 100x profits later, I still make that argument but more weakly.  I argue strenuously on this thread (being on-topic) that gold has some very real advantages in some very possible failure mode scenarios and they should be considered for those deciding their financial strategies.  Relatedly, there are some legitimate threats to Bitcoin and they should be considered as well.

I have zero shame about being either a 'pragmatist' or a 'realist', and people will find that I am a staunch defender of Bitcoin in cases where it is being ignorantly, dishonestly, or unfairly maligned.

At the end of the day, I've benefited mightily from Bitcoin already and at this point I'd just as soon walk away with a clear conscience than with even more of a windfall.  But I'd take either.



But as a self admitted socialist, not only do you expect gov't intervention, you want it.
tvbcof
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June 15, 2014, 10:24:23 PM
 #8708


But as a self admitted socialist, not only do you expect gov't intervention, you want it.

You are a failed clairvoyant.


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June 15, 2014, 10:42:25 PM
 #8709

But as a self admitted socialist, not only do you expect gov't intervention, you want it.
I've always envisioned tvbcof as the embodiment of the unprincipled, amoral pragmatism of the Baby Boomers, with the single redeeming quality of being notably more honest than most of them.

I really got that impression in some thread where the topic came up of the monstrous blight upon the planet the US empire has become, and tbconf's response was like, "meh, the other guys would have been worse."
tvbcof
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June 15, 2014, 11:03:04 PM
 #8710

But as a self admitted socialist, not only do you expect gov't intervention, you want it.
I've always envisioned tvbcof as the embodiment of the unprincipled, amoral pragmatism of the Baby Boomers, with the single redeeming quality of being notably more honest than most of them.

Actually, I actively cultivate such thought patterns.  It helps me understand the environments inhabited and to some degree created by those who have a meaningful impact on us.

I really got that impression in some thread where the topic came up of the monstrous blight upon the planet the US empire has become, and tbconf's response was like, "meh, the other guys would have been worse."

Guilty (of pragmatism) as charged (by cypherdoc and many others.)  It doesn't mean that I don't wish to and occasionally succeed in making concrete steps toward influencing an improvement in things.  Usually I'm to lazy though.

In my mind it is actually a pretty significant failing both intellectually and functionally to be and absolutist/fundamentalist.  I hold absolutists in contempt in the same way absolutists hold relativists like me in contempt.  This does not mean that I completely lack respect for their contributions in various spheres of course.  It's not uncommon that I do, and try to be quick to point them out when I see them.


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June 15, 2014, 11:21:08 PM
 #8711

This is big. Stocks coming to US markets soon:

http://www.coindesk.com/digitalbtc-makes-history-australian-stock-market-debut/
tvbcof
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June 15, 2014, 11:38:12 PM
 #8712


Wha-hoo!  The pinnacle of success is Bitcoin amalgamating into the US Stock market.  Not an opportunistic bone in ol' Cypherdoc's body of course.


cypherdoc
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June 15, 2014, 11:43:01 PM
 #8713


Wha-hoo!  The pinnacle of success is Bitcoin amalgamating into the US Stock market.  Not an opportunistic bone in ol' Cypherdoc's body of course.



Free markets at work, baby.

None of this socialist bs.
tvbcof
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June 15, 2014, 11:56:14 PM
 #8714


Wha-hoo!  The pinnacle of success is Bitcoin amalgamating into the US Stock market.  Not an opportunistic bone in ol' Cypherdoc's body of course.


Free markets at work, baby.

None of this socialist bs.

Ya, because the U.S. stock market is the epitome of unmanipulated and transparent freedom where everyone has the same fair shot.  Sure thing bud.

Don't get me wrong.  I love the thought of this.  I've already made a boat-load by pocketing VC money, but I've kept plenty of power dry to continue the game.  Bring it on!  I'd be delighted to profit from hedge fund money vs. milking the last Krugerrand out of some poor schmuck since there is a very real possibility that the latter might end up actually needing it at some point.


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June 16, 2014, 06:44:33 PM
 #8715

Holy mother of gaud:

https://blockchain.info/charts/hash-rate
bitcoinsrus
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June 16, 2014, 06:49:49 PM
 #8716


knc finally deliver or something?  Grin
cypherdoc
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June 16, 2014, 06:50:47 PM
 #8717

Ghash smack down to 34%:

https://blockchain.info/pools

Just like all the others.
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June 16, 2014, 07:09:15 PM
 #8718

Gold down.  Bitcoin UP.
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June 16, 2014, 07:13:56 PM
 #8719

Ghash smack down to 34%:

https://blockchain.info/pools

Just like all the others.

Selfish mining and block withholding switched back to actual mining?

FREE MONEY1 Bitcoin for Silver and Gold NewLibertyDollar.com and now BITCOIN SPECIE (silver 1 ozt) shows value by QR
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tvbcof
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June 17, 2014, 12:28:09 AM
 #8720


About 90% of the time when you point to some supposedly amazing metric you found (gold, bitcoin, hash rate, etc) I look at it and it's either ho-hum or actually the opposite of what you try to spout.  I guess a guy needs to look to see your startling observation within a few minutes or it will be gone.  Or you figure that nobody will even bother.  Ever heard the story about the little boy who cried 'wolf!'?  Look it up.


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