Haasonline Simple Trade Bot For BTCe and Bitstamp[Main topic]

[SmokedMolex]

I setup another test bot with the default settings on indicators and one custom indicator.

On the new bot I notice that the default indicators are very close to what's happening on the market.
So I am assuming that if I modify the indicator time frames then this messes the indicator up.

If I delete the indicator that is messed up and put it back it still doesn't correct the problem.
Is there a way to flush the settings?

Also can we store chart data local?  At present it's taking a whole day for a history to be established on MACD.
Caching that data would be a good idea I think.

[papasmurph]

Hello all,

I wanted to share some information with you as a comment or however you want to see that:

A bot is not a magic wand that avoids negative sells (losses).

When you set a bot to sell at a certain rule it will also do it backwards on downtrends. At the current market fluctuation (sidewards on all trading pairs over all exchanges ) it is very difficult to make some good trades at all.
Also of course you have to play and see which are good settings. don't expect nice trades right after start up or complications. sometimes its the API (cryptsy) and you have to send a email to support to reset it or sometimes is the bot which you have to restart in between, this happens when you change to much indicator settings during normal running. Sometimes maybe a bug your ISp, your homenetwork, your computer and so on

For this bot some basic settings that work very well:

PPO: 12/26 9 @ 1 or 2 minutes in combination with storch rsi 30/70 length 40-60 2 minutes
also you add very nice storch with the same settings to it.

MACD 23/43 with ROC

Further what is an good advantage is that you can define the indicators for buy/sell or none. so when one indicator hits good sell points just place it on sell/ buy or both etc. let it run for a while.

As a nice tool you can set many indicators and also the same indicators with different settings and un -m atch the buy/sell option. in this way you see as from Stephan described very nice after 1 or 2 days when the signals are triggered and you can compare them to the market price, tune them and activate them as indicator. this is a very nice option to fine tune your bot to your needs.
Sometimes the price falls and the bot is buying high and not selling no more. Just set the coin position to sold  and write down the price where the last buy was. Sell the coins later for a higher price once reached again while the bot keeps trading.

rule number 1, be patient (it can happen that the bot is not trading for 2 or 3 days , on some coins it will be maybe for a month if you don't either take losses or interfere. but one thing for sure, what goes up will go down and vice versa .

rule number 2, be patient, many coins are low now and will go up very high sooner or later

rule number 3, when you can't effort losses on trading then don't do it, this is like gambling, it can be tough to loose all coins, so build security and trade only small amounts

rule number 4: respect Stephan's work and support, there are more scammers out then everywhere else when it comes to bitcoin. So support him and pay your fee for what you expect to get delivered. I personally think he made one of the nicest bots compared to all others that are out there. Think just about the variety of option you have with no hazzle, no coding knowledge, just plug and play.
As he learns and progresses we have to learn how to use the tool and progress as well and name what we want to have implemented

I have posted some results earlier and with some readjustments as described above it was doing well same as posted. you want to make big profit you have to pay big money and do just one good trade without the bot .

This one is nice and slowly but steady is making gains. of course you have to watch it. the ultimate tool is not out there yet but this bot here is the most accurate and defined one yet. When someone has a better one name it and show proof of results.

@ Stephan: carry on your work, it is 100% and keep improving as you do.

thanks and happy trading to all of us.

[SmokedMolex]

Thanks Papasmurf,

I know what you are saying and I'm trying to be patient after getting no where.  But you said some things that just struck me the wrong way. Maybe I took it the wrong way, maybe I got it the way you meant it.

My biggest complaint is the interface redirecting me after I change a setting.  Every time I click something I may or may not get randomly redirected to some other screen in some other bot. And without much thought of having to scroll up to verify I am in the right bot, I change a setting, the timer fires, the trade gets made and I lose money because I changed the settings on a different bot.

Did I install the HTS wrong? Perhaps.  I had to guess about installing .Net4.5 just to get it to load. Administrator mode was fairly obvious after it refused to launch. Was there anything else I needed to do?  Don't know. No documentation on installing it.

Another example.

A little bit ago I changed the timer on MACD Histogram on LTC bot to 15 minutes.  After the page reloaded I found myself sitting halfway down the page on the BTC bot StochRSI page. WTF?  If I restart the server it seems to work ok for about 20 clicks before it loses its damned mind again.  Does it happen with just the timer?  Nope.  Add a new indicator and modify anything in it and you are back at the roulette tables when the page refreshes and you land on a new page and a completely different bot.  This cost me money because I wasn't paying attention to something I assumed would work, basic UI experience.

Is it possible that I am the only one experiencing this or do other people just tolerate it because it's the best thing out on the market?

And another...

Overcome Fees Cost.  What value is this?!  It sure isn't the same fee BTCe uses.  If you are going to hide something undocumented then put a label on the button so we know what it is.  I watch the software pass several nice sells/buys every day because it is not following the BTCe rates. The console just says "Did not overcome fee costs."  My calculator and position say quite the opposite.  Make the damn trade.

I'm not looking for massive profits every single moment nor on every trade. That's not my style anyway.  I am however looking for consistency. When I set a simple MACD-Histogram 12/26/9 trend rule 15/30 minute timer with StochRSI 14 20/80 then I expect the bot to follow this try to do the right thing as best it can. If it loses because I didn't close it soon enough then that's MY fault.  It just doesn't.  It just refuses to sell and then follows the trend down trying to buy everything it can.  If I put a safety on it then it never completes a trade, ever.  

Another feature is miscalculated purchase price and selling price.  When you tell the bot to buy 1 share it should know to either add more to the purchase price to cover the fees OR it should purchase 1 minus the fees and put that as your position.  It doesn't do this. Why?  Because if you are a single pip off on your position it will not trade because there is not enough on hand to complete the trade. I have to constantly monitor the buys and sells to make sure it's trading with the correct amount.   All or nothing just close the damn position!  If there isn't enough on hand, it should close your entire position anyway.  It's what I asked it to do.  Not get stuck in some nuance about fractions of a percent that costs major bucks.  And if you DO change your position manually....well get ready for that because it's Vegas time on whether the bot will close your position entirely in an uptrend.  I would say that 70% of my losses from this software come from configuring it while it's running after assuming I had done it right the Nth time.  A nice feature indeed.  

My whole point in purchasing this software was to free up some time that I have to sit near a console to make my trades the way I like to do it using the safe methods that I normally employ when trading by hand.  I'm not expecting SunGard or Citadel dark pools quality software from a small team of guys who are doing a good thing for the community. But the simple fact is this, I spend more time watching what the bot is doing or not doing while trying to avoid losing several hundred dollars than I do making all the trades myself, by hand and putting those hundreds back in my pocket.

I'm a programmer.  I understand what it takes to be committed to a product offering such as HTS. Each day I come back to see if something has been fixed.  It hasn't.  Just more upgrades to something that is, in my professional opinion, just not production ready.

I like seeing that it's being expanded. I'd be even more happy pausing all the new features and making the existing product solid and well documented.

Is that an unreasonable request or asking too much?  It takes a lot more time to code than it does to write out some simple text explaining how your features work to someone that's new to your product offering.  

Believe me when I tell you that I am trying to be patient.  I've configured, waited, entered positions, lost. Reconfigured, waited some more without entering a position. Waiting some more because it looked like it was working. It did.  Expanded the position in an uptrend and lost money by doing so.  It's just beyond ridiculous at this point.  Feature freeze the product and debug it.  No proper unit testing has been done on this.  I guarantee it.

Don't get me started on the new features that don't work like BTC China. I spent half a day trying to get a wallet status only to find out that it rarely works, if ever, because of API problems. So please please pleeeeease! For the love of God!  If it doesn't work then don't put it in your package.

And there is no way in hell an end user should have to contact a support department to reset an API because of flaky software.  I got better things to do than chase someone else's bugs down.  It was poor form that you even suggested it in their defense.

[krach]

" No documentation"
There is a lot of documention on the website.

You problem with the screens/ landing on different pages after you adjust something is strange. I have never seen or heard of it before. Have you tried the bot on another computer of yours or a windows vps and try to recreate the problem?

"
Overcome Fees Cost.  What value is this?!  It sure isn't the same fee BTCe uses.  If you are going to hide something undocumented then put a label on the button so we know what it is.  I watch the software pass several nice sells/buys every day because it is not following the BTCe rates. The console just says "Did not overcome fee costs."  My calculator and position say quite the opposite.  Make the damn trade."

In the past this was talked about but I am not 100% sure of the current value but I belive 0.4%. For buy & sell you dont need to overcome 0.2% but 0.4% due to two actions buy-sell, are you calculating 0.2% or 0.4%?

I agree with papasmurph

"
Also is there any planned support for other exchanges like mcxnow?"

There is voting on the haasbot page for the next supported exchange. Personly I dont like mcxnow and hope they go away, forever.

[smlu]

My biggest complaint is the interface redirecting me after I change a setting.  Every time I click something I may or may not get randomly redirected to some other screen in some other bot. And without much thought of having to scroll up to verify I am in the right bot, I change a setting, the timer fires, the trade gets made and I lose money because I changed the settings on a different bot.

Same here. And another thing, it would be really good if server could save bot configs and chart's data before it's shut-down/restarted. It happened to me twice now, when my computer crashed I lost all configurations.

Thx

[Demonxaian]

In the older version there used to be an option to do "Last buy and sell price reset (after sale)" Is this option lost in the new version? if not where is it located in the simple version? Or is it now an advanced version only? If it has been removed is it possible to put it back in the bot anytime soon?

Thanks in advance,
Demonxaian

[SmokedMolex]

Ok so I deleted all the bots and setting and started again from scratch.  It's busy queuing chart data.  I'll have to wait until tomorrow to try again.

[SmokedMolex]

In the older version there used to be an option to do "Last buy and sell price reset (after sale)" Is this option lost in the new version? if not where is it located in the simple version? Or is it now an advanced version only? If it has been removed is it possible to put it back in the bot anytime soon?

Thanks in advance,
Demonxaian

In the HTS there is a button on the configuration page to clear the last bought/sold and statistics data.  I'm not sure if it is a wholesale sweep or a triggered mechanism.  I've not gotten that far yet.

[SmokedMolex]

When setting the bots up on the server.

Is there a way to set the chart timer for the whole bot for default settings?

How does the logic behind the timers work?

For example I want a 15 minute chart in one bot because I am trading that period, 30 in the next and 60 in the other.

Should I set my MACD timer to reflect this or should I leave it at the default 1/2 minute timer?

Same thing with all other indicators?  Should their timers match the chart periods that you would like to trade?

If you use any charting software and you click on any time period you can automatically see every detail for that period and all indicators based on that time period.  All the timers and logica are set in the background for you.  Understanding how this works in HTS is key to understanding the building of bots that work.

Thanks.

[trubar]

FR: Alarm for trading bots that are not trading for X days. Alarm send an email to selected email address.

[papasmurph]

@ Smoked Molex:
lol I feel your frustration. I am sry. when you really have this funny complications as described. So far I can not confirm your issues and it seems that maybe something is fundamentally wrong with your installation of the bot or your computer. 

Again, I was critical as you way back and you can see my comments and complaints early this topic. However, as said my bot is trading profitable and I am not doing a defensive statement to HTS. I see what I see and that was trying all kind of bots out there by programming them myself and getting no favorable results. Further I always traded small amounts since I didn't want to loose the little I made or have in here.
Of course it is as you say Vegas time because the market is highly manipulated. Look just into the dip down of BTC/USD to 145 yesterday, guess why that is happening. Guess why BTC is currently so flatline that even a 23/43 2hr MACD can not handle buy low/sell high as it did in the past very nice. There are only a couple exchanges out and a couple trading platforms like cryptotrader. Guess what the people who own do in order to program their trading software and where they get all the codes from that their site has to avoid to happen?  Did you ever trade on BTCe with MT4, try to place an order and watch what the server is doing. Place an bot on MT4 and watch what the price is doing.
What do you think is does mean when the bold big numbers as BTC pop up and set their trades high and low as they want, yes that is the website owners trading software fooling the people into stupidiness. At the end either you are lucky with one big trade or you are patient with many small but make steady profit or you also can loose all.

If there would be the ultimate bot out there I wouldn't share it and further I would like to see the code the trading software is running on BTCe/MTGox and all of them.

No offense SmokedMolex but life is sometimes tough.  When you loose in a casino your money you wouldn't complain either or?

Happy trading and let us know when you have the perfect settings so we can try them out as well.

BTCe LTC USD
Exchange: BTCe
Currency: LtcUsd
Activated: True
Trade-amount: 2
Coin-position: Sold
Trades made: 5
Last profit: 0.8598 Usd
Total profit: 0.919798 Usd
Bot signal: Stay
Last buy price: 16.78 Usd
Last sell price: 17.2099 Usd

Cryptsy Dodge BTC
Exchange: Cryptsy
Currency: DogeBtc
Activated: True
Trade-amount: 30000
Coin-position: Sold
Trades made: 13
Last profit: 0.00540000 Btc
Total profit: 0.01500000 Btc
Bot signal: Stay
Last buy price: 0.00000214 Btc
Last sell price: 0.00000232 Btc

Cryptsy Dodge LTC
Exchange: Cryptsy
Currency: DogeLtc
Activated: True
Trade-amount: 30000
Coin-position: Sold
Trades made: 11
Last profit: 0.10410000 Ltc
Total profit: 0.33690000 Ltc

[SmokedMolex]

Trying again

[papasmurph]

SmokedMolex, I understand .
That is why we have this open forum discussions. As I say. It didn't do me bad yet so I am currently on the other side as you can see above.
Of course still far away from the money or so called BTC I spend for it to have my ROI.
I am tuning from here and have parallel same indicators with other settings running to see how the signals react. Once I find some suitable signals I try them. I didn't pay for the advanced version yet since I want to make the coins for being able to pay the other half BTC for it. Yes you are right it is a lot of coin for the software. However I assume that Stephan is trying best to provide updates and I hope for you that at least the software is doing what it is supposed to do. But face it , its trading right? 

When you go to Cryptotrader you pay as well 180 per 6 or 35 per month so for a year or 2 it will be same.
All the other open source software you need to have some programming skills and code the indicators by yourself. I tried so far about 8 different bots plus time to figure out how to command them and lost more coins then even trading manually.  I am not good in trading manually so the bot do me better then I to myself  lol

Yes you are right, the software needs some improvement.
Personally I liked the old interface and think that could have been adjusted with the options available now. I still use the old one but that is not sufficient at all. I couldn't make really positive trades with it.

Again set your limits low and try, I am certain the basic settings with one indicator Storch or PPO alone should do on uptrends some good moves already. Then step by step adjust to your needs. I have the bot installed on one of my mining rigs and only survey once a day with if needed some adjustments when it gets stuck and I am not patient cause I am scared that it will not reach the same position soon. Selfcontrol is needed

Btw. my LTC USD pair is moving good on 15min chart with no issues while the Cryptsy charts ares et between 1 and 3 minutes.

Keep in mind as well that one setting for one trading pair will 100% not work for another trading pair. the best APi connections I had with Cryptsy and BTCE. Cryptsy does plenty maintenance and cut of connections in between, I hope that will be solved soon.

[SmokedMolex]

Papasmurf,

Yes I understand what you are saying.

To be fair I will try settings as you have suggested to see how that works for me.

I really want this to work.  But so far it keeps failing for me.

I setup another bot with your settings on a 0.01 BTC account.

Thank you

[Jabbers]

my best addition to all this;

One setting that works in one market will not work in another when the market changes.  Looking at Bitcoin charts sometimes seems like just lines at times.  But there is something more to them.  They are patterns.  When learning how to use the bot it is about learning how to use the indicators.  When and which ones to use for what the market conditions are.  I'm no wizard at this.  A good trader is someone who can see behind all these numbers & Indicators

-learn how the bot program works
-learn what the indicators do (the important one) 
 come up with a learning strategy.  .01 bitcoin account is good at this.  Work with one indicator and fully understand how it reacts with price
 movements.
-have a collection of strategies that work in different markets.  Spot a market then employ your strategy.  There are all kind of markets but i think there are 3 main ones.  Up, sideways, and down.  (Notice I am just a novice.  I'm still all new to this stuff)  Thats when you graduate and become successful trader.

 
My trading have been put on hold till Steph finishes up with his back-testing.  I too am on the side of 'No new features to spend more time polishing program up'  It will take us years to master the tools he's given  us.

A side question;
How did everyone do on Sunday's Flash crash?  I been out of the market with my coins in my computer.  I slept through it so missed it completely.  Pretty amazing.  Wish I caught just half of that crash 

I have faith in me learning how to trade.  My first coin I brought I am very happy how it happened.

[JuAnAuJ69]

Stephan, I have been following your work for a while and have been a customer for some months. But this new update, even though it has tons of potential, I think is just not cooked yet...

- You can't have a trading tool without powerful backtesting (not hours, but days, weeks, months!). Backtesting is how you streamline your indicators and how you find the power of combining them. What happened last hour or two is just not enough data to create powerful bots!
- You can't have a web interface with graphics that won't even load 90% of the time.
- You can't have settings that, once saved, go back to the default position. That is confusing as hell.
- You can't make the navigation difficult. Right now the hiding menu and the constant clicking and saving is just not very useful.

I think there is HUGE potential in this tool, It's a leap forward from the previous trader. But I would strongly recommend you to stop and make it really useful before you do any new indicators, features, exchanges or anything. Only through strong usability you can really unlock the potential of your tool.

Thanks,

[toxick]

Long time lurker, first post blah blah..

This bot has been my largest cryptocurrency purchase to date and to be frank, so far it's been a waste of money. I've been using the simple trading bot for quite a while. Never really could make consistent profits and the software itself had lots of quirks. However, I was getting to know my way around the software and was willing to put up with it as I believed things would get sorted over time.

However development on that has now more or less stopped and we're onto the trading server. Well tbh I find it unusable. The UI is an absolute nightmare to navigate around. So much so that I've given up using it. I paid for the 0.05 upgrade but I would imagine anyone paying 0.45btc for it, is going to be very very disappointed. It is in no way ready to be released.

I also would like to echo what's being said.. Please stop adding things before the basics are fixed. However some sort of benchmarking tool is absolutely necessary, bots pretty useless without it. I understand your working on this but this 'autotune' feature again sounds overly complicated. I honestly wish you had stuck to the simple trading bot and just made that as rock solid as possible.

I appreciate your hard work on this but remember people are paying a lot of money for this bot and do expect a reasonable product.

[dddbtc]

I have created a new section on my website where i sell the APIs which i use to power this bot. Those APIs are available in open-source (for developers) against a little price. This will enable everybody to build i bot like i did. I did not release the main source of the simple bot yet, just to be on the safe. But it will be released later on.

I am very interested in licensing/purchasing the API and documentation used in this bot.  It would really streamline the development process of a project I am working on.

Thanks!

[bx8389]

Long time lurker, first post blah blah..

I also would like to echo what's being said.. Please stop adding things before the basics are fixed. However some sort of benchmarking tool is absolutely necessary, bots pretty useless without it. I understand your working on this but this 'autotune' feature again sounds overly complicated. I honestly wish you had stuck to the simple trading bot and just made that as rock solid as possible.

I appreciate your hard work on this but remember people are paying a lot of money for this bot and do expect a reasonable product.

I agree ( and most of people ) that this bot seems to have a high potential and have some nice features. But this bot have some reability problems and looking before i was unable to maintain it working more than 2-3 day without surprises. Last 2 days my STB was frozen in the middle of cryptocrisis without warning and gave a exception when try to operate it. Before i have the "best before 31 january 2014" problem good for yougurt but bad for software. Today won't start on bitstamp only btc-e. And so on.
I don't plan to expend more on STB upgrade not because i haven't got ROI (Market is bearish)  but mainly because if older STB have reability issues after months of development and fine tunning what is expected about and much more complex new piece software ?

Regards

[orac69]

@toxick

+1

No matter what settings I have tried over the last 3 months, different indicators, different combinations, different time periods the bot always buys high and sells low, and exits positions way too early. 

Ive consistently lost money/coins.   Frustrated   

I hate the web interface also.  Waaaaay too "clicky" for my tastes & everything is hidden away under more and more buttons.   All work does seem to have stopped on the old one which im disappointed about.