cyrozap
Newbie
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Activity: 5
Merit: 0
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July 17, 2013, 03:30:08 PM |
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There is no better GH/$ relation on the market atm.
I can see that, but KNC is predicted to add 450 Th/s of hashing power to the network ( http://www.coindesk.com/a-look-inside-kncminer/). Isn't that going to make the difficulty skyrocket? A 400 Gh/s miner isn't going to make much if the total network hashing power is over 1000 times that. |
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FeedbackLoop
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July 17, 2013, 03:30:47 PM |
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Yes, I agree they have been doing great things, especially when compared with epic failures like BFL. So far, like I said, they look like the best horse and that is why i paid them and the third party queue trader to be with them. I will also likely pay for their services further and maybe even buy new units.
Regarding the trading queue's, I wish I had not paid as much as I did for my 1-500: I paid because of the RISK. Risk has a cost and KNCminer and a lot of people here do not seem to understand that. Sure in the end they've put an enormous amount of orders in day 1 and 2 thus making everything "fine" (as an aside one has to also ask how much of this was achieved by simply delaying the first units) but when the risk was there some people had to assume that risk or incur in a cost like I did to get rid of it. And that risk came purely due to the surprise KNCminer service of queue trading. I would have been fine as well without losing the few BTC I did to that service but how could I have known???
Now imagine the following: new chip tech comes out that doubles the hash power. KNC puts new products for sale with the new technology. You have money to invest in one of those units but also an "old" unit. What do you do? Sure you can try to get KNC to clarify their position on old unit upgrades but now introduce a few more complications like new unit queues, upgrade queues, hosting offers attached to units, queue trading, "send money in x days" offers, what about upgrades in the new line of products that do not affect the new product queue,... you have to assume unnecessary extra risk coming from KNC trying to be friendly to some clients in your decision and possibly pay extra to third parties to make sure you won't get 3000 THs ahead of you.
Unnecessary loss of money and headaches in an already hard to figure investment!
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robix
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July 17, 2013, 03:41:15 PM |
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There is no better GH/$ relation on the market atm.
I can see that, but KNC is predicted to add 450 Th/s of hashing power to the network ( http://www.coindesk.com/a-look-inside-kncminer/). Isn't that going to make the difficulty skyrocket? A 400 Gh/s miner isn't going to make much if the total network hashing power is over 1000 times that. It's your own evaluation you have to follow when investing into mining hw. |
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cypherdoc
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
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July 17, 2013, 03:44:04 PM |
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Yes, I agree they have been doing great things, especially when compared with epic failures like BFL. So far, like I said, they look like the best horse and that is why i paid them and the third party queue trader to be with them. I will also likely pay for their services further and maybe even buy new units.
Regarding the trading queue's, I wish I had not paid as much as I did for my 1-500: I paid because of the RISK. Risk has a cost and KNCminer and a lot of people here do not seem to understand that. Sure in the end they've put an enormous amount of orders in day 1 and 2 thus making everything "fine" (as an aside one has to also ask how much of this was achieved by simply delaying the first units) but when the risk was there some people had to assume that risk or incur in a cost like I did to get rid of it. And that risk came purely due to the surprise KNCminer service of queue trading. I would have been fine as well without losing the few BTC I did to that service but how could I have known???
Now imagine the following: new chip tech comes out that doubles the hash power. KNC puts new products for sale with the new technology. You have money to invest in one of those units but also an "old" unit. What do you do? Sure you can try to get KNC to clarify their position on old unit upgrades but now introduce a few more complications like new unit queues, upgrade queues, hosting offers attached to units, queue trading, "send money in x days" offers, what about upgrades in the new line of products that do not affect the new product queue,... you have to assume unnecessary extra risk coming from KNC trying to be friendly to some clients in your decision and possibly pay extra to third parties to make sure you won't get 3000 THs ahead of you.
Unnecessary loss of money and headaches in an already hard to figure investment!
can u summarize this trading queue business that was going on initially before i was around? |
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Loredo
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July 17, 2013, 03:45:36 PM |
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There is no better GH/$ relation on the market atm.
I can see that, but KNC is predicted to add 450 Th/s of hashing power to the network ( http://www.coindesk.com/a-look-inside-kncminer/). Isn't that going to make the difficulty skyrocket? A 400 Gh/s miner isn't going to make much if the total network hashing power is over 1000 times that. You can answer that yourself, and guess what that increase in difficulty might mean as well as anyone. Just divide the network hash rate you estimate by 7.16 million to translate to difficulty. Then use your calculator of choice. Also, 1/1000 th of the network is nothing to sneeze at. Remember: 3600 coins per day: your share at that level is 3.6 coins. As long as one doesn't get blinded by greed and pay the current levels of gouging retail ask prices for hardware, that's a pretty fair return rate. |
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robix
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July 17, 2013, 03:47:44 PM |
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There is no better GH/$ relation on the market atm.
I can see that, but KNC is predicted to add 450 Th/s of hashing power to the network ( http://www.coindesk.com/a-look-inside-kncminer/). Isn't that going to make the difficulty skyrocket? A 400 Gh/s miner isn't going to make much if the total network hashing power is over 1000 times that. What payback period would be acceptable for you? |
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Mota
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 804
Merit: 1002
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July 17, 2013, 03:49:06 PM |
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There is no better GH/$ relation on the market atm.
I can see that, but KNC is predicted to add 450 Th/s of hashing power to the network ( http://www.coindesk.com/a-look-inside-kncminer/). Isn't that going to make the difficulty skyrocket? A 400 Gh/s miner isn't going to make much if the total network hashing power is over 1000 times that. You can answer that yourself, and guess what that increase in difficulty might mean as well as anyone. Just divide the network hash rate you estimate by 7.16 million to translate to difficulty. Then use your calculator of choice. !!! OR you could just take the hashrate of 1 unit / total hashrate *3600 and you have ~ btc per day |
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WastedLTC
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July 17, 2013, 03:50:18 PM |
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There is no better GH/$ relation on the market atm.
I can see that, but KNC is predicted to add 450 Th/s of hashing power to the network ( http://www.coindesk.com/a-look-inside-kncminer/). Isn't that going to make the difficulty skyrocket? A 400 Gh/s miner isn't going to make much if the total network hashing power is over 1000 times that. It's your own evaluation you have to follow when investing into mining hw. Agreed. Here is some more information for you. (not official but can help) https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=249065.0As you can see, some people believe it is worth ordering today but its your money to risk. If I did not have an order with KNC, I personally would not purchase one today. I would continue to look for other opportunities in this market. If something was to spike for me, maybe I would then move some of those funds in with KNC (if I didn't have an order already). |
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Loredo
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July 17, 2013, 03:51:29 PM |
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There is no better GH/$ relation on the market atm.
I can see that, but KNC is predicted to add 450 Th/s of hashing power to the network ( http://www.coindesk.com/a-look-inside-kncminer/). Isn't that going to make the difficulty skyrocket? A 400 Gh/s miner isn't going to make much if the total network hashing power is over 1000 times that. You can answer that yourself, and guess what that increase in difficulty might mean as well as anyone. Just divide the network hash rate you estimate by 7.16 million to translate to difficulty. Then use your calculator of choice. !!! OR you could just take the hashrate of 1 unit / total hashrate *3600 and you have ~ btc per day Yeah, actually I was adding that edit while you commented. People just love their difficulty, though, because of the calculators' biases to it. |
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WastedLTC
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July 17, 2013, 03:59:11 PM |
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Is anyone thinking about flying in from USA to pickup their unit(s)? Removing shipping risk/cost and any customs issues? + added hashing time.
Wouldn't it be worth the trip? I guess the toughest part of that would be knowing which date to be there so travel isn't outrageous. Shipping (for me) is between 374-408 so that will help with the travel cost.
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WastedLTC
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July 17, 2013, 04:25:07 PM |
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Has anyone done any of the math to figure out if it's even worth it to buy a Jupiter now? I've been looking to get into ASIC mining for a while, but I always seem to miss the original announcements for these things by a month or two. As I'm sure you all know, the later you receive the device, the longer it takes to pay itself off. I'd hate to order one now to only have it pay for itself in 5 years.  Cyrozap, here is one more page that can help you decide if mining is for you. http://minr.info/ |
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jmaccoin
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 43
Merit: 0
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July 17, 2013, 04:52:43 PM |
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I have often wondered why I would pay $7000 in June to be on shipping day #1 when it seems like I could pay the same $7000 in September to be on shipping day #4.
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ujka
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July 17, 2013, 04:58:23 PM |
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 I'll be good even with shipping day #5.
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toga
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 46
Merit: 0
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July 17, 2013, 05:12:36 PM |
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Has anyone done any of the math to figure out if it's even worth it to buy a Jupiter now? I've been looking to get into ASIC mining for a while, but I always seem to miss the original announcements for these things by a month or two. As I'm sure you all know, the later you receive the device, the longer it takes to pay itself off. I'd hate to order one now to only have it pay for itself in 5 years. Cyrozap, here is one more page that can help you decide if mining is for you. http://minr.info/according to this calculator with difficulty increase prediction x ex a mercury (october shipping) will make ROI in 46 days approx |
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amencon
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July 17, 2013, 05:54:02 PM |
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Yes, I agree they have been doing great things, especially when compared with epic failures like BFL. So far, like I said, they look like the best horse and that is why i paid them and the third party queue trader to be with them. I will also likely pay for their services further and maybe even buy new units.
Regarding the trading queue's, I wish I had not paid as much as I did for my 1-500: I paid because of the RISK. Risk has a cost and KNCminer and a lot of people here do not seem to understand that. Sure in the end they've put an enormous amount of orders in day 1 and 2 thus making everything "fine" (as an aside one has to also ask how much of this was achieved by simply delaying the first units) but when the risk was there some people had to assume that risk or incur in a cost like I did to get rid of it. And that risk came purely due to the surprise KNCminer service of queue trading. I would have been fine as well without losing the few BTC I did to that service but how could I have known???
Now imagine the following: new chip tech comes out that doubles the hash power. KNC puts new products for sale with the new technology. You have money to invest in one of those units but also an "old" unit. What do you do? Sure you can try to get KNC to clarify their position on old unit upgrades but now introduce a few more complications like new unit queues, upgrade queues, hosting offers attached to units, queue trading, "send money in x days" offers, what about upgrades in the new line of products that do not affect the new product queue,... you have to assume unnecessary extra risk coming from KNC trying to be friendly to some clients in your decision and possibly pay extra to third parties to make sure you won't get 3000 THs ahead of you.
Unnecessary loss of money and headaches in an already hard to figure investment!
can u summarize this trading queue business that was going on initially before i was around? Initially you couldn't pay for any orders, these no money orders were still kept for queue position so if you were the first to make a fake order then you could keep that position in line when they allowed people to pay for their orders. During the time people made no-money orders and before payments were allowed there were many that sold and traded their reserved queue position for BTC (or LTC according that other guy). Many thought it would be worth a BTC or 2 to buy a low queue position so that they'd be one of the first to be shipped a unit. There were some people that happened to register a bunch of no-money orders and so they had extras they could sell usually auction style. |
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Mota
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 804
Merit: 1002
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July 17, 2013, 05:58:24 PM |
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And? If you paid 2 btc for a day 1 ddelivery instead of day2 you still made a difference.
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yuriygeorge
Sr. Member
Offline
Activity: 262
Merit: 250
I hate my family
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July 17, 2013, 08:31:19 PM |
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IIRC, didn't KNC say we can get refunds up until the time of delivery? like October for me.
is there a link to that policy?
I e-mailed about this 2 days ago and Carl from KNCMiner responded: "You can request a refund at any time prior to shipment date." |
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Kuroth
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July 17, 2013, 08:38:29 PM |
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Not sure about the rest of you but I think Knc is going to have to release some pretty significant updates soon including Pic' of Chips, boards etc etc or a LOT of us are going to start getting itchy..
I come from the BFL disaster and I am one of the lucky ones that "JUST" this week got a refund for all my May 2013 orders.. But I had to file claims with Paypal and wait 14 days etc..
I have a very bad taste in my mouth for anything ASIC after that experience..
I used Paypal for my Knc order I placed in Mid June(Order # 25XX) and If dont see some pretty significant proof from Knc that they are on track and ok, my Paypal trigger finger will be itching and I have no idea what it will do..
I am gun shy now after BFL and have really NOTHING from Knc yet to make me NOT feel this way..
p.s. I am Emailing Knc this Post..
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ujka
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July 17, 2013, 08:38:46 PM |
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IIRC, didn't KNC say we can get refunds up until the time of delivery? like October for me.
is there a link to that policy?
There is no such written policy in a sale contract. It comes just to good will of the KnCMiner team. https://www.kncminer.com/pages/tandc |
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Mogumodz
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July 17, 2013, 08:42:55 PM |
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IIRC, didn't KNC say we can get refunds up until the time of delivery? like October for me.
is there a link to that policy?
I e-mailed about this 2 days ago and Carl from KNCMiner responded: "You can request a refund at any time prior to shipment date." I phoned KNC today as I have done a few times with them picking up pretty quickly. I got a verbal confirmation again today saying they are offering refunds up to the shipping of the miner. KNC also confirmed no delays on anything they know of. |
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