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Author Topic: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP.  (Read 1804288 times)
molecular
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April 19, 2015, 06:51:38 PM
 #22901

Guys, governments are structurally inefficient. Do you really think a bunch of bureaucrats could understand the potential of bitcoin back in 2011?

If governments were so smart and visionary, administered economy would work.

Government is big. It consists of many people. You can't rule out some smart people get hired into 3-letter-agencies, for example.

PGP key molecular F9B70769 fingerprint 9CDD C0D3 20F8 279F 6BE0  3F39 FC49 2362 F9B7 0769
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justusranvier
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April 19, 2015, 07:08:39 PM
 #22902

You can't rule out some smart people get hired into 3-letter-agencies, for example.
You especially can't rule out smart criminals joining 3-letter-agencies for the express purpose of being able to line their own pockets under the colour of law.
rocks
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April 19, 2015, 07:13:34 PM
 #22903

You can't rule out some smart people get hired into 3-letter-agencies, for example.
You especially can't rule out smart criminals joining 3-letter-agencies for the express purpose of being able to line their own pockets under the colour of law.

Agreed. Politicians and bureaucrats may be nothing more than feudal court officials, which requires zero brain power. But spending $3,500,000,000,000 per year does buy you intelligence in various agencies.

Heck we already know that the CIA contacted Gavin and Satoshi in late-2010 / early-2011, so someone there noticed bitcoin's potential before most (or maybe any) of us.
Wandererfromthenorth
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April 19, 2015, 07:48:37 PM
 #22904

Did you ever think that the NSA had the capabilities they have been shown to possess from the Snowden documents? And most experts agree that those documents released in 2013 are at least 2 years old. Cracking into mtgox would have been trivial for them.
And then... plot twist:


NSA created bitcoin  Tongue



NSA talking about "electronic anonymous cryptographic cash" prototype in 1996:


http://groups.csail.mit.edu/mac/classes/6.805/articles/money/nsamint/nsamint.htm







"Satoshi Nakamoto" anagram:

"I am NSA, took oaths"




 Tongue Tongue Tongue Tongue

/tinfoilhat
/troll
Erdogan
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April 19, 2015, 08:09:56 PM
 #22905

[...]
NSA talking about "electronic anonymous cryptographic cash" prototype in 1996:
[...]

For 30 years. It does not change a thing. We have the distributed blockchain with proof of work and block reward in the form of the currency itself. It looks easy now, but were not. It is an invention. They could not know.
cypherdoc
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April 19, 2015, 10:19:53 PM
 #22906

[...]
NSA talking about "electronic anonymous cryptographic cash" prototype in 1996:
[...]

For 30 years. It does not change a thing. We have the distributed blockchain with proof of work and block reward in the form of the currency itself. It looks easy now, but were not. It is an invention. They could not know.


Doesn't matter if Satoshi or the NSA wrote it. It's open source and had been inspected up the wazoo. It does what we think it does. And if it doesn't, we'll change it.
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April 19, 2015, 10:21:28 PM
 #22907

[...]
NSA talking about "electronic anonymous cryptographic cash" prototype in 1996:
[...]

For 30 years. It does not change a thing. We have the distributed blockchain with proof of work and block reward in the form of the currency itself. It looks easy now, but were not. It is an invention. They could not know.


Doesn't matter if Satoshi or the NSA wrote it. It's open source and had been inspected up the wazoo. It does what we think it does.

That too.
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April 19, 2015, 10:45:34 PM
 #22908

It wasn't really surprising that the Japan economy turns out to be weak currently. Come with a bogous economic theory, put it in practise, and conclude that it is surprising that it didn't work. From the eating-hole of Haruhiko Kuroda:

http://www.wsj.com/articles/bank-of-japan-chief-says-he-sees-progress-on-higher-inflation-1429479006
marcus_of_augustus
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April 20, 2015, 12:02:57 AM
 #22909

no, my bet is on gvt agents who were trying to destroy Bitcoin.  this board was covered with obvious trolls even back then and mtgox had just captured the public's attention for the first time with the run to 32.  since then, we have found out an astounding number of facts about NSA's unabashed unconstitutional actions to invade privacy and perform sabotage such as Stuxnet, Gemalto, Prism, Merkel's cellphone, etc, etc.  The SR agents were methodical, ruthless, and matter of fact about stealing SR coins with impunity.  doesn't seem to far a stretch that gvt agents would steal from mtgox while taking it down at the same time.  it would explain the radio silence on the whole issue as well as an attempt to bury the truth forever.

If true this would be the biggest endorsement of bitcoin I could imagine. It would mean that despite the government's best efforts and resources, they could not identify any mechanism to attack bitcoin even in it's early days, and so had to resort to attacking 3rd party intermediaries and not bitcoin itself. This implies that the bitcoin distributed computer is already hardened against large scale attacks. Of course it also means that governments are already seeking methods to attack bitcoin, and if they can not stop the DAC, regulation becomes the next obvious choice.

In another light, the senate hearings of Nov-2013 may have signified a capitulation after an unsuccessful covert attack. "We can't kill this thing let's begin efforts to coopt it into an unworkable regulatory framework", like they have done with electronic gold as money. bitcoin of course has effectively no targettable counter-parties at the network level.

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April 20, 2015, 12:10:06 AM
 #22910

wow, Ledger Wallet guys seem on top of things.  hardware wallet capabilities already built into your phone?:

http://cointelegraph.com/news/114003/bitcoin-could-be-stored-securely-as-a-hardware-wallet-on-your-phone
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April 20, 2015, 12:19:26 AM
 #22911

wow, more smartphone innovation on the horizon.  mobile is the bomb:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MNTObCr4gnM&feature=youtu.be
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April 20, 2015, 12:30:19 AM
 #22912

You can't rule out some smart people get hired into 3-letter-agencies, for example.
You especially can't rule out smart criminals joining 3-letter-agencies for the express purpose of being able to line their own pockets under the colour of law.

in fact, you can just about guarantee that the more power vested in these agencies the more venal and power-seeking the type of individuals they attract.

cypherdoc
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April 20, 2015, 12:35:11 AM
 #22913

Bitcoin trolls.  you really need to look the hell out:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/336f1w/its_not_about_21_inc_its_all_about_qualcomm/
Cconvert2G36
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April 20, 2015, 12:41:40 AM
 #22914

Peter's is a good theory.  in fact, i take it one step further.  i think it was probably gvt agents who took it down from 17.5 to 0.002 at the time.

what a crazy way to accumulate coins, if it was indeed just a hacker.  if he had really stole source code, he would have just bled 100 coin lots over the next 3 yrs as was apparently done according to WizSec.  no drama.  i remember quite vividly watching the attack take place real time on what was then used, Sierra Charts.  it was a straight down spiral of the price with no intervening buys, just selling.  it reminded me of watching the Bear Stearns chart plummet in real time back in 2008.  it's indescribable seeing such a thing happen right before your very eyes.  it was so public and so obvious that the guy Kevin got identified immediately for having bought 259684 BTC for under $3000:

06/19/11 17:51  Bought BTC  259684.77 for 0.0101

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=20207.0

no, my bet is on gvt agents who were trying to destroy Bitcoin.  this board was covered with obvious trolls even back then and mtgox had just captured the public's attention for the first time with the run to 32.  since then, we have found out an astounding number of facts about NSA's unabashed unconstitutional actions to invade privacy and perform sabotage such as Stuxnet, Gemalto, Prism, Merkel's cellphone, etc, etc.  The SR agents were methodical, ruthless, and matter of fact about stealing SR coins acting with impunity.  doesn't seem to far a stretch that gvt agents would steal from mtgox while taking it down at the same time.  it would explain the radio silence on the whole issue as well as an attempt to bury the truth forever.

You make the case about as well as it can be done at this point. Although, there was also extreme profit motive vs Mark K, on the other side of the razor.
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April 20, 2015, 03:02:09 AM
 #22915

Peter's is a good theory.  in fact, i take it one step further.  i think it was probably gvt agents who took it down from 17.5 to 0.002 at the time.

what a crazy way to accumulate coins, if it was indeed just a hacker.  if he had really stole source code, he would have just bled 100 coin lots over the next 3 yrs as was apparently done according to WizSec.  no drama.  i remember quite vividly watching the attack take place real time on what was then used, Sierra Charts.  it was a straight down spiral of the price with no intervening buys, just selling.  it reminded me of watching the Bear Stearns chart plummet in real time back in 2008.  it's indescribable seeing such a thing happen right before your very eyes.  it was so public and so obvious that the guy Kevin got identified immediately for having bought 259684 BTC for under $3000:

06/19/11 17:51  Bought BTC  259684.77 for 0.0101

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=20207.0

no, my bet is on gvt agents who were trying to destroy Bitcoin.  this board was covered with obvious trolls even back then and mtgox had just captured the public's attention for the first time with the run to 32.  since then, we have found out an astounding number of facts about NSA's unabashed unconstitutional actions to invade privacy and perform sabotage such as Stuxnet, Gemalto, Prism, Merkel's cellphone, etc, etc.  The SR agents were methodical, ruthless, and matter of fact about stealing SR coins acting with impunity.  doesn't seem to far a stretch that gvt agents would steal from mtgox while taking it down at the same time.  it would explain the radio silence on the whole issue as well as an attempt to bury the truth forever.

You make the case about as well as it can be done at this point. Although, there was also extreme profit motive vs Mark K, on the other side of the razor.

no, the USG was way up his ass in many ways.  not to mention the $5.1 M they seized from Tibanne here in the US.  i'm sure he was under a gag order.  so was the Japanese police ever since the 17.5 to 0.0101 hack as he reported it to them.

i'm sure during the subsequent investigations his systems got compromised.  and if i'm right, that they had access to the systems, i wouldn't put it past the gvts to steal coins that could be responsible for the depressed prices we see today in the never ending inexplicable selloffs we've been getting.  that's my tinfoil.
Cconvert2G36
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April 20, 2015, 03:14:20 AM
 #22916

You make the case about as well as it can be done at this point. Although, there was also extreme profit motive vs Mark K, on the other side of the razor.

no, the USG was way up his ass in many ways.  not to mention the $5.1 M they seized from Tibanne here in the US.  i'm sure he was under a gag order.  so was the Japanese police ever since the 17.5 to 0.0101 hack as he reported it to them.

i'm sure during the subsequent investigations his systems got compromised.  and if i'm right, that they had access to the systems, i wouldn't put it past the gvts to steal coins that could be responsible for the depressed prices we see today in the never ending inexplicable selloffs we've been getting.  that's my tinfoil.

The June 2011 hack happened exactly as it had to. With access to a huge amount of coins the price had to be dropped to near nothing, allowing a certain dollar value of btc to leave the system. A non-state actor would face it the same way.

I'm definitely not ruling out your theory. Just feel there are other possibilities.
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April 20, 2015, 03:15:55 AM
 #22917


So why would anyone trust a Qualcomm hardware bitcoin wallet built into their smartphone if it was proprietary?
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April 20, 2015, 03:18:15 AM
 #22918


So why would anyone trust a Qualcomm hardware bitcoin wallet built into their smartphone if it was proprietary?

maybe b/c they're joint investors in 21?  i sure hope they do their audits.
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April 20, 2015, 04:03:55 AM
 #22919


So why would anyone trust a Qualcomm hardware bitcoin wallet built into their smartphone if it was proprietary?

Most of the masses (as yet uninvolved in bitcoin) don't care.  I don't suppose its a great way to store your life's savings, but I think most would be willing to risk their spending money without a qualm. 
Adrian-x
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April 20, 2015, 04:13:08 AM
 #22920


So why would anyone trust a Qualcomm hardware bitcoin wallet built into their smartphone if it was proprietary?

That was my first thought, this could go horribly wrong with the likes of the NSA and other tentacles trying to embed into network hardware.

fortunately coin security has already being solved with multisig. Still privacy could be compromised but your coins can be safe.

Exciting solution have already been proposed. http://sigsafe.org/  is one solution to allow you to use the tech while diversifying the trust.  It just needs adoption.

Thank me in Bits 12MwnzxtprG2mHm3rKdgi7NmJKCypsMMQw
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