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Author Topic: Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com  (Read 3012259 times)
jmaccoin
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July 18, 2013, 01:21:51 PM
 #3801


Everything is a tad too open and abstract. I'd prefer to know they are doing a batch of X Jupiters; X Saturns; X Mars, delivered from September to December. In any case, they should already know how many chips are they receiving in their first batch, and what aprox. hashrate they are getting from them.

For example, we knew that Avalon was going to release 1,200 machines in three batches of 300; 600; 600. That's quite useful when planning this kind of investment, because you know the aprox. "competition" you will face due to your own supplier.


Maybe they are just going to hold onto some chips in case their competition keeps competing?

I can't see bitfury, vmc, bfl, etc. slowing down though, so I am thinking they will continue to sell throughout.
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jmaccoin
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July 18, 2013, 01:23:52 PM
 #3802


Well, KnC state that they also mine themselves:
https://www.kncminer.com/pages/faq

I get the impression that employees of KNC buy miners to mine themselves, but KNC isn't a mining company like Asicminer.
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July 18, 2013, 01:30:27 PM
 #3803


Everything is a tad too open and abstract. I'd prefer to know they are doing a batch of X Jupiters; X Saturns; X Mars, delivered from September to December. In any case, they should already know how many chips are they receiving in their first batch, and what aprox. hashrate they are getting from them.

For example, we knew that Avalon was going to release 1,200 machines in three batches of 300; 600; 600. That's quite useful when planning this kind of investment, because you know the aprox. "competition" you will face due to your own supplier.


Even if they did release the numbers, there are too many variables to predict the hash rate.  BFL, Bitfury, Avalon Chips, and ASICMiner are all unknowns.   I don't feel they need to release that info, but I can see why you would want it.  

What I feel is going to be very interesting is to see the effect of KNC's power efficient chips compared to Avalon and ASICMiner.  When KNC has fully released, will the other devices still be profitable?  Paying $7000 for an Avalon (or clone) will only take you so far.  [Not sure why anyone would buy a AsicMiner blade or USB at this point in time)

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July 18, 2013, 01:32:30 PM
 #3804


Everything is a tad too open and abstract. I'd prefer to know they are doing a batch of X Jupiters; X Saturns; X Mars, delivered from September to December. In any case, they should already know how many chips are they receiving in their first batch, and what aprox. hashrate they are getting from them.

For example, we knew that Avalon was going to release 1,200 machines in three batches of 300; 600; 600. That's quite useful when planning this kind of investment, because you know the aprox. "competition" you will face due to your own supplier.


Maybe they are just going to hold onto some chips in case their competition keeps competing?

I can't see bitfury, vmc, bfl, etc. slowing down though, so I am thinking they will continue to sell throughout.

They will slow down once the difficulty goes up. Because only the devices with the best $/GH ratio will make any sense. Although you never know, some people have more money than common sense I am told..
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July 18, 2013, 01:36:20 PM
 #3805

They will slow down once the difficulty goes up. Because only the devices with the best $/GH ratio will make any sense. Although you never know, some people have more money than common sense I am told..

I imagine prices will drop across the board as difficulty goes up.
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July 18, 2013, 01:40:36 PM
 #3806

[Not sure why anyone would buy a AsicMiner blade or USB at this point in time)

Maybe because as competition gets more intense, any tiny edge will seem larger relative to the tiny profits miners can eke out, so grabbing this last chance to pick up all the merged mined coins that the public pools fail to include in their merges might be worthwhile before pools that leave all that stuff on the table start losing all their miners due to miners no longer being able to afford to ignore a few percent or points of a percent here and there...

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July 18, 2013, 01:48:17 PM
 #3807

They will slow down once the difficulty goes up. Because only the devices with the best $/GH ratio will make any sense. Although you never know, some people have more money than common sense I am told..

I imagine prices will drop across the board as difficulty goes up.

That's correct, however a properly engineered product, using the latest technology and economies of scale (not to mention fabricated in a proper shop instead of someone's garage) should always offer a better deal/return. Once the difficulty goes up I think a lot of these mom & pop ASIC shops will close because they offer sub-par returns, worse customer service and are not as "future proof", if we can even talk about such a thing in this environment.
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July 18, 2013, 01:53:09 PM
 #3808

Right. Just place and order and paid through PayPal (after two weeks of deliberation and licking wounds after BFL).
So, KnC stands for "kennemar & cole" (stated on the PayPal receipt)

It is the same guys as
http://www.kennemarandcole.se/
Looks promising.

Also, after payment, I came back to KnC main page, but parts of it were in what appears to be Russian. Are they implementing multi-lingual support, which pops up when it should not?


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July 18, 2013, 02:16:45 PM
 #3809

got same email. plan makes sense give people chance to mine

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July 18, 2013, 02:25:06 PM
 #3810


Well, KnC state that they also mine themselves:
https://www.kncminer.com/pages/faq

I get the impression that employees of KNC buy miners to mine themselves, but KNC isn't a mining company like Asicminer.

The difference between owners/employees of KnC buying miners at cost and mining personally or KnC mining as a company isn't really relevant to us as customers. We have no idea how many units they'll use personally and we don't know how much of a hashrate they are targeting. To me the most relevant differences I see between AM mining and KnC mining is that AM is publicly traded and we know what AM's goals for network hashrate are.

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July 18, 2013, 02:28:20 PM
 #3811

Right. Just place and order and paid through PayPal (after two weeks of deliberation and licking wounds after BFL).
So, KnC stands for "kennemar & cole" (stated on the PayPal receipt)

It is the same guys as
http://www.kennemarandcole.se/
Looks promising.

Also, after payment, I came back to KnC main page, but parts of it were in what appears to be Russian. Are they implementing multi-lingual support, which pops up when it should not?


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Заказ номер XXXXXXXXXXXXXX успешно оплачен.
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The same thing happened to me when I made my preorder through paypal.  The payment posted to my knc account properly.  Just make sure in your order says "Paid (Payed) " at the top and your set.
OmegaNemesis28
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July 18, 2013, 02:30:11 PM
 #3812

Anyone also really enjoy the fact that they sent out a mass email about it? Rather than posting in some obscure web forum in the middle of a 100 page thread of rabble so that no one can find it?

I'm not one for donations but if you must go ahead and I will keep you in mind. =)
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jmaccoin
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July 18, 2013, 02:33:15 PM
 #3813


Well, KnC state that they also mine themselves:
https://www.kncminer.com/pages/faq

I get the impression that employees of KNC buy miners to mine themselves, but KNC isn't a mining company like Asicminer.

The difference between owners/employees of KnC buying miners at cost and mining personally or KnC mining as a company isn't really relevant to us as customers. We have no idea how many units they'll use personally and we don't know how much of a hashrate they are targeting. To me the most relevant differences I see between AM mining and KnC mining is that AM is publicly traded and we know what AM's goals for network hashrate are.

As I see it if they were mining as a company, they would have no incentive to price under roi. If employees buy at same prices as everyone else, they have incentive for bigger roi. Of course transparency is another question.

Edit: side note kind of off topic, but I was just looking at the order list page and it only comes to like $700,000 or about 40 th. I think that only a smallish percentage might be listed there.
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July 18, 2013, 03:11:34 PM
 #3814


Well, KnC state that they also mine themselves:
https://www.kncminer.com/pages/faq

I get the impression that employees of KNC buy miners to mine themselves, but KNC isn't a mining company like Asicminer.

The difference between owners/employees of KnC buying miners at cost and mining personally or KnC mining as a company isn't really relevant to us as customers. We have no idea how many units they'll use personally and we don't know how much of a hashrate they are targeting. To me the most relevant differences I see between AM mining and KnC mining is that AM is publicly traded and we know what AM's goals for network hashrate are.
Can't expect them to be able to say that yet. 

Suddenly, there looks like there is a going to be a healthy decentralized component to the network, what with bitfury's retail, Avalon's chips->DIY, and now, increasingly likely, BFL's chips->DIY, KnC's retail, and at an increasing snail's pace, BFL hardware.  Personally, I'm really pleased, and just a little surprised. 

The arc of those rollouts, whether moratoriums on shipping might happen or be honored, etc, are not known yet, and nobody can say anything accurately until then.
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July 18, 2013, 03:18:37 PM
 #3815


Well, KnC state that they also mine themselves:
https://www.kncminer.com/pages/faq

I get the impression that employees of KNC buy miners to mine themselves, but KNC isn't a mining company like Asicminer.

The difference between owners/employees of KnC buying miners at cost and mining personally or KnC mining as a company isn't really relevant to us as customers. We have no idea how many units they'll use personally and we don't know how much of a hashrate they are targeting. To me the most relevant differences I see between AM mining and KnC mining is that AM is publicly traded and we know what AM's goals for network hashrate are.

As I see it if they were mining as a company, they would have no incentive to price under roi. If employees buy at same prices as everyone else, they have incentive for bigger roi. Of course transparency is another question.

Edit: side note kind of off topic, but I was just looking at the order list page and it only comes to like $700,000 or about 40 th. I think that only a smallish percentage might be listed there.

I do not believe that KnC employees (owners) would pay anything more than cost for buying their own equipment. And the price doesn't really matter - to get specific, Sam could pay $1 or $1M for each Jupiter he purchases since he's a recipient of a share of the profits (or loss) from each sale made.

You are right, it's a matter of transparency and personally I doubt that KnC will share the exact number of units they'll be allocating to personal use vs selling - after all, they don't need to disclose this.

* Full disclosure - I don't have a problem with KnC mining with their own hardware. They were honest about it and we have to accept this or not purchase the equipment from them. I just don't see any point in suggesting that this is significantly different than AM or ActiveMiner or any other company that manufactures and mines with their own equipment.

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July 18, 2013, 03:20:16 PM
 #3816

New Mining Hardware Calculator from Genesis Block..

Is this correct?  Says my Saturn will earn me $16,800  ROI in 21 days..  Starting in Sept..   Shocked

http://thegenesisblock.com/tgb-launches-bitcoin-mining-dashboard/




Mining Payout Schedule
Display Currency

USD
Break Even Period:   21 days   Total Fixed Costs:   $3900
Max Profit:   $16,800 (Aug-14) - 430%   Monthly Power Costs:   $30.2
Month   Difficulty (MM)   Time per
Block (days)   Monthly Revenue   Monthly
Profit   Cumulative
Return
Sep-13   48   11.9   $5,600   $5,570   $1,670
Oct-13   64   16.0   $4,150   $4,120   $5,790
Nov-13   87   21.6   $3,070   $3,040   $8,830
Dec-13   117   29.2   $2,280   $2,250   $11,100
Jan-14   158   39.4   $1,690   $1,660   $12,700
Feb-14   214   53.1   $1,250   $1,220   $14,000
Mar-14   289   71.7   $925   $895   $14,800
Apr-14   390   96.8   $685   $655   $15,500
May-14   526   130.7   $508   $477   $16,000
Jun-14   710   176.5   $376   $346   $16,300
Jul-14   959   238.3   $279   $248   $16,600
Aug-14   1294   321.7   $206   $176   $16,800

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July 18, 2013, 03:21:46 PM
 #3817

How about KNCminer producing a die shot (image of its chip) increasing the likelihood they will ship devices September thru Novermber before claiming they will stop shipping December thru February?
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July 18, 2013, 03:26:11 PM
 #3818

Right. Just place and order and paid through PayPal (after two weeks of deliberation and licking wounds after BFL).
So, KnC stands for "kennemar & cole" (stated on the PayPal receipt)

It is the same guys as
http://www.kennemarandcole.se/
Looks promising.

Also, after payment, I came back to KnC main page, but parts of it were in what appears to be Russian. Are they implementing multi-lingual support, which pops up when it should not?


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The same thing happened to me when I made my preorder through paypal.  The payment posted to my knc account properly.  Just make sure in your order says "Paid (Payed) " at the top and your set.

Russian web cart software. This was explained aaaages back, they just have a preference for this software, but it gives a confirmation in Russian. All is cool though...

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July 18, 2013, 03:29:20 PM
 #3819

How about KNCminer producing a die shot (image of its chip) increasing the likelihood they will ship devices September thru Novermber before claiming they will stop shipping December thru February?

Unlikely, as they are going straight from chip manufacture, to production, also perhaps to retain competitive advantage. No doubt such a shot will surface in due course...

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July 18, 2013, 03:33:30 PM
 #3820


Asicminer will only ever have 20-25% of the hashrate.  Their hardware is in no way competition to KNC.

sorry I don't follow :p
How is a direct competitor selling the same product not competition exactly? Its like saying Sony and Microsoft don't compete for your cash.

They are selling a product that will never ROI because they are in the business of mining. They don't care if nobody buys their products, but if a sucker comes along and buys one for more than it will ever mine, then score for Asicminer, but can't call that competition.

This.

Knc's English isn't great but their logic is pretty spot on.

If others keep flooding the market in the winter months knc looks like they will sell upgrade modules upon upgrade modules to current customers as cheap as possible

They are not implying they will keep selling current offerings to new customers but lower upgrade prices so your Gh/$$ keeps ahead of the curve

So can people please stop nagging them with the little shit anymore? (pictures of chips,etc)

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