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Hunterbunter
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September 07, 2014, 09:01:27 AM |
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well smart money is all accumulating right now as you should be, so as price rises developers will come in and do a design for a bounty. That is the core benefit of devcoin over any other alt coin.
Agreed... Im just trying to liven up this topic with some discussion. You know i read somethign very obvious but clever on bitsharestalk today. "...if nobody use it , it means nothing...." So true.... I think the website's main problem is the huge amount of green everywhere (it's a very strong green on a 1920+ screen!), and general lack of images, but I think it's quite technically sound. It's not immediately obvious what we do from a cursory glance, which could be improved. It looks like it's been optimized for small screens, so looks very small on big ones. Hypersire is our web admin, so if we have any changes in mind that could make a big impact he's the one in charge of that. There's a list of current admins here for anyone curious: http://www.devtome.com/doku.php?id=devcoin_human_resourcesI for one would like to see more foreground and less background. Images I'm a bit lost with though, I don't know what would look good, or if they'd even help. Devcoin was the first bitcoin 2.0  the it should have much more value than any other altcoin. any new plan of the dvc? long time away from dvc. @ marcoman22: Devcoins were one of the first inflation coins, if not the first. Its low price doesn't mean it's not valuable. @ NOjust: Yep, lots of plans being put in motion: http://www.devtome.com/doku.php?id=devcoin_division_proposal just announced last week, which has big changes to the way shares are being earned. It should mean less coins to market (40% drop once implemented), market support from a community fund, more OS development in general, plus a couple other things. |
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notabot
Member
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Activity: 99
Merit: 10
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September 08, 2014, 11:48:38 AM |
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The structural changes coming to devcoin in Round 43 should align devcoin with its core intention - to support Open Source development. There will certainly be a rebalancing of work segments - Open Source work and Creative Commons writing, but the momentum of the changes should leverage internal and external opinion favorably. It will be interesting to see how it plays out, and I say that as a writer going to get less coins. But supply and demand - if a % is withheld, supply is less. Now the goal should be to increase demand.
But why stop there - the website has been mentioned a few times; it's not as flash as some of the other crypto website portals, so perhaps a makeover, in conjunction with the share distibution changes, could place devcoin in a new light. Perhaps we could make a visible change - new colors, new logo also? A lot of exchanges use the yellow devcoin logo (designed by Icoin IIRC). Or a logo design contest?
Could the amount of coins provided to faucets be temporarily increased for Round 44, to boost awareness of the structural changes? Allowing them to dispense a larger minimum amount of coins for thsi period.
Throw in some PR and we could be in a good position to gain some momentum.
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serejandmyself
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September 08, 2014, 12:20:29 PM |
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The structural changes coming to devcoin in Round 43 should align devcoin with its core intention - to support Open Source development. There will certainly be a rebalancing of work segments - Open Source work and Creative Commons writing, but the momentum of the changes should leverage internal and external opinion favorably. It will be interesting to see how it plays out, and I say that as a writer going to get less coins. But supply and demand - if a % is withheld, supply is less. Now the goal should be to increase demand.
But why stop there - the website has been mentioned a few times; it's not as flash as some of the other crypto website portals, so perhaps a makeover, in conjunction with the share distibution changes, could place devcoin in a new light. Perhaps we could make a visible change - new colors, new logo also? A lot of exchanges use the yellow devcoin logo (designed by Icoin IIRC). Or a logo design contest?
Could the amount of coins provided to faucets be temporarily increased for Round 44, to boost awareness of the structural changes? Allowing them to dispense a larger minimum amount of coins for thsi period.
Throw in some PR and we could be in a good position to gain some momentum.
+ 100 % As a trader i can say that devcoin is one of the few coins/assets im holding (it was my first ever coin that i bought - obvously through btc - but i bought btc to buy dvc). I really firmly believe in it. And as it was said in this discussion devcoin has its purpose, its obvious. And in 3-5 years (!) time we will see a lot of devs turning to it. The thing that the above psot is right about, is that every thing needs a momentum every now and again. And to just put it in a dark corner (ok im over exadurating a bit) is not the goal. So im up for rebrending with everything i can help with/ Unfortuntaly im not a techhi but i can certainly help with anything that is to do with translating into russian and pr in the russain community. |
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smeagol
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Merit: 1005
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September 08, 2014, 07:29:05 PM |
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I can do the website, if Hypersire is not available.
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serejandmyself
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September 08, 2014, 07:58:02 PM |
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I can do the website, if Hypersire is not available.
Cool! Im up for translating the website. All i need is the text of the new website |
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weisoq
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September 09, 2014, 09:02:05 AM |
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Fair enough then on the website, constructive criticism is a good thing. As HB said I think it was optimised for mobiles and smaller screens. Some changes in line with coming adjustments might be good, although I don't really see what could be added until new projects/structural aspects are implemented. Don't see the point of a logo competition as we had one before to design the current imaging.
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serejandmyself
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September 09, 2014, 10:51:29 AM |
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Fair enough then on the website, constructive criticism is a good thing. As HB said I think it was optimised for mobiles and smaller screens. Some changes in line with coming adjustments might be good, although I don't really see what could be added until new projects/structural aspects are implemented. Don't see the point of a logo competition as we had one before to design the current imaging.
Weisoq, if im not mistaken youre in devcoin long time ago. I have a very interesting idea for devcoin that could 1)implement the purpose of devcoin 2)put the devcoin acknowlgemnt and markep cap up 3)put the price up . But i dont want to speak about it on here, i at first would like to present it in pm to the devcoin development core team and then if it seems intersting to put it up here for people to discuss. The question is how do i contact and who? |
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Hunterbunter
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September 09, 2014, 12:58:20 PM |
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Ok I think we could make a bounty or two around a website update, it's a positive experiment - the current page is acceptable, but if a better one comes along that has a wider appeal, we'd be silly not to use it. A good looking, well filled out html5-ish website that looks sexy is great for PR/morale. Dev's should be more than used to the idea of iterative design (common programming principle), and it's a good practice to have for the devcoin project in general. It's the best way to use limited resources for complex projects.
One thing this highlights is our general problem of selecting dev tasks that depend on things like aesthetics. Programmers are typically a functional bunch, and UI/UX tends to take second place. A voting system would be good, but progress kind of died on voting-bounty engine ideas a few months ago. We still quite badly need some good solutions to be developed, especially for things that largely depend on wider appeal, so maybe we can bump that up the priority list once we get developers interested again. We want to create a place where the different disciplines can meet and play (collaborate), and a good bounty engine will allow that.
In any case, since we have to do without for now, let's try something new. I'd like three people to be the judges of the new website design. There will be a deadline for 2-3 page mockups (photoshop, ms paint, whatever, people may be able to use templates they've purchased, but I'm not sure if there are license ramifications for that, so check that first), and the judges have to decide if that submission meets the criteria they set for the new site. If no mockups are satisfactory to the judges, the original stays, and another deadline will be set for new mockups. The judges are picking which mockup to proceed with. If a designer can do a good mockup, but can't do the site itself, they should still do the mockup and say they'll need help with the site in their submission, and someone will be able to help for a share of the bounty (usually split by time spent, but that's up to the people involved).
The judges should be confident they know what a good UI/UX is - self-proclaimed is fine. I'm happy to put my 2 dvc in, but I don't want to be a final judge of this - I'd prefer to include more people in the decision making going forward. Of course, judges can't submit a design, but that shouldn't surprise anyone. If you want to judge this competition, have no intention of putting a design in but know in your heart of hearts what makes a page shine, post in this thread that you'd like to judge. The first three people in good standing with the community will get the task. Good standing is anyone who has ever earned a share, or a non share-earner (eg investor, but you don't have to prove it) who has actively discussed improvements here or elsewhere and has no legitimate objection from other admins or share earners.
The judges must decide on a list of criteria for the competition (including whether or not to allow logo-redesigns, considering the impact it'll have across all our websites and client), and once that's clear I'll suggest a bounty amount. If everyone agrees on that and the deadline, then mockup submissions are go. Once the deadline has passed, the judges will have a week to decide on a winner, and it's solely up to them how they decide it (eg: unison vote, vote for 3 designs and highest count wins, 1 vote each, as some suggestions). If a winner is picked, that designer has as much time as they need to rejuvenate the website with/without aid, and they'll get the shares once all the criteria are satisfied. If the criteria the judges set are extensive, this can be a tiered bounty with milestone rewards.
How does that sound? Anything that should be changed?
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serejandmyself
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September 09, 2014, 01:21:55 PM |
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Ok I think we could make a bounty or two around a website update, it's a positive experiment - the current page is acceptable, but if a better one comes along that has a wider appeal, we'd be silly not to use it. A good looking, well filled out html5-ish website that looks sexy is great for PR/morale. Dev's should be more than used to the idea of iterative design (common programming principle), and it's a good practice to have for the devcoin project in general. It's the best way to use limited resources for complex projects.
One thing this highlights is our general problem of selecting dev tasks that depend on things like aesthetics. Programmers are typically a functional bunch, and UI/UX tends to take second place. A voting system would be good, but progress kind of died on voting-bounty engine ideas a few months ago. We still quite badly need some good solutions to be developed, especially for things that largely depend on wider appeal, so maybe we can bump that up the priority list once we get developers interested again. We want to create a place where the different disciplines can meet and play (collaborate), and a good bounty engine will allow that.
In any case, since we have to do without for now, let's try something new. I'd like three people to be the judges of the new website design. There will be a deadline for 2-3 page mockups (photoshop, ms paint, whatever, people may be able to use templates they've purchased, but I'm not sure if there are license ramifications for that, so check that first), and the judges have to decide if that submission meets the criteria they set for the new site. If no mockups are satisfactory to the judges, the original stays, and another deadline will be set for new mockups. The judges are picking which mockup to proceed with. If a designer can do a good mockup, but can't do the site itself, they should still do the mockup and say they'll need help with the site in their submission, and someone will be able to help for a share of the bounty (usually split by time spent, but that's up to the people involved).
The judges should be confident they know what a good UI/UX is - self-proclaimed is fine. I'm happy to put my 2 dvc in, but I don't want to be a final judge of this - I'd prefer to include more people in the decision making going forward. Of course, judges can't submit a design, but that shouldn't surprise anyone. If you want to judge this competition, have no intention of putting a design in but know in your heart of hearts what makes a page shine, post in this thread that you'd like to judge. The first three people in good standing with the community will get the task. Good standing is anyone who has ever earned a share, or a non share-earner (eg investor, but you don't have to prove it) who has actively discussed improvements here or elsewhere and has no legitimate objection from other admins or share earners.
The judges must decide on a list of criteria for the competition (including whether or not to allow logo-redesigns, considering the impact it'll have across all our websites and client), and once that's clear I'll suggest a bounty amount. If everyone agrees on that and the deadline, then mockup submissions are go. Once the deadline has passed, the judges will have a week to decide on a winner, and it's solely up to them how they decide it (eg: unison vote, vote for 3 designs and highest count wins, 1 vote each, as some suggestions). If a winner is picked, that designer has as much time as they need to rejuvenate the website with/without aid, and they'll get the shares once all the criteria are satisfied. If the criteria the judges set are extensive, this can be a tiered bounty with milestone rewards.
How does that sound? Anything that should be changed?
Sounds good - i can offer to judge if its ok The criteria in my opinion, should be as follows, Modern, Considers devcoin colors and design, Should be interactive, Easy to read, Understandable, Include info (faq) about basics of devcoin in an easy reach Load quickly Not heavy on the eye |
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weisoq
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September 09, 2014, 01:25:11 PM |
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Weisoq, if im not mistaken youre in devcoin long time ago. I have a very interesting idea for devcoin that could 1)implement the purpose of devcoin 2)put the devcoin acknowlgemnt and markep cap up 3)put the price up . But i dont want to speak about it on here, i at first would like to present it in pm to the devcoin development core team and then if it seems intersting to put it up here for people to discuss. The question is how do i contact and who?
A while, but not as long as many others. Things are in a bit of a transition at the moment, in terms of people and focus also aiming to achieve some of what you say. But the more ideas the better. Until everything's settled into place I guess hunterbunter is the guy to msg on big-picture ideas (he can say if I'm wrong on that). On the website, I'm all for iterative progress - trial, error, improvement, progress - that's sort of devcoin's entire thing imo. And an multi-step update process is a good way to involve multiple interests/skills (art, marketing, design, development). It might be nice to do it in train with hypersire though, who ofered and built the current himself for free, or at least give him a heads up in case he has his own thoughts? That doesn't mean any limit to completely new ideas or updated aesthetics on current, only that it seems to make sense to involve the current website admin and developer in any prospective changes. But I'm not a web developer so again someone can tell me if I'm wrong on that basic outlook on how these things get done. ------- Does anyone know why this thread keeps being moved to the announcement sub forum? I got it moved back last time it happened, but getting annoying as I think devcoin really has only the best of intentions and focus. |
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serejandmyself
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September 09, 2014, 01:48:59 PM |
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Weisoq, if im not mistaken youre in devcoin long time ago. I have a very interesting idea for devcoin that could 1)implement the purpose of devcoin 2)put the devcoin acknowlgemnt and markep cap up 3)put the price up . But i dont want to speak about it on here, i at first would like to present it in pm to the devcoin development core team and then if it seems intersting to put it up here for people to discuss. The question is how do i contact and who?
A while, but not as long as many others. Things are in a bit of a transition at the moment, in terms of people and focus also aiming to achieve some of what you say. But the more ideas the better. Until everything's settled into place I guess hunterbunter is the guy to msg on big-picture ideas (he can say if I'm wrong on that). On the website, I'm all for iterative progress - trial, error, improvement, progress - that's sort of devcoin's entire thing imo. And an multi-step update process is a good way to involve multiple interests/skills (art, marketing, design, development). It might be nice to do it in train with hypersire though, who ofered and built the current himself for free, or at least give him a heads up in case he has his own thoughts? That doesn't mean any limit to completely new ideas or updated aesthetics on current, only that it seems to make sense to involve the current website admin and developer in any prospective changes. But I'm not a web developer so again someone can tell me if I'm wrong on that basic outlook on how these things get done. ------- Does anyone know why this thread keeps being moved to the announcement sub forum? I got it moved back last time it happened, but getting annoying as I think devcoin really has only the best of intentions and focus. PMd him ))) as for the thread - where should it be? Arent all altcoin threads are here? |
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Papacrusher
Member
Offline
Activity: 218
Merit: 10
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September 09, 2014, 02:28:02 PM |
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I support updating the website and I think that having a three person judging panel is an excellent idea for getting different perspectives. It is my opinion that since DVC was founded with developers and OS in mind, it is imperative that the website be the most engaging, aesthetically pleasing site out there. Unfortunately too many people out there unfairly equate OS with "second-rate" and this is a chance to debunk that myth.
Papa
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serejandmyself
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September 09, 2014, 03:27:00 PM |
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I support updating the website and I think that having a three person judging panel is an excellent idea for getting different perspectives. It is my opinion that since DVC was founded with developers and OS in mind, it is imperative that the website be the most engaging, aesthetically pleasing site out there.
absolutly! |
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Hunterbunter
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September 09, 2014, 03:46:54 PM |
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On the website, I'm all for iterative progress - trial, error, improvement, progress - that's sort of devcoin's entire thing imo. And an multi-step update process is a good way to involve multiple interests/skills (art, marketing, design, development). It might be nice to do it in train with hypersire though, who ofered and built the current himself for free, or at least give him a heads up in case he has his own thoughts? That doesn't mean any limit to completely new ideas or updated aesthetics on current, only that it seems to make sense to involve the current website admin and developer in any prospective changes. But I'm not a web developer so again someone can tell me if I'm wrong on that basic outlook on how these things get done.
By all means he should get a heads up, but one thing I don't want to happen is for people to get overly attached to the creations they give over to the collective fold. If someone comes along with a better dvccountdown (not difficult, I promise you), I will be happy that someone took that further...it's the OS way, and personally, even validates my work more than shares do. Much of the content on the current devcoin site can, and should, be reused, plus the improvements, but ultimately giving people complete freedom allows the most creative and innovative solutions to appear. I thought Hypersire got bounty shares for the initial site, but I could be mistaken. If he's happy to continue web admin, then great, he can still maintain the website that's there, but also has a chance to submit ideas in a mockup design. He would also be a prime candidate for designers to seek to split bounties with if their design is picked. One of the recognizable downsides of the bounty system is that they are discrete - usually winner takes all, and I don't really know what a good solution to that is without consolation prizes, which bring their own problems. As long as the reward outweighs the risk (of not being picked/winner), people should still decide to submit. 99designs works this way (crowd-funded design work, usually winner takes all), and doesn't seem short on designers...I think what makes it work is the smaller risk at the start - ie quick mockups that quickly eliminate things going completely down the wrong path, so less time overall is wasted. The judge idea is loosely related to this system. I know hyper's still responsive to pms, but I'm not sure if he's watching the thread atm. Sounds good - i can offer to judge if its ok
The criteria in my opinion, should be as follows,
Modern,
Considers devcoin colors and design,
Should be interactive,
Easy to read,
Understandable,
Include info (faq) about basics of devcoin in an easy reach
Load quickly
Not heavy on the eye
Great, I'll put you as the first judge then. Regarding criteria, once the other two judges make themselves known you three can figure these out amongst yourselves and present the final criteria. You can do many-recipient messages in bitcointalk pretty easily, or any other chat you find convenient. If any issues come up with the panel I'll aide you guys in reaching a resolution. I don't to make this too formal, but just saying because you never know  . |
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weisoq
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September 09, 2014, 05:32:11 PM
Last edit: September 09, 2014, 06:39:52 PM by weisoq |
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By all means he should get a heads up, but one thing I don't want to happen is for people to get overly attached to the creations they give over to the collective fold...I know hyper's still responsive to pms, but I'm not sure if he's watching the thread atm. Completely agree. The heads up is all I meant as also don't see him about much. You might be right about bounties, was originally started as pro bono but I don't remember now. serejandmyself: No I think most alt threads are just under 'Alternate cryptocurrencies'. I have this one bookmarked but it's now in a subforum called 'Announcements' that I never browse, and I guess many others don't either. So it doesn't help for visibility. |
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Hunterbunter
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September 12, 2014, 10:33:22 AM |
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Come on everyone, don't be shy, I was expecting more participation than this. We need 2 more judges for the website revamp competition, easy job, no pressure, serejandmyself and myself (and myself) will do all the coordination, you just have to turn up. If it even slightly takes your fancy put your hand up! You get to crush people's dreams!!
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Papacrusher
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Activity: 218
Merit: 10
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September 12, 2014, 12:15:10 PM |
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Come on everyone, don't be shy, I was expecting more participation than this. We need 2 more judges for the website revamp competition, easy job, no pressure, serejandmyself and myself (and myself) will do all the coordination, you just have to turn up. If it even slightly takes your fancy put your hand up! You get to crush people's dreams!!
I would be happy to, but I do not feel I have the technical skill set to judge other people's work in this area. Maybe we should post this on Coinzen as well. Papa |
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ranlo
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1974
Merit: 1007
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September 12, 2014, 01:24:42 PM |
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Come on everyone, don't be shy, I was expecting more participation than this. We need 2 more judges for the website revamp competition, easy job, no pressure, serejandmyself and myself (and myself) will do all the coordination, you just have to turn up. If it even slightly takes your fancy put your hand up! You get to crush people's dreams!!
I'll help judge. |
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Hunterbunter
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September 13, 2014, 08:54:07 AM |
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I would be happy to, but I do not feel I have the technical skill set to judge other people's work in this area. Maybe we should post this on Coinzen as well.
Papa
That's ok, it's about aesthetics as much as technical ability in this particular case. Unless there are no specific objections, you're the second judge. Come on everyone, don't be shy, I was expecting more participation than this. We need 2 more judges for the website revamp competition, easy job, no pressure, serejandmyself and myself (and myself) will do all the coordination, you just have to turn up. If it even slightly takes your fancy put your hand up! You get to crush people's dreams!!
I'll help judge. Great, thanks ranlo. So we have our three judges: serejandmyself, papacrusher and ranlo. Since serejandmyself was the instigator and first judge, he'll be the coordinator. Are you ok with that serej? What you need to do next is come up with a list of criteria for what you want the site to be, and they don't have to just be technical criteria. Aesthetic criteria are important too - how should it look, other sites comparable, etc. You can be specific, or airey fairy, its up to you, although the more specific you are, the better for designers. You can discuss that here or in pms (you can do a 3-way chat pretty easily on the forum), and once you have a list you're satisfied with, which you think reasonable for a designer, post it here and we'll give it a bounty and deadline for mockups. What does everyone think about share awards for designs? I'm thinking it might encourage more actual submissions, so if there's a general consensus, I'll propose 1 winning design award of 6 shares, and 2 consolation awards of 3 shares each, for designs the judges like but don't pick. Those consolation awards don't have to be given out, they're only there to reward a good design that didn't win. The full site bounty will then be assessed and proposed based on the estimated time to complete it, and only awarded upon completion. The unique thing about this bounty, is that the designer will have exclusive rights to work on the bounty as proposed, for a period of time we set once we estimate how long it'll take, and then it'll be open to all (to implement the winning design). If no designs are submitted before the design deadline, we will double the design awards and set another one. How does that sound? Any changes? |
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