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Question: Will you support Gavin's new block size limit hard fork of 8MB by January 1, 2016 then doubling every 2 years?
1.  yes
2.  no

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Author Topic: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP.  (Read 1808018 times)
cypherdoc
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May 04, 2015, 12:30:01 AM
 #23401

hmmm.  i wonder if Gavin is putting his foot down:

https://github.com/gavinandresen/bitcoin-git/commit/5f46da29fd02fd2a8a787286fd6a56f680073770
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May 04, 2015, 12:31:00 AM
 #23402

Bitcoin is a meta-layer for settlement systems, let's keep the politically-driven social sciences, like "economics", out of it.
That sounds like VC doublespeak.

Far from it. Though I expect each can approach it on their chosen level and interpret it through familiar lens filters, however limiting and distorted that may prove to be.

cypherdoc
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May 04, 2015, 12:33:50 AM
 #23403


eh, looks like he's serious.  i, for one, support him:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/34riua/hard_fork_allow_20mb_blocks_after_1_march_2016/cqxfpni
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May 04, 2015, 12:53:23 AM
 #23404


given this new development, you guys ought to make sure to vote in the current poll above.
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May 04, 2015, 12:59:44 AM
 #23405

It looks like bitcoin will continue to drop for the next little while. I have sold most of my btc and plan on to reenter at around $150. Untill then I may buy some gold and see where that goes.
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May 04, 2015, 01:04:21 AM
 #23406

It looks like bitcoin will continue to drop for the next little while. I have sold most of my btc and plan on to reenter at around $150. Untill then I may buy some gold and see where that goes.

sounds like you're gonna be left behind.
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May 04, 2015, 01:05:55 AM
 #23407

It looks like bitcoin will continue to drop for the next little while. I have sold most of my btc and plan on to reenter at around $150. Untill then I may buy some gold and see where that goes.

sounds like you're gonna be left behind.


no man, I made enough money to not worry. but btc is coming back down and you failing to see that is retarded. You're old school and you still don't get it. Your loss my gain.
Zangelbert Bingledack
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May 04, 2015, 01:08:28 AM
 #23408

I wonder how many of those who voted for a graduated increase realize that the blocksize limit isn't actually limiting anything right now. It's a limit that will eventually become a factor. Right now if it were removed nothing special would happen.
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May 04, 2015, 01:14:28 AM
 #23409

I wonder how many of those who voted for a graduated increase realize that the blocksize limit isn't actually limiting anything right now. It's a limit that will eventually become a factor. Right now if it were removed nothing special would happen.

you're right that it isn't limiting anything right now.  but if the market gets the sense that Gavin is going to get his way (and i think he will) it could unleash the next wave of speculation into the market, and along with it, a new wave of tx volume simply from everyone piling in frontrunning.

the way the charts are lining up it seems to me that the market is looking for any reason at all to rally hard.
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May 04, 2015, 01:23:12 AM
 #23410

I wonder how many of those who voted for a graduated increase realize that the blocksize limit isn't actually limiting anything right now. It's a limit that will eventually become a factor. Right now if it were removed nothing special would happen.

That's a bit overstated. It already slows things down when there are long (random) block times because all the accumulated transactions can't fit in the first block. Allowing all (or at least more) of the transactions into the first block doesn't increase bandwidth or storage requirements at all, but does improve service. There is a small centralizing effect though (rewards miners with higher bandwidth).
 
This has happened to me twice. I have the worst luck on block times. Both were close to an hour.
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May 04, 2015, 01:28:15 AM
 #23411

just in case anyone is interested in what one of my full nodes is using.  it's remarkably consistent across all of them.  note the minimal bandwidth usage.  i have 1GB of RAM with 100GB of disk:

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May 04, 2015, 01:28:23 AM
 #23412

you're right that it isn't limiting anything right now.  but if the market gets the sense that Gavin is going to get his way (and i think he will) it could unleash the next wave of speculation into the market, and along with it, a new wave of tx volume simply from everyone piling in frontrunning.

the way the charts are lining up it seems to me that the market is looking for any reason at all to rally hard.

That would be a welcome development. I do get the sense that some investors have developed misgivings because of the blocksize issue, and if that's the case certainly a step toward solving that should spur some investment.

I still say just let exchanges arbitrage the two forks so that skeptics of "GavinCoin" (Roll Eyes) can put their money where their mouth is and see if anyone agrees with them - that is, if they are really willing to take, oh, say a 95% devaluation of their holdings if the market rejects them (and that's the optimistic case where their little group lasts as an altcoin; otherwise they can ride it all the way to zero). I suspect very few people will actually take this bet.

To quote the enigmatic Mr. Sztorc again, "Predictions markets make cheap talk expensive." Fork arbitrage functions as a prediction market for which fork will succeed.
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May 04, 2015, 01:29:06 AM
 #23413

I wonder how many of those who voted for a graduated increase realize that the blocksize limit isn't actually limiting anything right now. It's a limit that will eventually become a factor. Right now if it were removed nothing special would happen.

That's a bit overstated. It already slows things down when there are long (random) block times because all the accumulated transactions can't fit in the first block. Allowing all (or at least more) of the transactions into the first block doesn't increase bandwidth or storage requirements at all, but does improve service. There is a small centralizing effect though (rewards miners with higher bandwidth).
 
This has happened to me twice. I have the worst luck on block times. Both were close to an hour.

Hmm, that's interesting. Thanks for the correction.
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May 04, 2015, 02:23:10 AM
 #23414

i'm going to lock this poll by tomorrow and put up a new one given Gavin's "announcement" so get your voting in now.
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May 04, 2015, 02:40:01 AM
 #23415

i'm going to lock this poll by tomorrow and put up a new one given Gavin's "announcement" so get your voting in now.

How about all of the above, stop wasting gavin's precious time, and do it sooner to give ppl some confidence that micropayments will be economically viable so we can get on with building stuff on the blockchain. Stuff that actually delves into areas where fiat cannot go rather then merely providing small benefits to those who have already set up wallets and little to no benefit to those who must do the whole education thing and then the time inefficient fiat btc xfer btc fiat circus.
iCEBREAKER
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May 04, 2015, 03:02:16 AM
 #23416

i'm going to lock this poll by tomorrow and put up a new one given Gavin's "announcement" so get your voting in now.

How about all of the above, stop wasting gavin's precious time, and do it sooner to give ppl some confidence that micropayments will be economically viable so we can get on with building stuff on the blockchain. Stuff that actually delves into areas where fiat cannot go rather then merely providing small benefits to those who have already set up wallets and little to no benefit to those who must do the whole education thing and then the time inefficient fiat btc xfer btc fiat circus.

If Bitcoin's precious blockchain has no greater destiny than to be used for an eternal record of inconsequential "micropayments" the project has no future.

Stop trying to enable the fluffy VC daydream of 'enabling tipping economies' and worry about macropayments.

This is revolution against the BIS, etc. and a chance to evolve past gold as humanity's default store of value, not a call to replace Reddit gold/Dogecoin/TipBot.

The places "where fiat cannot go" that matter are brain/paper/hardware wallets, multi-sig, and realtime auditing, not giving some Redditard 0.000000001 BTC for confirming your bias with a snarky comment.

Too bad we have to wait an entire year to watch Mircea shit all over GavinCoin.  It's worse than waiting for the next season of Walking Dead!

The difference between bad and well-developed digital cash will determine whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy.  David Chaum 1996
Fungibility provides privacy as a side effect.  Adam Back 2014
"Monero" : { Private - Auditable - 100% Fungible - Flexible Blocksize - Wild & Free® - Intro - Wallets - Podcats - Roadmap - Dice - Blackjack - Github - Android }


Bitcoin is intentionally designed to be ungovernable and governance-free.  luke-jr 2016
Blocks must necessarily be full for the Bitcoin network to be able to pay for its own security.  davout 2015
Blocksize is an intentionally limited resource, like the 21e6 BTC limit.  Changing it degrades the surrounding economics, creating negative incentives.  Jeff Garzik 2013


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HeliKopterBen
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May 04, 2015, 03:11:30 AM
 #23417

I voted graduated limit but if things go well over time eventually remove the limit.

Counterfeit:  made in imitation of something else with intent to deceive:  merriam-webster
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May 04, 2015, 03:38:45 AM
 #23418

just in case anyone is interested in what one of my full nodes is using.  it's remarkably consistent across all of them.  note the minimal bandwidth usage.  i have 1GB of RAM with 100GB of disk:



Umm, bandwidth numbers without time are meaningless.

Are you using 23 GB per day? Per hour? Per second?

Please clarify, thanks.



"You have no moral right to rule us, nor do you possess any methods of enforcement that we have reason to fear." - John Perry Barlow, 1996
shmadz
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May 04, 2015, 03:57:20 AM
 #23419

i'm going to lock this poll by tomorrow and put up a new one given Gavin's "announcement" so get your voting in now.

How about all of the above, stop wasting gavin's precious time, and do it sooner to give ppl some confidence that micropayments will be economically viable so we can get on with building stuff on the blockchain. Stuff that actually delves into areas where fiat cannot go rather then merely providing small benefits to those who have already set up wallets and little to no benefit to those who must do the whole education thing and then the time inefficient fiat btc xfer btc fiat circus.

If Bitcoin's precious blockchain has no greater destiny than to be used for an eternal record of inconsequential "micropayments" the project has no future.

Stop trying to enable the fluffy VC daydream of 'enabling tipping economies' and worry about macropayments.

This is revolution against the BIS, etc. and a chance to evolve past gold as humanity's default store of value, not a call to replace Reddit gold/Dogecoin/TipBot.

The places "where fiat cannot go" that matter are brain/paper/hardware wallets, multi-sig, and realtime auditing, not giving some Redditard 0.000000001 BTC for confirming your bias with a snarky comment.

Too bad we have to wait an entire year to watch Mircea shit all over GavinCoin.  It's worse than waiting for the next season of Walking Dead!

Agreed.

Bitcoin is much better suited to the store of value function.

Why do you think Goldman Sachs et all are trying to pigeon-hole bitcoin as merely a "payments network"?

*also, increasing block size does nothing to address the "instant payment" problem.

"You have no moral right to rule us, nor do you possess any methods of enforcement that we have reason to fear." - John Perry Barlow, 1996
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May 04, 2015, 05:25:46 AM
 #23420

Subspace sounds like an interesting project BIP70

https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/bitcoin-startup-subspace-develops-bip70-payment-requests-protocol/

Quote
We should be able to achieve full-node like privacy for lightweight wallets. But on top of that we’ll be able to do things like ‘push’ payment requests to end-users. This could enable monthly billing for services, which we don’t currently have in Bitcoin. We can also attach messages to our transactions and even use it for messages between clients.

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