Why do islam hates people?

[popcorn1]

I am islam, I do not hate everyone, I am a haters but I just hate people who do evil to me and hurt my heart. I do not hate people based on religion and where they come from. But I hate people because of their nature to me and those close to me.

yes slam do not hate people but in fact is the people who want to defame Islam otherwise Islam is a peaceful religion and you just need to study about  then you will understand the fact about Islam.

I think you need to listen to one of your EX followers ..
She seen the light and become an earth sister ..

I BET YOU HAVE NOTHING TO SAY ..Your STUMPED by your own KIND ..

AND IS SHE A LIAR ?..Does she lie about the KORAN?..I.E ISLAM is she a liar about ISLAM?..

No you wont say nothing because YOU KNOW she speaks the TRUTH..

Excellent: Ex-muslim Woman Speaks the Truth About Islam - YouTube
Video for ex muslim woman▶ 8:47
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edVQETclhps

[popcorn1]

And what some more EX muslims think about ISLAM..
They should know what islam is like.

Ray of Sunshine1 year ago (edited)

I was born into a Muslim family but since I was a teenager I have been doubting religion. I don't like religion because it puts labels on people (Muslim vs Jews vs Christians). Why do we need this label? At the end of the day we are one - we are all humans (we are the same).  The second reason why I don't like religion is because it sounds made up and mythical, and people are encouraged to believe these mythical stories are true otherwise they go to "hell" (which I also don't believe in). This therefore causes lots of trouble in this world, such as war and disagreements.
I don't believe in capital G God or Allah, if there is any controlling force out there. There could be something but I just deny it. I don't believe in heaven or hell. I also don't fast or pray or follow any religious trends. I'm done with it.
Anyone else feel the same way? Anyone else denying religion? I just don't believe in it. Whatever you believe in I won't judge you - I am done with judgment.
 
 
Dyed Fox1 year ago
I left Islam 2 years ago, all the friends i had hated me for being an apostate. That itself proves how evil Islam is, dividing families and friends just because a sand dwelling pedophile said Allah is watching you.



SO who is lying ? ..I would believe someone who once believed in islam what it's like?.

I mean it's like a bricklayer telling you not to do something because it's not good for your home..
You would listen to them because they do study brickwork ..

Well the same goes for EX muslims they do have experience of ISLAM..

They was born into islam and now they hate it WHY if it's so good?.. 

[Xester]

And what some more EX muslims think about ISLAM..
They should know what islam is like.

Ray of Sunshine1 year ago (edited)

I was born into a Muslim family but since I was a teenager I have been doubting religion. I don't like religion because it puts labels on people (Muslim vs Jews vs Christians). Why do we need this label? At the end of the day we are one - we are all humans (we are the same).  The second reason why I don't like religion is because it sounds made up and mythical, and people are encouraged to believe these mythical stories are true otherwise they go to "hell" (which I also don't believe in). This therefore causes lots of trouble in this world, such as war and disagreements.
I don't believe in capital G God or Allah, if there is any controlling force out there. There could be something but I just deny it. I don't believe in heaven or hell. I also don't fast or pray or follow any religious trends. I'm done with it.
Anyone else feel the same way? Anyone else denying religion? I just don't believe in it. Whatever you believe in I won't judge you - I am done with judgment.
 
 
Dyed Fox1 year ago
I left Islam 2 years ago, all the friends i had hated me for being an apostate. That itself proves how evil Islam is, dividing families and friends just because a sand dwelling pedophile said Allah is watching you.



SO who is lying ? ..I would believe someone who once believed in islam what it's like?.

I mean it's like a bricklayer telling you not to do something because it's not good for your home..
You would listen to them because they do study brickwork ..

Well the same goes for EX muslims they do have experience of ISLAM..

They was born into islam and now they hate it WHY if it's so good?.. 

On the contrary everyone can change its religion if someone feels that they are not into it.  I know some Catholic who become muslim after residing in muslim country.  So change as they say is inebitable even if you grow on that religion since we have different perspective in life.

[Spendulus]

And what some more EX muslims think about ISLAM..
They should know what islam is like.

Ray of Sunshine1 year ago (edited)

I was born into a Muslim family but since I was a teenager I have been doubting religion. I don't like religion because it puts labels on people (Muslim vs Jews vs Christians). Why do we need this label? At the end of the day we are one - we are all humans (we are the same).  The second reason why I don't like religion is because it sounds made up and mythical, and people are encouraged to believe these mythical stories are true otherwise they go to "hell" (which I also don't believe in). This therefore causes lots of trouble in this world, such as war and disagreements.
I don't believe in capital G God or Allah, if there is any controlling force out there. There could be something but I just deny it. I don't believe in heaven or hell. I also don't fast or pray or follow any religious trends. I'm done with it.
Anyone else feel the same way? Anyone else denying religion? I just don't believe in it. Whatever you believe in I won't judge you - I am done with judgment.
 
 
Dyed Fox1 year ago
I left Islam 2 years ago, all the friends i had hated me for being an apostate. That itself proves how evil Islam is, dividing families and friends just because a sand dwelling pedophile said Allah is watching you.



SO who is lying ? ..I would believe someone who once believed in islam what it's like?.

I mean it's like a bricklayer telling you not to do something because it's not good for your home..
You would listen to them because they do study brickwork ..

Well the same goes for EX muslims they do have experience of ISLAM..

They was born into islam and now they hate it WHY if it's so good?.. 

On the contrary everyone can change its religion if someone feels that they are not into it.  I know some Catholic who become muslim after residing in muslim country.  So change as they say is inebitable even if you grow on that religion since we have different perspective in life.

Nice, just don't answer the question.

[popcorn1]

  I know some Catholic who become muslim after residing in muslim country.

Sounds to me they thought they better change or they will get picked on?..

I mean if everyone walked around with a peg on the nose i suppose that Catholic would be putting
a peg on the nose..
They would    because they moved to a place where everyone had a peg on the nose they would also be wearing a peg on the nose to FIT IN ..
And why do you want to fit in?      YES to not get picked on pointed at stared at laughed at and mocked
for not wearing a peg on the nose because everyone else does..

But not me i think what's the point in putting a peg on your nose..

[Tyrantt]

Islam doesn't hate people, tho it has some violence i quran it doesn't hate people, it hates the infidels, the non-belivers. And for you to ask that is probably coming from the islamic terrorist attacks. Well all those lands are war torn and destroyed, so they're pretty much seeking revenge. It's just religion 100%

[semaforo]

Religions are not the real causes are just a motive for those who are inferiors and feeling conceitedly.The need to feel and join a group like I.S.I.S comes from xenophobia, insecurity, fear, and complexity. All these feelings are fought by education.

    The diffetence between education and brainwashing is simply whether you agree with the content or not.

Bah.

The difference between education and brainwashing can be simply found by looking at the definitions of the words.

To be more thorough, look at the reference for each in wikipedia.

    I checked it out. One of the key components of brainwashing is that it introduces "unwanted" thoughts into the subject. So if the thoughts are wanted, I guess it wouldn't be brainwashing then would it? What would you call it in such a case? Programming, perhaps?

That's all you got from checking it out? Well, I guess a medieval mindset may be slow to comprehend modern concepts. At least you are trying.

Programming people to do what a ruler wants has been important for thousands of years. Whatever warlord did the best job of figuring that out was likely to win wars. Particularly important was ways of convincing men to kill themselves for The Cause. Whatever the Cause was would be figured out according to the King's wishes at the moment.

Brainwashing as a science is a 20th century phenomena, though.

  Comforting to see you continue to resort to insults rather than actually confront the issues. Your denigration of medieval times is understandable since you are probably ethnically European. I am too, so I know my anceators had a hard time of it in Europe in the middle ages, due in no.small part to poor hygiene, alcoholism, and extreme ignorance in fields like medicine, until medical textbooks written by Muslims helped Europe to come out of this difficult phase. I can understand why you would be acting out an inferioritt complex based in that hereditary shame. As a European Muslim, I've moved beyond this and I invite you to do so as well.

     If you look a little deeper into history, particularly the history of ideas, you will find all modern ideas have antecedents. For example, people have been using killing of non combatants to achieve political aims in psychological warfare for millenia, but only recently has the term 'terrorism' been coined.

     In fact, the key to understanding most modern ideas on a fundamental level is to understand their historical context.

   To reduce armed struggle to mere hedonism or self interest on the part of autocrats is correct in some circumstances, but this overlooks the numerous popular and ideologically motivated liberation struggles in history.

   For example, we can better understand secularism if we understand the background of the wars of the Reformation in Europe, and how Holland, by reclaiming land from the ocean, was able to establish a state ruled by a merchant oligarchy outside of the rigid and established order of the traditional aristocracy. This necessitated a theological alternative to the Catholic orthodoxy, since the doctrine, as you pointed out, necessitated blind service to the elite which ultimately was not in the rational best self interest of many subjects. Puritanism harnessed the power of religious belief, but by claiming a more authentic application of Holy scripture, it simultaneously provided the ideological backdrop for a popular uprising against the church- why do think heresy was punished so severely?

     Secularism was viewed as a way to transcend the cycles of religious violence, but nearly all of its core principle were drawn from Christianity, and these principles came to govern the nature of state and government, and the institutional landscape of the modern state grew largely out of a (very violent) process of compromise between the church, the merchant class, and the aristocracy, by which more power and status was given to the merchant and artisan classes.

    As such, principles such as the European variant of human rights, which form the orthox doctrine, as it were, of modern secularism, are deeply rooted in Christian theology.

    What I am trying to say, is that one must understand the medieval mindset in order to truly understand modern ideas.

       Prisons are a mind control technology.

[semaforo]

And what some more EX muslims think about ISLAM..
They should know what islam is like.

Ray of Sunshine1 year ago (edited)

I was born into a Muslim family but since I was a teenager I have been doubting religion. I don't like religion because it puts labels on people (Muslim vs Jews vs Christians). Why do we need this label? At the end of the day we are one - we are all humans (we are the same).  The second reason why I don't like religion is because it sounds made up and mythical, and people are encouraged to believe these mythical stories are true otherwise they go to "hell" (which I also don't believe in). This therefore causes lots of trouble in this world, such as war and disagreements.
I don't believe in capital G God or Allah, if there is any controlling force out there. There could be something but I just deny it. I don't believe in heaven or hell. I also don't fast or pray or follow any religious trends. I'm done with it.
Anyone else feel the same way? Anyone else denying religion? I just don't believe in it. Whatever you believe in I won't judge you - I am done with judgment.
 
 
Dyed Fox1 year ago
I left Islam 2 years ago, all the friends i had hated me for being an apostate. That itself proves how evil Islam is, dividing families and friends just because a sand dwelling pedophile said Allah is watching you.



SO who is lying ? ..I would believe someone who once believed in islam what it's like?.

I mean it's like a bricklayer telling you not to do something because it's not good for your home..
You would listen to them because they do study brickwork ..

Well the same goes for EX muslims they do have experience of ISLAM..

They was born into islam and now they hate it WHY if it's so good?.. 

On the contrary everyone can change its religion if someone feels that they are not into it.  I know some Catholic who become muslim after residing in muslim country.  So change as they say is inebitable even if you grow on that religion since we have different perspective in life.

Nice, just don't answer the question.

Hypocrisy or ignorance. Hypocrites make the religion look bad. Ignorance or taking things oit of context can also make it look bad, as with any good thing.

[bryant.coleman]

Islam doesn't hate people, tho it has some violence i quran it doesn't hate people, it hates the infidels, the non-belivers.

In that case, the countries which are close to 100% Muslim would be extremely peaceful and calm. But that is not the case. Look at such countries - examples are Yemen, Sudan, Mauritania, Afghanistan.etc. Almost all of these countries are suffering from conflict and  anarchy. So here the hatred is affecting everyone, and not just the "infidels".

[Okurkabinladin]

Islam doesn't hate people, tho it has some violence i quran it doesn't hate people, it hates the infidels, the non-belivers.

In that case, the countries which are close to 100% Muslim would be extremely peaceful and calm. But that is not the case. Look at such countries - examples are Yemen, Sudan, Mauritania, Afghanistan.etc. Almost all of these countries are suffering from conflict and  anarchy. So here the hatred is affecting everyone, and not just the "infidels".

That is true, islamic countries are as matter of rule violent and dangerous, especially for women.

However, from the outsider perspective, it is easy to focus only the fact, that muslims tend to agressive against unbelievers the most, jihad being their rallying cry.

If you look at the map of terror below, it neatly outlines areas where Islam is confronted with other cultures.



http://www.start.umd.edu/gtd/images/START_GlobalTerrorismDatabase_TerroristAttacksConcentrationIntensityMap_45Years.png

[semaforo]

Islam doesn't hate people, tho it has some violence i quran it doesn't hate people, it hates the infidels, the non-belivers.

In that case, the countries which are close to 100% Muslim would be extremely peaceful and calm. But that is not the case. Look at such countries - examples are Yemen, Sudan, Mauritania, Afghanistan.etc. Almost all of these countries are suffering from conflict and  anarchy. So here the hatred is affecting everyone, and not just the "infidels".

  Have you ever been to any of these countries? I have. And I think your assessment is not very good. Care to prove me wrong? Who do you think knows more about riding a bicycle- someone who read some books about balance and peddling, or someone who has actually eiden a bike?

[semaforo]

Islam doesn't hate people, tho it has some violence i quran it doesn't hate people, it hates the infidels, the non-belivers.

In that case, the countries which are close to 100% Muslim would be extremely peaceful and calm. But that is not the case. Look at such countries - examples are Yemen, Sudan, Mauritania, Afghanistan.etc. Almost all of these countries are suffering from conflict and  anarchy. So here the hatred is affecting everyone, and not just the "infidels".

That is true, islamic countries are as matter of rule violent and dangerous, especially for women.

However, from the outsider perspective, it is easy to focus only the fact, that muslims tend to agressive against unbelievers the most, jihad being their rallying cry.

If you look at the map of terror below, it neatly outlines areas where Islam is confronted with other cultures.



http://www.start.umd.edu/gtd/images/START_GlobalTerrorismDatabase_TerroristAttacksConcentrationIntensityMap_45Years.png

   Hmm, I wonder why rape is so much less common in Islamic countries if they are dangerous for women? Why are there over double the violent deaths per capita in America as in Egypt, even though Egypt is in a low level civil war?

The majority of rapes involve alcohol, as does the vast majority of domestic violence, so the simple prohibition of alcohol makes the situation of women quite a lot more dangerous.


   Have you been to any of the countries you are talking about? Because I have, and I think you're a victim of propaganda. There's a lot of money to be made by convincing people to think as you think, so it would be kind of crazy not to invest in manipulating public opinion, including yours, in this direction.

[Turbanshee]

Well, according to Quran Islam does hate only people who were muslims whom became enemies of islam.



Also Islam just orders to kill people who fight against Islam.



Anyway, Islam is originated by Arabs, Christianism and Judaism are originated by Israelians. These 2 races are actually releated by blood.



All of these three religions "orders to kill" actually...

[Spendulus]

....
   Hmm, I wonder why rape is so much less common in Islamic countries....

...because maybe the result in Islamic countries of a woman reporting a rape is that the police rape her?

Let's look at where a bunch of those Muslims were moved to a country where rape IS REPORTED SAFELY and see what happened, shall we?

....after the Swedish parliament unanimously decided to change the formerly homogenous Sweden into a multicultural country, violent crime has increased by 300% and rapes by 1,472%.

https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/5195/sweden-rape

Any other propaganda, lies or pro-Muslim nonsense you want to pull out for the benefit of your audience?

Just to be clear here. That's your Muslims you are so proud of, raping Swedish women left and right. Your people.  Now let's look back at the thread title, shall we? Why do Islam hates people?

What's your answer? Islamic rapists don't hate? They just enjoy a bit of kuffer pussy now and then?

[Sithara007]

Hmm, I wonder why rape is so much less common in Islamic countries if they are dangerous for women?

In reality, the Muslim nations have one of the highest rates for rape in the world. But the truth never comes out because less than 1% of the rapes are reported. This is because in Muslim nations, if a rape happens then the probability is that the victim will receive a much harsher sentence when compared to the perpetrator.

[Spendulus]

Hmm, I wonder why rape is so much less common in Islamic countries if they are dangerous for women?

In reality, the Muslim nations have one of the highest rates for rape in the world. But the truth never comes out because less than 1% of the rapes are reported. This is because in Muslim nations, if a rape happens then the probability is that the victim will receive a much harsher sentence when compared to the perpetrator.

This is in conflict with Semaforo's proudly presented facts on incidence of rape in Muslim nations.

How can this be?

Wait...you did say..."In reality"....

Would Islam in and of itself cause it's members to not be in reality?

[semaforo]

Hmm, I wonder why rape is so much less common in Islamic countries if they are dangerous for women?

In reality, the Muslim nations have one of the highest rates for rape in the world. But the truth never comes out because less than 1% of the rapes are reported. This is because in Muslim nations, if a rape happens then the probability is that the victim will receive a much harsher sentence when compared to the perpetrator.

This is in conflict with Semaforo's proudly presented facts on incidence of rape in Muslim nations.

How can this be?

Wait...you did say..."In reality"....

Would Islam in and of itself cause it's members to not be in reality?

   Your arguments would carry a lot more weight if you had ever been to any of these countries. All statistics are flawed, although they are also adjusted for the issues you mention- including the ones that support your viewpoints, but it is glaringly obvious that the behavioral norms, particularly in conservative Muslim countries, simply do not allow for the fraction of the rape or sexual abuse as in western countries. Again, simply the fact that a majority of rapes in the United States involve alcohol points to the fact that with less alcohol consumption comes less rape.

Oh yeah, and by the way, the statistics on rape include not only reported rapes but in many studies anonymous surveys which tend to be much more accurate as there is no risk of social stigma for participants- and these also indicate that the United States has one of the highest rates in the world.

     If you actually spend time living with Muslim families, you see very quickly that the level of respect and honor accorded to women increases as they age, whereas in western countries you see many extremely lonely and  neglected elderly women who are no longer very valued due to having lost their physical beauty.

    It is very obvious that the norms of gender relations in the west put women into danger- but again, most critics are speaking from having browsed the websites of terrified and hateful peopñe than actually having had contact with Muslims.

     As for the case of Sweden, there is s consistent trend that social inequality leads to increased crime rates, and opening immigration has led to higher inequality- and if you actually look into it, you find the vast majority of the people convicted of crimes are not practicing Islam even a little- it is just part of their cultural background, and similar crime rates exist among Christian racial underclasses like Mexicans in the United States- the issue really has nothing to do with Islam and everything to do with extreme global inequality and continuing injustice on the part of the dominant class- these rising crime rates, as well as increased immigration, are largely a result of the economic devastation wrought by the destruction of traditional social orders of the countries where most of these immigrants come from in order to advance European economic interests- in other words, you reap what you sow.

[Spendulus]

Hmm, I wonder why rape is so much less common in Islamic countries if they are dangerous for women?

In reality, the Muslim nations have one of the highest rates for rape in the world. But the truth never comes out because less than 1% of the rapes are reported. This is because in Muslim nations, if a rape happens then the probability is that the victim will receive a much harsher sentence when compared to the perpetrator.

This is in conflict with Semaforo's proudly presented facts on incidence of rape in Muslim nations.

How can this be?

Wait...you did say..."In reality"....

Would Islam in and of itself cause it's members to not be in reality?

   Your arguments would carry a lot more weight if you had ever been to any of these countries. All statistics are flawed, although they are also adjusted for the issues you mention- including the ones that support your viewpoints, but it is glaringly obvious that the behavioral norms, particularly in conservative Muslim countries, simply do not allow for the fraction of the rape or sexual abuse as in western countries. Again, simply the fact that a majority of rapes in the United States involve alcohol points to the fact that with less alcohol consumption comes less rape.

Oh yeah, and by the way, the statistics on rape include not only reported rapes but in many studies anonymous surveys which tend to be much more accurate as there is no risk of social stigma for participants- and these also indicate that the United States has one of the highest rates in the world.

     If you actually spend time living with Muslim families, you see very quickly that the level of respect and honor accorded to women increases as they age, whereas in western countries you see many extremely lonely and  neglected elderly women who are no longer very valued due to having lost their physical beauty.

    It is very obvious that the norms of gender relations in the west put women into danger- but again, most critics are speaking from having browsed the websites of terrified and hateful peopñe than actually having had contact with Muslims.

     As for the case of Sweden, there is s consistent trend that social inequality leads to increased crime rates, and opening immigration has led to higher inequality- and if you actually look into it, you find the vast majority of the people convicted of crimes are not practicing Islam even a little- it is just part of their cultural background, and similar crime rates exist among Christian racial underclasses like Mexicans in the United States- the issue really has nothing to do with Islam and everything to do with extreme global inequality and continuing injustice on the part of the dominant class- these rising crime rates, as well as increased immigration, are largely a result of the economic devastation wrought by the destruction of traditional social orders of the countries where most of these immigrants come from in order to advance European economic interests- in other words, you reap what you sow.

Response.

Ad hominem, outright denial, and True Scotsman.

Please stop the Takiyya. It does not fool anyone here.

[semaforo]

Hmm, I wonder why rape is so much less common in Islamic countries if they are dangerous for women?

In reality, the Muslim nations have one of the highest rates for rape in the world. But the truth never comes out because less than 1% of the rapes are reported. This is because in Muslim nations, if a rape happens then the probability is that the victim will receive a much harsher sentence when compared to the perpetrator.

This is in conflict with Semaforo's proudly presented facts on incidence of rape in Muslim nations.

How can this be?

Wait...you did say..."In reality"....

Would Islam in and of itself cause it's members to not be in reality?

   Your arguments would carry a lot more weight if you had ever been to any of these countries. All statistics are flawed, although they are also adjusted for the issues you mention- including the ones that support your viewpoints, but it is glaringly obvious that the behavioral norms, particularly in conservative Muslim countries, simply do not allow for the fraction of the rape or sexual abuse as in western countries. Again, simply the fact that a majority of rapes in the United States involve alcohol points to the fact that with less alcohol consumption comes less rape.

Oh yeah, and by the way, the statistics on rape include not only reported rapes but in many studies anonymous surveys which tend to be much more accurate as there is no risk of social stigma for participants- and these also indicate that the United States has one of the highest rates in the world.

     If you actually spend time living with Muslim families, you see very quickly that the level of respect and honor accorded to women increases as they age, whereas in western countries you see many extremely lonely and  neglected elderly women who are no longer very valued due to having lost their physical beauty.

    It is very obvious that the norms of gender relations in the west put women into danger- but again, most critics are speaking from having browsed the websites of terrified and hateful peopñe than actually having had contact with Muslims.

     As for the case of Sweden, there is s consistent trend that social inequality leads to increased crime rates, and opening immigration has led to higher inequality- and if you actually look into it, you find the vast majority of the people convicted of crimes are not practicing Islam even a little- it is just part of their cultural background, and similar crime rates exist among Christian racial underclasses like Mexicans in the United States- the issue really has nothing to do with Islam and everything to do with extreme global inequality and continuing injustice on the part of the dominant class- these rising crime rates, as well as increased immigration, are largely a result of the economic devastation wrought by the destruction of traditional social orders of the countries where most of these immigrants come from in order to advance European economic interests- in other words, you reap what you sow.

Response.

Ad hominem, outright denial, and True Scotsman.

Please stop the Takiyya. It does not fool anyone here.

    1: ad hominem: the original suggestion was that Muslim societies are hostile to women- implicit in this is that they are more so than western societies. So I mentioned my personal experience with certain ways in which women get more respect and honor in traditionally Muslim cultures. Is this what you call ad hominem?  Besides, if there is a motive for distorting the truth someone is going to do it, and there is a very clear motive in this civilizational war, which I think deserves to be part of the discussion. People don't arrive to intensely negative perceptions about cultures they have little or no contact with without a lot of energy being put into it. My issue is that the perception I got traveling through place like Afghanistan, Pakistan, Morocco, Egypt, Turkey, and Senegal was dramatically different than the impression I got about Muslim cultures from the media in the US, which is why my first response to this is to ask what level of experience the people making these comments actually have with the subject matter at hand. It's a reasonable question- if someone is telling me my car needs a new head gasket, it's not a logical fallacy to ask what their qualifications as a mechanic are.

2: outright denial: What am I denying? The argument that the stigma on rape leads to underreporting? This is true, but as I said the source for this information is not only crime statistics- and I have also seen isolated cases where rape victims are punished being vastly blown out proportion to make it appear as if these injustices are systemic.

3: true scotsman: by the legal definition of Islam, someone who does not pray 5 times a day is not a Muslim.

   You are using stock arguments that don't really match up to what I am saying so I understand you are a veteran internet debater, but this just doesn't work here.

   If you are unhappy and filled with hate and lookong for someone to blame I suggest focusing the financial elite who have enslaved the better part of humanity, and who are using the civilizational conflict to further increase their power at the expense of millions of innocent people among all of the earths people. A combative attitude towards Islam simply plays into their hands, and is ultimatelt aggravating the issue rather than improving it.

   Takiyya is mainly practiced by shia, another gross misinterpretation of the islam hate websites. The reality is that most of the 'good' moderate Muslims are generally hypocrites. I don't deny any of the aspects of Islam thst haters usually cite- it all makes sense to me. It's silly to pin it on cultural Muslims though- Bulgarian christian immigrants in Sweden also have above average levels of criminality, it has to do with socio economic status more than cultural or religious background.

   There's so much hate and paranoia here it's just not that coherent what you are talking about. Are you suggesting Islam allows rape? In certain circumstances, you may be right, according to certain opinions, as in the case of female captives in war- however, they also have a high level if rights- they can only have intercourse with one man at a time, he is responsible to feed and clothe them at the level lf his own family and they should live with the family as a family member, if he hits her he is obligated to free her, if she becomes pregnant she cannot be sold, and anyone who purchases her must ensure she is not pregant before having intercourse with her, and must then be freed upon her owners death. Compared to the actions of any one of a dozen of the proxy armies financed and supported by the west this is extremely kind treatment. Besides, Islam is responsible for the freeing of more slaves thsn any social movement in history.

   So I think you see I am not your run of the mill apologist- rather I see the modern system(not to be confused with modern technologt) as far worse, albeit it indirectly. So what is it I am trying to deceive about?

[Spendulus]

Hmm, I wonder why rape is so much less common in Islamic countries if they are dangerous for women?

In reality, the Muslim nations have one of the highest rates for rape in the world. But the truth never comes out because less than 1% of the rapes are reported. This is because in Muslim nations, if a rape happens then the probability is that the victim will receive a much harsher sentence when compared to the perpetrator.

This is in conflict with Semaforo's proudly presented facts on incidence of rape in Muslim nations.

How can this be?

Wait...you did say..."In reality"....

Would Islam in and of itself cause it's members to not be in reality?

   Your arguments would carry a lot more weight if you had ever been to any of these countries. All statistics are flawed, although they are also adjusted for the issues you mention- including the ones that support your viewpoints, but it is glaringly obvious that the behavioral norms, particularly in conservative Muslim countries, simply do not allow for the fraction of the rape or sexual abuse as in western countries. Again, simply the fact that a majority of rapes in the United States involve alcohol points to the fact that with less alcohol consumption comes less rape.

Oh yeah, and by the way, the statistics on rape include not only reported rapes but in many studies anonymous surveys which tend to be much more accurate as there is no risk of social stigma for participants- and these also indicate that the United States has one of the highest rates in the world.

     If you actually spend time living with Muslim families, you see very quickly that the level of respect and honor accorded to women increases as they age, whereas in western countries you see many extremely lonely and  neglected elderly women who are no longer very valued due to having lost their physical beauty.

    It is very obvious that the norms of gender relations in the west put women into danger- but again, most critics are speaking from having browsed the websites of terrified and hateful peopñe than actually having had contact with Muslims.

     As for the case of Sweden, there is s consistent trend that social inequality leads to increased crime rates, and opening immigration has led to higher inequality- and if you actually look into it, you find the vast majority of the people convicted of crimes are not practicing Islam even a little- it is just part of their cultural background, and similar crime rates exist among Christian racial underclasses like Mexicans in the United States- the issue really has nothing to do with Islam and everything to do with extreme global inequality and continuing injustice on the part of the dominant class- these rising crime rates, as well as increased immigration, are largely a result of the economic devastation wrought by the destruction of traditional social orders of the countries where most of these immigrants come from in order to advance European economic interests- in other words, you reap what you sow.

Response.

Ad hominem, outright denial, and True Scotsman.

Please stop the Takiyya. It does not fool anyone here.

    1: ad hominem: the original suggestion was that Muslim societies are hostile to women- implicit in this is that they are more so than western societies. So I mentioned my personal experience with certain ways in which women get more respect and honor in traditionally Muslim cultures. Is this what you call ad hominem?  Besides, if there is a motive for distorting the truth someone is going to do it, and there is a very clear motive in this civilizational war, which I think deserves to be part of the discussion. People don't arrive to intensely negative perceptions about cultures they have little or no contact with without a lot of energy being put into it. My issue is that the perception I got traveling through place like Afghanistan, Pakistan, Morocco, Egypt, Turkey, and Senegal was dramatically different than the impression I got about Muslim cultures from the media in the US, which is why my first response to this is to ask what level of experience the people making these comments actually have with the subject matter at hand. It's a reasonable question- if someone is telling me my car needs a new head gasket, it's not a logical fallacy to ask what their qualifications as a mechanic are.

2: outright denial: What am I denying? The argument that the stigma on rape leads to underreporting? This is true, but as I said the source for this information is not only crime statistics- and I have also seen isolated cases where rape victims are punished being vastly blown out proportion to make it appear as if these injustices are systemic.

3: true scotsman: by the legal definition of Islam, someone who does not pray 5 times a day is not a Muslim.

   You are using stock arguments that don't really match up to what I am saying so I understand you are a veteran internet debater, but this just doesn't work here.

   If you are unhappy and filled with hate and lookong for someone to blame I suggest focusing the financial elite who have enslaved the better part of humanity, and who are using the civilizational conflict to further increase their power at the expense of millions of innocent people among all of the earths people. A combative attitude towards Islam simply plays into their hands, and is ultimatelt aggravating the issue rather than improving it.

   Takiyya is mainly practiced by shia, another gross misinterpretation of the islam hate websites. The reality is that most of the 'good' moderate Muslims are generally hypocrites. I don't deny any of the aspects of Islam thst haters usually cite- it all makes sense to me. It's silly to pin it on cultural Muslims though- Bulgarian christian immigrants in Sweden also have above average levels of criminality, it has to do with socio economic status more than cultural or religious background.

   There's so much hate and paranoia here it's just not that coherent what you are talking about. Are you suggesting Islam allows rape? In certain circumstances, you may be right, according to certain opinions, as in the case of female captives in war- however, they also have a high level if rights- they can only have intercourse with one man at a time, he is responsible to feed and clothe them at the level lf his own family and they should live with the family as a family member, if he hits her he is obligated to free her, if she becomes pregnant she cannot be sold, and anyone who purchases her must ensure she is not pregant before having intercourse with her, and must then be freed upon her owners death. Compared to the actions of any one of a dozen of the proxy armies financed and supported by the west this is extremely kind treatment. Besides, Islam is responsible for the freeing of more slaves thsn any social movement in history.

   So I think you see I am not your run of the mill apologist- rather I see the modern system(not to be confused with modern technologt) as far worse, albeit it indirectly. So what is it I am trying to deceive about?

Lying is lying, please stop it.

Let's take just one of your treasured Muslim countries, a shithole called Egypt. We'll look at the first paragraph of Wikipedia's entry on the subject.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_in_Egypt

Rape is one of the most common crimes in Egypt.[1] Marital rape is not illegal in the country. By 2008, U.N. quoted Egypt's Interior Ministry's figure that 20,000 rapes take place every year, although according to the activist Engy Ghozlan (ECWR), rapes are 10 times higher than the stats given by Interior Ministry, making it 200,000 per year.[2] Mona Eltahawy has also noted the same figure (200,000), and added that it was before the revolution, today the number is actually higher.[3]

Rapes have been carried out during festivals and the Egyptian protests, it includes the public rapes carried on women, and the female journalists.[4]