NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information

[allwelder]

Re-posting my Public Service Announcement:
(... because I haven't posted it in almost 500 pages of posts here...)

If you are new to Nxt and don't want to read through 2420 pages of posts, come to the wiki, parts of which are now available in nineteen languages:
- Learn about Nxt
- Get started
- get basic questions answered in the FAQ and common problems pages
- Learn how to set up a public node on a VPS
- read up on the Nxt high-level API, which you can use to build apps, games, clients, utilities, and more
- find additional resources for programmers, including suggested methods for integrating Nxt with your sites, API documentation, software change logs, a PHP library, and more.
- check out the current draft version of the Nxt whitepaper, which is being built and refined by top community contributors (it's still rough, but there's lots of great content already)

There are also great forums with lots of info and support for beginners. Many of the best Nxt wiki articles are based on information originally contributed here:
- The nxtcrypto.org forum
- The nextcoin.org forum

... and don't forget our other Nxt sites (and these are just the English ones):
- Summaries of this thread
- http://www.nxtclients.org
- http://www.nxtcrypto.org
- http://mynxt.org
- http://nxtarea.com/

Wiki contributors help to pull information from these threads every day to keep the wiki up to date. You can help too!! contribute, or translate.

Another:www.nxt123.org

[CIYAM]

Is AT just a feature of a truing complete scheme that you have in mind?

AT is basically an Nxt account that is a "computer program" (which was created with a "Turing complete" instruction set).

I say *basically* because it most likely won't have "all the same abilities" as any "normal" account (and can't use the *real* Nxt API as it is "sandboxed" to using the Nxt AT API).

I think Ethereum's focus on "contracts" is somewhat limited which is why I created the "lottery" use case.

[brooklynbtc]

Just distributed over 2200 NXT to the miners for less than 24 hours of mining!!!
And that was with the price jump!

My 149 average dropped to 108, but that's what you get for rising prices.  

[brooklynbtc]

are we forking? or is mynxt.info off the chain?

I got 3 emails from mynxt.info tonight saying I had forged blocks.. that can be right. two with payments and they don't show in the explorer..

[brooklynbtc]

Jack, your analysis of too many trading pairs is mathematically sound insofar as it's THEORETICALLY POSSIBLE that the scenario you describe would happen, but you ignore human behavior and examples of markets that exist in reality.

Let's pretend the USA released its control over the oil markets and oil could now be traded in something other than USD.

Do you really think the markets are going to be flooded with "too many oil markets?" Oil / Wheat, Oil / pork bellies, oil / silver, oil / gold, oil / USD, oil / Euro, oil / copper, oil / cement, oil / ethylene oxide, oil / cocaine, oil / soybeans, oil / yen, oil / iron, oil / corn, oil / orange juice, oil / lumber

Yes...they are all theoretically possible, and in effect, that's what you are so worried about. Hopefully you understand how silly it looks when you see it listed that way.

No, even if oil were not forced to be traded in USD (akin to you insisting that everything be priced in NXT), there would be maybe 3 major oil markets

OIL / USD
OIL / EUR
OIL / CNY
And maybe OIL / JPY (Yen)

These 4 markets would be patronized by whatever was most convenient for the participating traders. A trader in Europe would rather bargain in Euros than dollars.

All the other tiny markets (E.g. oil / orange juice) would be specialized to unique players and would constitute a tiny fraction of the trade that happened. The rest of the world could safely ignore them entirely.

YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY that there will be 5000 asset pairs reducing liquidity. Your Nxt client will filter out those asset pairs of small liquidity, and you'd never even see them. If you own an orange tree farm and want to trade orange juice for gold or oil, then you will have to go looking for that info. It would probably be easier, though, for you to sell your oranges for one of the "top tier" currencies, and use that currency to buy your oil.

Thank you for the well reasoned response and some chuckles .  The 'programmer' guy in me wants to find all the ways a system can break... you have forced to see how market economics can influence seemingly intractable 'theoretical' problems.

I have milk.  Will trade 8 fl. oz. for 6 chocolate chip cookies.  

I have wine, will trade .5cl for 100g hard cheese

[CIYAM]

I have milk.  Will trade 8 fl. oz. for 6 chocolate chip cookies.  
...
I have wine, will trade .5cl for 100g hard cheese

I have 1 empty bottle of wine will trade for 2 aspirins.

[dhit]

Into 5th!  Looking forward to unseating Peercoin at 4.

[brooklynbtc]

I have milk.  Will trade 8 fl. oz. for 6 chocolate chip cookies.  
...
I have wine, will trade .5cl for 100g hard cheese

I have 1 empty bottle of wine will trade for 2 aspirins.

empties are worth 10¢

[salsacz]

so they decided to accept Nxt, but a problem is - how can I hide this from my gf?
http://toronto.kijiji.ca/c-buy-and-sell-jewellery-watches-Crypto-Jeweler-Buy-diamonds-gold-and-silver-with-Bitcoin-W0QQAdIdZ576680963

[allwelder]

http://hashrate.org just paid out it's third payout.  (http://hashrate.org/payouts.html)
Five miners took home over 100 NxT, two miners took home over 200 NxT and one took home over 400 NxT
Start mining for NxT today!

just curious.
How to mine Nxt with specialized rig?

At the moment I am mining in both pools with an ASIC miner using cgiminer. You can also use GPU miners using scrypt. Is that what you mean?

I just mean there is no mining in Nxt.
So why and how use these hash power of specialized rig for Nxt mining? principle?

[salsacz]

allwelder: smoking is bad, but poeple still smoke

[mczarnek]

Anon136,

The free market must be allowed to flourish on the blockchain. Why insist on settling trade in NXT for every transaction when every transaction already has a NXT cost to process? What if a consumer wants to use the Nxt AE, has NXT for transaction fees and wants to buy $10 million of oil from a reputable Nxt AE Issuer (vetted with history, positive transactions, other due diligence items).

In your scenario the buyer must buy $10 million worth of NXT (about 250 million NXT) or about 1/4 of the existing TOTAL supply of NXT.
This simple attempt to purchase 25% of the supply of the TOTAL STAKE of a cryptocurrency would drive the price of NXT far past reasonable and the order could not be filled at the preferred price (the price before $10 million of NXT buy orders hit the market, attempting to take control of 25% of the supply of a Proof of Stake Currency.)

Then the user of the NXT AE (now seller of NXT) would have to sell $10 million of NXT to buy $10 million of oil from the reputable Nxt AE Issuer.
Big money needs room to move. Nxt needs to provide that room to move. I believe my illustration showing why Nxt AE needs to allow trading between any pair is complete.

Keep in mind this is also one reason that big companies aren't going to start accepting Bitcoin soon, Amazon does 4.9 billion dollars in sales, now people would have to start buying Bitcoin's, Amazon would accept them, and use Bitpay to dump them back onto the market.. maybe there would be an equilibrium but I actually think that the price would start going down.. 9 times out of 10 people aren't going to buy Nxt just to use them to purchase an item at Amazon but if you buy something at Amazon, they'll dump Nxt onto the market.  So unless people refill their wallets for everything spend, the price will actually start going down.

Us Nxt as a platform to facilitate transactions in a currency better suited to grow or keep a more stable value, and the price stays fairly even.  I actually have an idea in mind for a perfect currency to run on top of Nxt that would be more stable and more trusted by both sides to retain it's value.

Nxt still maintains it's value and it's valuable because you buy Nxt to run services that require the forgers be fed.  Anytime a transaction goes through, you have to at least own enough Nxt to feed the forgers, so you have to own Nxt, say everyone buy $50 worth, enough to send a NxtTxt, you could still hold onto Nxt and at time of purchase convert it to the currency running on top of Nxt to be held by the party on the other end, you need to pay in Nxt anytime you use a Nxt smart contract.  

And you do still make sure that Nxt can be used for purchases.

[mczarnek]

http://hashrate.org just paid out it's third payout.  (http://hashrate.org/payouts.html)
Five miners took home over 100 NxT, two miners took home over 200 NxT and one took home over 400 NxT
Start mining for NxT today!

just curious.
How to mine Nxt with specialized rig?

At the moment I am mining in both pools with an ASIC miner using cgiminer. You can also use GPU miners using scrypt. Is that what you mean?

I just mean there is no mining in Nxt.
So why and how use these hash power of specialized rig for Nxt mining? principle?

Let's say you bought one in the olden days, you can still make money using it but realize that Nxt is the one going up in the long term.

Plus, you mine their coins, dump them on their market and buy Nxt... Nxt goes up, other coin goes down

[allwelder]

I just had a look at the excel sheet in your signature, rickyjames!
It´s amazing to have a look behind the courtains and see the enormous work that is put into the projects.

Keep up the great work!

yes,great enormous works

[wakasaki808]

allwelder: smoking is bad, but poeple still smoke

+1

Even though NXT is "GREEN" doesn't mean we should just forget about the many mining rigs that are available that won't go away any time soon. I've used my mining rig prior to the NXT multipools to mine BTC then convert to NXT. This cuts down on one step The NXT mining pools do nothing but help NXT go up with all the alt-clones go down because of how they work.

The way I view it might as well use mining rigs for as long as can if it's available. Cater towards the many instead of the few.

[paradigmflux]

heck hashrate.org has paid out nearly 5000 NXT in the last couple of days in return for miners contributing scrypt hashrate!!!

[allwelder]

Nxt is on the way to moon...

[lounge]

Nxt is on the way to moon...

 

[Pouncer]

Let the market work.

Let people do business however THEY see fit.

Do not try to force people to use YOUR favored currency. That is behavior suited for governments.

NXT will succeed, IF we empower people to do business in THEIR preferred way.

+ Very well said (the whole post).  Trades can be denominated in any currency. BUT, if there is any attempt to force traders to use a particular currency/token, then it must be NXT and nothing else. In other words, free for all, or only NXT. I hope it will be implemented this way, provided there are no serious technical issues.

A decentralized, flexible trading platform with low fees, multisig gateways, plus special high end features using AT will make Nxt AE a class of its own!

[Anon136]

I've been thinking about limiting trading pairs to only nxt crosses and whether that's possible and i think it is. The only thing is that if people in the other camp were super stubborn than we could potentially get a fork and get 2 separate nxt's one with and one without alt crosses. I would say that there are definitely very good reasons to want to limit crosses to nxt but if people really felt so strongly about it as to force a fork than i would back down, it isn't THAT big of a deal. The world would keep spinning even if people traded other crosses.

*edit* just remember that if we are competing with other people and they have crosses all over the place with everything trading against everything else and we are committed to crossing everything against nxt, our markets would be THE go to place for prices and any orders that are even reasonably large. Large orders would just move the other thinner markets too much in the process for it for anyone big to play there. *edit2* unless they bought a little bit of everything and executed trades on every cross at the same time, but who wants to deal with that.