[UNOFFICIAL] [VNL] Vanillacoin 0.4.1 | Instant ▱ Incentivized ▱ Innovative

[Riseman]

John may be a good developer but his prediction of markets just plain sucks. Since when is Bitcoin's price based on miners?

 since no one is buying? (current pump not withstanding)

i've accumulated millions of alts since i started mining/trading a couple of years ago. what are they worth now? approximately what it cost to make them ...

It's true that fundamental(real) price of bitcoin is equal to the cost of mining. It's not based on any other real, measurable value other than the electricity and mining operation costs. Maybe popularity,brand, value of the network, and the technology are capitalised in the price but you can't really measure that, and it's changing very fast. Bitcoin's price = mining costs + pure speculation.

I think network hashrate always follows the price, not vice versa.

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[hughbt]

John may be a good developer but his prediction of markets just plain sucks. Since when is Bitcoin's price based on miners?

 since no one is buying? (current pump not withstanding)

i've accumulated millions of alts since i started mining/trading a couple of years ago. what are they worth now? approximately what it cost to make them ...

It's true that fundamental(real) price of bitcoin is equal to the cost of mining. It's not based on any other real, measurable value other than the electricity and mining operation costs. Maybe popularity,brand, value of the network, and the technology are capitalised in the price but you can't really measure that, and it's changing very fast. Bitcoin's price = mining costs + pure speculation.

I think network hashrate always follows the price, not vice versa.

But mining costs are never == price.
You can even look at it from wider perspective. Higher demand->higher price->more miners->higher nethash. This doesn't mean that what I wrote is not true. The most basic method to measure bitcoin's real value(I'm not talking about market price) would be to count all of the used energy and convert it into $. Maybe I wasn't clear enough. I should have written:
Bitcoin's value(overall value - of all coins) = mining costs(since the beginning to this day) + pure speculation.
No one wants to sell antyhing below the costs of production.

And I agree that the speculation part is the most important and dictates the price. That's why we should keep in mind, that Bitcoin isn't really backed up by anything other than electricity cost. A lot of people bought @200$, 100$, average mining cost is different than the current one. There is a room for growth but it can much easier go down.

[etoque]

can we simply have more information about darkpp please ? how it suppose to work? Its an mixer ? side chain ?

[traumschiff]

can we simply have more information about darkpp please ? how it suppose to work? Its an mixer ? side chain ?

It's a mixer most probably (according to some of the file names and code bits on github) and will probably bring a certain level of anonimity to transactions if I had to make a guess. I doubt it's going to be CoinJoin or something equal basic though.

BTW if you would open a topic on talk.vanillacoin.com about the DarkPP questions I'm sure you will get a faster response from John. You asked here 3x already in 2 pages with no luck.

[DeCrypterManiac]

I recommend you to change name.. Dark Pee Pee ... Please not...

[bitcoin carpenter]

DGB could only pump because there were months of heavy accumulation, people like you are blind thinking a project pumps because of some random spam on twitter.

+1

Listen to this guy. He knows what he's talking about. It's just the way markets work.

Shhhh....  I'm enjoying accumulating at these prices

[luckygenough56]

with the rise of eth why is vnl needed now

eth is bloated as hell, 1.7 GB (vnl is 350 Mo after one year) after 2 months, 500 confirms, it is barely functionnal in real world imo. Well, it tries to innovate, i have nothing against it, but the fundamentals are questionnable. Look at nxt, lots of hype at release, then only drop and drop...same speech, eth/nxt are not coins but tokens/gas. It's nice and all, but without a killer app, it doesn't work that well. Vnl is like a nokia 3310 on steroids, it has a simple purpose, solve all bitcoin problems, tx speed, scalability and anonimity and it'll probably be the best at doing it in a simple elegant way a always.

I hope John pulls blockchain pruning soon as said in roadmap, i know most people don't care but it is big deal as it makes the coin look viable look term, future proof.

[luckygenough56]

DGB could only pump because there were months of heavy accumulation, people like you are blind thinking a project pumps because of some random spam on twitter.

+1

Listen to this guy. He knows what he's talking about. It's just the way markets work.

Shhhh....  I'm enjoying accumulating at these prices

Old coins are pumped once pumpers get 80% of the supply, simple as that. And dgb team  putting a video of a random office with 2 guys working on the coin doesn't mean shit. Dgb is 2 years old at least and the development is very poor at best. John is more creative than all this guys combined imo, he already proved it

[etoque]

Also if someone can made an tutorial about how to setup an node on VPN/VPS on windows I'll be happy and make probably more people happy!

Soundslave have help me on IRC, thanks alot

[john-connor]

I recommend you to change name.. Dark Pee Pee ... Please not...

LOL

It's pronounced Dark Plus Plus.

Thank you for your support.

[john-connor]

with the rise of eth why is vnl needed now

eth is bloated as hell, 1.7 GB (vnl is 350 Mo after one year) after 2 months, 500 confirms, it is barely functionnal in real world imo. Well, it tries to innovate, i have nothing against it, but the fundamentals are questionnable. Look at nxt, lots of hype at release, then only drop and drop...same speech, eth/nxt are not coins but tokens/gas. It's nice and all, but without a killer app, it doesn't work that well. Vnl is like a nokia 3310 on steroids, it has a simple purpose, solve all bitcoin problems, tx speed, scalability and anonimity and it'll probably be the best at doing it in a simple elegant way a always.

A 12 second block time will only scale on private lans. 64 seconds is the best you can propagate blocks on the public internet before they become backed up.

Thank you for your support.

[john-connor]

can we simply have more information about darkpp please ? how it suppose to work? Its an mixer ? side chain ?

It's a mixer most probably (according to some of the file names and code bits on github) and will probably bring a certain level of anonimity to transactions if I had to make a guess. I doubt it's going to be CoinJoin or something equal basic though.

BTW if you would open a topic on talk.vanillacoin.com about the DarkPP questions I'm sure you will get a faster response from John. You asked here 3x already in 2 pages with no luck.

There is nothing wrong with CoinJoin, it is 100% anonymous when denominations are identical.

Let me show you:

Code:

array<transaction, 3> unblended_txs = { transaction("A", "B", 25), transaction("B", "C", 25), transaction("C", "A", 25) };

for (auto & i : unblended_txs)
{
    for (auto & j : i.outs())
    {
        tx_blended.outs().push_back(j);
    }

    for (auto & j : i.ins())
    {
        tx_blended.ins().push_back(j);
    }
}

random_device rd;
mt19937 g(rd());

random_shuffle(tx_blended.ins().begin(), tx_blended.ins().end(), g);
random_shuffle(tx_blended.outs().begin(), tx_blended.outs().end(), g)

transaction tx_final = tx_blended;

In the blockchain you would not be able to tell which input belongs to which output.

It would go from:

Code:

Transaction:
A 25 => B 25
B 25 => C 25
C 25 => A 25

to:

Code:

Transaction:
B 25 => C 25
C 25 => B 25
A 25 => A 25

...with no way to put them back into original order you cannot tell who sent who which one.

Thank you for your support.

[d0om]

seems that the current pump on btc is going for a ponzi scheme promoted on poor countries by a famous russian scammer.
believe it or not

http://cointelegraph.com/news/115425/btcc-ceo-bobby-lee-warns-bitcoin-investors-about-mmm-ponzi-scheme

https://letstalkbitcoin.com/blog/post/mmm-global-republic-of-bitcoin-cryptos-next-scandal

http://www.coindesk.com/bitcoin-price-breaks-260-to-hit-two-month-high/

http://beta.iol.co.za/news/crime-courts/russian-fraudster-hits-s-africans-1911289

last night this ponzi scheme came to china and the price difference between huobi and bitfinex reached $30

That's hilarious. The Russian prince travels to Nigeria

[traumschiff]

can we simply have more information about darkpp please ? how it suppose to work? Its an mixer ? side chain ?

It's a mixer most probably (according to some of the file names and code bits on github) and will probably bring a certain level of anonimity to transactions if I had to make a guess. I doubt it's going to be CoinJoin or something equal basic though.

BTW if you would open a topic on talk.vanillacoin.com about the DarkPP questions I'm sure you will get a faster response from John. You asked here 3x already in 2 pages with no luck.

There is nothing wrong with CoinJoin, it is 100% anonymous when denominations are identical.

Let me show you:

Code:

array<transaction, 3> unblended_txs = { transaction("A", "B", 25), transaction("B", "C", 25), transaction("C", "A", 25) };

for (auto & i : unblended_txs)
{
    for (auto & j : i.outs())
    {
        tx_blended.outs().push_back(j);
    }

    for (auto & j : i.ins())
    {
        tx_blended.ins().push_back(j);
    }
}

random_device rd;
mt19937 g(rd());

random_shuffle(tx_blended.ins().begin(), tx_blended.ins().end(), g);
random_shuffle(tx_blended.outs().begin(), tx_blended.outs().end(), g)

transaction tx_final = tx_blended;

In the blockchain you would not be able to tell which input belongs to which output.

It would go from:

Code:

Transaction:
A 25 => B 25
B 25 => C 25
C 25 => A 25

to:

Code:

Transaction:
B 25 => C 25
C 25 => B 25
A 25 => A 25

...with no way to put them back into original order you cannot tell who sent who which one.

Thank you for your support.

Nice to get some info on the mixer I just meant CoinJoin wasn't so far used well, the basic implementation which people used lacked always something.

Any rough ETA you may want to give on the DarkPP release?

[john-connor]

Nice to get some info on the mixer I just meant CoinJoin wasn't so far used well, the basic implementation which people used lacked always something.

Yes, the example here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CoinJoin is flawed and like most implementations you can match inputs and outputs because the denominations differ.

Any rough ETA you may want to give on the DarkPP release?

Dark++ is a framework, so it will come in stages.

Thank you for your support.

[dygus]

Nice to get some info on the mixer I just meant CoinJoin wasn't so far used well, the basic implementation which people used lacked always something.

Yes, the example here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CoinJoin is flawed and like most implementations you can match inputs and outputs because the denominations differ.

Any rough ETA you may want to give on the DarkPP release?

Dark++ is a framework, so it will come in stages.

Thank you for your support.

Ok, so when you can give us the nearest stage?

[bitcoin carpenter]

He already promised it would be in this quarter.

[pseudonymdude]

Nice to get some info on the mixer I just meant CoinJoin wasn't so far used well, the basic implementation which people used lacked always something.

Yes, the example here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CoinJoin is flawed and like most implementations you can match inputs and outputs because the denominations differ.

Any rough ETA you may want to give on the DarkPP release?

Dark++ is a framework, so it will come in stages.

Thank you for your support.

Ok, so when you can give us the nearest stage?

One dark application will come within the next 3 months approximately.

See the 4-month timeline announced 3 weeks ago: https://talk.vanillacoin.net/topic/221/4-month-timeline

[etoque]

Nice to get some info on the mixer I just meant CoinJoin wasn't so far used well, the basic implementation which people used lacked always something.

Yes, the example here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CoinJoin is flawed and like most implementations you can match inputs and outputs because the denominations differ.

Any rough ETA you may want to give on the DarkPP release?

Dark++ is a framework, so it will come in stages.

Thank you for your support.

Ok, so when you can give us the nearest stage?

One dark application will come within the next 3 months approximately.

See the 4-month timeline announced 3 weeks ago: https://talk.vanillacoin.net/topic/221/4-month-timeline

originally Dark++ was suppose to came for Q4...

[bigfryguy]

Is there a way to tell which address sent you coins from the client?
Or to be able to tell which address coins were sent to?

I would like to be able to use cryptopia to retail a few items, but I dont want to use the the blockchain explorer to figure out who sent which coins.