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Author Topic: HashFast announces specs for new ASIC: 400GH/s  (Read 865317 times)
dexX7
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October 29, 2013, 03:35:23 PM
 #2061

No refunds in any case.

From https://hashfast.com/checkout/terms-of-sale:

Quote
3. DELIVERY AND QUANTITIES.
(a) Guaranteed Baby Jet Delivery Dates – Batch 1. All of the 550 Baby Jet units from Hashfast’s first production batch are guaranteed for delivery by December 31, 2013. If Buyer ordered one or more units of such Baby Jets, and Hashfast does not deliver such units by that date, then Buyer may cancel the undelivered portion of the order at Buyer’s request and Hashfast will refund the payment for the units that Buyer purchased but did not receive and cancelled. This cancellation and refund is Buyer’s sole and exclusive remedy for Hashfast failing to deliver by the December 31, 2013 guaranteed delivery date. To avail itself of this remedy, Buyer must cancel the order before such unit(s) are delivered by Hashfast, and in any case before March 31, 2014.*

(b) Guaranteed Baby Jet Delivery Dates – Batch 2. All of the 550 Baby Jet units from Hashfast’s second production batch are guaranteed for delivery by February 28, 2014. ... This cancellation and refund is Buyer’s sole and exclusive remedy for Hashfast failing to deliver by the February 28, 2014 guaranteed delivery date. To avail itself of this remedy, Buyer must cancel the order before such unit(s) are delivered by Hashfast, and in any case before May 28, 2014.

(c) Guaranteed Sierra Delivery Dates – Batch 2. All Sierra units from Hashfast’s second production batch are guaranteed for delivery by January 31, 2014. ... This cancellation and refund is Buyer’s sole and exclusive remedy for Hashfast failing to deliver by the January 31, 2014 guaranteed delivery date. To avail itself of this remedy, Buyer must cancel the order before such unit(s) are delivered by Hashfast, and in any case before April 4, 2014.

*For whatever reason it seems that this was initially "... by the December 31, 2013 guaranteed delivery date, and Buyer must cancel the order by January 15, 2014 to avail itself of this remedy. Buyer to pay all taxes, duties and shipping costs." after order completion.

It was stated earlier that the explicit listing of delivery dates is HashFast's "out-of-jail" card, so to speak.

But back to the quote: even if would need to refund batch one, there are still two more months to fill batch two purchases, so I think "no refunds in any case" is slightly off.

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October 29, 2013, 03:44:51 PM
 #2062

But back to the quote: even if would need to refund batch one, there are still two more months to fill batch two purchases, so I think "no refunds in any case" is slightly off.

Riddle me this: Can a bankrupted company give refunds? If no, than they have to deliver before Dec 31st => no refunds. If they manage to deliver batch #1 they will most probably deliver batch #2 also => no refunds.
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October 29, 2013, 07:39:40 PM
 #2063

Riddle me this: Can a bankrupted company give refunds? If no, than they have to deliver before Dec 31st => no refunds. If they manage to deliver batch #1 they will most probably deliver batch #2 also => no refunds.

This could buy more time to accumulate fresh, new funds.. but let's not get all too crazy. What's your reason to believe HF is unable to ship before Dec 31 anyway? Smiley

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October 29, 2013, 07:43:30 PM
 #2064

Cedivad, look at my history of posts - I'm in no way associated with HashFast (as a shill or a customer), yet I still believe Perozoso's  point is valid.

Another thing:
2) just after the delay, people realised that the delay will cost them 75%+ of their investment.
The delay is about three weeks (20-30 Oct to middle Nov). Let's say it is a whole month - you are going to lose mining in November. It would be around 12 BTC or less.
Is 12 BTC equal to 75%+ of the investment?
I estimate 400 GH/s machine to earn up to 35 BTC between Dec 2013 and the end of 2014, and then still earn more (not hosted, with 0.15 $/kWh electricity).
Even if my estimates are wrong, add MPP to that. You won't lose (at least in USD).

My conclusions: Don't use TGB calculator and don't exaggerate. This delay is nothing. More dangerous would be delaying two or three months, but then MPP or refunds would kick in.
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October 29, 2013, 07:46:34 PM
 #2065

Cedivad, look at my history of posts - I'm in no way associated with HashFast (as a shill or a customer), yet I still believe Perozoso's  point is valid.

Another thing:
2) just after the delay, people realised that the delay will cost them 75%+ of their investment.
The delay is about three weeks (20-30 Oct to middle Nov). Let's say it is a whole month - you are going to lose mining in November. It would be around 12 BTC or less.
Is 12 BTC equal to 75%+ of the investment?
I estimate 400 GH/s machine to earn up to 35 BTC between Dec 2013 and the end of 2014, and then still earn more (not hosted, with 0.15 $/kWh electricity).
Even if my estimates are wrong, add MPP to that. You won't lose (at least in USD).

My conclusions: Don't use TGB calculator and don't exaggerate. This delay is nothing. More dangerous would be delaying two or three months, but then MPP or refunds would kick in.

Also estimate rather 500 GH instead of 400. They already hinted that peformance will be higher.
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October 29, 2013, 07:49:09 PM
 #2066

This delay is 3 difficult adjustments in the best case (the mid november deadline will be heavily missed imo, we have yet to see pics of everything). This is why, with this delay, i call these machines worthless. (1*1.5^3 more hashrate at the beginning). Your extrapolations are different, that's all.
I'm sorry that you had to begin your posts with a suggestion to look at your post history. Please accept my apologies.

My anger against what is wrong in the Bitcoin community is productive:
Bitcointa.lk - Replace "Bitcointalk.org" with "Bitcointa.lk" in this url to see how this page looks like on a proper forum (Announcement Thread)
Hashfast.org - Wiki for screwed customers
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October 29, 2013, 07:51:16 PM
 #2067

Also estimate rather 500 GH instead of 400. They already hinted that performance will be higher.
I prefer to be pessimistic in estimates.
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October 29, 2013, 08:31:42 PM
 #2068

TACOTIME;

Can you get me an answer to these questions on the sierra case?
1.  What are the case dimensions (l x w x h)?  I am NOT looking for "it's a standard 4U case", need dimensions.
2.   On the mounting flanges, what is the diameter of the holes and what is the center to center distance across the face?   I am assuming from the pictures that are now out that they are going with holes.


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October 29, 2013, 08:44:40 PM
 #2069

This delay is 3 difficult adjustments in the best case (the mid november deadline will be heavily missed imo, we have yet to see pics of everything). This is why, with this delay, i call these machines worthless. (1*1.5^3 more hashrate at the beginning). Your extrapolations are different, that's all.
I'm sorry that you had to begin your posts with a suggestion to look at your post history. Please accept my apologies.

2 weeks is not 3 difficulty adjustments, its barely more than one. Difficulty adjustments are also not 50% (yet) and particularly the upcoming one is likely relatively modest; KnC is done shipping, the rest isnt ready yet, so you will only get some BFLs and Bitfury's being added to the network. Honestly, if a 2 week delay wasnt factored in to your purchase decision, you should never have  bought; Ive had shipments at customs for longer than that. And that would be a lot worse than when everyone is delayed 2 weeks.

ANyway, best I can tell, the FTC is on your side and you should have the right to get a refund.  I will support anyone trying to get it, but at the same time I find it hard to crucify hashfast over what is so far a very very modest delay, certainly when compared to BFL customers that have been waiting 6 or 12 months.
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October 29, 2013, 08:49:28 PM
 #2070

>2 weeks is not 3 difficulty adjustments
From the 20th of december to the 15th (or 20th) of november, maybe even more than that.

>KnC is done shipping
As long as it's profitable to produce them, they will be produced. I don't see the hashrate increases to slow down anytime soon; we won't see exahashes next year, either.

>Honestly, if a 2 week delay wasnt factored in to your purchase decision, you should never have  bought
2 weeks is a good delay. The problem is that they will delay more than that (where are the pics of the PCBs?)

>I find it hard to crucify hashfast over what is so far a very very modest delay, certainly
They are laying to us and buying time. I don't see the future bright in any way.

(Email style quoting for short)

My anger against what is wrong in the Bitcoin community is productive:
Bitcointa.lk - Replace "Bitcointalk.org" with "Bitcointa.lk" in this url to see how this page looks like on a proper forum (Announcement Thread)
Hashfast.org - Wiki for screwed customers
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October 29, 2013, 09:14:05 PM
 #2071

News !

https://hashfast.com/golden-nonce-interface-protocol-released/




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October 29, 2013, 09:18:06 PM
 #2072

Quote
From the 20th of december to the 15th (or 20th) of november, maybe even more than that.

You mean from end of october to middle of november, no? Thats 2 weeks in my book. Even if its three, thats still no 3 difficulty adjustments and certainly not 50% ones.

Quote
As long as it's profitable to produce them, they will be produced.

No one every said KnC got out of the business, but they finished batch 1, batch 2 will only start shipping mid November, by their own account. Hence the next 2 weeks I dont expect spectacular increases in the network hashrate. As for what will happen after that, everyone would have told you it would go ballistic in December and January, but you cant blame HF for that. If anything their delay will also delay the ballistic trajectory.

Quote
2 weeks is a good delay. The problem is that they will delay more than that (where are the pics of the PCBs?)

I can have a PCB prototypes made in 2 days and volume production in a week. Anything can cause delays, but not seeing a PCB is not a worry, nor is seeing one any reason to breath easily (think BFL monarch PCB pics).

Quote
They are laying to us and buying time. I don't see the future bright in any way.

I see no evidence of lying at this point. Certainly not more than one might have "seen" months ago.
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October 29, 2013, 09:19:10 PM
 #2073

News!
https://forums.butterflylabs.com/announcements/597-bitforce-sc-communication-protocol-draft.html

Attached is a copy of our draft of the communication protocol used for the SC line of products.
I look forward to developer feedback, please post any questions you may have.

Josh, 12-28-2012. (months before working chips)

My anger against what is wrong in the Bitcoin community is productive:
Bitcointa.lk - Replace "Bitcointalk.org" with "Bitcointa.lk" in this url to see how this page looks like on a proper forum (Announcement Thread)
Hashfast.org - Wiki for screwed customers
cedivad
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October 29, 2013, 09:21:57 PM
 #2074

>You mean from end of october to middle of november, no?
Well, we will see that when they finally deliver.

>I can have a PCB prototypes made in 2 days and volume production in a week.
This makes me suppose that they don't have a draft of the PCB ready yet.

>I see no evidence of lying at this point.
You are right. It's not lying, but the next time i have an evident example, i will quote that for you. Anyway no lying, sorry for that.

My anger against what is wrong in the Bitcoin community is productive:
Bitcointa.lk - Replace "Bitcointalk.org" with "Bitcointa.lk" in this url to see how this page looks like on a proper forum (Announcement Thread)
Hashfast.org - Wiki for screwed customers
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October 29, 2013, 09:23:53 PM
 #2075

>Honestly, if a 2 week delay wasnt factored in to your purchase decision, you should never have  bought
2 weeks is a good delay. The problem is that they will delay more than that (where are the pics of the PCBs?)

>I find it hard to crucify hashfast over what is so far a very very modest delay, certainly
They are laying to us and buying time. I don't see the future bright in any way.

Did you have Dec 31 in your ToS?

I did.

I think we're done here!   Cool



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"The difference between bad and well-developed digital cash will determine
whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy." 
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"Fungibility provides privacy as a side effect."  Adam Back 2014
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dexX7
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October 29, 2013, 09:25:25 PM
 #2076

That was fast. The Genesis Block also published an article about the interface protocol.

Quote
HashFash Announces Open Sourcing of Bitcoin Mining ASIC Interface Protocol

Today HashFast announced they are open sourcing the interface protocol used for controlling their bitcoin mining ASICs. Open sourcing this design gives significant insight into how their bitcoin miners operate and provides a platform for driver developers. More users collaborating in driver development should allow for a more diverse set of options, and a better […]

http://thegenesisblock.com/hashfash-announces-open-sourcing-bitcoin-mining-asic-interface-protocol/

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October 29, 2013, 09:25:38 PM
 #2077

Oh god, here, too.
I offered you something that you will trow around for months, didn't i?

My anger against what is wrong in the Bitcoin community is productive:
Bitcointa.lk - Replace "Bitcointalk.org" with "Bitcointa.lk" in this url to see how this page looks like on a proper forum (Announcement Thread)
Hashfast.org - Wiki for screwed customers
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October 29, 2013, 09:57:07 PM
 #2078

Anyway i would have never said it, but that pdf (https://hashfast.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/gn_protocol.pdf) is really good.
Finally some proofs that they have been working on something. But this good feeling is still overcomed by the incredibly similarity with the BFL paper released months before anything... BFL's paper was poorer, at least.

My anger against what is wrong in the Bitcoin community is productive:
Bitcointa.lk - Replace "Bitcointalk.org" with "Bitcointa.lk" in this url to see how this page looks like on a proper forum (Announcement Thread)
Hashfast.org - Wiki for screwed customers
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October 29, 2013, 10:07:57 PM
 #2079

Anyway i would have never said it, but that pdf (https://hashfast.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/gn_protocol.pdf) is really good.
Finally some proofs that they have been working on something. But this good feeling is still overcomed by the incredibly similarity with the BFL paper released months before anything... BFL's paper was poorer, at least.

Glad to see you're feeling better, coming out of the crazy zone, and joining us in the real world.



Here's to better luck with internet lawyering in the future!  Cheers!

BTW, the Global Work Queue described in the protocol document is awesome!

This is just a preview of the high quality of innovative technology HashFast has been busy developing, while ActiveMining played with logos and mucks about with facilitating the trade of unregistered securities on illicit exchanges.


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"The difference between bad and well-developed digital cash will determine
whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy." 
David Chaum 1996
"Fungibility provides privacy as a side effect."  Adam Back 2014
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October 29, 2013, 10:41:32 PM
 #2080

damn someone beat me to the punch..

anyhow..

The HF Golden Nonce interface protocol is out and ready for your reading enjoyment! https://hashfast.com/golden-nonce-interface-protocol-released/
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