This analysis provided by r1s2g3  https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1SAi_b3umCcFJO2dMoLYjWCjNz1JhOLWrsRHhYQK-nb8/edit?usp=sharing

Does add weight to your suspicions. If you could remove even the top 300 or 400 and merits from the meta board then you would start to see a more reasonable merit score table. Most would not have more than 100 merit.

You can see already many persons merit score is cut in half or in extreme cases reduced by 75% and that is without taking meta out of it or those aspiring to join the fraction of 1% that reward each other the most merit.

There are some on the top 200 who deserve to be there for sure but I would not pay much heed to merit scores.

You can there fore see great posters from the alt board will have extremely low chance of merit.

Where do most new posters post??

Merit is good for showing you like your friends posts or agree with peoples posts... I would far rather read through a persons post history in depth to get an idea of what they are like and how much you can rely on what they say.

Trust is a more important score to look at but again I would read through it deeply not just take the scores at face value.

Look it is very simple.

1. You initially claimed he was claiming the work as his own.  This was proven false.
2. You consider his posts as shit posting - I have demonstrated that is not essentially true by any criteria I have noticed is widely accepted and I don't think others will share your opinion. If you ban every person whom posts to his standard you can start banning a huge proportion of the board that actually does nothing against the rules and does not harm directly anyone else. He is certainly not a shit post scamming spammer who have ruined the alt board. You do not have the right to evaluate his posts alone and decide he is not worthy of being a member.
3. You then admit he was not claiming the work as his own.
4. You said you would expect other members (staff or dt) to disagree with you if you were wrong. -- They have. You still  do not listen.

I find it more than strange that you have reviewed all of the observable evidence that I provided on the other post and still insist he deserves a perma ban? That is a very serious punishment.


Now I notice you don't want to  mud sling but seem very interested to know why I am sticking up for what is clearly a fair and correct decision by DS?  why would the motive of my interest change the observable events?

 Let's say i am discovered to be the actual devil or just a person whom likes to cause trouble for no reason. How could I hack into the board or go back in time and change what people can observe has taken place. It does not matter who presents observable events because there is no trust required. I am asking for no trust I am asking people review the observable events and make their own minds up.

What part specifically interests you, and what would you like to know? Am I his father? the devil?  this is a tactic a lot of people resort to to not deal with observable events and not one people should be diverted by.

It is very simple I have always done so and especially when people in perceived power seem to be picking on those of perceived lesser power for no good reason.

I was bored browsing this board and noticed his thread. I would do the same for anyone.

Someone trying to help others and getting banned for that or red trust is something I would always comment on and try to change.

I agree though I find it strange this is still ongoing. If you will not remove it there is nothing more to be done at this point. Although historically I believe it will turn out to be a mistake on your part to leave it there and will not be one of your finest decisions.

People can only make so many bad decisions before the credibility of that person is reduced dramatically.

Run baby..........

1. it is clear that you will not present observable grounds for your argument.
2. thinks it is okay to say that I have shady motives and other spurious attacks on persons and deflection tactics to try to decredit other persons  character - - but not willing to accept reasonable conclusions based on his trust feedback and previous post history. Again observable on this thread/board. I mean complaining about behaviour you yourself introduce first into a thread is the definition of HYPOCRISY.
3. Now gone back on plagiarism or not (prime crux of argument)? but now invents other behaviour worth of perm ban but will not provide evidence.
4. Destruction of the private property of gekos.  That could be a balloon full of innocent investors dreams using certain escrows. Evil kitty.
5. Has no memory of being a dash supporter... has no memory of later saying it was a scam. (not that that is that relevant only to counter his argument he is never wrong)

seems legit. lol

I have nothing personal against you all things considered ( i have not read in detail all the basis of your negative feedback )however I can not allow you to persecute a person I see no evidence provided deserves such treatment by claiming there is such evidence.

Please remain quiet if you are unwilling/unable to bring evidence to substantiate your opinions or show any logical and reasonable trail of thought that others that are reasonable and fair could follow and agree with. Anything else requires trust in you and your personal moral compass which I don't expect many would be comfortable with at this point.

So now its plagiarism or no plagiarism he just has to be banned??? what other behaviour deserving a perm ban do you mean?

Please provide basis for your statements. I see someone trying to avoid discussing the presented facts.


Please provide what I have asked for. Without it your argument is a non-starter.

Please go back and read my posts.

Let's save the personal scrutiny for later. I am certainly open to that stage coming next if you wish.

For now read my posts, present your argument clearly with observable events/facts.

No more personal remarks discuss the observable events only.

I am totally down for a personal scrutiny session later on. I will look forward to examining all the evidence with you and help you clear you negative trust. Even you deserve a chance to be declared innocent if you are. However having read some of the threads about you we have a long road ahead my friend.

You have been wrong on some very big projects before. Why deny which is observable in the public domain.

LOL you can't trust me. Motivated by something shady - - lol take a look at your feedback. You are generally thought of as one of the most devious scammers on this board according to many threads here and your trust score.

Your argument does not hold water.

Read my post and take your time to reply. You seem upset and rushing your replies and constantly editing your posts.

LOL mr ad hominem.

Now take a deep breath and simply provide a simple basis for your frantic posting of gibberish.

You must realise that as previous dash enabler and promoter can not be taken at face value however much you repent for this.

You are only making yourself look desperate and pathetic by trying to divert from the topic here.

I would also imagine people are more interested in your motivation here than my own.

LaudaM - - You seem to be missing several  points.



1. this person clearly did not break the board rules. The person you were sticking up for did.

2. you want to see what you initially saw as unfair imposed upon others because it happened once. Actually this is even more unfair because he did not break the rules. You seem not to stick to your beliefs and are now arguing therefore for what you initially saw as unfair. I'm not sure what that says about you. . As I have already shown this is even more unfair because he did not claim the work as his own.
Incidentally even though the guy you were arguing FOR did break the rules I agree that it was harsh to perm ban him.... however this is not comparable to this instance in that this person did not break the board rules as they are written. Any implied further meaning to those rules are up for debate.

This is what you are saying here.

The store rules ( those leaving the store without paying for goods are thieves)

I don't think the person who walked into a store and took the fruit without paying should be hung -- that seems too extreme. Okay he got hung damn.

In that case I want the other guy who walked into the store threw the money on the floor of that store before leaving to be certainly hung because that makes it fair.

Sorry that is just strange and just makes it look like you have a strange moral compass.

3. That I know you can change and alter your perspective on things regularly hence why I need to see the basis of each and every statement that you make that seems unreasonable.



Please laudaM take time to structure your argument so that is is not so time wasting . Try to say something and then substantiate it with a logical path that can be followed for me not to have to just repeat myself over and over. It may be best to go back and read the original thread a few times. Then as I said bring forth any holes you find so we can discuss it.

First copy and paste the unofficial rule that was broken before posting more unsubstantiated claims.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3432369.msg35964475#msg35964475

No you are a selective hypocrite.  That persons copy and paste was not a fair comparison as I have shown before.

Also LaudaM you have often altered your opinion on things that were clearly wrong to start with.

Every person is worthy of a fair assessment of the observable fact.

But that post just confirms another reason why Darkstar was 100% correct in light of the evidence we have to over turn your claim of him being a plagiarist. You did not leave red trust for him being a shit poster (which I have refuted strongly and provided argument) but plagiarism which you say is not arguable he is not. You have also recently even said the board rules (which are unofficial) need more clarity.  On this point they are clear but people are simply sayimg they imply things they do not say.

Intent and context are very important as Lauda himself has said before.

Being a shit poster also needs to have some criteria provided so we can measure people against it. To me he is not a shit poster.

Lauda also provides no basis for his statement that Darkstar has acted incorrectly. On the basis of what exactly?

Here is Lauda https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3432369.msg35964475#msg35964475

1. there is no black and white (even though the accused broke no board rule as it stands) and the context clearly shows the OP had no reason to post suspected plagiarism in the meta board the ban hammers looking for nails in great concentration there and no sig banner... no real gain at all. Just trying to be helpful and getting fucked.

The entire thing is a waste of board time and resource.

Other posters in that thread after reviewing the context, intent, and full presentation of the observable events was brought to their intention seemed to soften on their stance.

Darkstar_  displayed why he is a DT here and has shown great character.  If we are to have judges here they must be flexible and able to alter opinion as observable events dictate.

But who wants a reporter badge ? seriously the psychology of that is just not great.

I face serious scammers and scamming projects face on. Spammers and sig chasers are often probably desperate and poor individuals/kids who i do not feel good about reporting at all. Or if they are bots you will never stop them with reporting because they don't need any requirement to shill post with others fake conversations for the icos coding them out.

I would rather have myself a promoter badge  or something to indicate I am giving merits to worthy people from the junior boards I would introduce. Or rather just one board that is clearly clearly needed an alt discussion junior board. Senior alt board ( current one would require 5 or 10 merit to post on)

the alt discussion board is the one that has been destroyed... bitcoin discussion is still usable really.

Reporting 500,000 to enable potential legendary sounds like a strange and hard to remember number. I would suggest keeping things simple and making it 1M.

There is a far easier solution to all of this which i have suggested many times.

Nobody wants to spend their time snitching and reporting real bad things and lesser evils that are  just annoying kids seeking a few bucks (cant say that i don't empathise a bit with some) that spoil the board experience.

A system that would allow you to reward the good and deserving and simply not bother with the rest.

However, without providing any reasonable argument that I could establish within their posts they all said they didn't like the idea.

There will always be a far greater number of kids and people from less well off countries that will go to extreme lengths for a couple of bucks than those not financially/morally motivated to stop them.

In a place like this in the situation we are in now you can not assume everyone is an honest enthusiast that wants to discuss/learn about cc in a reasonable way. It is better to let them prove or at least demonstrate they are capable of such before letting them drive genuine enthusiasts away.

so the sec don't like decentralised exchanges

that does not bode well.

@unicorn

I can't quote all of that since it will take up too much space. People need to scroll up to view the previous post you made.

there is either too much being lost in translation or you simply do not understand what I am saying. Trying to deny what i have merely observed and pointed out is pointless.

Everything I have suggested in the past would have clearly benefitted the project. There is nothing more to be said about it.

No tonych was not naive we had discussed going ahead would land the largest proportions with those ico managers and exchanges.
I am not in favour of airdrops to bitcoin holders anyway just on the basis i would not give the already most wealthy the most.

I am as selfish and greedy as any other normal person here. However arguing against airdropping to btc holders was not in my financial favour since i could have linked a lot more than i did and also it suits me financially better than some of my other suggestions. Wide distributions with no immediate super whales is best.

No need to apologise for your english I can not speak french. I just believe you do not fully understand everything that I am trying to convey.

I have no problem with people saying i want more money for doing nothing. However actually I am not doing nothing and if all the effort I had put into this thread and project had had any effect the real bb holders and enthusiasts would be better off and so would tonych. Also as i have explained people who buy and hold your alt are not doing nothing. They are adding to investor confindence which is a form of free advertising and at this time the most powerful type of advertising. When everyone dumps your project and people see it sinking that is showing a lack of confidence which can self perpetuate strongly.

I would love more money for doing nothing for sure that is not something you should doubt is a primary dream of a great proportion of people in the world.

I really honestly do not see your point that you are trying to make?

Are you saying trying to get people to invest and make it look as attractive as possible to future investors and hodlers is less important than drumming up adoption with baker and piano stores. Well that is useful too but the fast route to the top 50 right now is appealing to speculators and investors. Once there you will give yourselves a lot more financial leverage to develop applications and usage and get the attention of those that already have huge opportunities waiting in terms of adoption.  You will need a lot of volume and value to bring in big adopters.

crypotounicornrider    Date Registered:   12-10-2018
tarm0888                  Date Registered:   12-10-2018


come on guys....

That would be the ANN section.

It's already there. Close your eyes and place a bet. Odd's are kind of stacked against you right now though.

I would like to see a junior board in the alt section. 10 merits to post on the main alt discussion. Instant removal of 90% of the spam.

If that is your conclusion it only demonstrates that you are unable to grasp what I have written and likely a lost cause.

The fact that you can't differentiate between quoting a set of unrelated questions that can be answered in in isolation since they are my focus and which I made clear I was addressing - - and a bunch of related material that one needs to read to understand the entire point that is your problem. I think that was clear to most people. You have only made yourself look foolish to conflate the 2 examples as demonstrating the same thing.


Ok just for you ...buttflake

I stick by what I said and it is observably true just by looking at the examples I have given previously.

The greatest advertisement you can have right now is a High MC. (without freak examples none of which bb looks likely to get given right now like front page news on the FT that bb is the answer to fiat replacement) that is simply observable fact. This is a market driven by speculation and investment so if you deny you need to appeal to speculators and investors  - - LOL

I don't know any other person on this forum including you who wants more money for doing nothing. This is a completely foreign concept to every person on this board. I am glad you are here to make sure bb does not appeal to any of those types. The fact you are denying that or hinting it is a terrible thing and that your yourself never consider such things just make you seem even more stupid and fake.

Go find your unicorns elsewhere and ride them hard into financial ruin and exasperation.

Also I have constantly advertised BB and given time and effort trying to stop tonych doing thigns like giving it all to other ico managers, appeal to noobs that consider bb more expensive that iota and other things of vital importance.

What have you done noob trash? waste peoples time explaining things to you that should be obvious.

Also I am very suspicious of several low post low merit accounts with the same type of just about English all arriving on this thread with more or less the same protectionist unreasonable illogical thought patterns. This is likely the same person.

@TP

"Older posters?  I think they've been the ones who've been posting the most in Meta for a long time now.  It's the newbies who've started posting here recently, and they're the ones who are doing so, probably to earn merit."


Posters that have been posting around 3-4yrs or longer who were frequent posters on the alt board before.

This is actually very true. Although since I have spent a few hours now looking over the merit and where and by who it was given/received I can totally understand any new poster from the alt board would realise that he will not earn merit there. Meta seems to be the easiest place to gain merit so they are catching on. Also you have to wonder if after a while the members who want to speak to genuine other members who are looking to discuss and debate cc related topics and they are finding the alt discussion board can no longer sustain this.

The problem with moving all good posters off of the main discussion boards on to boards that are not unusable due to new spammers (whom seem motivated to put lots of effort into creating accounts and spamming for a tiny amount of reward) is that it's seems a strange approach. The the good posters should not need to move. Would have been better to bring back junior boards (noob jails to contain those types) which would have worked instantly and a lot of members would not have left. Then rather than doing lots of negative reporting and snitching on serious and non serious offenders we could just do positive work like meriting new posters until they have enough to post on the main boards.

If we are being serious most people will come here not to discuss how the board should be run but to discuss items specifically related to bitcoin or altcoins. The other sub boards can be of interest to people but I have never seen a forum where the fastest growing and most highly merited (other boards have similar mechanisms) is a forum which discusses these mechanisms.

Merit is being more and more concentrated by the top 200 merit holders and I expect those that have the highest merit scores (except a handful) are receiving it from other top 200 merit holders in the meta section. Whilst that continues and practically nothing is going to the altcoin discussion board you can expect meta to keep expanding and the altcoin board just left with bots and fake discussions from ico spam teams. These are not essentially criticisms of the top merit holders because it is quite clear if the majority of genuine posters have moved here and also a lot of very helpful people are in here too then lots of merit will be concentrated here.

I mean if merit was just started as a nice way to say thanks or appreciate a post then fair enough. To me though it could be such an interesting tool to bring the board back to version of it that is long gone. You will end up with tiny % of the board with 1000's of merit all from the tiny % and the voices of potentially great posters never being heard because they will be drown out by a lot of financially motivated noise.

So yes some it is completely understandable why things are as they are regards merit concentration but great posters will come here and leave because nobody can ever locate them to invite them to meta and are unable to post on serious/ivory. Also you may get a poster that has a lot of interesting knowledge and advice or even very interesting questions that could if answered by a tech boffin give a lot of people a lot of insight come make a post and it just vanishes in the wave of who is best with no justification other than I am part of the spam team or bought some crew.  I have no care about merit if you are a legend you don't have a use for it do you? but it would be great to use it as a tool for good as well as a way of just tipping your hat to other good posters that are already of a level up where merit is of no use.

I am not sure why the junior board idea has not gained more traction. I have seen no logical reason for it not to be implemented. If most want to stay in here sending merit around and around how will anything change on the main discussion boards. The bitcoin board is not so bad since it is kind of self moderated by the fact you meant to keep discussion of other projects to the alt board which is obviously what icos need to do or immediately can have their spam threads moved.

You would expect support of certain projects to be on the alt discussion board. But there is for the most part no discussion it is just I think this one is best with no debate/reasoning or discussion at all and 99% of posters look like they may take the only semi reasonable post and have text spun it. Also multiple threads on the same ico on the front page at the same time all saying the same thing.

In years previous you would get a lot of deeper discussion into the projects with a mixture of knowledgeable (tech wise) posters and others both posting and asking questions. It was actually useful and interesting.

Just be great to have alt discussion back as it was a few years back before ico massacre.

Why have most of the older posters I recognise retreated here to meta and not moved to the ivory tower of serious discussion after being driven from the main discussion boards?

Discussing how the board works is not generally why people visit forums is it?

I understand your pov.

However I would certainly not think of dumping your entire stash of bb right now. That could end up being a catastrophic mistake financially especially if like myself you accumulated a lot of them at a much higher rate.

Even though we don't get listened to that much I agree. I still think the development tonych has put into this and the expertise he has demonstrated deserves a MC in the top 50 already. I can not really say I have seen many more talented devs than him. Anonymint was highly interested in this design and he was never interested in 1000's of other projects.

That is just my opinion but of course it is up to you and I may not be correct. I can not see 50 projects better than this.

With a few improvements and a bit of a push this will have a huge upswing i think.

If the community could just unite a bit that would help.

The issue is some of the bb team take suggestions that are meant well and to help bb as criticism and that makes no sense. The main points I see mentioned are not even technical things they are simple things regarding distribution and changing exchange units. these are not even huge issues at this point. Merely suggestions.

Bitcointalk is underrated it is the jumping point for new cc enthusiasts and active thread here is free advertising. of course best if looks like a cohesive community.

I also strongly suggest the team start seeing hodlers as vital and constructive even if they are not doing anything else. These are your core investors that will help the MC rise and that alone is the largest and most powerful form of advertisement in an arena dominated by speculators and investors.  The time of adoption is not here and they are not ready as yet. Even btc is not widely adopted as for the other high cap super snake oil it is not adopted and will likely not get adopted. It is though widely advertised and sucks up more investment.

Hodlers are good at this stage.

Other suggestions that are made by other members should not just be ignored. If the development team thinks it is not a good idea it would be best to explain the logic behind their decision not to run with that at this time. 1/ the person suggesting may not have thought of or 2/ they will at least think you have considered it.

To be clear I am a bb fan and always advertise it on my suggestion threads in the top 5. This is apparent if you just check. I would like to be a community manager here but I really think it is not possible since a community manager needs to understand a lot of the design and technical matters because they need to be answer such queries.  From all of the posters on this thread there must be one person who could do this who has a diplomatic way of posting and has technical understanding of the project.

been explained, please go and re-read my simple explanation.

then any specific points you don't understand or do not agree with then please come back and I will assist you.

thanks that is all very interesting to look through.

on the chart the output has one small issue that the left column starts at 2 as there was a small out put error but it does not really matter.

to me this is the most important analysis of the merit system so far.